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Clinton meets Brun - Again.

Clinton and Brun miss connections hilariously.

Brun meets Cosette. (Now you know how "The Blink" happened.)

Clinton and Claire Sibling-Bond.

Wacky Pokemon-Go AnthroPC Hijinks

Something else... it's just way too hot here in the States.

Purple Monkey Elephant Dishwashers.

Spathe Ham and Waffles.

[oddtail]

jheartney: I am not sure I agree. Giving a guest at her house dinner (or whichever meal this is) does not give me a "deciding what she can eat tonight" vibe. Unless Brun doesn't eat at Renee's and she was offered casserole out of the blue, she seems to be offering a meal to a guest, which I'd describe as normal, even expected behaviour.

Nor do I see her as particularly needy of validation. Brun basically said what she prepared looks like shit (except using more colorful language), a negative reaction to that is, again, perfectly reasonable in my book.

[Gyrre]

Could have been worse Renee.  At least Brun didn't throw the plate across the room and call it garbage.

"What do you mean you're not a peer support volunteer anymore?"

One can only tolerate so much of certain behaviors for so long.

[jwhouk]

Stews are more of a heavy soup; casseroles are baked dishes.

[jwhouk]

I kinda want a thread of forum users' favorite casserole recipes.

Tater tot casserole. My fave. Tater tots, ground beef, shredded cheese, cream of mushroom soup. Mix in a dish, put the tots on top, bake at (I wanna say) 375 for about 20-25 minutes...

[jheartney]

I took Brun's undiplomatic reaction to the meal as similar to her undiplomatic assessment of Renee's alarm clock; she doesn't have filters on these things.

If I had a friend having to stay over, I'd probably ask what she wanted for dinner rather than just making something and expecting her to tell me how great it is. As to presumptuous, add this to not only the Clinton paranoia, but also Renee expecting Brun to switch her sleep schedule over to Renee's and bombarding Brun with tasks on her first morning as houseguest. It's a pattern.

[Zebediah]

Brun seems to have developed adequate defenses against Renee's efforts to manage her life. It's probably why they're able to be friends. I strongly suspect that neither of them has many other friends.

Personally, I could handle Brun's blunt-to-the-point-of-rudeness honesty far better than I could handle Renee's overbearing control-freak meddling, however well-intentioned it might be.

[Xader]

Incidentally, my wife makes a dish called "dog barf".

It's ground beef and baked beans simmered in tomato sauce with brown sugar.

It's a quick-n-easy recipe that is savory and a little sweet, but doesn't exactly look terribly appetizing. Great with cornbread, though.

[brasca]

I don't think making dinner for a friend who is staying with you is presumptuous, nor is it unreasonable to expect a thank you rather than insults when you do.

Perhaps, but maybe Brun was going to make herself a sandwich and then Renee cooks something and expects praise for her efforts.  If Brun never asked her to make dinner or make that casserole for dinner it's hardly ingratitude. 

[Milayna]

....??? If someone does a favor for you you thank them and repay them if possible/appropriate regardless of whether that favor was actually of any practical benefit to you. Just look at holidays. I don't ask for underwear or food or gadgets or anything for my birthday/christmas - in fact I go out of my way to explicitly say I want NOTHING. Regardless I always get stuff, and I'm obliged to put on a show of gratitude and profuse thanks for it, and stress over whether I got other people stuff of enough value to balance the value they got me. It's how things work.

If Brun had her own plans or wasn't hungry or whatever it's totally possible to politely decline, and if Renee gets pushy about that...well, smiling and putting up with it is probably the best option, or politely but firmly confronting that behavior if she felt she HAD to. But either way insults are uncalled for.

Unless that's their friendly dynamic. I've seen that in play on occasion irl, though I don't understand it.

[swapna]

Where as some people can find the Author/fans view that Claire is so super cool she can do no wrong a little wearing to. People can have different opinions yet no-body is wrong.

I have no issue with people not liking Claire. I have no issue with people not liking any character in the comic, because they're all fictional. I also don't think Claire is faultless, and Jeph clearly doesn't either. My point wasn't even about that, my point was about how I find it bizarre how seemingly personally offended people were that Claire booked the appointment, again because they're fictional.

There's a common thread in WCDTs of this personal offense being taken over character actions and it's just not something I've ever understood.

In my case - I don't like Claire as a character, which would be okay in the setting, but both the storytelling and a lot of the forum treat Claire as great and cute, even when she's being annoying. This, in turn, is just frustrating for me; an annoying character who reaps what they sow makes for much more interesting stories (Faye, also a character that is hard to like, at least has to pay for her mistakes). Claire is treated as cute and likeable even when she's clearly not, and is forgiven her hypocrisy without even naming it.
So, no, I'm not offended by the character; I'm just annoyed by the way the storytelling treats her.

The decision should be made together with him. Yes, he can say "no", but he could always say no, even if she sprung this at him at the last second. Wouldn't make it 100% right. Making the arrangements before checking for his OK seems pushy.

Sure, but also very common among a lot of people. Also, Clinton seems at worst mildly irritated by it and again actually into the idea. Can we not let Clinton make his own choices about how he feels?

They just had a discussion about Claire being manipulative, and she promised to change. Asking would show that she has thought about what Clinton said, and that she respects and considers his feelings. She doesn't, and is still treated as sympathetic, that's why it's annoying.

....??? If someone does a favor for you you thank them and repay them if possible/appropriate regardless of whether that favor was actually of any practical benefit to you. Just look at holidays. I don't ask for underwear or food or gadgets or anything for my birthday/christmas - in fact I go out of my way to explicitly say I want NOTHING. Regardless I always get stuff, and I'm obliged to put on a show of gratitude and profuse thanks for it, and stress over whether I got other people stuff of enough value to balance the value they got me. It's how things work.

If Brun had her own plans or wasn't hungry or whatever it's totally possible to politely decline, and if Renee gets pushy about that...well, smiling and putting up with it is probably the best option, or politely but firmly confronting that behavior if she felt she HAD to. But either way insults are uncalled for.

Unless that's their friendly dynamic. I've seen that in play on occasion irl, though I don't understand it.

Yeah, right? It would also have been nice for Brun to cook something for Renee, or ask her out for dinner as thanks for letting her crash at her place.
And even if she can't help her honesty, 'dog vomit'  isn't 'honest', it's insulting. "Dog food"  would be debatable, 'weird' would probably be okay, even.

I don't even think Renee expects to be praised, a simple 'Thanks' would suffice; she's just sardonic because she has feelings, too.

[Kugai]

At least she likes it.  Brun has no filters and has a very odd perspective on things at times.  It sorta adds to the speculation she's a High Functioning Autistic individual.

[Thrudd]

I see the dynamic like this

Friends - Hi, how are you. Missed you, hugs, etc etc

Really close friends -  mrgle brgle. Wheres the coffee pooty pants. Top left cabinet asshole. Thanks,

[Tova]

In my case - I don't like Claire as a character, which would be okay in the setting, but both the storytelling and a lot of the forum treat Claire as great and cute, even when she's being annoying. This, in turn, is just frustrating for me; an annoying character who reaps what they sow makes for much more interesting stories (Faye, also a character that is hard to like, at least has to pay for her mistakes). Claire is treated as cute and likeable even when she's clearly not, and is forgiven her hypocrisy without even naming it.
So, no, I'm not offended by the character; I'm just annoyed by the way the storytelling treats her.

I suppose if a character has a flaw that you find somehow unforgivable, you might detest the mere fact that others find them forgivable.

However, just consider for a moment what this means for those other people. It doesn't mean that those people have ignored the flaw, only that they like the person in spite of it. Love the sinner, hate the sin is the usual expression. That is what is going on with people who find Claire "cute and likeable" in spite of her obvious flaws.

The same remark applies to the way her brother Clinton is clearly approaching her. Their relationship is a dynamic thing, a work in progress. This, I believe, is normal and natural. Which is why I don't have this problem with the storytelling.

On the topic of friendship dynamics. My father and a close family friend would occasionally have pretty heated discussions. To an outsider, it would appear that they were about to break into fisticuffs. In fact, occasionally someone would approach them to try and defuse things. And they would turn around with genuine confusion - what are you talking about, we're just having a discussion, there's no animosity, we're best friends.

In contrast with this, I have seen interactions between family members or close friends which to an outsider appear innocent, but are in fact heavily loaded and rife with conflict.

You can't easily take interactions between close friends and judge them out of context.

Really close friends -  mrgle brgle. Wheres the coffee pooty pants. Top left cabinet asshole. Thanks,

This is an awesome example. It is terrible to call someone an asshole. No no, that's how they express their love for each other. Relationships have context, they have nuance.

[Perfectly Reasonable]

To hell with nuance...
I want the recipe.

[Method of Madness]

I wonder if Jeph was thinking of this when Emily says "Clin-ton".

[Oenone]

I don't think making dinner for a friend who is staying with you is presumptuous, nor is it unreasonable to expect a thank you rather than insults when you do.

Perhaps, but maybe Brun was going to make herself a sandwich and then Renee cooks something and expects praise for her efforts.  If Brun never asked her to make dinner or make that casserole for dinner it's hardly ingratitude.

Be kinda weird to be picky about dinner but totally comfy digging in someone else's kitchen to make a sandwich.

ETA: part of why that as an idea doesn't work for me is that in a 1BR apartment that's as small as Renee's appears, it seems like you'd really have to go out of your way to exist as a separate ecosystem from each other. There's not the space or the layout for them to each have their own wake up times, and honestly it makes more sense to share food/meals...

[Nepiophage]

Tater tot casserole. My fave. Tater tots, ground beef, shredded cheese, cream of mushroom soup. Mix in a dish, put the tots on top, bake at (I wanna say) 375 for about 20-25 minutes...

Shudder.

It's ground beef and baked beans simmered in tomato sauce with brown sugar.

The horror!

[BenRG]

New Comic Up!

Is it me, or was Brun lying there and literally saying 'Zzzzz!' to indicate that her schedule calls for her to be asleep at this point?

In his footer notes, Jeph adds: "They're... friends... right?" I wonder if he's shooting us a hint. Yes, they're friends but this may be the first time that they've been in enforced close proximity for such a long time. It will be a test of the strength of their friendship to see if it can survive the way their personalities are beginning to rub at each other. Quite frankly, I can't help but be a bit pessimistic about the long-term prospects for them.


[edit]
Fixed typo

[wlewisiii]

To hell with nuance...
I want the recipe.

My favorite is chicken and rice. Cut up chicken,  couple of cups of rice, 2 cans of cream of mushroom soup,  one can cream of celery soup,  can of milk,  mix and bake for 2 to 3 hours in a medium oven. A layer of tater tots is a nice topping  &, some times I'll mix in green beans as well.

A very Midwestern hot dish.

[jheartney]

Quite frankly, I can't help but be a bit pessimistic about the long-term prospects for them.

Thought that too for a while. But Renee must have some notion of what Brun is like (no filters, etc.) Assuming the forum thinking is correct, and Brun is on the Autism scale, and also assuming Renee is overprotective of Brun because she knows this about Brun, then Renee can't be surprised at Brun's behavior. From the other side, Brun has never expressed annoyance at Renee's meddling; maybe because she's "not good with emotions." We can only speculate about Renee and Brun's past history (how long have they known each other, how did they meet, how have they interacted in the past, etc.) For me, I'd find this housing situation hard to tolerate. But I'm not Brun.

Brun is operating on a sleep deficit due to the sleepless night at the hotel. If she's hitting the sack at 8, then by 4 am she'll have had 8 hours. Will that be enough?

Final note: All the attention to them strongly suggests they'll be interacting with the main cast again, most likely with Clinton. Hope it happens soon.

[alanari]

*sneaks in*
 about the "dog barf"-thing..

Im autistic, and sometimes i say things like that, too. the problem is, it's in no way meant to be mean. It's just an abservation. like "the sky is blue" or "it's cold, i shouldn't wear a skirt".
and that's where the problem lies. For me, describing something accurately is never a problem. If someone tells me that my dress looks like a giant cupcake, im fine with it as long as it does, indeed, resemble some kind of cupcake. There's no real difference to someone telling me that it looks great, I'd just nod and accept the opinion without any emotional reaction.
When you have no problem at all with such descriptions, it's really difficult to decide beforehand what will insult or disturb someone else and what won't. For me, negative reactions are mostly completely out of the blue. I'm trying to leran and I'm getting better but things like that will always happen..

I'm a friendly human that seeks harmony and peace wherever possible. I'd never be rude intentionally. I think that's what makes it easier for those who know me to deal with this, there's never a question on whether it's actually meant to be mean. Knowing it's never intentionally makes it easier to forgive.

But yeah, being honest and speaking directly is one of the reasons communications between autistic and non-autistic people can be really difficult. It's not that we want to be tactless, we just can't help it sometimes.

the being-tired-thing..
A day that forces me to improvise and interact with many foreign people can completely exhaust me. I'd be completely spent after 8 hours of job hunting plus looking for a new appartement.

[Thrillho]

Everything else I'll just have to agree to disagree on, but this:

They just had a discussion about Claire being manipulative, and she promised to change. Asking would show that she has thought about what Clinton said, and that she respects and considers his feelings. She doesn't, and is still treated as sympathetic, that's why it's annoying.

...In the precisely zero scenes she's had since she mentioned the tattoo thing to Clinton?

[Nepiophage]

To hell with nuance...
I want the recipe.

My favorite is chicken and rice. Cut up chicken,  couple of cups of rice, 2 cans of cream of mushroom soup,  one can cream of celery soup,  can of milk,  mix and bake for 2 to 3 hours in a medium oven. A layer of tater tots is a nice topping  &, some times I'll mix in green beans as well.

A very Midwestern hot dish.

That sounds tolerable - if you were hungry and there was nothing else to eat.

[oddtail]

To hell with nuance...
I want the recipe.

My favorite is chicken and rice. Cut up chicken,  couple of cups of rice, 2 cans of cream of mushroom soup,  one can cream of celery soup,  can of milk,  mix and bake for 2 to 3 hours in a medium oven. A layer of tater tots is a nice topping  &, some times I'll mix in green beans as well.

A very Midwestern hot dish.

That sounds tolerable - if you were hungry and there was nothing else to eat.

Really? To me, that sounds delicious =)

[brasca]

....??? If someone does a favor for you you thank them and repay them if possible/appropriate regardless of whether that favor was actually of any practical benefit to you. Just look at holidays. I don't ask for underwear or food or gadgets or anything for my birthday/christmas - in fact I go out of my way to explicitly say I want NOTHING. Regardless I always get stuff, and I'm obliged to put on a show of gratitude and profuse thanks for it, and stress over whether I got other people stuff of enough value to balance the value they got me. It's how things work.

If Brun had her own plans or wasn't hungry or whatever it's totally possible to politely decline, and if Renee gets pushy about that...well, smiling and putting up with it is probably the best option, or politely but firmly confronting that behavior if she felt she HAD to. But either way insults are uncalled for.

Unless that's their friendly dynamic. I've seen that in play on occasion irl, though I don't understand it.

So someone who is vegan should be grateful someone made them a steak or someone that is kosher a plate of bacon?  Sure most of us would be polite, but Brun isn't like most people.  Sometimes I wish I could be so blunt as to tell people what I think of their so called gifts, but I'm too overly concerned with what other people might think of me.  Even thought the casserole doesn't conflict with any dietary beliefs Brun has it's become increasingly clear that Brun does not speak with a filter and a friend like Renee should know that.  Now maybe Renee's passive aggressive complaining is actually a way of communicating to Brun when she says things that would hurt the feelings of people who aren't friends that know her better, but after today's strip I'm thinking she's someone who seeks praise and adulation for every little good deed she does. 

[oddtail]

I'm not sure I understand the logic here... I'm far from being particularly harsh on Brun, but "well, she doesn't have any filter" is hardly a get-out-of-jail-free card, in my opinion. I can understand *why* she acts the way she does, and I don't think her actions are terrible, but that doesn't mean her reaction is justified.

Is Renee passive-aggressive? Perhaps a bit. I do think passive-aggressive behaviour is less of a big deal than being insulting of someone's well-intentioned help. Heck, since Brun accepted the meal and ate it, it's even worse. Apparently she doesn't have a problem with being served food. She'll gladly eat it. But she also wants to keep her "I say whatever I want" rights.

I accept that Brun and Renee's relationship dynamics might be something we don't have enough context for, but if Brun gets a free pass for saying whatever the Hell she feels like saying at the moment, does anyone? Is it OK to say anything hurtful or insulting or rude just because it feels fun at the time? If so, where's the line? If not, why is Brun's "no filter" justification enough? I do not believe it is.

[Zebediah]

Look, the thing with Brun isn't that she says "whatever she wants." It's that she can't not say whatever is on her mind. The lack of filter is not a choice. So stop judging her as if it is.

[oddtail]

It's that she can't not say whatever is on her mind.

I'm not sure if I've seen anything in the comic that proves that. I'm not saying that's not the case, but I'm not convinced it is, either.

[BenRG]

I would be wary of using Brun's condition as an excuse to automatically assume that she has no agency over her actions. As I posted yesterday, the title Jeph chose for the strip does suggest that Brun sometimes slips in a deliberate snark or two.

[alanari]

Is it OK to say anything hurtful or insulting or rude just because it feels fun at the time?

Assuming she's autistic, this is not about "feeling fun".
Assuming Brun had cooked, and Renee would have said "this looks like dog barf". She'd most likely say "yes" and continue serving. She wouldn't feel offended or attacked. It is what it is and truth is never a bad thing for an autist. I have really big problems with people telling me that something i did was great an them later discovering that it wasn't-and they knew. A polite lie can be something I'm upset about for days. "This is crap because of *insert reason*, do it again" is what I would have preferred. Dealing with lies is really difficult for me, and being polite often includes lying.

There are two fundamentally different views on communication clashing. It only works if both try their best to understand the other and accept that he has a different view on things, and of course try their best to treat the other the way he prefers.
I know being honest about things is sometimes difficult for non-autistic people. I think they have this feeling of doing something wrong, of purposely offending someone.

There will always be people who think the do me a favour telling a small polite lie, and hurt me. There will always be people I hurt by being too honest.

The decision which truths non-autists want to hear and which they don't want to hear seems to be pretty arbitrary to me. And, even worse, it differs from person to person. Learning to distinguish will be a lifelong task.

[JimC]

Interesting that we can criticise the character's apparently negative comments on a dish she has seen and has eaten, and yet can also be crticical of a posted recipe we have neither seen nor eaten.

[Milayna]

....??? If someone does a favor for you you thank them and repay them if possible/appropriate regardless of whether that favor was actually of any practical benefit to you. Just look at holidays. I don't ask for underwear or food or gadgets or anything for my birthday/christmas - in fact I go out of my way to explicitly say I want NOTHING. Regardless I always get stuff, and I'm obliged to put on a show of gratitude and profuse thanks for it, and stress over whether I got other people stuff of enough value to balance the value they got me. It's how things work.

If Brun had her own plans or wasn't hungry or whatever it's totally possible to politely decline, and if Renee gets pushy about that...well, smiling and putting up with it is probably the best option, or politely but firmly confronting that behavior if she felt she HAD to. But either way insults are uncalled for.

Unless that's their friendly dynamic. I've seen that in play on occasion irl, though I don't understand it.

So someone who is vegan should be grateful someone made them a steak or someone that is kosher a plate of bacon?  Sure most of us would be polite, but Brun isn't like most people.  Sometimes I wish I could be so blunt as to tell people what I think of their so called gifts, but I'm too overly concerned with what other people might think of me.  Even thought the casserole doesn't conflict with any dietary beliefs Brun has it's become increasingly clear that Brun does not speak with a filter and a friend like Renee should know that.  Now maybe Renee's passive aggressive complaining is actually a way of communicating to Brun when she says things that would hurt the feelings of people who aren't friends that know her better, but after today's strip I'm thinking she's someone who seeks praise and adulation for every little good deed she does.

I'm not sure why you added escalated irrelevancies to make your point. "If someone made me something I can't eat I shouldn't have to express gratitude, therefore I should never be obliged to express gratitude for any favor!" is obviously bs. But to address your first sentence about veganism/kosher in isolation: It depends on the scenario. If the host made those dishes, knowing that their guest couldn't eat it, then than would be rude and could be responded to rudely (though the guest might still want to politely decline, for the sake of not angering their host and creating more trouble). If the host had no idea about their guest's proscriptions, then yes, it would be rude for the guest to insult it and should politely decline (though in this scenario commenting on its looks would be irrelevant to the issue at hand - the inability to eat it regardless of looks).

But that's an entire meaningless paragraph I just typed because it has nothing to do with the dinner issue in the comic. Brun was explicitly capable of eating it and insulted the favor for no good reason. THAT is uncalled for.

As for whether it's Brun's duty to polite or Renee's duty to put up with Brun's rudeness, I don't know. I am not very involved in autism-related-issues, though in regards to "acceptance", it stands to reason that "acceptance" would entail the latter. Personally speaking, I go with the former; I do not have the qualities to make "other people putting up with me" a viable option, and as I depend on other people and society to create and make available the things I need to survive, I find the most practical worldview to be the one where I conform as closely as I am able to social expectations, whether those expectations are "fair" or not.

I won't discount that Renee expects "praise and adulation" for everything she does, though I don't subscribe to that so far; but expecting a generic "thanks" token when she's done Brun a favor, or at least not be insulted, does not evidence that. And if you wantt to consider the broader context: Renee does seem to be controlling, possessive, and condescending toward Brun's ability to manage her own life. But Renee is ALSO allowing Brun to stay in HER home, presumably rent-free. To put it bluntly, since you're in favor of that, Brun is currently parasite and has no leeway to flout Renee in her own home while receiving Renee's benefits. ANY favor Renee does is on top of the REALLY BIG ONE of letting Brun stay with her. "If she doesn't like it, then she can find her own place to live. immediately". That is simply the unavoidable, practical, factual way of life.

[Mr. Doctor]

For some reason unknown to me... I lost interest in these two characters VERY quickly, specially with Renee (jeez, I had to double check her name). I'll let the rest of the week pass by.

[jheartney]

Assuming Brun had cooked, and Renee would have said "this looks like dog barf". She'd most likely say "yes" and continue serving. She wouldn't feel offended or attacked. It is what it is and truth is never a bad thing for an autist. I have really big problems with people telling me that something i did was great an them later discovering that it wasn't-and they knew. A polite lie can be something I'm upset about for days. "This is crap because of *insert reason*, do it again" is what I would have preferred. Dealing with lies is really difficult for me, and being polite often includes lying.

I think this is exactly what happened. If fact, we have another instance in-comic of just this sort of interaction involving Brun. In panel 2, Brun tells Clinton that her job involves making patrons feel welcome. Clinton retorts that this is the opposite of what she's done so far. Rather than feeling insulted, Brun simply says "yes" and then reiterates a question about why Clinton feels angry. Here, Brun seems incapable of being offended by a statement of fact. She simply accepts it and moves on, in exactly the manner that alanari is describing.

[Timemaster]

For some reason unknown to me... I lost interest in these two characters VERY quickly, specially with Renee (jeez, I had to double check her name). I'll let the rest of the week pass by.

Hello Doc,

Somehow Iīm with you here. I donīt know why, but I cannot relate to Brun (and Renee) yet, so I find this storyline rather boring. Maybe this will change if she gets to interact with the crew and Clinton.

See you then:
TM

[sitnspin]

Hell, I've been sitting here still waiting for more Dora and Tai, and I have a feeling I'll be waiting a long time. We all have characters we'd like to see more or less of.

[Neko_Ali]

Sadly, they've been shuffled off to 'happy couple' land, so Jeph just doesn't have much use for them right now. Such is the problem with a large and ever growing cast... Unless something interesting is happening with them, we just don't see them often. About the only reason we see Dora these days is if a scene is taking place in the Coffee of Doom. Likewise, we haven't seen the library in months, so no Tai.

[cesium133]

All we need is for Clinton to go to the library. Then it'll burn down and things will be interesting there again.

[swapna]

Everything else I'll just have to agree to disagree on, but this:

They just had a discussion about Claire being manipulative, and she promised to change. Asking would show that she has thought about what Clinton said, and that she respects and considers his feelings. She doesn't, and is still treated as sympathetic, that's why it's annoying.

...In the precisely zero scenes she's had since she mentioned the tattoo thing to Clinton?

No, I referenced this discussion.

[brasca]

....??? If someone does a favor for you you thank them and repay them if possible/appropriate regardless of whether that favor was actually of any practical benefit to you. Just look at holidays. I don't ask for underwear or food or gadgets or anything for my birthday/christmas - in fact I go out of my way to explicitly say I want NOTHING. Regardless I always get stuff, and I'm obliged to put on a show of gratitude and profuse thanks for it, and stress over whether I got other people stuff of enough value to balance the value they got me. It's how things work.

If Brun had her own plans or wasn't hungry or whatever it's totally possible to politely decline, and if Renee gets pushy about that...well, smiling and putting up with it is probably the best option, or politely but firmly confronting that behavior if she felt she HAD to. But either way insults are uncalled for.

Unless that's their friendly dynamic. I've seen that in play on occasion irl, though I don't understand it.

So someone who is vegan should be grateful someone made them a steak or someone that is kosher a plate of bacon?  Sure most of us would be polite, but Brun isn't like most people.  Sometimes I wish I could be so blunt as to tell people what I think of their so called gifts, but I'm too overly concerned with what other people might think of me.  Even thought the casserole doesn't conflict with any dietary beliefs Brun has it's become increasingly clear that Brun does not speak with a filter and a friend like Renee should know that.  Now maybe Renee's passive aggressive complaining is actually a way of communicating to Brun when she says things that would hurt the feelings of people who aren't friends that know her better, but after today's strip I'm thinking she's someone who seeks praise and adulation for every little good deed she does.

I'm not sure why you added escalated irrelevancies to make your point. "If someone made me something I can't eat I shouldn't have to express gratitude, therefore I should never be obliged to express gratitude for any favor!" is obviously bs. But to address your first sentence about veganism/kosher in isolation: It depends on the scenario. If the host made those dishes, knowing that their guest couldn't eat it, then than would be rude and could be responded to rudely (though the guest might still want to politely decline, for the sake of not angering their host and creating more trouble). If the host had no idea about their guest's proscriptions, then yes, it would be rude for the guest to insult it and should politely decline (though in this scenario commenting on its looks would be irrelevant to the issue at hand - the inability to eat it regardless of looks).

But that's an entire meaningless paragraph I just typed because it has nothing to do with the dinner issue in the comic. Brun was explicitly capable of eating it and insulted the favor for no good reason. THAT is uncalled for.

As for whether it's Brun's duty to polite or Renee's duty to put up with Brun's rudeness, I don't know. I am not very involved in autism-related-issues, though in regards to "acceptance", it stands to reason that "acceptance" would entail the latter. Personally speaking, I go with the former; I do not have the qualities to make "other people putting up with me" a viable option, and as I depend on other people and society to create and make available the things I need to survive, I find the most practical worldview to be the one where I conform as closely as I am able to social expectations, whether those expectations are "fair" or not.

I won't discount that Renee expects "praise and adulation" for everything she does, though I don't subscribe to that so far; but expecting a generic "thanks" token when she's done Brun a favor, or at least not be insulted, does not evidence that. And if you wantt to consider the broader context: Renee does seem to be controlling, possessive, and condescending toward Brun's ability to manage her own life. But Renee is ALSO allowing Brun to stay in HER home, presumably rent-free. To put it bluntly, since you're in favor of that, Brun is currently parasite and has no leeway to flout Renee in her own home while receiving Renee's benefits. ANY favor Renee does is on top of the REALLY BIG ONE of letting Brun stay with her. "If she doesn't like it, then she can find her own place to live. immediately". That is simply the unavoidable, practical, factual way of life.

Renee could do that, but seeing as how she is so protective of her friend she probably won't.  She knows Brun better than Clinton or any of the previously existing characters so she should be more than familiar with her quirks and/or neuroses.  As such she's either feigning offense to help Brun understand when she's hurt someone's feelings to help her improve her interaction or doesn't understand her friend as much as she likes to think she does.  Seeing as how Brun made an honest observation Renee could have shrugged it off as Brun being Brun instead of being offended by her blunt honesty.  It has yet to be confirmed that Brun is a high functioning autistic and if that is the case then she really cannot help lacking a filter.  If not then she really is a rude ingrate, but I seriously doubt anyone would put up with her for so long if there wasn't a sympathetic excuse.         

[Milayna]

Renee could do that, but seeing as how she is so protective of her friend she probably won't.  She knows Brun better than Clinton or any of the previously existing characters so she should be more than familiar with her quirks and/or neuroses.  As such she's either feigning offense to help Brun understand when she's hurt someone's feelings to help her improve her interaction or doesn't understand her friend as much as she likes to think she does.  Seeing as how Brun made an honest observation Renee could have shrugged it off as Brun being Brun instead of being offended by her blunt honesty.  It has yet to be confirmed that Brun is a high functioning autistic and if that is the case then she really cannot help lacking a filter.  If not then she really is a rude ingrate, but I seriously doubt anyone would put up with her for so long if there wasn't a sympathetic excuse.

Good point that she probably won't because she's so protective, though now I wonder WHY she's so protective of Brun. Or if Brun even knows. Also good point about feigning offense to help her understand, I hadn't thought of that, though I also can't tell if Brun caught on to it. She seemed pretty dismissive of Renee's "offense".

I will object to "being autistic = lacking a filter" which I've seen from a couple of people. I am autistic and you can see what I am arguing. It may be generally more true for autistic people than allistic people but is by no means universal. From my perspective, besides it being rather obviously rude to compare the food's appearance to dog vomit, it was also completely pointless; no comment on it was elicited and I can't think of any purpose Brun would have had to comment on it in any capacity. Then again, I learned long ago to carefully consider the purpose and ramifications of anything that I do and err on the side of self-censorship if I wasn't reasonably sure of a positive outcome or momentarily reckless. I'm surprised that Brun woudn't have learned the same thing considering her propensity to offend but not inconceivable that she wouldn't.

Yeah, she isn't confirmed to be autistic. If you don't believe she is, that's fair. My feelings on the subject are somewhat complicated. Autistic people don't get much representation, so when I see a character that behaves in a relatably autistic way (another example, Peridot from Steven Universe) I tend to headcanon them as such; on the other hand nearly all such character or canon autistic characters are written by allistic people. I want to see more such characters written or at least consulted by actual autistic people, but I guess I'm thirsty enough for any relatable ones that I'll tend to accept them somewhat bittersweetly anyway =/

[Kugai]

Renee angling for a Gibbssmack at this rate

[Oenone]

I again want to point out that it's not a guarantee that Renee is neurotypical. It's entirely possible that she's trying to navigate the shifts in her space and routine that Brun's staying with her has caused. I'd put dollars to donuts she's got something going on that helps explain not only her rigidity about scheduling but also her need to deliberately organize herself and others.

Also... Idk Brun's really not responding well to Renee's repair gestures. She might not have a filter but she's still being kind of mean.

[Tova]

I suppose I am the only one here who simply got a chuckle out of this week's comics so far, rather than flying into a mild rage.

[Stoutfellow]

No, you aren't.

[Zebediah]

You aren't the only one. What's the point of getting enraged by a webcomic when there are so many things in the world more worthy of rage?

[Tova]

That's a relief.

[wlewisiii]

I suppose I am the only one here who simply got a chuckle out of this week's comics so far, rather than flying into a mild rage.

I am in agreement with you and really don't get the vitriol. 

[chaospersonified]

Good lord, I leave for two days, and check the comic, assuming there's nothing for people to get riled up about. I saw nothing. This is apparently another case of me missing a LOT of angry stuff. You folk are so angry...

[sitnspin]

I suppose I am the only one here who simply got a chuckle out of this week's comics so far, rather than flying into a mild rage.

I am in agreement with you and really don't get the vitriol.

I find humans will get angry at literally anything. Often I think they actually enjoy being angry and look for any excuse to rage.