Topic: WCDT Strips 3376 - 3380 (19th to 23rd December 2016) (Read 34668 times)

BenRG · « **on:** 18 Dec 2016, 09:42 »

So, we are almost at the end of the year. Traditionally, Jeph has a lineart-only filler strip for the week between Christmas and New Year so this will likely be the last QC week for this year. What do you think it will be?

The more I think about it, the more I think that Jeph is going to hold Bubbles' story for the new year, just because it's going to take more than a week to tell. With this in mind, I'm wondering if we're going to have an interlude for the next week. What can it be?

A lot of the options I've presented personally appeal to me. The most quixotic being following Veronica's first 'straight' (i.e. non-BDSM in some way) Christmas since she went pro as a Domme, before she even met Henry. It could be very sweet, especially if there is a lot of focus on Jim and Sam accepting her into their family traditions and rituals.

However, the more I think about it, I love the idea of some two-character semi-random humorous interaction. For that, I've got to go for Brun taking Renee out clock shopping. Renee doesn't want a new alarm clock, of course, but Brun insists. Her current one is just too boring and pedestrian; Brun is becoming embarrassed to call Renee her friend, knowing she owns such a common time piece!

jwhouk · « **Reply #1 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 10:11 »

I think this is going to be The Talk II - Talk Harder.

gprimr1 · « **Reply #2 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 12:18 »

Hopefully not. I'd like to see the Bubbles back story be told this week, then when the New Year begins, we can go forward with what happens next.

Kugai · « **Reply #3 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 13:44 »

Guest Strips.

Steve eating Cereal with guests from other Comics

cesium133 · « **Reply #4 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 14:33 »

Condensed matter physicists may have a stroke after reading Monday's comic.

hedgie · « **Reply #5 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 14:38 »

Early comic is live, so they don't have to wait.

Thrudd · « **Reply #6 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 15:50 »

Well dang! $:-\$

jheartney · « **Reply #7 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 18:23 »

If an AI mind can be transferred and backed up, it can also be cloned. Just transfer the backup into a new matrix. As many times as you want.

This also strongly brings back the question of whether a transferred AI mind is the same mind or a copy of the same mind. And if it's a copy, how can there be continuity of self? IOW, Momo was murdered when they put a copy of her consciousness into a new chassis. The new Momo just thinks she's the old Momo. (This is another variant on the Enterprise Transporter problem.)

Method of Madness · « **Reply #8 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 18:32 »

...holy shit, was I actually right about an Eternal Sunshine scenario?

foolsguinea · « **Reply #9 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 19:51 »

I was promised Steve eating cereal! This is the last straw, Jeph!

Gyrre · « **Reply #10 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 19:59 »

So hard to pick a choice!

Though, I very much would love to see the second panel as a stained glass window.

DonInKansas · « **Reply #11 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 20:17 »

Quote from: jwhouk on 18 Dec 2016, 10:11

I think this is going to be The Talk II - Talk Harder.

The Talk II - Electric Bugaloo.

Dicrostonyx · « **Reply #12 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 21:16 »

Quote from: jheartney on 18 Dec 2016, 18:23

If an AI mind can be transferred and backed up, it can also be cloned. Just transfer the backup into a new matrix. As many times as you want.

That, combined with Bubbles' comment about minds as an emergent system, could suggest that there was only one original AI which all current AIs have evolved or descended from. When a copy gets left behind it proceeds on one path while the recognised self follows another. Different bodies and brain technologies could impose physical limitations on personality development as well. This theory would explain why there seems to be a reasonable degree of harmony amongst AIs: they're all related or have some hidden protocols.

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #13 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 21:48 »

Corpse Witch is a memory editing practitioner.

That's a field with much scope for unethical practices.

Why did Bubbles trust her in the first place?

Gyrre · « **Reply #14 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 22:11 »

Bubbles' reveal that the process removes rough hewn segments of memory seems to suggest that I could be right about Detective Basilisk knowing her before she served.

hakko504 · « **Reply #15 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 23:10 »

With this discussion of AI minds, we might finally find out if androids do dream of electric sheep.

And about the poll, I'd love to see 'Sven and Hannelore: "No-one should celebrate Christmas alone."', but as we're already in the process of "The Talk II: Bubbles speaks her mind" I'd be surprised if we get anything but Faye/Bubbles strips this week.

BenRG · « **Reply #16 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 23:19 »

Okay, this is something that is quite disturbing on a lot of levels. Knowing how to 'edit' minds and consciousnesses, even on the crudest level, is a formula for abuse, especially as there seems to be a kinship between it and the more routinely-used chassis transfer process. It's a lot easier to control someone if you can cut out the bits that made them want to resist you.

Concerns about large-scale abuses aside, I do have to say that panel 6 was nicely done. It's subtle but Jeph has communicated the stress Bubbles is feeling at even discussing this subject just by the fact that she's wringing her hands (an amazingly human reaction, when you think about it).

Quote from: hakko504 on 18 Dec 2016, 23:10

With this discussion of AI minds, we might finally find out if androids do dream of electric sheep.

I think that we've established, at least in Bubbles' case, that she likely dreams of Technicolour ponies.

hakko504 · « **Reply #17 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 23:48 »

Quote from: BenRG on 18 Dec 2016, 23:19

Quote from: hakko504 on 18 Dec 2016, 23:10
With this discussion of AI minds, we might finally find out if androids do dream of electric sheep.

I think that we've established, at least in Bubbles' case, that she likely dreams of Technicolour ponies.

Unicorns, you mean.

BenRG · « **Reply #18 on:** 18 Dec 2016, 23:55 »

Pegasi too!

oeoek · « **Reply #19 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 00:00 »

(reads comic, googles something, googles some more, gets lost in several scientific articles)

D*mn, when I grew up in the sixties they told me reading comics was dumming people down!

NyxDarkness · « **Reply #20 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 02:18 »

I like to consider myself at least mildly techno-savvy, but my brain is in knots following this description.

I would like to see some catching up done this week, as well as Bubbles telling her story. I do wonder what everybody is up to. It seems like forever since we've really caught up with everybody.

Quote from: BenRG on 18 Dec 2016, 09:42

...Veronica's first 'straight' (i.e. non-BDSM in some way) Christmas...

We call that vanilla.

Thrillho · « **Reply #21 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 05:18 »

Gotta say, this is the most gripped I've been by a story development in QC since Dora first kissed Marten.

Neko_Ali · « **Reply #22 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 06:37 »

Quote from: Is it cold in here? on 18 Dec 2016, 21:48

Corpse Witch is a memory editing practitioner.

That's a field with much scope for unethical practices.

Why did Bubbles trust her in the first place?

Trauma and desperation can make people turn to things they wouldn't consider under other circumstances. And with someone like CW, once she has some measure of control over you, they'll make sure to keep and make use of it.

theMarc · « **Reply #23 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 07:44 »

The AI in panel three is a toaster now, but can he make bread fun?

blt · « **Reply #24 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 10:24 »

I also voted for Sven and Hannelore because that would be the cutest. Maybe it can be Friday's comic? (wishful thinking)

Quote from: BenRG on 18 Dec 2016, 23:19

It's subtle but Jeph has communicated the stress Bubbles is feeling at even discussing this subject just by the fact that she's wringing her hands (an amazingly human reaction, when you think about it).

More of AIs doing human things because humans do them.

sitnspin · « **Reply #25 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 11:40 »

My guess is she had some major traumatic memories from her military service, most likely the events that lead to the death of her team. Unfortunately, since editing AI memories is notoriously difficult and imprecise, Bubbles was still left with the trauma and psychological fallout even after the memory extraction.

Storel · « **Reply #26 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 11:42 »

Quote from: foolsguinea on 18 Dec 2016, 19:51

I was promised Steve eating cereal! This is the last straw, Jeph!

I know, really!

Personally, I think it would have been hilarious if today's strip had been Steve and Marten eating cereal, and then tomorrow (after everyone was resigned to a week of cereal) going back to the Faye-Bubbles Talk. Just imagining the looks on people's faces (on BOTH days) makes me giggle.

And the forum would have gone nuts, of course. We'd probably be on page 3 already just with people's reactions to Steve eating cereal...

Kugai · « **Reply #27 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 11:54 »

The Cereal was a lie!!

This is making my head spin. I think Jeph can add a PhD to his title after this.

Dev Null · « **Reply #28 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 15:01 »

Never take medical advice from someone with "Witch" or "Corpse" in their name or title.

oddtail · « **Reply #29 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 15:16 »

Quote from: Dev Null on 19 Dec 2016, 15:01

Never take medical advice from someone with "Witch" or "Corpse" in their name or title.

In modern times, that's probably reasonable, but I think historically, anyone known as a "Witch" was the BEST kind of person to get medical help from, at least if you didn't have a lot of money. "Witch" was basically code for "there's a woman, and that woman knows about stuff that people consider confusing and spooky."

USS Martenclaire · « **Reply #30 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 15:45 »

What did Corpse Witch want in return? Sure, she was "sympathetic" to Bubbles' plight but I'm equally certain there was a price tag attached. There usually is, when dealing with witches....

JacobArduino · « **Reply #31 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 15:51 »

I think Sven and Hannelore could do each other a world of good.

*Dora explodes in the distance*

Method of Madness · « **Reply #32 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 15:57 »

Quote from: Dev Null on 19 Dec 2016, 15:01

Never take medical advice from someone with "Witch" or "Corpse" in their name or title.

What about Alice (from AG)? She doesn't call herself a witch, but she's referred to as such.

St.Clair · « **Reply #33 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 16:58 »

So, if Faye could undergo a procedure to "forget" the trauma of watching her dad shoot himself, leaving only the dry and/or vague knowledge that yeah, that happened ...
Do you think she would?

jheartney · « **Reply #34 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 17:01 »

Quote from: USS Martenclaire on 19 Dec 2016, 15:45

What did Corpse Witch want in return? Sure, she was "sympathetic" to Bubbles' plight but I'm equally certain there was a price tag attached. There usually is, when dealing with witches....

Some period (measured in years) of uncompensated or low-compensated labor. Corpse Witch got a powerful, skilled and hard-working employee who couldn't leave, however she was treated. We can also see why Corpse Witch did everything possible to sabotage Bubbles' social development, both as a friend of Faye, and in her trips to Coffee of Doom.

This does not yet explain about the people that Bubbles needed a refuge from. Though it does suggest the origin of the threat about Bubbles losing her chassis; CW could suggest that Bubbles had spilled the beans about operational secrets, after which the government would impound her chassis.

Zebediah · « **Reply #35 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 17:03 »

Quote from: St.Clair on 19 Dec 2016, 16:58

So, if Faye could undergo a procedure to "forget" the trauma of watching her dad shoot himself, leaving only the dry and/or vague knowledge that yeah, that happened ...
Do you think she would?

In a heartbeat, yeah. There are some memories a person doesn't want to hang on to.

Perfectly Reasonable · « **Reply #36 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 17:38 »

So it is now confirmed that transfer, back-up, and editing of an AI consciousness is possible. But we have -not- seen duplication of an AI. And I am sure we never will. Because Civil Rights? yeah, sure. Because only a few standard obedient AIs would be duplicated endlessly? dull, dull. Because Gary? Maybe.

"Delete any of My People and I will 'take care of your stuff'."

TheEvilDog · « **Reply #37 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 18:15 »

Quote from: USS Martenclaire on 19 Dec 2016, 15:45

What did Corpse Witch want in return? Sure, she was "sympathetic" to Bubbles' plight but I'm equally certain there was a price tag attached. There usually is, when dealing with witches....

Bubbles' once wonderful singing voice.

But back to the new comic. So it seems that Momo was not unusual in her original opinion of Bubbles and it seems that Bubbles is a outcast to the greater AI community. No wonder she had to turn to someone like CW.

Morituri · « **Reply #38 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 18:53 »

Okay, I just want to say something here.

VA Hospitals in the US are better than that!

I mean, I know they have problems, I know the paperwork jungle gets hip deep at times, I know their scheduling is right out of Kafka, I know that sometimes they have limited access to the most recent drugs and there are legal barriers to holding them accountable for malpractice, and all of that. Okay, I know that. They're run by a bureaucracy. That's kind of a given.

But scrapped program or no scrapped program, classified operational details or none, injuries received in action while operating under orders - even if the orders were wrong, stupid, or illegal - is what they are there to deal with and unless something VERY wrong is going on in the QC-verse they don't turn away from it.

"Never disclose operational details" means that the people you'll be talking over your problems with will have to have clearance, but VA hospitals will go to whatever lengths they have to go to to get someone involved in treatment appropriate clearance. PTSD is NOT a joke to those guys.

And there's a major VA hospital not far at all from real life northhampton.

blt · « **Reply #39 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 19:02 »

Quote from: jheartney on 19 Dec 2016, 17:01

This does not yet explain about the people that Bubbles needed a refuge from. Though it does suggest the origin of the threat about Bubbles losing her chassis; CW could suggest that Bubbles had spilled the beans about operational secrets, after which the government would impound her chassis.

I'm still of the feeling that the people Bubbles needed refuge from was just the general public. If the military wanted her chassis they wouldn't have released her with it. Actually I'm surprised it wasn't just turned in at CIF or whatever anyway.

But if general AI public and some parts of human public can't even deal with her walking around town, I can see CW giving her refuge from this. And playing it up, given her own sentiments.

YMMV with VA care.

TheEvilDog · « **Reply #40 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 19:30 »

Quote from: Morituri on 19 Dec 2016, 18:53

Okay, I just want to say something here.

VA Hospitals in the US are better than that!

I mean, I know they have problems, I know the paperwork jungle gets hip deep at times, I know their scheduling is right out of Kafka, I know that sometimes they have limited access to the most recent drugs and there are legal barriers to holding them accountable for malpractice, and all of that. Okay, I know that. They're run by a bureaucracy. That's kind of a given.

But scrapped program or no scrapped program, classified operational details or none, injuries received in action while operating under orders - even if the orders were wrong, stupid, or illegal - is what they are there to deal with and unless something VERY wrong is going on in the QC-verse they don't turn away from it.

"Never disclose operational details" means that the people you'll be talking over your problems with will have to have clearance, but VA hospitals will go to whatever lengths they have to go to to get someone involved in treatment appropriate clearance. PTSD is NOT a joke to those guys.

And there's a major VA hospital not far at all from real life northhampton.

Bear in mind that Bubbles has admitted that she is a pariah in both the AI and human communities. A doctor "might" be able to help Bubbles, but what about the patients who might be triggered by the sight of a combat unit AI? Admittedly, I say this because as I have said a couple of times, Bubbles has the look of a flensed body, which is terrifying.

It's a shitty reasoning, but it's also shitty to be in the position that Bubbles has found herself in. And it's shitty that hundreds, if not thousands of veterans cannot avail themselves of the various VA facilities, but they themselves might have reasons not to go to them.

sitnspin · « **Reply #41 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 20:53 »

If the military disavowed her entirely, she may not even be eligible for VA benefits. Plus, it's likely her period of service predated the legislation that gave AI full rights.

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #42 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 21:45 »

She might not have been regular military. Some kind of deniable CIA team is a possibility.

WoaLG · « **Reply #43 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 21:53 »

There's a bit of talk about VAs and therapists so far in this thread, but I do wonder if maybe that's just not something that's available for AIs in this world as a whole?

As far as I can tell from this comic, AIs are legally equal, but are generally ignored by most people in the QC universe (main cast obviously excepted because of how much time they spend around the different AnthroPCs). I wonder if anybody has bothered to actually create those kind of services for AIs?

Bubbles has just explained that their minds work in a fundamentally different way than human minds, so it seems probable that our normal methods of treating humans might not work on AIs.

Gyrre · « **Reply #44 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 23:27 »

Quote from: Morituri on 19 Dec 2016, 18:53

Okay, I just want to say something here.

VA Hospitals in the US are better than that!

I mean, I know they have problems, I know the paperwork jungle gets hip deep at times, I know their scheduling is right out of Kafka, I know that sometimes they have limited access to the most recent drugs and there are legal barriers to holding them accountable for malpractice, and all of that. Okay, I know that. They're run by a bureaucracy. That's kind of a given.

But scrapped program or no scrapped program, classified operational details or none, injuries received in action while operating under orders - even if the orders were wrong, stupid, or illegal - is what they are there to deal with and unless something VERY wrong is going on in the QC-verse they don't turn away from it.

"Never disclose operational details" means that the people you'll be talking over your problems with will have to have clearance, but VA hospitals will go to whatever lengths they have to go to to get someone involved in treatment appropriate clearance. PTSD is NOT a joke to those guys.

And there's a major VA hospital not far at all from real life northhampton.

That depends entirely on the location. I think she's saying that the whole operation got marked black ops and classified top secret.

I watched my best friend's father die slow death due to complications from emphysema and in infection in a broken toe. The VA told him he didn't have emphysema, gave him the cheapest antibiotics they could, anpassedlittle more than an asprin regime for the plaque psoriosis that engulfed half of his body from head to toe (other foot) by the time he passed.

BenRG · « **Reply #45 on:** 19 Dec 2016, 23:44 »

Sometimes I hate being right and this is one of those times.

As I suspected, when she was demobilised, Bubbles got the Vietnam treatment. The general public looked upon her as an immoral monster to be shunned and the government looked on her as an embarrassment to be actively denied and swept under the carpet. Because no-one felt the moral responsibility to help her (indeed, the most self-righteous probably felt a moral responsibility to harm her), she got no help. Much to the authorities disappointed surprise, having no other options, she became part of the criminal underworld rather than finding a corner to quietly die in, something that they would have preferred as it would have saved them further embarrassment.

I'm thinking that, yeah, Uncle Sugar would be annoyed if they knew Corpse Witch had access to the data on those blacker-than-black 'never happened' missions Bubbles was in and the likely Bill of Rights-defiling terms under which AI soldiers were treated. That is likely what she is holding over Bubbles. I can't see any way out of this that ends well for Bubbles and includes Corpse Witch remaining functional with her memory intact.

All of this because politicians' first instinct is to cover up to save their careers and reputations and too many people's first instinct is to condemn and ostracise because it makes them feel like they're morally superior. I'm sure that they'd try to prosecute Bubbles for war crimes if they could whilst the politicians who put her in the position where she was fighting for her life and the life of her friends and led to some arguably bad decisions continue to enjoy immunity, impunity and wealth provided by the State, various foreign tyrannies and the corporate world.

Sorry; it's just that things like this disgust me beyond words.

Scarblac · « **Reply #46 on:** 20 Dec 2016, 00:53 »

Apparently the memories are still inside her head, just partitioned off.

Does Faye know about Hannelore's dad?

NyxDarkness · « **Reply #47 on:** 20 Dec 2016, 01:22 »

First off, whatever operation Bubbles and her team were on, the government is treating it as though it didn't happen. They are not going to give her any aid, that would be admitting that something happened in the first place.

Second, My family has dealt with VA hospitals for a long time, and I can say with confidence that they always give you the run around, even if your sevice and the termination of such was valid.

Third, Would treatment of PTSD even be available for an AI? Does therapy work as it does with humans? Even for humans, therapy doesn't always work, and when it does, sometimes it is a very thin cover that can break easily, in some cases.
A person can do a fair amount of damage if they have a breakdown. Imagine if that was a near 8 foot killing machine going on a rampage.

I am worried for Bubbles. As she said, she was desperate by this time. Maybe going to Corpse Witch was her only option. Maybe tampering of an AI consciousness is outlawed and that's why she's hiding. Maybe the government has changed its mind concerning her freedom and really is after her. Or maybe the entire idea is a fabrication from CW, implanted to keep Bubbles under her thumb.
I will definitely be interesting to see where Jeph takes us.

DashaBlade · « **Reply #48 on:** 20 Dec 2016, 01:22 »

I'm just going to say that from my experiences with the VA, I'm actually unsurprised that they didn't help her. After all, she's not human. (And also female.)

I won't go into too many details, but when I was active duty, I almost died thanks to a military hospital. I was fortunate that a civilian hospital admitted me and gave me the treatment I needed. And it took me a year and a half to get the military to even pay for my hospital admission, because there was a "suitable hospital" on base.

Given that the standard joke when I was in is that military hospitals use doctors that are too crappy to have a civilian practice, and the VA uses doctors that are too crappy to work in a military hospital, I don't think it's that much of a stretch to think that the VA was substandard in their treatment of a non-human too.

TinPenguin · « **Reply #49 on:** 20 Dec 2016, 01:47 »

And if her service was pre-civil rights, as sitnspin suggested, I can imagine an attitude of, 'pff, you're a robot, what problems could you possibly have?'

THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)

Poll

What awaits us this week?

Author Topic: WCDT Strips 3376 - 3380 (19th to 23rd December 2016) (Read 34668 times)

TheEvilDog

TheEvilDog