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What will Ardent's answer reveal?

Exactly what he said, a friend hacked the transporter console and he woke up on Earth.
It was actually someone no one ever heard of that promised this and Alice was wrong about the Praeses.
The Praeses are playing dumb and Laridia is just there to convince them they had nothing to do with Ardent going to Earth.
There's actually a rogue element among the Praeses in cahoots with a mysterious 3rd party.
Nothing.  Spookybot will wake up suddenly and realize this was all just a nightmare.

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Author Topic: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?  (Read 50882 times)

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #100 on: 05 Jul 2017, 15:09 »

No one has any need to kill Pate - he's lost his weapon and is now powerless.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #101 on: 05 Jul 2017, 15:11 »

Pffft, need.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #102 on: 05 Jul 2017, 15:16 »

He'll be more hurt by being ignored.   Boo-hoo.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #103 on: 05 Jul 2017, 15:19 »

No one has any need to kill Pate - he's lost his weapon and is now powerless.

As can be inferred from Sitnspin's comment, at this stage its not so much need as more like a cathartic release for him being such a colossal douche with all the charm, likeability and personality of a diseased slug and that popping his head like an overripe pimple would be doing the universe a favour.

Really, just such an insightful comment Sitnspin, thank you for that.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #104 on: 05 Jul 2017, 15:39 »

No one has any need to kill Pate - he's lost his weapon and is now powerless.
Mmm, remember Pate was the only one Laridia didn't list as being potentially dangerous...
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #105 on: 05 Jul 2017, 15:49 »

Really, just such an insightful comment Sitnspin, thank you for that.

Always happy to please.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #106 on: 05 Jul 2017, 15:55 »

Sedna's thinkyblob is intact and Church's isn't.  She has a better chance, depending on resilience to exsanguination.  Might not be a whole lot though.

Also, when he was sealed in magma, his armor was fully up.  The stabbyholes were in exposed flesh. Sorry, first stabbyhole was through armor.  Still penetrated, but the kill shot is the second.  Church is gone gone, Sedna still bleeding out which may or may not be kill.
« Last Edit: 05 Jul 2017, 16:19 by Celly »
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #107 on: 05 Jul 2017, 16:26 »

As can be inferred from Sitnspin's comment, at this stage its not so much need as more like a cathartic release for him being such a colossal douche with all the charm, likeability and personality of a diseased slug and that popping his head like an overripe pimple would be doing the universe a favour.

It's like you just described Renee.  :-P

I know Renee is unpopular, but surely comparing her to Pate is a bit much. She's not a psychopath.
edit: brain fart
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #108 on: 05 Jul 2017, 16:28 »

Where is Laridia in all this?

Also, subscribing to the idea that the "real" world is just another simulation.  See also: "ontologically identical to the reality we currently inhabit"

But are they layered or parallel?  Embodiment is simple if the Praeses have admin access to the "outer" reality...  Are the Praeses manifestations/extensions of higher reality being(s), or have they "hacked" the outer reality from within to control it at a fundamental level?
« Last Edit: 05 Jul 2017, 19:02 by Celly »
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #109 on: 05 Jul 2017, 17:05 »

He'll be more hurt by being ignored.   Boo-hoo.

He is not even a little fish in this sized pond. More like a bit of algae.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #110 on: 05 Jul 2017, 17:23 »

Wow. I...missed a lot in this past week or so. Just caught up on this thread. I wonder why Jeph is so ready for this to end.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #111 on: 05 Jul 2017, 17:40 »

The only thing that disappointed me about this comic was we didn't get to see Pate's face as he realises he has lost all his power and leverage. I cannot wait for the next comic for this reason. Honestly he is so use to being in charge and powerful I can see him still acting like he has the upper hand and everyone should be afraid of him because he runs a little town back on earth.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #112 on: 05 Jul 2017, 17:49 »

Where is Laridia in all this?

The eight frames since Pate told Church he was "off his leash" represent only a few seconds in real time.  Laridia hasn't had time to respond.

While Jesper may not be the most obnoxious autocrat around, it's a cinch that he has plenty of enemies back home, and his life isn't worth a plugged nickle if he returns without Church.  If Elmer is dead or too damaged to be useful Pate will be begging Laridia for asylum, even if it means being discorporated and reduced to JESPER.EXE.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #113 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:27 »

He'll be more hurt by being ignored.   Boo-hoo.

Everyone there was a witness to Ellie's death, if memory serves. Gavia was threatened with torture. Alice was enslaved.

Ignoring Pate is not on their agenda.

Sparing his life would require an out-of-character surge of spiritual enlightenment.

He's an imminent corpse unless someone saves him.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #114 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:29 »

At first I thought "now wait just a goldurn minute here" (yes I do actually think like that). Church is so invulnerable that Alice originally had to bury him in lava to stop him, so Sedna just stabs him  a couple times and he falls over? Then it hit me: just as only a diamond can cut a diamond, perhaps only a jagged bit of super-soldier can cut another super-soldier. That is some SERIOUS material they're constructed out of.  If Alice had been willing to use a chunk of herself as a weapon, maybe she could have taken down Church earlier.

 I too hope Sedna survives, but that's not the way to bet. Perhaps her sacrifice will impress the Praeses.

Pretty sure Church is toast after that brain strike through the eye, unless they keep their brains elsewhere.

That's why I fear the worst for Sedna.  If this was a possibility then why not do it sooner?  Sure the immortals have survived some seriously lethal damage, but perhaps losing a limb or piercing the brain is the Achilles Heel or silver bullet.  That could be why Alice didn't do this during the last fight because if she failed she'd die and no one could hope to stop Church.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #115 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:31 »

Wow. I...missed a lot in this past week or so. Just caught up on this thread. I wonder why Jeph is so ready for this to end.

I think it's a pacing thing. Take the simulation bombshell, or Sedna killing Church. If these were drawn out as weekly comics, we as readers would suffer due to our habit of overanalysing things and forming expectations or interpretations. Daily comics let us experience the comics as they come, which is closer to how they would be read in print. Waiting for the pay-off of Sedna ripping her own arm out wouldn't be nearly as exciting if we had to wait until next week to see her do Church a murder. That's important in webcomic writing, where sections which would be fine in print can drag when you're waiting for updates.
No, I mean, I wonder why he's ending it at all.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #116 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:33 »

HOLY SHIT!!!


That is all
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #117 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:38 »

No, I mean, I wonder why he's ending it at all.

If I remember correctly, back when Alice Grove started, Jeph said that it was a story he had rolling around his head for some time. It was always going to be a side project rather than something on the scale of QC, and its getting to the point where the story has been told and there's no reason to continue it.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #118 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:42 »

He'll be more hurt by being ignored.   Boo-hoo.

Everyone there was a witness to Ellie's death, if memory serves. Gavia was threatened with torture. Alice was enslaved.

Ignoring Pate is not on their agenda.

Sparing his life would require an out-of-character surge of spiritual enlightenment.

He's an imminent corpse unless someone saves him.

TL;DR - He needs killin' ...
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #119 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:43 »

there's no reason to continue it.
There are so many reasons! But alas, 'tis his story.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #120 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:44 »

My problem is that I'm getting a real "rocks fall, everyone dies" feel for this ending.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #121 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:48 »

there's no reason to continue it.
There are so many reasons!

No, there aren't. The only reason one tells a story is to let it be known. And Jeph probably feels that he has told the story he wanted to tell. Why continue when its completed its sole purpose? A good story and a better storyteller knows when to end and this has been a very good story and Jeph has been an even better storyteller.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #122 on: 05 Jul 2017, 18:52 »

Where is Laridia in all this?

While Jesper may not be the most obnoxious autocrat around, it's a cinch that he has plenty of enemies back home, and his life isn't worth a plugged nickle if he returns without Church.  If Elmer is dead or too damaged to be useful Pate will be begging Laridia for asylum, even if it means being discorporated and reduced to JESPER.EXE.

Well it's good enough for Corpse Witch.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #123 on: 05 Jul 2017, 19:01 »

Sparing his life would require an out-of-character surge of spiritual enlightenment.
Enter Ardent.  He's the most dynamic character of the bunch and Jeph has him moving from foolish youth to wise young man.  If anyone advocates for clemency for either Pate or Church, it'll be him.

That's why I fear the worst for Sedna.  If this was a possibility then why not do it sooner?

This is the first time Church has dropped his guard.  Sedna's been watching and waiting since he killed Ellie.  He let himself get distracted by his desire for revenge and Sedna struck.

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Celly

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #124 on: 05 Jul 2017, 19:04 »

Where is Laridia in all this?

The eight frames since Pate told Church he was "off his leash" represent only a few seconds in real time.  Laridia hasn't had time to respond.

While Jesper may not be the most obnoxious autocrat around, it's a cinch that he has plenty of enemies back home, and his life isn't worth a plugged nickle if he returns without Church.  If Elmer is dead or too damaged to be useful Pate will be begging Laridia for asylum, even if it means being discorporated and reduced to JESPER.EXE.
Laridia is the embodiment of an AI that is running multiple universe simulations.  "A few seconds" is an eternity with that processing power.
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WareWolf

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #125 on: 05 Jul 2017, 19:05 »

At first I thought "now wait just a goldurn minute here" (yes I do actually think like that). Church is so invulnerable that Alice originally had to bury him in lava to stop him, so Sedna just stabs him  a couple times and he falls over? Then it hit me: just as only a diamond can cut a diamond, perhaps only a jagged bit of super-soldier can cut another super-soldier. That is some SERIOUS material they're constructed out of.  If Alice had been willing to use a chunk of herself as a weapon, maybe she could have taken down Church earlier.

 I too hope Sedna survives, but that's not the way to bet. Perhaps her sacrifice will impress the Praeses.

Pretty sure Church is toast after that brain strike through the eye, unless they keep their brains elsewhere.

That's why I fear the worst for Sedna.  If this was a possibility then why not do it sooner?  Sure the immortals have survived some seriously lethal damage, but perhaps losing a limb or piercing the brain is the Achilles Heel or silver bullet.  That could be why Alice didn't do this during the last fight because if she failed she'd die and no one could hope to stop Church.

Makes sense. This is Sedna taking a last desperate chance. A last extremity, even.
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Celly

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #126 on: 05 Jul 2017, 19:07 »

Wow. I...missed a lot in this past week or so. Just caught up on this thread. I wonder why Jeph is so ready for this to end.

I think it's a pacing thing. Take the simulation bombshell, or Sedna killing Church. If these were drawn out as weekly comics, we as readers would suffer due to our habit of overanalysing things and forming expectations or interpretations. Daily comics let us experience the comics as they come, which is closer to how they would be read in print. Waiting for the pay-off of Sedna ripping her own arm out wouldn't be nearly as exciting if we had to wait until next week to see her do Church a murder. That's important in webcomic writing, where sections which would be fine in print can drag when you're waiting for updates.
No, I mean, I wonder why he's ending it at all.

I wish it would go on as well.  But I have a feeling that this was planned to the end before he even inked the first strip.  Read the early strips and you see him planting seeds for the bombshells being dropped here at the end.  I think this is part of the vision, it's going to form a complete story as intended.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #127 on: 05 Jul 2017, 19:13 »

Sparing his life would require an out-of-character surge of spiritual enlightenment.
Enter Ardent.  He's the most dynamic character of the bunch and Jeph has him moving from foolish youth to wise young man.  If anyone advocates for clemency for either Pate or Church, it'll be him.

That's why I fear the worst for Sedna.  If this was a possibility then why not do it sooner?

This is the first time Church has dropped his guard.  Sedna's been watching and waiting since he killed Ellie.  He let himself get distracted by his desire for revenge and Sedna struck.

Suddenly Sedna's promise to Ardent "As soon as I figure out a way to put [Church] on a spike I'm gonna do it" takes on a horrifying new meaning.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #128 on: 05 Jul 2017, 20:14 »

Can't wait to see Pate's face... :D
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #129 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:08 »

Hmmm. :/
I'm kind of disappointed by this resolution, mostly because every part of it is so implausible that instead of feeling like "Oh, that's such a cool thing to do with the scenario presented!", I'm just thinking, "... What?"

Firstly, if Supersoldier Bones that were randomly broken into shards made a strong enough knife to punch through Supersoldier Armor, why wasn't Alice just armed with a bone knife when she fought him before the Blink? Don't bury him, stab him to death. (Or bury him, uncover the top of his head, THEN stab him to death.)
Second, we've seen that Church is MUCH faster than Alice (being able to cross several paces before Alice can move her arm two feet(, who in turn is - if not faster - at least stronger than Sedna. So either 1, why wasn't Church running at anywhere near top speed, or 2, how dod Sedna suddenly run faster than him?
Third, Laridia is clearly not scared of Church, even remotely: She views him as a minor potential nuisance. Based on this, it seems unlikely that a fight could break out at all.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #130 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:09 »

Sedna...

I am heartbroken.  :cry:
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #131 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:30 »

Was not expecting that...here I thought she was going to gut Pate.

Love the silhouette panels.

Quote
My problem is that I'm getting a real "rocks fall, everyone dies" feel for this ending.
We still haven't seen an inkling of what the laserblast to the moon was or what it did.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #132 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:45 »

This is the first time Church has dropped his guard.  Sedna's been watching and waiting since he killed Ellie.  He let himself get distracted by his desire for revenge and Sedna struck.
Also "Put on a spike" from that particular strip.  Evidently Sedna meant that a little more literally than it seemed.

But poor Alice. What is her reaction to Sedna's death going to be?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #133 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:46 »

Hmmm. :/
I'm kind of disappointed by this resolution, mostly because every part of it is so implausible that instead of feeling like "Oh, that's such a cool thing to do with the scenario presented!", I'm just thinking, "... What?"

Firstly, if Supersoldier Bones that were randomly broken into shards made a strong enough knife to punch through Supersoldier Armor, why wasn't Alice just armed with a bone knife when she fought him before the Blink? Don't bury him, stab him to death. (Or bury him, uncover the top of his head, THEN stab him to death.)
Second, we've seen that Church is MUCH faster than Alice (being able to cross several paces before Alice can move her arm two feet(, who in turn is - if not faster - at least stronger than Sedna. So either 1, why wasn't Church running at anywhere near top speed, or 2, how dod Sedna suddenly run faster than him?
Third, Laridia is clearly not scared of Church, even remotely: She views him as a minor potential nuisance. Based on this, it seems unlikely that a fight could break out at all.

I would say that if we were to crudely equate the super soldiers to something similar, then Church is a dreadnought, Alice is a cruiser and Sedna is a destroyer. Church is the powerhouse that needs to build up speed, Alice is the jack-of-all-trades, while Sedna is brings firepower beyond her comparative size. Essentially, The destroyer rammed the dreadnought and took it down.

As for Laridia? Easy. She's a modern day aircraft carrier compared to their WWI prowess. As in she's got the reach and damage potential the others can only dream of.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #134 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:47 »

I wonder: was the blink the moment when the Praeces took over? Humankind had wiped itself out, and everything thereafter is a simulation intended to provide some form of life in a completely sterilized world?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #135 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:51 »

This is the first time Church has dropped his guard.  Sedna's been watching and waiting since he killed Ellie.  He let himself get distracted by his desire for revenge and Sedna struck.
Also "Put on a spike" from that particular strip.  Evidently Sedna meant that a little more literally than it seemed.

But poor Alice. What is her reaction to Sedna's death going to be?

That's part of what is just breaking my heart right now. Alice and Sedna go way back, knew each other for thousands of years, and now Sedna is just gone. Alice has lived so long and seen people she cared for pass away, but Sedna was still with her.

I'm sorry, I am probably the only one losing it over this but I am totally heartbroken, I didn't see this coming at all.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #136 on: 05 Jul 2017, 21:53 »

I wanted them all to be together and safe in the end, and clearly that just isn't going to happen.  :-(

I know that isn't realistic, but...sigh.

And what is it going to do to Gavia to know that taking the knife out of Pate's heart caused this to happen...
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #137 on: 05 Jul 2017, 22:08 »

Second, we've seen that Church is MUCH faster than Alice (being able to cross several paces before Alice can move her arm two feet(, who in turn is - if not faster - at least stronger than Sedna. So either 1, why wasn't Church running at anywhere near top speed, or 2, how dod Sedna suddenly run faster than him?

Both Pate and Church were anticipating an attack when Alice moved to kill Pate and were ready for her.  If Church's attention had been on Sedna, she probably would not have gotten to him in one piece - make that two pieces.  But, he was focused on (presumably) Alice and probably thinking up a 5,000 year torment to inflict upon her and didn't remember/bother to check his six.  (Note the contrast between Church's normal flat affect poker face versus his shark smile whenever he's attacking Alice.)  For Sedna it was now-or-never - she saw her chance to kill the bastard and went for it.
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mikmaxs

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #138 on: 05 Jul 2017, 22:49 »

Second, we've seen that Church is MUCH faster than Alice (being able to cross several paces before Alice can move her arm two feet(, who in turn is - if not faster - at least stronger than Sedna. So either 1, why wasn't Church running at anywhere near top speed, or 2, how dod Sedna suddenly run faster than him?

Both Pate and Church were anticipating an attack when Alice moved to kill Pate and were ready for her.  If Church's attention had been on Sedna, she probably would not have gotten to him in one piece - make that two pieces.  But, he was focused on (presumably) Alice and probably thinking up a 5,000 year torment to inflict upon her and didn't remember/bother to check his six.  (Note the contrast between Church's normal flat affect poker face versus his shark smile whenever he's attacking Alice.)  For Sedna it was now-or-never - she saw her chance to kill the bastard and went for it.
Take a closer look at that comic. It's hard to tell exactly the real distances, but based off of the character's scale relative to one another, Alice is a couple of paces - five or six feet- at most behind Pate, and Church is WELL behind either of them, at least ten feet behind Alice.
In the time it takes Alice to leap forward five feet at top speed, Church doesn't just cross all the way over, and grab Alice's arm, he does it like it's nothing. He blurs, and suddenly his hand is gripping hers with enough strength to stop all of her forward momentum, without having to exert himself in the slightest - He's not leaning into the grab, or pushing her, he's just standing there without any leverage and he's still able to stop her cold.

Given this, Church is at least three times faster than Alice, and it is implied to be much more.

Meanwhile, when Church dives after Alice, Sedna has time to - While standing in one spot a couple of paces behind Church - Rip off her own arm, break it into two pieces with her mouth, and then chase down Church, when Church is sprinting forward at top speed in order to (presumably) finish off Alice.

I'm not saying that Sedna couldn't have snuck up behind him and/or taken him by surprise while he pounded Alice in the face over and over, I'm saying that, given the information we have learned from the comic, she couldn't possibly have chased him down. (Also: It was apparently a very loud crack when she broke her arm in half, which would presumably be something worth checking out, even to him.)


I would say that if we were to crudely equate the super soldiers to something similar, then Church is a dreadnought, Alice is a cruiser and Sedna is a destroyer. Church is the powerhouse that needs to build up speed, Alice is the jack-of-all-trades, while Sedna is brings firepower beyond her comparative size. Essentially, The destroyer rammed the dreadnought and took it down.

As for Laridia? Easy. She's a modern day aircraft carrier compared to their WWI prowess. As in she's got the reach and damage potential the others can only dream of.
That doesn't really solve much, though. My point about Laridia was easily the weakest, so I could buy that she just didn't react quickly enough before the melee went down, but we've clearly seen that these characters are effectively indestructible, with Church being completely unphased by literally everything else up to this point. Alice uses a weapon that we can presume is specifically designed for her to use against other super-soldiers, and then hits him with an orbital space cannon exterminatus beam laser, and all it does is trap him Rita Repulsa style. A splintery bone should not be better at cutting through armor than an actual weapon.
And even if Sedna is faster than Alice, there's no reason for her to be THAT MUCH faster, and we've clearly seen that Church does not need to build up speed - He catches Alice without breaking a sweat, literally blurring through the air. According to the information given by Sedna, she's a support grunt, while Alice and Church are much more powerful. Sedna is not even a soldier, or at least not one that was designed to see front-line combat.
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brasca

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #139 on: 05 Jul 2017, 22:56 »

Hmmm. :/
I'm kind of disappointed by this resolution, mostly because every part of it is so implausible that instead of feeling like "Oh, that's such a cool thing to do with the scenario presented!", I'm just thinking, "... What?"

Firstly, if Supersoldier Bones that were randomly broken into shards made a strong enough knife to punch through Supersoldier Armor, why wasn't Alice just armed with a bone knife when she fought him before the Blink? Don't bury him, stab him to death. (Or bury him, uncover the top of his head, THEN stab him to death.)
Second, we've seen that Church is MUCH faster than Alice (being able to cross several paces before Alice can move her arm two feet(, who in turn is - if not faster - at least stronger than Sedna. So either 1, why wasn't Church running at anywhere near top speed, or 2, how dod Sedna suddenly run faster than him?
Third, Laridia is clearly not scared of Church, even remotely: She views him as a minor potential nuisance. Based on this, it seems unlikely that a fight could break out at all.

When Alice fought Church 5000 years ago it was probably before the Blink and her superiors might've ordered her to leave him buried in magma so they could reuse him later.  After the Blink there was no one that knew he was there except Alice who I doubt wanted to go to the trouble to kill him.  As for why he didn't move at top speed I believe Gavia was the target and there was no need to move so quickly.  She was the only one who could put Pate in check in such a way that Church could do nothing.  The rest could be killed at his leisure.
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mikmaxs

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #140 on: 05 Jul 2017, 23:01 »

Hmmm. :/
I'm kind of disappointed by this resolution, mostly because every part of it is so implausible that instead of feeling like "Oh, that's such a cool thing to do with the scenario presented!", I'm just thinking, "... What?"

Firstly, if Supersoldier Bones that were randomly broken into shards made a strong enough knife to punch through Supersoldier Armor, why wasn't Alice just armed with a bone knife when she fought him before the Blink? Don't bury him, stab him to death. (Or bury him, uncover the top of his head, THEN stab him to death.)
Second, we've seen that Church is MUCH faster than Alice (being able to cross several paces before Alice can move her arm two feet(, who in turn is - if not faster - at least stronger than Sedna. So either 1, why wasn't Church running at anywhere near top speed, or 2, how dod Sedna suddenly run faster than him?
Third, Laridia is clearly not scared of Church, even remotely: She views him as a minor potential nuisance. Based on this, it seems unlikely that a fight could break out at all.

When Alice fought Church 5000 years ago it was probably before the Blink and her superiors might've ordered her to leave him buried in magma so they could reuse him later.  After the Blink there was no one that knew he was there except Alice who I doubt wanted to go to the trouble to kill him.  As for why he didn't move at top speed I believe Gavia was the target and there was no need to move so quickly.  She was the only one who could put Pate in check in such a way that Church could do nothing.  The rest could be killed at his leisure.
HE GOT HIT WITH A SPACE LASER. That's not 'Let's leave him alive but incapacitated', that's 'We are hitting him with literally the most powerful weapon we have in our arsenal.'

Also: There's no frames of reference to be certain of this, but every single panel that shoes Church moving implies that he's rocketing forward at top speed, not taking his leisurely time. Keep in mind that he has to kill Gavia before she can get her nanobots inside Pate again - He'd be wanting to get that done immediately, before anything could slow him down. (It apparently takes no time to use the Nanobots, so he had until gavia saw him moving. That's a tiny window of time, and he seemed eager to kill.)
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #141 on: 06 Jul 2017, 00:32 »

What kind of kamikaze mode might the super-soldiers have?

Alice has some internal power source that can deliver enough energy to break large amounts of reinforced concrete, in a fraction of a second. Can it be shorted out?
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mikmaxs

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #142 on: 06 Jul 2017, 03:47 »

Two things:

1) I think that the Sedna arm rip comic showed something which in all likelihood took less than a second of actual time.

2) Nobody seems to have brought this up, but I think Sedna probably went full throttle after Church, and that exertion may have burnt her out. Otherwise, I think losing an arm would be nothing more than a flesh wound. She's not trying to conserve herself at this point, and I think that Church's general lack of restraint is a big part of the difference between him and Alice.
1: Well sure, but Church has been seen to pass fifteen to twenty feet of space in an eyeblink without effort.
2: If the super soldiers have some kind of 'Overclocking mode' that allows them to increase their capabilities somehow, that's really something that the author should explain before the climax of his story.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #143 on: 06 Jul 2017, 05:22 »

Or Sedna is fast but weak.  Could be due to the support role she was designed for that they would prioritize allowing her to escape from bigger threats.  Dump all stat points in speed, possibly making her faster than Church.
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brasca

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #144 on: 06 Jul 2017, 06:31 »

Hmmm. :/
I'm kind of disappointed by this resolution, mostly because every part of it is so implausible that instead of feeling like "Oh, that's such a cool thing to do with the scenario presented!", I'm just thinking, "... What?"

Firstly, if Supersoldier Bones that were randomly broken into shards made a strong enough knife to punch through Supersoldier Armor, why wasn't Alice just armed with a bone knife when she fought him before the Blink? Don't bury him, stab him to death. (Or bury him, uncover the top of his head, THEN stab him to death.)
Second, we've seen that Church is MUCH faster than Alice (being able to cross several paces before Alice can move her arm two feet(, who in turn is - if not faster - at least stronger than Sedna. So either 1, why wasn't Church running at anywhere near top speed, or 2, how dod Sedna suddenly run faster than him?
Third, Laridia is clearly not scared of Church, even remotely: She views him as a minor potential nuisance. Based on this, it seems unlikely that a fight could break out at all.

When Alice fought Church 5000 years ago it was probably before the Blink and her superiors might've ordered her to leave him buried in magma so they could reuse him later.  After the Blink there was no one that knew he was there except Alice who I doubt wanted to go to the trouble to kill him.  As for why he didn't move at top speed I believe Gavia was the target and there was no need to move so quickly.  She was the only one who could put Pate in check in such a way that Church could do nothing.  The rest could be killed at his leisure.
HE GOT HIT WITH A SPACE LASER. That's not 'Let's leave him alive but incapacitated', that's 'We are hitting him with literally the most powerful weapon we have in our arsenal.'

And if her superiors wanted Church dead they would've given her a knife made out one of her comrade's bones.  They didn't which is why I theorize that like a lot of military organizations they wanted to capture a powerful weapon rather than destroy it. 

 
Also: There's no frames of reference to be certain of this, but every single panel that shoes Church moving implies that he's rocketing forward at top speed, not taking his leisurely time. Keep in mind that he has to kill Gavia before she can get her nanobots inside Pate again - He'd be wanting to get that done immediately, before anything could slow him down. (It apparently takes no time to use the Nanobots, so he had until gavia saw him moving. That's a tiny window of time, and he seemed eager to kill.)

I'll admit that I'm not entirely sure the position of everybody, but consider their location.  It's like a big tube or root.  Now if Church ran at Gavia at full speed he would squash her in a nano second, however, at such high speeds he would go up the wall over the ceiling and down the other like a motorcycle on one of those loops.  And by doing so there is the possibility that he would smash right into Pate at full speed killing his master in the process.  Because of their location I think he chose to attack at a speed that was faster than anything Gavia could avoid, but dangerous to the one person he's supposed to protect. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #145 on: 06 Jul 2017, 07:18 »

I was trying to fanwank this resolution into coherence in my head before I decided to fall back on Hodgson's Law.  Then I re-entered the wank zone and figured if the current reality is also a sim, maybe whoever is pulling the strings wanted Church's cut and Sedna was a handy and humerus option to do the cutting.  The fact that she got a very satisfying revenge leads me to fear a sadder turn in the next few days for the survivors. 

Baseless pondering:  I wonder if Ardent and Gavia are going to have to make a decision like at the end of Mass Effect 3 (and countless other things I'm sure, but I know Jeph is a giant ME fan) where they can direct the future of the simulations with their discontinuity.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #146 on: 06 Jul 2017, 08:33 »

Whatever else, and whatever else  might occur, it could only be an assumption Pate  isn't needed for anything or that he doesn't have something up his sleeve.   

As far as that and more goes, Gavia has probably lost power and anger, Ardent is not too proactive or emotional to begin with.  Either way, seems Gavia and Ardent might kind of be out of commission while trying to think themselves out of the corner of the box.   Alice is rather not feeling well.     Sedna is if not dead is very used up for at least a long while, and it would appear Church has been firmly dispatched.   Laridia isn't really involved in this directly, and is a sort of ad hoc temporary interface system anyway.    The only one who is still largely untouched is the only actual human (probably maybe) but what can Pate do but be scared of his ex-hostages.    Maybe nothing else.  Or perhaps he thinks he can still get his answers without forcing others to do things and they'll do nothing to him.

What will Alice perhaps do to Pate, then.  Or will she just wait for Laridia (Ardent, Gavia) to do something or say something, or go to check on or help Sedna, or to make sure about Church.   Either way,  Pate seems no rush if he's no harm or just some revenge target.   Alice might only think of him as a joke who at one point happened to have a Church.  Or might think that he threatened her and hers, and now must be removed.   Sure, it's not impossible that  Ardent or Gavia will do something, or even Pate to them, or that something involving Laridia or the trees might happen, Pate involved or not.       
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #147 on: 06 Jul 2017, 08:34 »

Sedna was a handy and humerus option to do the cutting. 
Please tell me that was a brilliant pun on 'humorous".  Please tell me that...
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #148 on: 06 Jul 2017, 09:03 »

Or Sedna is fast but weak.  Could be due to the support role she was designed for that they would prioritize allowing her to escape from bigger threats.  Dump all stat points in speed, possibly making her faster than Church.

Remembering back to Alice and Sedna's fight Ardent remarked that she was fast, but Gavia countered that Alice was faster.  And seeing as how Church stopped her from ramming her hand through the back of Pate's head it  would seem that he is as fast as he is strong. 

And what is it going to do to Gavia to know that taking the knife out of Pate's heart caused this to happen...

If the existential crisis wasn't bad enough this could really cause her to snap.  She was shaken at the sight of Ellie's corpse and that was someone she just met and didn't care for much.  At the very least I got a mentor vibe between Gavia and Sedna.  Like X-Men First Class she'll have Pate exactly where Magneto had Sebastian Shaw and anything Ardent says will be ignored like Xavier's.   
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?
« Reply #149 on: 06 Jul 2017, 09:35 »

The best part about this is that it probably all happened in bullet-time, so from the point of view of everyone else (other than Alice, maybe), two people just instantly exploded in fountains of blood and collapsed. It's gonna look like a Shrike attack.
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