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Poll

Guesses to the first panel of each of this week's comics?

Amanda or Evie asks how long Faye and Bubbles have been dating
Evie has a horrible realization
Melon is their waitress and the bug thing was just a metaphor.
Evie apologizes to Bubbles back at U.R.
Melon reports back the next day that the "robo-penis" seems much happier and is "rather attached to Aurthur".
Amanda on the floor of Union Robtics laughing uncontrollably  followed by a flashback alluding to the above option.
Evie asks Bubbles to critic her presentation.
Melon invites Pintsize over to play with her new pet
Brun, Clinton, Elliott and Reneé standing in awkward silence.
Emily bumps into Melon as she's leaving Union Robotics
Steve eats cereal
Martin and Claire eat cereal
Marigold eats cereal for dinner

Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5]   Go Down

Author Topic: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)  (Read 30461 times)

Case

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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #200 on: 26 Jan 2018, 12:00 »

<stuff>

.......except I've never been part of a community before where if I don't use the right pronouns, I am denounced...maybe thats because in 40 years on this earth, I have still not met anybody who thinks they are so important they deserve their own pronouns.......

<more stuff>

This is the only thing I will say on this topic: It is possible to use too many ellipses.

(Yes, I'm aware of the irony implicit in me, of all people, pointing that out)
« Last Edit: 26 Jan 2018, 12:24 by Case »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #201 on: 26 Jan 2018, 12:06 »

I do think that this forum as a whole seems to very very quickly look for the worst in every new character introduced (sometimes inventing things that aren't even THERE. Seriously if half the stuff that offended the people on the forum was how they treated people they meet in real life, I can't imagine how they would ever have any friends).

It is honestly why I went back to lurking for a long time rather than ever posting. It is just tiring.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #202 on: 26 Jan 2018, 12:39 »

I have still not met anybody who thinks they are so important they deserve their own pronouns.......

This is the only thing I will say on this topic.
No one is so important that they deserve their own pronouns.
Everyone is important enough to deserve ordinary, decent respect in how they are seen and identified.
That is all its about, respect.
It is about respect. It is also about kindness and humanity.

My daughter is trans. I wrote a wall of text about how our culture is cruel to her  in ways both great and small, but I'm not posting it. It suffices to say that gender non-conforming people are ostracized, marginalized, and in danger every day of their lives.

Although we alone can only do so much to make those things better, there is one thing we can do, out of kindness if not out of respect. We can honor their names and pronouns.
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Case

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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #203 on: 26 Jan 2018, 12:42 »

sometimes inventing things that aren't even THERE. Seriously if half the stuff that offended the people on the forum was how they treated people they meet in real life, I can't imagine how they would ever have any friends.

Sooooh ... best to imply they're social outcasts that nobody wants to be around, so they have something real to be offended by?

P.S.: Is there anybody left who knows who 'those people' and ... the other 'those people' are? I think this Forum has a serious problem with 'Those people whoTM ...'-debates. Well, it is a problem if you're one of those people who wonder what would happen if all the people who complain the loudest about those other people whoTM who are being too easily offended (or the ones who 'like' the complaints of the people who are offended about the people who are too easily offended) discovered that most of the people who they thought were on their side were actually referring to them when they were talking about "those people whoTM ...". The "other people whoTM", of course.

Savvy?  :wink:

P.P.S.: That should about guarantee that everybody has a reason to suspect they might be implicated. And justified in being offended by it ...
« Last Edit: 26 Jan 2018, 12:49 by Case »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #204 on: 26 Jan 2018, 12:43 »

On the subject of pronouns: If someone identifies as a woman, I will use she/her, if they identify as a man, I will use he/him, if they identify as neither I will use they/them.

But I just can't memorize individual pronouns for every person who decides they need a new one. From a practical standpoint, and from the standpoint of I don't even know how xie is pronounced.

That was what I interpreted when the person said "their own pronouns", rather than saying they wouldn't identify a trans person by the gender they identify as.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #205 on: 26 Jan 2018, 12:48 »

sometimes inventing things that aren't even THERE. Seriously if half the stuff that offended the people on the forum was how they treated people they meet in real life, I can't imagine how they would ever have any friends.

Sooooh ... best to imply they're social outcasts that nobody wants to be around, so they have something real to be offended by?

No, it is implying that they treat the new characters more harshly than they do real people. Because I seriously doubt that anyone would feel that a real person was somehow in the wrong for just asking a few leading questions without pressuring the person to answer them in an attempt to get them to realize something. We've just as a whole gotten way more critical of people in this comic than I could imagine ever being with real people. Myself included! I've been involved in arguments in the past on these forums where I've done the same thing.

You look for malice where there is none.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #206 on: 26 Jan 2018, 13:10 »

sometimes inventing things that aren't even THERE. Seriously if half the stuff that offended the people on the forum was how they treated people they meet in real life, I can't imagine how they would ever have any friends.

Sooooh ... best to imply they're social outcasts that nobody wants to be around, so they have something real to be offended by?

No, it is implying that they treat the new characters more harshly than they do real people. Because I seriously doubt that anyone would feel that a real person was somehow in the wrong for just asking a few leading questions without pressuring the person to answer them in an attempt to get them to realize something. We've just as a whole gotten way more critical of people in this comic than I could imagine ever being with real people. Myself included! I've been involved in arguments in the past on these forums where I've done the same thing.

Fair enough.

You look for malice where there is none.

Who, like me specifically, looking for malice in your post, right now? No, I don't think you have much malice in you. Less than average, if anything, judging by what I've seen from you. It's an old Gamer-burn ("pWnED u, Noob!", "At least I have a life ..."), is all.

I do think that this is one of those periods when there's been strain in the community and everybody is kinda vaguely pissed with those people whoTM who are being too easily offended and feel that now is the time to voice their agreement with the people who've pointed out that they think that some peopleTM on this forum are too easily offended - and I'm pretty sure that many who are happy now to have someone to agree with would be very surprised if they knew who those they agreed with had in mind.
« Last Edit: 26 Jan 2018, 13:18 by Case »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #207 on: 26 Jan 2018, 13:20 »

Fair enough. I've been a bit prickly the last few days, just not doing well (I have caught what I refer to as "The Malaise", which is just that feeling of not enjoying anything and feeling listless and vaguely bad for no reason). I apologize if I come off as more critical or nasty than intended :)
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #208 on: 26 Jan 2018, 13:32 »

Fair enough. I've been a bit prickly the last few days, just not doing well (I have caught what I refer to as "The Malaise", which is just that feeling of not enjoying anything and feeling listless and vaguely bad for no reason). I apologize if I come off as more critical or nasty than intended :)

I don't think you have anything to apologize for - I think we have a cultural 'Those people whoTM'-problem that makes disagreements seem worse than they are, and the 'camps' seem larger than they are - which sometimes ends up in disagreements becoming worse than they need to be and many, many people feeling ill-treated. You just happened to be in front of my soapbox.

Hope The Malaise pisses off soon.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #209 on: 26 Jan 2018, 13:42 »

...And no, good drama doesn't require a conflict.

As Joe sniped me to saying... well, yes? Yes it does?

You're right that it doesn't need a villain to cause it, but... every story, period, requires conflict.

http://www.thewriteturn.com/kishotenketsu-the-four-act-narrative-or-the-plot-without-conflict/

"All drama needs conflict" is common knowledge. In western/european schools. That doesn't make it universal truth any more than any other euro-centric "truths" about civilization, social norms, etc.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #210 on: 26 Jan 2018, 14:14 »

 It might be that what I understand is different from what were talking about here, but that structure, interesting as it is, is narrative, but not drama to me, necessarily.

Plot and narrative without conflict are easy enough to imagine. Calling it drama, to me, does imply a certain kind of narrative, a certain genre, really.

 
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #211 on: 26 Jan 2018, 14:35 »

...And no, good drama doesn't require a conflict.

As Joe sniped me to saying... well, yes? Yes it does?

You're right that it doesn't need a villain to cause it, but... every story, period, requires conflict.

http://www.thewriteturn.com/kishotenketsu-the-four-act-narrative-or-the-plot-without-conflict/

"All drama needs conflict" is common knowledge. In western/european schools. That doesn't make it universal truth any more than any other euro-centric "truths" about civilization, social norms, etc.

What is conflict?

It is the opposition to the completion of a goal.

A character wants to be happy? What stands in the way of that goal?

Conflict is the process by which character development occurs, where a character has to reflect on their past and their actions in order to move forward. But more importantly, one can not separate the story from the conflict and vice versa, the fact is, they are mutually inclusive. Without conflict, there is no story to tell.

William Faulkner once wrote that the "Only thing worth writing about is the human heart in conflict with itself."

To put it another way, a story without conflict is like food without flavour, as that article puts it.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #212 on: 26 Jan 2018, 15:11 »

You're free to not like different styles of story.

That doesn't mean your preferred style is the only valid one.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #213 on: 26 Jan 2018, 15:21 »

Never said it was.

You are the one who seems to have a particular bugbear about the topic.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #214 on: 26 Jan 2018, 15:36 »

It should be pointed out that even in stories based on the Kishotenketsu structure, conflict is often present. Just because the structure is not based around conflict like in the three-act western structure, does not mean that conflict is nonexistent in the stories.

To be honest, human existence without conflict rarely exists. Managing to write something with literally no conflict would be difficult, just because it would be so foreign to the human experience.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #215 on: 26 Jan 2018, 15:57 »

I do think that this forum as a whole seems to very very quickly look for the worst in every new character introduced (sometimes inventing things that aren't even THERE. Seriously if half the stuff that offended the people on the forum was how they treated people they meet in real life, I can't imagine how they would ever have any friends).

It is honestly why I went back to lurking for a long time rather than ever posting. It is just tiring.

I know what you're talking about.

Some fraction, I don't know how much, is an unintended effect of how well Jeph writes. With a few words and a few pictures he makes characters real enough to remind forum-goers of real people from their pasts. Then his readers respond with the same emotions they felt toward the person from the past. Sometimes those feelings are at traumatic levels of intensity.

EDIT: on top of that, the game of overanalyzing everything can make us lose perspective. I step back, I stop over-thinking Evie, and I see the fact is the the last few days have had me laughing out loud on every strip.
« Last Edit: 26 Jan 2018, 22:28 by Is it cold in here? »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #216 on: 27 Jan 2018, 01:23 »

These fora could use a heavy dose of the MST3K mantra, and I don't mean the bit about Tilly getting shot into space.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #217 on: 27 Jan 2018, 06:29 »

Adding to the current meta-discussion, I've also been baffled by the response to Evie*; less so regarding the initial dislike - she did demonstrate a certain lack of social grace, which probably struck a chord with some people more so than with me because I've been lucky enough not to have my lived experiences talked about like that - but more so regarding the following analysis of her entire character and motivations. It seemed as if people were almost starting to see her as some sort of "intellectual terror", an academic completely out of touch with ethics and basic decency, solely fuelled by her desire to further her research. (Obviously this is an exaggerated image of people's reactions to her, but not, I'll argue, an unfounded one.) We have barely met this character, and so we are sorely lacking the necessary amount of data for any sort of thorough character analysis; let's not jump to conclusions, eh? And maybe, just maybe, not think the worst of a character from the get-go because of less-than-perfect initial impressions?

*I was also shocked at people's hatred of Tilly, but let's not get into that here and now.
« Last Edit: 27 Jan 2018, 11:27 by DannyboyTheDane »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #218 on: 27 Jan 2018, 07:23 »


http://www.thewriteturn.com/kishotenketsu-the-four-act-narrative-or-the-plot-without-conflict/

"All drama needs conflict" is common knowledge. In western/european schools. That doesn't make it universal truth any more than any other euro-centric "truths" about civilization, social norms, etc.

I... did you really have to make it a 'European' thing?

Despite having studied mandarin a while back -- Some poetry even! "Shī Shě shí shī shǐ" or "The Story of Mr. Shi Eating Lions" is one of my favourite literary works of all time -- I wasn't familiar with this particular narrative structure, because while I have made an effort to study other cultures outside my own, all of my formal literary and screenwriting education has been what's commercially viable in my own culture. That's a fair criticism.

If you had taken a kinder tone, I could have pointed out this is a more abstract style suited for other works, and doesn't work in a slice-of-life format like QuestionableContent, but thanked you for broadening my education, and that could have been a cool good interaction.

But instead you kind of... insinuated prejudice on my behalf. And that's kind of not cool?
« Last Edit: 27 Jan 2018, 07:53 by MrNumbers »
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Case

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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #219 on: 27 Jan 2018, 10:26 »

Does that distinction even make sense, whatwith 'Drama' being a classification in European art? (originally Greek, right?)

We could, of course, debate which is worse: Implicitly excluding non-European art while talking about one category in a European taxonomy of art, or implicitly lumping non-European art into a European taxonomy of art ... but does that make sense? And isn't it a bit ... 'Eurocentric'? (*)

What would the respective non-European artists think about such a discussion? Don't they have their own terms for what they do?


(*) I mean, I'm a Euro on a largely USnian board, so I got no problem with a wee bit of Eurocentrism every once in a while ...
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #220 on: 27 Jan 2018, 10:33 »

I'll reiterate that I think it's important to distinguish between narrative structure, and genre. There is not always a one to one relationship between the two.

Personally, I have written a few things that do not have any conflict in them, and that might fit the suggested pattern. However, I never would have called it drama. Even though it's in prose format, I consider it very much closer to poetry.

And as such, drama is a genre in itself. It can take the form of kishotenketsu, even, according to the cited article. But central to the drama is the action - from which the name itself derives, in old Greek - the conflict.

Now, just as a reaction to MrNumbers's post that every story needs conflict, I can agree. But genres are what they are. And it's fine, and wonderful that not everything is in the same genre, but let's just celebrate the diversity, rather than make sweeping statements.

It's true that the literary canon has been a little one sided - many of the comment's on Bloom's magnum opus are certainly justified. And we should include non-European art. But we should, in my opinion, recognise it in its own genres and categories. There are some categories that are probably common to both European and non-European; especially on the higher levels of the taxonomy.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #221 on: 27 Jan 2018, 21:08 »

But instead you kind of... insinuated prejudice on my behalf. And that's kind of not cool?

You declared all stories - not even just dramas, but all stories, "every story, period" - require conflict, and think it's not cool if I point out that fairly narrow school of thought on story structure isn't a universal truth?

Okay.

Edit: I initially refrained as I was worried I might let a little bit too much of my honest response to that post shine through if I wrote it too hastily, but after taking a moment to settle, I'll add something a little closer to that mood: You know what's not cool? Tone-policing. Especially when it's done in the same breath as admitting ignorance of something you'd previously spoken of as if you had some kind of (unearned) authority on the topic.

I can't say you've presented a case for me to care about having a "cool, good interaction" with you when that's how you respond to "a fair criticism."
« Last Edit: 27 Jan 2018, 21:15 by Shjade »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #222 on: 28 Jan 2018, 05:58 »

Global Moderator Comment Tone policing is the only way the moderators have found to reconcile the owner's disgust with flame wars with our commitment to being inclusive of a wide variety of people. Being cool and civil is expected in this tiny corner of the Internet even under provocation.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #223 on: 28 Jan 2018, 06:33 »

I am also aware of strong criticism of tone policing in some quarters (it's been directed against me personally on another forum, together, to be fair, with links to thoughtful arguments on the matter); however, I feel that it is appropriate here, and I am not fully convinced by the arguments against it in other places either.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #224 on: 28 Jan 2018, 06:57 »

Tone policing is the only way the moderators have found to reconcile the owner's disgust with flame wars with our commitment to being inclusive of a wide variety of people. Being cool and civil is expected in this tiny corner of the Internet even under provocation.

I am also aware of strong criticism of tone policing in some quarters (it's been directed against me personally on another forum, together, to be fair, with links to thoughtful arguments on the matter); however, I feel that it is appropriate here, and I am not fully convinced by the arguments against it in other places either.

What had to be good enough for Valdis and TIR is certainly good enough for me.



Edit: Speaking of which:

Fair enough. I've been a bit prickly the last few days, just not doing well (I have caught what I refer to as "The Malaise", which is just that feeling of not enjoying anything and feeling listless and vaguely bad for no reason). I apologize if I come off as more critical or nasty than intended :)
I don't think you have anything to apologize for <snip>

On second thought, make that: I don't think you have anything to apologize for, and if you do, I'm guilty of it to at least the same degree, if not more. Sorry for that. I didn't find a better way to communicate what I wanted to say upthread. Maybe should have tried harder.
« Last Edit: 28 Jan 2018, 09:53 by Case »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #225 on: 29 Jan 2018, 02:49 »

...And no, good drama doesn't require a conflict.

As Joe sniped me to saying... well, yes? Yes it does?

You're right that it doesn't need a villain to cause it, but... every story, period, requires conflict.

http://www.thewriteturn.com/kishotenketsu-the-four-act-narrative-or-the-plot-without-conflict/

"All drama needs conflict" is common knowledge. In western/european schools. That doesn't make it universal truth any more than any other euro-centric "truths" about civilization, social norms, etc.

"The third act of a Kishōtenketsu story is a complication, but it is not a conflict.
The contrasting dislocation might provide the reader with a sense of chaos as this third, seemingly random situation is explored, but this is not a conflict.
It might be argued that the third act of Kishōtenketsu might be able to be a conflict, but conflict certainly isn’t integral to the plot resolution or narrative development as it is in Western narrative structures.
A further difference is that the character does not need to engage with the complication of the third act. The twist might simply be a shift in setting or focus, that will bear some relevance to the establishing acts in the fourth act."

Complication / Conflict
TomAYto / TomAHto

However...
Your intitial comment questioned that "all *Drama* needs conflict."
Drama, by it's very definition, *is* conflict... and conflict itself has many, MANY facets.
"Contrasting dislocation"? "Sense of chaos"?
Says "conflict" to me.

The article you quoted also flatly states that "Kiki's delivery Service" is a classic example of this (apparent) non-conflict trope...
Except it isn't. Miyazaki, (The director of the film) has stated that the movie portrays the gulf between independence and reliance in teenage Japanese girls...
Conflict.

In the film she is basically stalked by a young guy... Conflict.
She and her cat have a falling out... Conflict.
She forgets how to fly... Conflict.

(Yeah, that'll do.)

« Last Edit: 29 Jan 2018, 02:54 by JoeCovenant »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #226 on: 29 Jan 2018, 06:33 »

Hmm. This is educational.

Less educationally but more fundamentally, there's an old definition that says "The King died" is a news report, and "The King died, then the Queen died of a broken heart" is a story. Pretty sure that was from a Euro-descended background. I don't see it as conflict. Ditto Hemingway's "For sale. Baby shoes. Never worn." which he represented as being a story.

(Actually I can beat that one from real life. On the bulletin board for ads at one job, "Estate sale: motorcycle helmet". )
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #227 on: 29 Jan 2018, 07:35 »

I think another issue we're having, is what is the definition of conflict? If we're discussing conflict in the context of drama, or narrative, in general, the term does not hold the same definition as it does in other contexts. There's our internal conflict as well.

But let's move away from the term conflict, for a while. Let's go back to our ancient Greeks, who seem to have meddled somewhat in this discussion already, and borrow their term for the concept: agon. This is the word that gives us protagonist, antagonist, and agonising. Its meaning approximates contest, which is less strong than conflict.
The main function of agon, is to provide a certain tension, to drive the story, regardless of the cause of that tension. It may be your classic melodramatic good guy and bad guy, it might be one man's fight against the sea (not to mention a marvellous marlin), or someone's growth over time.

"Then the Queen died of a broken heart" contains this tension, even if it is not explicit. There is the tension between the instinct of survival and the emotions of grief. Hemingway's shortest story has the same kind of tension, in its implicit context that the child never got to wear them. It's less poignant, to me, in the estate sale example. But well, in six words or less, your tension practically must be implicit.

Even in the most basic narrative, there is the tension of time - of what was, and is, and will or will not be - or conversely, like in De avonden the sense that nothing changes despite that being the normal order of things.  Granted, that will not always be the most interesting of narratives, but that in itself stresses the importance of that tension.

It might be that I've spent too much time reading my scholastics, but a proper definition of the question, and the terms used, can sometimes enlighten things to a surprising degree. So, I guess that this is what, in a narrative context, I understand by the term conflict. And I hope it helps enlighten why I do think it is quite essential for most narratives - poetry is another thing, though, where the same rules do not always apply.
« Last Edit: 29 Jan 2018, 08:03 by Cornelius »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #228 on: 29 Jan 2018, 08:26 »

I think another issue we're having, is what is the definition of conflict? If we're discussing conflict in the context of drama, or narrative, in general, the term does not hold the same definition as it does in other contexts. There's our internal conflict as well.

(forgive the snippage but...)

^^^^^^^^
In a nutshell!
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #229 on: 29 Jan 2018, 14:55 »


To get back to the starting point:

It's interesting, and frustrating, to me how quick some members of this forum are to search for a villain in every storyline.

Maybe. However good drama tends to require a degree of conflict. A 24/7 hugfest would not engage people.

Good drama may or may not require conflict. Discussion of art does not. That was the point - the behaviour of people here on this board, in this thread right here. Not the behaviour of fictional people on the other side of the 4th wall.
« Last Edit: 29 Jan 2018, 15:05 by Case »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #230 on: 29 Jan 2018, 16:53 »

Let's make this more concrete. Where is the conflict right now? Here's what I think.

There is conflict between the way Bubbles and Faye appear to be viewing their developing relationship.

There is conflict between the way Faye sees her relationship with Bubbles, and the way the rest of the world sees it.

There is conflict between Evie's academic view of AI society and Bubbles' very real, lived experience of it.

All of these stories will be interesting as they play out, but I don't see evil or maliciousness on any side of these conflicts.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #231 on: 29 Jan 2018, 17:31 »

Looks like Melon reporting back with news of how her new "pet" is doing wins.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #232 on: 15 Feb 2018, 06:42 »

I'm posting in an old thread but this would be off topic in the current WCDT.

Evie is wrong
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #233 on: 15 Feb 2018, 13:37 »

We haven't progressed at all since The Man in the White Suit, have we?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #234 on: 16 Feb 2018, 03:03 »

It's interesting that you should mention The Man in the White Suit. Along with its stable-mate, I'm Alright Jack, it is a debunking of the power of scientific and social progress to make the world a better place. Both films highlight the tragically human habit of choosing to reject objectively beneficial change simply because doing otherwise would lead to short-term inconvenience or financial loss or reduction of personal power on your part. In both cases, the protagonist ends up the tragic loser with the entire world having risen as one to strike them down for daring to threaten the status quo, no matter how bad said status quo might be.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #235 on: 16 Feb 2018, 08:25 »

It's interesting that you should mention The Man in the White Suit. Along with its stable-mate, I'm Alright Jack, it is a debunking of the power of scientific and social progress to make the world a better place. Both films highlight the tragically human habit of choosing to reject objectively beneficial change simply because doing otherwise would lead to short-term inconvenience or financial loss or reduction of personal power on your part. In both cases, the protagonist ends up the tragic loser with the entire world having risen as one to strike them down for daring to threaten the status quo, no matter how bad said status quo might be.

..Ummm...

I'm about 100% certain that's *why* Tova referenced it in the first place, Ben.. :)
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #236 on: 17 Feb 2018, 17:32 »

We haven't progressed at all since The Man in the White Suit, have we?
"The status quo will do whatever it takes to retain the status quo."
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #237 on: 18 Feb 2018, 13:25 »

Otherwise it would have changed already.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3661-3665 (22nd to 26th January 2018)
« Reply #238 on: 21 Feb 2018, 17:41 »

Otherwise it would have changed already.

Jake from Adventure Time expresses a rather cynical view about how the status quo works, but I can't really argue with him on his point.

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