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Author Topic: Solo - The Star Wars Movie  (Read 967 times)

LeeC

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Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« on: 05 Feb 2018, 07:26 »

So the teaser trailer dropped during the super bowl.


I'm very excited!  :-D
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #1 on: 05 Feb 2018, 07:47 »

And of course they put up a new one as soon as I post this.  :-D

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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #2 on: 05 Feb 2018, 08:32 »

They really should have had that satellite or antenna break off at the end of that second trailer... :-D
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #3 on: 05 Feb 2018, 16:56 »

IT'S SO CLEAN!!!
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #4 on: 12 Feb 2018, 04:15 »

Ok, I am 100% down for this movie, but I hate them adding "A Star Wars Story" to every non-trilogy movie. Just call it Solo, damn it. (I had this same objection to when they did this to Rogue One, but it seems even more annoying now.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #5 on: 12 Feb 2018, 08:26 »

Ok, I am 100% down for this movie, but I hate them adding "A Star Wars Story" to every non-trilogy movie. Just call it Solo, damn it. (I had this same objection to when they did this to Rogue One, but it seems even more annoying now.

I figure, they gotta keep the franchise name alive after 9, so their setting their precedent from the off...
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #6 on: 12 Feb 2018, 08:39 »

Ok, I am 100% down for this movie, but I hate them adding "A Star Wars Story" to every non-trilogy movie. Just call it Solo, damn it. (I had this same objection to when they did this to Rogue One, but it seems even more annoying now.

They can't, there was already a Tamil-Malayalam film called Solo released last year, its a bilingual anthology film.

There's also a Canadian thriller from 2013.

And a Telugu language film in 2011.

Oh and an Australian documentary in 2008.

Can't forget the 2006 Australian film that was written and directed by Morgan O'Neill.

Then there was a 1996 science fiction action film.

Preceded 19 years early by a New Zealand film.

And finally a 1969 film that was directed by Jean-Pierre Mocky.

You can see where I'm going with this, right?
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #7 on: 12 Feb 2018, 15:39 »

I don't understand what's wrong with it, myself.

It's maybe a bit superfluous now, but when they make a Thrawn movie*, it won't be obvious to a great many people.

* No idea if they will, just chose it because I've just picked up the recent Thrawn novel.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #8 on: 12 Feb 2018, 17:02 »

For people who aren't into Star Wars (I know, it seems strange to me too), then that sub title is important. It sets up these projects as part of the franchise. Every other Star Wars movie has had it in the title. Though people generally just use the sub title for convenience, it's always been Star Wars: Empire Strikes Back etc.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #9 on: 13 Feb 2018, 03:14 »

I really don't see why they couldn't just call it 'Star Wars - Solo'. Now they routinely put the episode numbers in the film titles, there is no risk of people mistaking them for main thread stories.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #10 on: 13 Feb 2018, 03:25 »

Probably because the likes of Rogue One and Solo, while connected to the main story of the three trilogies aren't actually a part of that story, which is the Skywalker story.

Its like how Marvel has the New Avengers, Mighty Avengers, Secret Avengers and so on, all the teams were connected to the main team, but not a part of the story.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #11 on: 13 Feb 2018, 03:29 »

Probably because the likes of Rogue One and Solo, while connected to the main story of the three trilogies aren't actually a part of that story, which is the Skywalker story.

Its like how Marvel has the New Avengers, Mighty Avengers, Secret Avengers and so on, all the teams were connected to the main team, but not a part of the story.

Tiny, tiny bit of pedantry...
Rogue One *is* directly connected to SW:ANH.
There are many characters from SW:ANH in Rogue One, it's a direct prequel...
(It even has a Skywalker in it... you could even say it has TWO... from a certain point of view... :) )
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #12 on: 13 Feb 2018, 11:30 »

But at the end of the day, the main focus of the three trilogies is on the Skywalker family.

The "A Star Wars Film" films are more like Hero Of Another Story.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #13 on: 14 Feb 2018, 02:40 »

But at the end of the day, the main focus of the three trilogies is on the Skywalker family.

The "A Star Wars Film" films are more like Hero Of Another Story.

Oh, absolutely-without doubt!

Me? I'm looking forward to "Kenobi"... because, Lightsabers!

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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #14 on: 14 Feb 2018, 02:57 »

Same here, though I'm trying to keep a lid on my expectations!
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #15 on: 14 Feb 2018, 03:24 »

FWIW, I view Rogue One as the Wonder Woman of the Disney Wars era - The one definite and unequivocal good film in a series mostly plagued by questionable artistic, characterisation and plotting choices that make the films divisive amongst what should be a rock-solid and reliable fan-base (with Episodes VII and VIII being Man of Steel and Batman v Superman respectively).

I'm wondering if Solo will confirm or break this trend. I've got the feeling that it is going to be the equivalent of Suicide Squad - A quirky and artistically-unique crowd-pleaser but with an indefinable sense that it was somehow done wrong.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #16 on: 14 Feb 2018, 03:27 »

I have no doubt there will be a group of people who will be upset it was done wrong. The only question is how big that group will be.

P.S. Rogue One is probably my favourite of the Disney era SW films, so we are not in complete disagreement.

Seeing as HISHE came up in another thread:

https://youtu.be/RjR71XpAu0I
« Last Edit: 14 Feb 2018, 03:47 by Tova »
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #17 on: 14 Feb 2018, 04:09 »

You can see where I'm going with this, right?
That each of those movies (besides the first one) saw that other films were named Solo and still named their film that? :parrot:

But yeah, I can see why they'd mention Star Wars in all of their marketing, but they could've still just had the actual title be Solo. It's not a huge deal, just my preference.

But at the end of the day, the main focus of the three trilogies is on the Skywalker family.

...is it, though? It's still pretty important through Kylo, Luke, and Leia, but I would argue that the third trilogy's main focus is elsewhere.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #18 on: 14 Feb 2018, 05:07 »

Even if the heroes are Rey, Finn and Poe, they are still subject to the actions of Skywalkers and the effect of their actions on the galaxy.

(click to show/hide)

The focus of the new trilogy might be the new heroes, but Skywalkers are still influencing the galaxy.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #19 on: 14 Feb 2018, 05:14 »

Also Kylo Ren/Ben Solo is a freaking Skywalker in all but name
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #20 on: 14 Feb 2018, 07:30 »

The Force Awakens it's questionable and easy to miss just how important the Skywalker bloodline is because so much of the film is set up and introduction of the new characters. But it was there. Ben struggling with the Light and Dark in himself. Luke's withdrawal from galactic society and the chaos that was in the wake without a hero for the Resistance to stand behind. Kaz having Luke's old lightsaber and it waking the Force in Rey. While not overtly all about the Skywalker bloodline a lot of the foundation blocks were there. The Last Jedi was much more of a Skywalker gig. A good portion of the movie was wrapped up in their family discord and their relationship to the Force. To the point where a lot of people feel the parts of the movie that don't involve them feel shoe horned in and don't belong. ie: The whole sub plot about the movie-long chase scene and the 'find the slicer' plot with Finn, Rose and Poe.

Consider the history of the movies chronologically. We are to presume that Palpatine caused Anakin to be born via Force manipulation as part of his long and complicated bid to become Emperor. From the time Anakin begins training as a Jedi he becomes a disruptive influence on what balance there was between the Jedi and the Sith eventually leading to the destruction of the Jedi order and the birth of the Empire. Episodes 4-6 detail the conflict between Anakin and his children. None of them started the conflict, but they act as major force multipliers (no pun intended). Without the fall of Anakin the Jedi would not have been so thoroughly crushed. Without Leia and Luke the Rebellion would not have succeeded at destroying either Death Star or killing the Emperor. And now we have the new trilogy. Luke's uncertainty and moment of doubt is what drove Ben from the Jedi and embrace the Dark Side legacy of his grandfather. Kylo Ren may not have started the First Order, but the Skywalker blood and drama put him in the position where he leads it against his mother's Resistance. 

So yes, the core of the Tri-trilogy that has been core Star Wars has always been about the Skywalker family line and the Force. Therefore it make sense that all the side projects be marketed as films in the Star Wars franchise, but different. The tri-trilogy should probably be called the Skywalker Wars. But that wouldn't market as well. Even though Darth Vader was in Rogue One, he was more easter egg than participant. He never interacted with the main cast in the couple of scenes he was in, and was primarily there to link the narrative of the end of Rogue One to the beginning of A New Hope.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #21 on: 14 Feb 2018, 07:44 »

I think the Star Wars saga will, in the end, be the rise and fall of the Skywalkers.

We are to presume that Palpatine caused Anakin to be born via Force manipulation

Wait, what?
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #22 on: 14 Feb 2018, 08:12 »

There's a scene from Revenge of the Sith, the opera scene, when Palpatine is talking about a Sith who could control life and death and who was murdered by his apprentice, Sidious. There's a long standing fan theory that Sidious continued his master's work and manipulated the midiclorians to create Anakin as part of his long term scheme to become Emperor.

There's another theory that Sidious killed Plagueis not as part of the tradition of the apprentice killing the master, but because Plagueis had already manipulated Anakin's conception and Sidious wanted to be the one in control.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #23 on: 14 Feb 2018, 08:31 »

We are to presume that Palpatine caused Anakin to be born via Force manipulation
Wait, what?

Anakin being 'born off the Force' is canon, IIRC. He has no father. I think I recall Shmi Skywalker telling Qui-Gon as much? Either in the SW1 movie or the novelisation.

What isn't clear in canon is the how and they why of it, but there's sort of a 'semi-canon theory' about that:

There's a scene from Revenge of the Sith, the opera scene, when Palpatine is talking about a Sith who could control life and death and who was murdered by his apprentice, Sidious. There's a long standing fan theory that Sidious continued his master's work and manipulated the midiclorians to create Anakin as part of his long term scheme to become Emperor.

Methinks that's a bit more than a fan-theory: It's described in more detail in James Luceno's novel 'Darth Plagueis' (Palpatine's master & predecessor). However, while the novel (and the retcons) is pretty good, like most of Luceno's stuff, it was never considered canon, even before Disney took over.

Quote
As the novel comes to a close during the events of The Phantom Menace, Sidious and Plagueis learn that a young boy named Anakin Skywalker, a former slave found by Qui-Gon Jinn on Tatooine, had been born of the Force. They discern that this is most likely due to Plagueis's experiment of creating life through the Force, which he had commenced about a decade earlier.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Plagueis_(novel)

Note though that there's no indication in the novel of either Plagueis or Palpatine creating Anakin deliberately - if I remember the novel correctly, Plagueis and Palpatine undertake several (extremely 'high-powered') Force-experiments (either as part of Plagueis' quest for eternal life and/or their 'un-balancing' the Force in preparation for the culmination of the Millennia-old plan of Sith takeover), and once they learn of Anakin's birth, Palpatine suspects that the Force created Anakin as a reaction to those experiments.

IIRC, he's actually more than a little bit unsettled by that, since it would indicate that the Force can act on its own, and very specifically so, without control by a Force-user, which would obviously be bad news for a Force-user striving for complete control and domination of both the Force and the Galaxy. Remember how much emphasis Palpatine placed on Force-vision and Force domination to further his aims - it'd be like a chess player discovering that the rooks are sentient.

I think that's a theme that Luceno comes back to several times in other novels ('The Unified Force') as a major philosophical difference within the Jedi and Sith orders: Sith see the Force as something to be used, Jedi see the Force as something to be guided by, but neither is entirely sure whether the Force might not an entity with its own goals, that can act independently of either.

All of that non-exactly-canon: Luceno is probably the best retconer amongst the EU-authors ('The Unified Force', 'Millenium Falcon'), but I guess the powers that be were wary of tying that bit of lore down in to much detail.
« Last Edit: 14 Feb 2018, 12:01 by Case »
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #24 on: 14 Feb 2018, 09:47 »

Ah okay, I knew about the "force is the father" bit from 1 and that scene with Palpatine at the opera in 3 but didn't think the link between them was proven.  Looks like it is just fan cannon.  I really hope it doesn't become cannon as I just hate that everyone/thing in star was has to be connected in some way.  It makes the universe seem small.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #25 on: 14 Feb 2018, 10:22 »

Looks like it is just fan cannon.

Uhmmmmhwell, as I said above, I wouldn't consider it just-another-type-of-fancanon - Luceno isn't a nobody amongst the EU-authors. It is, however, not officially considered canon, and wasn't considered canon even before the Disney-sale. <- Not completely sure about that last part, cf. my next post below.

Personally, I could imagine that maybe the people-who-decide-that-sort-of-shit (Sue Rostoni?) might have liked (the idea of) the novel a little too much (I can highly recommend it, just as anything authored by Luceno) - i.e. they saw a potential for a standalone story about "How Anakin came to be", but knowing Lucas and the way he operates, they knew he would never stick to an already developed detailed script.

Or something, yaknow?
« Last Edit: 20 Feb 2018, 17:50 by Case »
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #26 on: 19 Feb 2018, 04:12 »

Also Kylo Ren/Ben Solo is a freaking Skywalker in all but name
Well yeah, that's why I mentioned him with Luke and Leia.

Re: Anakin, I thought Plagueis created him. Palpatine super strongly implied it, and even if it's not "canon" (however that's defined), it's a reasonable interpretation, which is almost as good.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #27 on: 20 Feb 2018, 16:12 »

Re: Anakin, I thought Plagueis created him. Palpatine super strongly implied it, and even if it's not "canon" (however that's defined), it's a reasonable interpretation, which is almost as good.

Sorry if I'm telling you stuff you already know: I can't remember anything in Revenge of the Sith that suggested Plagueis creating Anakin, or Palpatine suggesting to Anakin that Plagueis created Anakin - in RotS, Palpatine talks to Anakin about Plagueis' alleged ability to create life using the Force.

It was suggested in James Luceno's post-RotS novel "Plagueis" that either Palpatine and Plagueis together inadvertently triggered the Force's creation of Anakin as a reaction to their "willing the Force to shift and tip irrevocably to the dark side" (both assumed to have succeeded in that, see below), or that  Plagueis alone created Anakin when he subsequently attempted to create a strong Force-sensitive being (Plagueis initially believes to have failed; quote below, last passage).

However, it is never clarified which event brought Anakin into life, or if any of them did, and both Plagueis and Palpatine are initially shocked, even terrified, when they learn of his birth and the Jedi's suspicion that he could be the "chosen one".

(Note that Anakin Skywalker was born 41BBY (Before Battle of Yavin) - nine years before the first quote and eight years before the second)

Quote
Ignoring the reactions of apprehensive residents and wary security personnel, Plagueis hastened along a plush corridor in 500 Republica toward Palpatine’s suite of crimson rooms. He had planned to be at the Senate Building to hear Amidala’s call for a vote of no-confidence in Valorum, which would strike the first death knell for the Republic. At the last moment, however, Palpatine had contacted him to recount a conversation he had had with Dooku. The fact that Qui-Gon Jinn had identified Maul as a Sith was to be expected; but Dooku’s news about a human boy at the center of a vergence of the Force had come as a shock. More, Qui-Gon saw the boy as the Jedi’s prophesied Chosen One!

He had to see this Anakin Skywalker for himself; had to sense him for himself. He had to know if the Force had struck back again, nine years earlier, by conceiving a human being to restore balance to the galaxy.

"Plagueis" by J. Luceno - 32 BBY

The "Force had struck back" is a reference to an event (or even several events) that Plagueis remembers in an earlier passage, dated 33 BBY

Quote
The question of whether he and Sidious had discovered something new or rediscovered something ancient was beside the point. All that mattered was that, almost a decade earlier, they had succeeded in willing the Force to shift and tip irrevocably to the dark side. Not a mere paradigm shift, but a tangible alteration that could be felt by anyone strong in the Force, and whether or not trained in the Sith or Jedi arts.

The shift had been the outcome of months of intense meditation, during which Plagueis and Sidious had sought to challenge the Force for sovereignty and suffuse the galaxy with the power of the dark side. Brazen and shameless, and at their own mortal peril, they had waged etheric war, anticipating that their own midi-chlorians, the Force’s proxy army, might marshal to boil their blood or stop the beating of their hearts. Risen out of themselves, discorporate and as a single entity, they had brought the power of their will to bear, asserting their sovereignty over the Force. No counterforce had risen against them. In what amounted to a state of rapture they knew that the Force had yielded, as if some deity had been tipped from its throne. On the fulcrum they had fashioned, the light side had dipped and the dark side had ascended.

On the same day they had allowed Venamis to die. Then, by manipulating the Bith’s midi-chlorians, which should have been inert and unresponsive, Plagueis had resurrected him.

[...] But having gained the power to keep another alive hadn’t been enough for him. [...] Drunk on newfound power, then, he had attempted an even more unthinkable act: to bring into being a creation of his own. [...] But ultimately to no end. The Force grew silent, as if in flight from him, and many of the animals in his laboratory succumbed to horrifying diseases.
[...]
Gazing into Sojourn’s darkening sky, he wondered what calamity the Force was planning in retreat to visit upon him or Sidious or both of them for willfully tipping the balance.

"Plagueis" by J. Luceno - 33 BBY


... "canon" (however that's defined)

Quote
The character was created by George Lucas as early as the first draft of Revenge of the Sith—dated April 2003—and possibly earlier than that. His story was massively expanded upon in the 2012 novel Darth Plagueis, written by James Luceno. However, that story is part of the Star Wars Legends continuity, formerly known as the "Expanded Universe," and therefore is no longer official canon as of the 2014 reboot.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Plagueis
« Last Edit: 20 Feb 2018, 19:39 by Case »
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #29 on: 22 Feb 2018, 02:04 »

Donald Glover as Lando ...  :-D

Germans would say "Coole Sau" (Intranslatable - Lit. "Cool Hog" - Think Brad Pitt in Fight Club)
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #30 on: 22 Feb 2018, 02:08 »

There are few trailers that "Sabotage" cannot make better!  :)
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #31 on: 22 Feb 2018, 04:21 »

Palpatine talks to Anakin about Plagueis' alleged ability to create life using the Force.
I interpreted that (with a combination of Anakin having no biological father) as confirmation that Plagueis used that ability to create Anakin, but that Palpatine wasn't entirely sure that he did. I could be wrong, but I guess we'll never really know for sure.
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BenRG

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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #32 on: 22 Feb 2018, 04:35 »

Personally, it is my belief that Anakin wasn't created by either side but was, as the prophecy implied, actually a creation of The Force Itself. He was, in essence, an antibody to the increasingly destructive conflict between Light and Dark Side adepts (with the destruction being social - through the Jedi's stagnation - as well as physical - through the Sith's... episodes). My interpretation of 'balance' was the destruction or reform of both paths, possibly even their unification.

FWIW, I'm pretty sure that this ending of the conflict between Dark and Light Side adepts was supposed to be the main arc of the Episode-VII to -IX trilogy; certainly it is hinted in many ways in both the Clone Wars and Rebels animated series. However, I am not confident that Kennedy and Abrams have sufficient grasp on the importance of this arc to film the feature film aspects of it correctly.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #33 on: 22 Feb 2018, 04:42 »

I really should watch those shows. I just hated the Clone Wars pilot movie so much.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #34 on: 22 Feb 2018, 06:51 »

I really should watch those shows. I just hated the Clone Wars pilot movie so much.
Ugh, I couldn't get through it (clone war movie).

The show has its ups and downs.  I'd give it a C+.  There are a few episode lists out there somewhere that will give you a better run through it.  The best thing to come out of the show IMHO is Hondo, especially in the later seasons.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #35 on: 22 Feb 2018, 08:40 »

Any episode with the Clones was good, any episodes about Jar-Jar and Droids were not.

So far I'm much more into Rebels than I was Clone Wars, but that may be because I enjoyed the Genndy Tartakovsky version much more
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #36 on: 22 Feb 2018, 11:38 »

Oh the little five minute episodes, I always loved those ones.
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Re: Solo - The Star Wars Movie
« Reply #37 on: 25 Feb 2018, 03:43 »

That was so good! I know they’re not actually canon but they still affect how I see the actual movies.
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