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Summer's here! What summer stories would you like to see? (Choose Three)

The Reed/Bean family vacation (Marten, Claire (and Pintsize?) along for the ride; lots of coincidental background characters returning)
- 27 (16.2%)
The Fairy Girl ropes the ladies into some weird Summer Solstice festival
- 12 (7.2%)
Dora decides to add iced teas and iced coffees to CoD's repetoire; there are teething troubles
- 6 (3.6%)
Northampton's medieval-themed Summer Faire (Bubbles mentors Sam to win the Tournament)
- 30 (18%)
Claire's final exams looms; later the graduation is a significant thing
- 27 (16.2%)
Angus's show is on hiatus; he comes back to try to make peace with Faye
- 23 (13.8%)
Pintsize, having cleaned up at the poker game, goes on tour to several world casinos with Melon as his sidekick/assistant
- 8 (4.8%)
For the first time, Bubbles is able to face the annual reunion of the survivors of her unit
- 22 (13.2%)
Sven is going on tour to the summer Country festivals; somehow, May gets a Roadie job
- 8 (4.8%)
Other (please specify in a comment)
- 4 (2.4%)

Total Members Voted: 68

Voting closed: 26 Jun 2018, 15:18


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Author Topic: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)  (Read 9606 times)

awgiedawgie

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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #350 on: 03 Jun 2018, 11:54 »

Did you notice her expression and what she did with her hands was the same cute thing that Claire did when asking Marten if she should move in? So cute!
Yeah, someone else pointed that out, too. Might’ve been on Patreon. (Might’ve been you)
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BlueFatima

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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #351 on: 03 Jun 2018, 12:39 »

All this talk about Hanners never being able to heal is rather depressing and not necessarily true. Having scars is not the same thing as remaining wounded/disabled by your past. And truthfully? We all have our quirks.

I tend to see her current journey of self awareness simply to be an attempt not to let the damage from her mother's emotional abuse limit her life. She is trying to learn to make life choices on her own terms. 

I'm kind of in a similar place right now—though I'm limited to many more responsibilities (and a budget) so I'm trying lots of new things at home. I can certainly relate to her storyline, though, and find it refreshing and even a little joyful.

No question about it, she's never going to be completely 'healed', but she has developed a set of coping behaviors which bring her mental illnesses under more, if not complete, control. She can self-coach to get past the some anxiety attacks. She can vent enough to handle cleaning out a stable. That doesn't mean she won't have to wash her hands a few times extra every day, and it doesn't mean she won't ever panic, it just means she can function in ways she could never manage before.

Again, the underlined parts are where we seem to disagree.

Coming back to the beginning, I mentioned that, going by today's comic, I get the impression that Hannelore in fact is not in control. As I said, to me she looked manic. And, yes, this one, and the comic with the yak are not in chronological order, and we don't know how much time has passed between them in comic-time. I get that.

You say the change in her behavior has been foreshadowed. I disagree, but I'm willing to say that maybe I just didn't pay as much attention to certain details as you did.

If I interpret your comment correctly, you say that, at the time of the yak stable cleaning, Hannelore has developed enough coping techniques do deal with her anxiety, because she was finally able to break out of her inner prison. Not always, but often, and to a high degree of success.
Once more I seem to be unable to connect the dots here.
My view of Hannelore was that, even taking into account how far she has come since we first met her, she still has a long long way to go before she can be a functioning adult. There can be breakthroughs and little leaps and bounds of progress, but what we currently see (in the yak stable scene) strikes me as a very big leap of progress with very little in-comic explanation. That is why I would call her supposed change too much and too sudden. To me it almost feels like a revamping of her character.

I think I'll have to wait and see...
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #352 on: 03 Jun 2018, 13:53 »

All this talk about Hanners never being able to heal is rather depressing and not necessarily true. Having scars is not the same thing as remaining wounded/disabled by your past. And truthfully? We all have our quirks.

I tend to see her current journey of self awareness simply to be an attempt not to let the damage from her mother's emotional abuse limit her life. She is trying to learn to make life choices on her own terms. 

I'm kind of in a similar place right now—though I'm limited to many more responsibilities (and a budget) so I'm trying lots of new things at home. I can certainly relate to her storyline, though, and find it refreshing and even a little joyful.
It's really, really important to understand something about Hannelore. It is OK that she'll never get "well". The major mental illnesses are chronic conditions which can be usually be controlled through medication and therapy but can not be cured. In that, they're like diabetes or bad eyesight: they're just things which you live around like you live around any other controllable but incurable illness. Me, I take one pill every morning and two every evening and periodically go to talk to someone or attend group therapy, but if I'm good about doing all those things, I function nominally. In fact, in my case, if I didn't tell you, you'd never notice that I'm mentally ill.

That does *not* mean that I don't have remaining symptoms. I will always need to lay out my desk in a certain way. I'll always have to straighten pictures on the walls. I'll never be able to cross a bridge without being dizzy with terror. For my part, I regret these things, but they aren't so crippling that I need to fix them. Instead, I structure my life so they don't happen often, and have coping behaviors when they do. As you say, they've become quirks, not not the crippling disabilities they used to be.

Hannelore is in the same situation. Medication helps her a lot, and on-going therapy and normal social interaction help her, too. The results are dramatic: she's functional. She has developed coping mechanisms like self-coaching to avoid panic attacks. She's not 'better', just functional...but that's fine. Most of us settle for functional in one or another part of our lives, it's just that some of us have to reach farther to get there.

In a way, though, this is the most optimistic message you can get. OK, so you'll never be 'normal'. That doesn't mean you'll be crippled, just 'not normal'. If you focus on that, rather than on 'getting better', you may find that there's a huge burden lifted off your shoulders. After all, if you have to get well, you can't settle for half measures. If you only need to get better, any gain is a win.
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Shjade

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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #353 on: 03 Jun 2018, 22:51 »

Sooo I just need to vent. Apparently ignorance towards AIs does exist in the real world. I shared the Faye/Bubbles storyline with an online friend and he said some pretty closed minded stuff.
A long time ago, there was an episode of Star Trek:TNG where Tasha Yar (I think?) had sex with Data, and I remember reading some pretty ugly stuff on-line about it. About the most polite was "He's just a fancy dildo."

Yes, it was Tasha in The Naked Now.

"What I want now is gentleness, and joy, and love from you, Data. You are fully functional aren't you?"
"Of course, but..."
"How fully?"
"In every way, of course. I am programmed in multiple techniques. A broad variety of pleasuring."
"Oh, you jewel! That's exactly what I hoped."
    - Data and Tasha Yar

Sadly, followed by this on the day after:

"Data, I'm only going to tell you this just once: it never happened."
    - Tasha Yar, to Data

*reads up on the episode via the provided link*

...um. So...Yar was clearly not in her right mind, but we're just gonna act like she was in a healthy consenting state for this interaction and it's somehow disappointing that she suggested she wanted to act like it didn't happen afterward because AI Discrimination?

Okay then.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #354 on: 04 Jun 2018, 00:02 »

*reads up on the episode via the provided link*

...um. So...Yar was clearly not in her right mind, but we're just gonna act like she was in a healthy consenting state for this interaction and it's somehow disappointing that she suggested she wanted to act like it didn't happen afterward because AI Discrimination?

Okay then.

Yeah, the episode was kinda... weird...  about sex. It was definitely not TNG at its best. But I think the point of the comment was about dehumanizing commentary about the episode, not about Yar's behavior towards Data within the episode.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #355 on: 04 Jun 2018, 01:36 »

*reads up on the episode via the provided link*

...um. So...Yar was clearly not in her right mind, but we're just gonna act like she was in a healthy consenting state for this interaction and it's somehow disappointing that she suggested she wanted to act like it didn't happen afterward because AI Discrimination?

Okay then.

Yeah, the episode was kinda... weird...  about sex. It was definitely not TNG at its best. But I think the point of the comment was about dehumanizing commentary about the episode, not about Yar's behavior towards Data within the episode.

Everything about Season 1 TNG was just terrible.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #356 on: 04 Jun 2018, 17:59 »

*reads up on the episode via the provided link*

...um. So...Yar was clearly not in her right mind, but we're just gonna act like she was in a healthy consenting state for this interaction and it's somehow disappointing that she suggested she wanted to act like it didn't happen afterward because AI Discrimination?

Okay then.

Yeah, the episode was kinda... weird...  about sex. It was definitely not TNG at its best. But I think the point of the comment was about dehumanizing commentary about the episode, not about Yar's behavior towards Data within the episode.

Everything about Season 1 TNG was just terrible.
Season Two wasn't really any better.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #357 on: 04 Jun 2018, 18:20 »

It included "Loud as a Whisper".
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #358 on: 04 Jun 2018, 21:48 »

It included "Loud as a Whisper".

It also included "Shades of Grey."  Allowing those two to cancel out... yeah.  About the same as season 1.  (Thankfully, season 3 got SO MUCH BETTER.)
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #359 on: 05 Jun 2018, 03:33 »

Season 2 introduced the Borg. For that, if nothing else, it is a good season.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #360 on: 05 Jun 2018, 03:46 »

IIRC, they had some budget and screenwriter strikes during season 2. However, I feel that their worst conceptual failing was trying to recreate  the Spock/McCoy antagonism between Data and Pulaski (Diana Muldur doing her best with a poorly-conceived legacy-ripoff character).
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Mr_Rose

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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #361 on: 05 Jun 2018, 04:17 »

They failed because they forgot that the reason it worked in the first place was that Spock gave at least as good as he got when McCoy was being an arse to him. Data on the other hand, being the naive-but-curious type, goes straight to “kicked puppy” mode whenever Pulaski was dehumanising, which was every other breath, and it made her come across like a complete monster rather than one half of a mutually respectful/antagonistic relationship. Plus there was no third party who knew ‘this is what they’re like, this is what they’ve always been like’ to moderate or mediate or let the audience know that this is just how these two express their affection for each other.

Basically they took the core element of ‘doctor is sarcastic to emotionless guy’ and threw it at the script without any establishing background or support. This is like trying to put a roof on a building with no walls. Not that they ever even finished putting the roof together properly either.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #362 on: 10 Jun 2018, 05:12 »

It included "Loud as a Whisper".

It also included "Shades of Grey."  Allowing those two to cancel out... yeah.  About the same as season 1.  (Thankfully, season 3 got SO MUCH BETTER.)


I always consider this ultimate vindication as a Doctor Who fan. Basically Star Trek didn't Start getting good until Doctor who was Off the air. And except for TOS(which was good as was 66-69 Docr Who) Star Trek has never had a superior or critically acclaimed season when airing against Doctor Who. I had to giggle when Docovery was set in stone for a air date and once the Doctor who trailers started dropping..... boom.... Postponed.

If it aint broke don fix it. Aka Classic Doctor Who fans are predisposed to watch Star Trek when Doctor who isn't on. And a whole oof a lot of us were very happy we had Discovery to enjoy when Doctor Who took a break.

As for AI stuff, I think they did some amazing stuff with the concept of humanity with data in 3-7. Also even though I maintain DS9 was the superior show( Yes I'm one of those) Voyager really double dipped and did some brilliant stuff with AI. and they even did some AiI type storylines with 7of9.


And yes, Pulaski came off as a monster.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #363 on: 17 Jun 2018, 13:20 »

Right, but she needs to reject them, then, surely? Not easy but what she’s doing now isn’t going to work. She hasn’t really given clear indications that it’s never going to happen, and if that’s the case, she’s gotta.

Of course she doesn't need to do that.

Even if she were neurotypical, she probably wouldn't do that.  I don't really know how it looks from the many other perspectives out there, but from the observations of a cisgendered heterosexual male, women very rarely "reject" anyone unless anyone is a super persistent jerk who can't take a hint.  To have her ignoring their attraction to her is about as strong a message as Clinton or Elliot should expect or need, at least once they're certain that she knows about their attraction to her.

And if they don't accept that as a clear message that she's not interested in them that way, they're just being deliberately dense.
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Re: WCDT strips 3751-3755 (28th May to 1st June 2018)
« Reply #364 on: 03 Jul 2018, 23:31 »

Poll Results Post
Summer's here! What summer stories would you like to see?

1. Northampton's medieval-themed Summer Faire (Bubbles mentors Sam to win the Tournament) - 30 (18%)
=2. The Reed/Bean family vacation (Marten, Claire (and Pintsize?) along for the ride; lots of coincidental background characters returning) - 27 (16.2%)
=2. Claire's final exams looms; later the graduation is a significant thing - 27 (16.2%)
4. Angus's show is on hiatus; he comes back to try to make peace with Faye - 23 (13.8%)
5. For the first time, Bubbles is able to face the annual reunion of the survivors of her unit - 22 (13.2%)
6. The Fairy Girl ropes the ladies into some weird Summer Solstice festival - 12 (7.2%)
=7. Pintsize, having cleaned up at the poker game, goes on tour to several world casinos with Melon as his sidekick/assistant - 8 (4.8%)
=7 Sven is going on tour to the summer Country festivals; somehow, May gets a Roadie job - 8 (4.8%)
9. Dora decides to add iced teas and iced coffees to CoD's repetoire; there are teething troubles - 6 (3.6%)
10. Other (please specify in a comment) - 4 (2.4%)

-----------------

So, the general victors are Bubbles as Sam's sensei-sama, a vacation arc and Claire's graduation. Well, given events in the strips starting Monday 2nd July, it seems that we might at least get the latter of these!
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