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Poll

So what is Roko's new chassis going to be like?

Pretentious like a Porsche.
- 9 (28.1%)
Big Badonkadonk like a Kardashian.
- 4 (12.5%)
Pigtails (and her other accoutrements) like Momo.
- 2 (6.3%)
Attitude and glitches like May.
- 2 (6.3%)
HAH! She looks like Lemon!
- 3 (9.4%)
Worse - she looks like PINTSIZE.
- 0 (0%)
That dream of being a toaster is FINALLY REALIZED!
- 4 (12.5%)
Purple Monkey Dishwasher!
- 8 (25%)

Total Members Voted: 32


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Author Topic: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)  (Read 6225 times)

Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #100 on: 10 Jan 2019, 03:39 »

I just can't help but laugh at her surprise that Roko could see the balloon!




(Don't ask me how long I've been waiting for an opportunity to post this one ...)
« Last Edit: 10 Jan 2019, 13:39 by Case »
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #101 on: 10 Jan 2019, 03:43 »

Note also the lack of seam lines where the various joints are.  The area where the neck joins the body being the sole exception (I wonder if even this is smoothed out in higher grade models?)
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #102 on: 10 Jan 2019, 04:14 »

Note also the lack of seam lines where the various joints are.  The area where the neck joins the body being the sole exception (I wonder if even this is smoothed out in higher grade models?)

Lots of the higher-specification chassis have this feature, most notably Bubbles and Momo's current body. To me, the real extra features on Roko's new body are the human-mimicking auricles and some secondary sexual features, both of which suggest to me that the designers' goal was 'as human as we can get it'.
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #103 on: 10 Jan 2019, 04:16 »

Note also the lack of seam lines where the various joints are.  The area where the neck joins the body being the sole exception (I wonder if even this is smoothed out in higher grade models?)

Lots of the higher-specification chassis have this feature, most notably Bubbles and Momo's current body. To me, the real extra features on Roko's new body are the human-mimicking auricles and some secondary sexual features, both of which suggest to me that the designers' goal was 'as human as we can get it'.

"More human than human" is our motto...

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #104 on: 10 Jan 2019, 05:53 »

Note also the lack of seam lines where the various joints are.  The area where the neck joins the body being the sole exception (I wonder if even this is smoothed out in higher grade models?)

Lots of the higher-specification chassis have this feature, most notably Bubbles and Momo's current body. To me, the real extra features on Roko's new body are the human-mimicking auricles and some secondary sexual features, both of which suggest to me that the designers' goal was 'as human as we can get it'.

"More human than human" is our motto...

So more emphatic and selfless then? :wink:
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #105 on: 10 Jan 2019, 06:32 »

To me, the real extra features on Roko's new body are the human-mimicking auricles and some secondary sexual features, both of which suggest to me that the designers' goal was 'as human as we can get it'.

Oh she's gonna like her new bun zones
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #106 on: 10 Jan 2019, 06:39 »

Note also the lack of seam lines where the various joints are.  The area where the neck joins the body being the sole exception (I wonder if even this is smoothed out in higher grade models?)

Lots of the higher-specification chassis have this feature, most notably Bubbles and Momo's current body. To me, the real extra features on Roko's new body are the human-mimicking auricles and some secondary sexual features, both of which suggest to me that the designers' goal was 'as human as we can get it'.

Even Spookybot has the neck seam.  I thought they might be so sophisticated their chassis lacked that, but apparently there is a need to separate the head from the rest of the body if need be. 
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #107 on: 10 Jan 2019, 06:56 »

Note also the lack of seam lines where the various joints are.  The area where the neck joins the body being the sole exception (I wonder if even this is smoothed out in higher grade models?)

Lots of the higher-specification chassis have this feature, most notably Bubbles and Momo's current body. To me, the real extra features on Roko's new body are the human-mimicking auricles and some secondary sexual features, both of which suggest to me that the designers' goal was 'as human as we can get it'.

"More human than human" is our motto...

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #108 on: 10 Jan 2019, 07:14 »

We’ve seen the higher-end models vent coolant through their neck seams. So maybe that’s its purpose - to give the chassis a way of venting coolant that’s slightly more dignified than having it come out their ears. Or farting it.
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #109 on: 10 Jan 2019, 08:11 »

Weíve seen the higher-end models vent coolant through their neck seams. So maybe thatís its purpose - to give the chassis a way of venting coolant thatís slightly more dignified than having it come out their ears. Or farting it.

I'm sure Pintsize took a chassis that farts to vent coolant...
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #110 on: 10 Jan 2019, 09:14 »

I really liked how Jeph kind of took us into one of the most degrading of the aspects of the trans experience: people asking very personal questions about your body, and whether and you'd had surgery. I particularly think it's great that he brought the whole debate about whether or not Claire has had genital corrective surgery directly into the narrative, even if only indirectly.

I hope that the next time somebody wants to speculate about Claire, they'll think about Roko's response to the question about whether or not she now has nipples...
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Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #111 on: 10 Jan 2019, 09:35 »

Even Spookybot has the neck seam.  I thought they might be so sophisticated their chassis lacked that, but apparently there is a need to separate the head from the rest of the body if need be.

Well, humans manage that trick on a regular basis (even without a neck seam), so mayhaps it was felt that AI should possess the ability in order to blend in?
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #112 on: 10 Jan 2019, 10:28 »

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #113 on: 10 Jan 2019, 12:39 »

Not any more, you're not  :x

My work here is done.  :evil:
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Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #114 on: 10 Jan 2019, 13:08 »

Even Spookybot has the neck seam.  I thought they might be so sophisticated their chassis lacked that, but apparently there is a need to separate the head from the rest of the body if need be.

Well, humans manage that trick on a regular basis (even without a neck seam), so mayhaps it was felt that AI should possess the ability in order to blend in?

They just wanted to be able to help out humans that wanted to get ahead.

Don't all AIs have the seams? I wasn't aware of any without them.
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Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #115 on: 10 Jan 2019, 13:48 »

Even Spookybot has the neck seam.  I thought they might be so sophisticated their chassis lacked that, but apparently there is a need to separate the head from the rest of the body if need be.
Well, humans manage that trick on a regular basis (even without a neck seam), so mayhaps it was felt that AI should possess the ability in order to blend in?
Like so?

More like so:




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Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #116 on: 10 Jan 2019, 13:52 »

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #117 on: 10 Jan 2019, 13:55 »

...Even though this is a SFW comic I can't help thinking that that's gotta be Chekhov's nipples. Or maybe Jeph is just trying to say that all "unspecialized" chassis aren't necessarily Barbie dolls like May.
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Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #118 on: 10 Jan 2019, 14:00 »

Damn, my "it's all about the jokes" sig got changed.
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Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #119 on: 10 Jan 2019, 14:29 »

...Even though this is a SFW comic I can't help thinking that that's gotta be Chekhov's nipples. Or maybe Jeph is just trying to say that all "unspecialized" chassis aren't necessarily Barbie dolls like May.

chekhovsnipples.com is still free for the taking ...
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #120 on: 10 Jan 2019, 16:02 »

*looks at string of pics*

Case, I think that they're all more legless than headless.
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Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #121 on: 10 Jan 2019, 17:16 »

*looks at string of pics*

Case, I think that they're all more legless than headless.

In a very, very literal sense that's true, yes.

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #122 on: 10 Jan 2019, 19:32 »

Poor  Crunchbot. *lol*

Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #123 on: 10 Jan 2019, 20:12 »

Um. Faye's last line. >:\
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #124 on: 10 Jan 2019, 20:18 »

Um. Faye's last line. >:\

I think it's MEANT to be funny. Plus, this IS Faye.

"Oh, a card. And it's from Crushbot."

"CONGRATS ON NEW BODY. HOPE YOU ENJOY NIPPLES."

"AWK!" Roko yelped

Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #125 on: 10 Jan 2019, 20:38 »

Yah, I assume so.

eh /shrug
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #126 on: 10 Jan 2019, 20:51 »

Quote from: Jeph
I'm surprised Roko even dented Crushbot
I would assume it was the GROUND that dented Crushbot. Roko just happened to get in the way.  :-o
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #127 on: 10 Jan 2019, 21:21 »

Um. Faye's last line. >:\

Agreed.  Crushbot could get repaired anywhere else since he probably has insurance coverage for that too.  This is business that fell onto Roko's back and is now falling into Union Robotic's lap. 

Faye really should be nicer unless AI's don't care about that surly attitude of hers.   
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #128 on: 10 Jan 2019, 21:39 »

Yeah, I'm wondering if the logo for the Philomena-G is something like this! Cute (because of its origins) but still stylish. I also think it has the sort of general feel of which Roko would approve!

Me too! (Added to Headcanon.)
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BenRG

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #129 on: 10 Jan 2019, 23:13 »

I think that this is in character for Faye. Remember how defensive she gets if she encounters people that have hurt her friends? She poured hot milk into the lap of Marten's ex, remember? Years after the event too, I think! So, yeah, being angry with Crushbot for what happened to an unreasonable degree is what she would do.

In Faye's defence, looking at that buckled back panel and realise that most of that damage was caused by the tougher parts of her new friend's anatomy as she was pulverised can't be an easy thing to do.

As for Faye's question...? What do you get a synthetic as a sympathy gift? If they knew Roko better, they'd know it would be a photographic catalogue of men's underwear, mostly because it will afford views of human abs. However, knowing Faye, it will be some kind of bizarre 'gag gift' that she bought on an impulse.
« Last Edit: 11 Jan 2019, 00:04 by BenRG »
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Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #130 on: 10 Jan 2019, 23:27 »

I think that this is in character for Faye.

I mean, you're not wrong, I guess.

And normally I just laugh Faye's sass off. Because I know it's just sass.

But Crushbot is probably already feeling the weight (pun unintended) of guilt. This seems malicious.
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #131 on: 10 Jan 2019, 23:45 »

As for Faye's question...? What do you get a synthetic as a sympathy gift. If they knew Roko better, they'd know it would be a photographic catalogue of men's underwear, mostly because it will afford views of human abs. However, knowing Faye it will be some kind of bizarre 'gag gift' that she bought on an impulse.

Since a fruit basket is out of the question, they might in good faith decide on a basket of baked goods, as a good alternative. Which would show us directly just what the impact of her sensorium upgrade would be.
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #132 on: 10 Jan 2019, 23:50 »

As for Faye's question...? What do you get a synthetic as a sympathy gift. If they knew Roko better, they'd know it would be a photographic catalogue of men's underwear, mostly because it will afford views of human abs. However, knowing Faye it will be some kind of bizarre 'gag gift' that she bought on an impulse.

Not a fruit basket, no, but that's in the right ballpark: you get her a bread basket! Two or three freshly-baked loaves of still-warm bread would be just the thing, no?

Edit: Hah, ninja'd!
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #133 on: 11 Jan 2019, 00:03 »

If she can have a hallucinatory response to the aroma of tea, she can respond to fruit as well.  Definitely no bananas, though. 

Maybe a nice, ripe durian.  Naw, not as a get well gift, but file that away for another arc.  (What would a whiff of durian do to Spookybot?)
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traroth

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #134 on: 11 Jan 2019, 01:15 »

It's Roko's neural core which let a dent on Crushbot
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #135 on: 11 Jan 2019, 02:34 »

I think that this is in character for Faye. Remember how defensive she gets if she encounters people that have hurt her friends? She poured hot milk into the lap of Marten's ex, remember? Years after the event too, I think! So, yeah, being angry with Crushbot for what happened to an unreasonable degree is what she would do.

Yes, but she's grown a lot since then.  Honestly, this reaction reminds me of why I never cared much for her character.  Apparently her attitude didn't seem to affect business at Coffee of Doom too much, but I know I'd probably never return if she was my barista.  And now that she's got a struggling business of her own she really needs to be nicer because like I said Crushbot could've had his repairs done somewhere else and he's not obliged to give them a positive review.   
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Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #136 on: 11 Jan 2019, 02:54 »

And now that she's got a struggling business of her own she really needs to be nicer because like I said Crushbot could've had his repairs done somewhere else and he's not obliged to give them a positive review.   

Yeah, honestly? He is obliged not to crush people - especially people who don't schlepp their brainboxes around in an armoured casing & can't just plonk it into a shiny new body with a fancy butt-emblem.

'Customer is King' & positive reviews and all that come way behind public health & safety as far as I'm concerned.
« Last Edit: 11 Jan 2019, 03:06 by Case »
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Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #137 on: 11 Jan 2019, 03:08 »

We disagree on this one, my friend.
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Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #138 on: 11 Jan 2019, 03:12 »

We disagree on this one, my friend.

We do? About time!  :laugh:

Jokes aside: Shoot (*)


(*) = Where do we disagree? Why? How? etc.
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Tova

Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #139 on: 11 Jan 2019, 03:21 »

Perhaps you would be angry at Crushbot because they own a dangerous chassis? I guess I could accept that. Even though we accept risk elsewhere in life. Such as driving cars.

Otherwise, what's the point of anger at Crushbot at this time?

If someone lost control of their car after a rock hit the windshield, and someone were killed as a result, would your reaction towards that person be angry or compassionate?

Bonus supplementary question: how would you feel in turn if your anger resulted in the person inflicting self-harm?

I think that would make me pretty upset.

P.S. Oh, I should clarify. Faye shouldn't be nicer for positive reviews. Faye should be nicer because it's the decent thing to do.
« Last Edit: 11 Jan 2019, 03:34 by Tova »
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Case

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #140 on: 11 Jan 2019, 03:58 »

P.S. Oh, I should clarify. Faye shouldn't be nicer for positive reviews. Faye should be nicer because it's the decent thing to do.

Yeah, the review thing surprised me a bit.

Perhaps you would be angry at Crushbot because they own a dangerous chassis? I guess I could accept that. Even though we accept risk elsewhere in life. Such as driving cars.

That's actually the analogy I was thinking of: I'm German (Chorus: "We know, Case!"), and we love cars, we love to drive them often, we drive at very high traffic density, and we do it legally at speeds few other countries on this planet allow. We also have rather low number of road fatalities. Comes with extensive safety regulations, driver training, etc. <- The point is that it's drilled into you to be constantly aware of your surroundings and the impact of your actions on others (In theory, at last).

There's been a debate here about (very) old drivers - when it's time that they should hand in their license, as there is no legal age-limit. On the one hand, it is a cruel statement to make, it is likely to shrink their mobility and thus their social circle at a time when loneliness becomes a health-hazard etc. On the other hand, they're handling half a ton of murder on wheels in one of the most demanding driving environments on the planet. Reaction times become longer, focussing becomes harder, eyesight weaker.

The individual and its rights and welfare must be at the core of societies' considerations - that's where all 'western democracies' agree, the heritage of the enlightenment, to be dramatic about it. In the end, 'the people' are comprised of individuals and whatever rights you take away from one, you take away from all.

Otoh, the people are also a collective of people, not merely the sum total of its individual members. At what point does the concern for the welfare of the many override the concern of the welfare and freedom of the few?

IDK, for me this is a natural consideration, the way I was raised and the discursive ideal my society - or liberal democracy in general - purports to strive towards (not always successfully, and increasingly less so, but still). It's a constant balancing act, it's the core question that most of society's problems boil down to. And I'm sometimes a bit ... surprised to see that other cultures agree on the first part, but that the second seems foreign to many.

TL;DR - Yes, he shouldn't be in this chassis, or shouldn't walk it on the sidewalk, or get a sensor upgrade or safety training or whatever. I understand he didn't intend to hurt anyone, but "With great power ekcetra ekcetra"

Otherwise, what's the point of anger at Crushbot at this time?

Anger ... there's not much point to anger, unless it fuels productive action. I'd say that it's not wrong to insist that Crushbot has a think about whether he can safely walk his chassis around people he could easily kill accidentally, and what he could do to reduce the risk to his fellow beings.

And anger is something different than cruelty, which is what you seem to be reading here? I'd say that anger can (!) be productive and instructive, when it is followed and joined by compassion and care. Being angry with someone doesn't imply shunning them forever - you can always come back, apologize, embrace etc. Of course, as you'll rightly point out, many people agree with the first part and forget about the second ... (or how addictive anger can be)

If someone lost control of their car after a rock hit the windshield, and someone were killed as a result, would your reaction towards that person be angry or compassionate?

Happens all the time over here, and at speeds you've rarely driven at. The results aren't pretty, penalties (for the rock-throwers) are severe and nobody has sympathies for the sociopaths who do that. In fact, I used to flinch whenever I saw people on a bridge over an autobahn I was riding on.

That's very different from crushing someone flat on a sidewalk because you stumbled ass backwards over a crate of bananas - a sidewalk is not a highway, people do all manner of stuff on a sidewalk, and 'people' includes e.g. children, who are widely known to come up with the most unthinkable stuff apropos nothing at all.

Bonus supplementary question: how would you feel in turn if your anger resulted in the person inflicting self-harm?

Horrible. But that's an unanswerable question and, more problematic, an unactionable one. First, you can never truly know how your words impact the actions of another - afaics, the time-evolution of the statevector of the human brain is very much an unsolved problem. Second, if you make 'Always act in such a way as to exclude the possibility of someone coming to harm, including harming themselves as a possible reaction to your actions' your maxime, you can't act at all. Which actually makes sure you're harming one person - yourself.

(Sidenote: Threatening suicide for coercion is a real thing and a real problem and it's a tactic abusers use. Thank God it never happened to me, but I was in a position once where informing myself and thinking about it seemed an immediate necessity, so ... I'm sorry: While I am among those who insist that 'words have consequences', I also insist that everyone of us is ultimately responsible for their own actions (modulo illness). I'm well aware that this sentence, if read literally enough, contains a paradox. I have no better answer than: "Do what you can, that's all you can do, and all anyone can demand of you")


"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; What is essential is invisible to the eye" would be the maxime I'd try to follow.

This reminds me a lot of the comic where Fae starts a dialog with Hanners with "Hi fellow crazerina". Lot of people got upset about addressing someone sufferning from OCD as "crazerina". I've lived with OCD for quite a while, and I wasn't upset. It was clear to me what she meant. There's meaner/more damaging things people have said to me than 'crazerino', and they did it with a smile and polite words and superficial concern (or simply because they didn't know better). Forcing them not to use 'crazy' while I'm around won't protect me from those.

<- Points to 'motto-quote' 

I think this situation is similar: People get upset about Faye saying something crass, but forget that crass isn't the same as cruel. Note e.g. that when she says 'Nobody likes you' she adds the qualifier 'right now', which implies that in the future, people will like him again. And it's ... IDK, close to the hyperbole you use around kids?

Anyhow, my 1$ 21cents.
« Last Edit: 11 Jan 2019, 07:09 by Case »
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #141 on: 11 Jan 2019, 04:47 »

Interesting point made by the guys on the subreddit today. All salvageable components from Roko's old chassis should remain hers (unless the chassis was leased or something weird but the way the insurance settlement was handled doesn't suggest that). Anyway, we know that she has a phobia about seeing her parts but it is still hers. So, how are Faye and Bubbles going to handle the bits  they pick out of Crushbot's back panel? I am thinking of Faye presenting Roko with a bucket of parts and asking 'Do you want to keep these in case you need spare parts?' because... well, Faye.

I'm wondering if we're going to see the AI equivalent of an organ/tissue donor charity starting via Roko's voluntary work. It strikes me as something that no-one would have thought to have done so far, given how poor May had to go begging for bits. Maybe Bubbles and Faye could donate the mystery arm too?

Would anyone else find a long-term arc about Faye, Bubbles and Roko being the leading lights in supported healthcare for low-income synthetics?
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #142 on: 11 Jan 2019, 06:44 »

If someone lost control of their car after a rock hit the windshield, and someone were killed as a result, would your reaction towards that person be angry or compassionate?

Aside from what Case answered above, let me adjust that image; Someone is driving a car on the sidewalk all the time, and doesn't see an obstacle, about the same size of a child drawing on the sidewalk, reverses, and kills someone. Should we be angry at that person?

I know the idea is that their chassis is their body, and that they're supposed to be accepted as people, but let's be honest, what is the heaviest person you're likely to see on a sidewalk? And are those people likely to be clad in metal? There's a good reason to separate traffic, even if some people think it might be a good idea to mingle it and slow down traffic.
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #143 on: 11 Jan 2019, 06:48 »

Interesting point made by the guys on the subreddit today. All salvageable components from Roko's old chassis should remain hers (unless the chassis was leased or something weird but the way the insurance settlement was handled doesn't suggest that). Anyway, we know that she has a phobia about seeing her parts but it is still hers. So, how are Faye and Bubbles going to handle the bits  they pick out of Crushbot's back panel? I am thinking of Faye presenting Roko with a bucket of parts and asking 'Do you want to keep these in case you need spare parts?' because... well, Faye.
On the other hand, Melon didn't get to keep Roko's head, so perhaps she part exchanged the wreckage towards her new body? Like some car dealers will take your totaled car for scrap, and count it towards your new purchase?
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #144 on: 11 Jan 2019, 06:59 »

Interesting point made by the guys on the subreddit today. All salvageable components from Roko's old chassis should remain hers (unless the chassis was leased or something weird but the way the insurance settlement was handled doesn't suggest that). Anyway, we know that she has a phobia about seeing her parts but it is still hers. So, how are Faye and Bubbles going to handle the bits  they pick out of Crushbot's back panel? I am thinking of Faye presenting Roko with a bucket of parts and asking 'Do you want to keep these in case you need spare parts?' because... well, Faye.

I'm wondering if we're going to see the AI equivalent of an organ/tissue donor charity starting via Roko's voluntary work. It strikes me as something that no-one would have thought to have done so far, given how poor May had to go begging for bits. Maybe Bubbles and Faye could donate the mystery arm too?

Would anyone else find a long-term arc about Faye, Bubbles and Roko being the leading lights in supported healthcare for low-income synthetics?

Interesting point... not sure if it's cogent, though.

It's a bit tricky, considering it's Sentient AIs but..

If you have a car, said car must be insured. IF your car is written off, your insurer will pay for it - and the car is no longer yours.

If you go to hospital, and a surgeon removes your leg - that leg is destroyed - it's no longer yours.
(Yes, there are odd occasions when people may be allowed to be given things like kidneys stones etc if they ask after they have been removed, but generally speaking, if it's removed from your body, it's destroyed... it's no longer yours.
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #145 on: 11 Jan 2019, 07:19 »

And now that she's got a struggling business of her own she really needs to be nicer because like I said Crushbot could've had his repairs done somewhere else and he's not obliged to give them a positive review.   

Yeah, honestly? He is obliged not to crush people - especially people who don't schlepp their brainboxes around in an armoured casing & can't just plonk it into a shiny new body with a fancy butt-emblem.

'Customer is King' & positive reviews and all that come way behind public health & safety as far as I'm concerned.

Crushbot is a big AI and so is Bubbles.  Now if Bubbles slipped and fell on Roko it wouldn't have done as much damage, but Roko would definitely need repairs.  Do you think Faye would have the same attitude?  She'd probably brush it off as accidents happening.   

We don't know a lot of the details about AIs interacting with humans.  It's possible Crushbot has special sensors that detect humans and animals which may lock up movements to avoid accidentally falling over on anyone, but this is not in effect when other AIs are present.  Roko is alive with a better chassis than before and while you can dismiss Crushbot's feelings over the matter that doesn't change the fact that he could've chosen anywhere to get his repairs done, but is patronizing their struggling business.  She doesn't have to console him, but she really should be nicer if she wants repeat business.     
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #146 on: 11 Jan 2019, 07:25 »

As for Faye's question...? What do you get a synthetic as a sympathy gift. If they knew Roko better, they'd know it would be a photographic catalogue of men's underwear, mostly because it will afford views of human abs. However, knowing Faye it will be some kind of bizarre 'gag gift' that she bought on an impulse.

Since a fruit basket is out of the question, they might in good faith decide on a basket of baked goods, as a good alternative. Which would show us directly just what the impact of her sensorium upgrade would be.

Scented candles that smell like freshly baked bread rubbed on human abs.
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #147 on: 11 Jan 2019, 08:31 »

Bread looking like human abs. It seems it exists...

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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #148 on: 11 Jan 2019, 08:38 »

So let me get this straight. We’re letting Crushbot off the hook for nearly killing Roko, but we’re condemning Faye for potentially hurting Crushbot’s feelings?
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Re: WCDT 7-11 January 2019 (3911-3915)
« Reply #149 on: 11 Jan 2019, 08:53 »

So let me get this straight. Weíre letting Crushbot off the hook for nearly killing Roko, but weíre condemning Faye for potentially hurting Crushbotís feelings?

Well, Crushbot's insurance company is making a hefty ($20K+) payout, and his premiums are likely to go up; he's done what he can to make amends and will wind up paying a stiff price. I'd say that's enough, and wouldn't expect more; if that's "letting him off the hook", so be it.

No comment as regards Faye.
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