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Poll

Is Yemisi a new character or just one we haven't seen in awhile?

I completely remember her and am definitely not lying.
new character
old character
Ummm......hang on. Let me check the archives.
Wasn't she one of the library interns introduced with Claire, Gabby, and Emily?
No clue, tired man.

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Author Topic: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)  (Read 6699 times)

BlueFatima

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #100 on: 03 Dec 2020, 07:23 »

And I came away from today's comic with: OK, Brun and Millie for a bit, then Millie will give up as Brun is an Ace and return to Jones for comfort and attention.  Indeed, we'll see where these characters get taken.

I notice in webcomic communities that when a character doesn’t jump right into a relationship/sex, some followers enthusiastically label them as Ace—sometimes to the point massive debates start. This is not necessarily happening here yet, but seeing the label get dropped made me think about it.


Having had people (friends and family members) speculate over my own sexuality when I was in my late teens, I find it odd and intrusive. There are so many reasons people don’t date or show sexual interest in others until later in life. It doesn’t always come down to something being wrong or someone not being a sexual person, either. Sure I believe Ace people do exist (the world is a big place—way bigger than my little bubble), however it feels like fiction communities really overuse that label and often it turns out the character is not. Go Get a Roomie (another fantastic webcomic which is coming to a close) comes to mind, but there are other comics like it, too.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #101 on: 03 Dec 2020, 07:29 »

And I came away from today's comic with: OK, Brun and Millie for a bit, then Millie will give up as Brun is an Ace and return to Jones for comfort and attention.  Indeed, we'll see where these characters get taken.

I notice in webcomic communities that when a character doesn’t jump right into a relationship/sex, some followers enthusiastically label them as Ace—sometimes to the point massive debates start. This is not necessarily happening here yet, but seeing the label get dropped made me think about it.


Having had people (friends and family members) speculate over my own sexuality when I was in my late teens, I find it odd and intrusive. There are so many reasons people don’t date or show sexual interest in others until later in life. It doesn’t always come down to something being wrong or someone not being a sexual person, either. Sure I believe Ace people do exist (the world is a big place—way bigger than my little bubble), however it feels like fiction communities really overuse that label and often it turns out the character is not. Go Get a Roomie (another fantastic webcomic which is coming to a close) comes to mind, but there are other comics like it, too.

I think people are overeager to label characters as Ace for the same reason fandoms are eager to assume characters are queer (or ship them) at the slightest suggestion or queerbating on the part of creators (see: BBC's Sherlock).

That is to say, representation is so sparse that it has people grasping at straws.

It doesn't help that it's difficult to establish a character as Ace without them explicitly saying so. You can establish other sexualities with more overt hints.

So I can sympathise with asexual people in that it must be frustrating that they do not get adequate representation in fiction.
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BlueFatima

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #102 on: 03 Dec 2020, 07:57 »

And I came away from today's comic with: OK, Brun and Millie for a bit, then Millie will give up as Brun is an Ace and return to Jones for comfort and attention.  Indeed, we'll see where these characters get taken.

I notice in webcomic communities that when a character doesn’t jump right into a relationship/sex, some followers enthusiastically label them as Ace—sometimes to the point massive debates start. This is not necessarily happening here yet, but seeing the label get dropped made me think about it.


Having had people (friends and family members) speculate over my own sexuality when I was in my late teens, I find it odd and intrusive. There are so many reasons people don’t date or show sexual interest in others until later in life. It doesn’t always come down to something being wrong or someone not being a sexual person, either. Sure I believe Ace people do exist (the world is a big place—way bigger than my little bubble), however it feels like fiction communities really overuse that label and often it turns out the character is not. Go Get a Roomie (another fantastic webcomic which is coming to a close) comes to mind, but there are other comics like it, too.

I think people are overeager to label characters as Ace for the same reason fandoms are eager to assume characters are queer (or ship them) at the slightest suggestion or queerbating on the part of creators (see: BBC's Sherlock).

That is to say, representation is so sparse that it has people grasping at straws.

It doesn't help that it's difficult to establish a character as Ace without them explicitly saying so. You can establish other sexualities with more overt hints.

So I can sympathise with asexual people in that it must be frustrating that they do not get adequate representation in fiction.

I could understand that and it is way cool to celebrate when a queer character comes out of the closet (I HATE queer-baiting), but usually the majority of the folks doing the labeling either aren’t queer or they seem to have very little experience withIn the LGBTQ community. I can definitely attest to this in RL circumstances (not one person I’ve heard using labels like that was lGBTQ or at least out of the closet) and in some of the communities where some of the people in the discussions appeared to be open about their lives (haha—but we never really know right?).

Another thing to consider is that while there are people who are legitimately Ace, it is not as cut and dry a kind of thing to pin down as being gay or bi (and those are complicated in their own rights). Mental and health issues can actually impact a person’s ability to feel sexual or attempt to have a relationship. I think that is part of why the use of label bothers me beyond labeling a broad group of people—aside from the fact I have seen and felt how being lumped into a label can hurt.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #103 on: 03 Dec 2020, 09:26 »

I am queer.  Somewhere between bi and ace, haven't exactly pinned down exactly where but I definitely claim both labels because I feel they both describe me.  I'm part of a community of mostly queer people in a show's fandom, and we pretty much ALL have our "your fave is queer" headcanons.

For me, my first exposure to the idea of asexuality in this context was through fanfic.  Reading the fic, especially the ones that were explicitly about Being Ace and What It's Like For Ace Characters In Relationships, helped me understand a lot of things about myself.  That got me researching specific terms I encountered and interacting with people with similar headcanons, and finding the words and explanations for myself and how I feel.

As long as people keep in mind that their headcanons are not the same as Actual Canon, I think it does more good than harm.  I can understand, given the irresponsible speculation that hurt you, why you disagree.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #104 on: 03 Dec 2020, 11:39 »

some discussion on labels from Ashley in El Goonish Shive

Quote
https://ww.egscomics.com/comic/2015-05-23
"Part of why I don't like labeling people is the labels mean different things to different people, and they come with their own prejudices and expectations.  I don't know what I'm actually telling someone with labels.  And when is comes to who I'm attracted to, that's really nobody else's businesses unless I want to tell them." 

I have seen arguments about a thing, where they are really in agreement, but do not realize they are using different terms or definitions.  It is difficult to communicate without a confidence that each side is using the same concepts.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #105 on: 03 Dec 2020, 11:53 »

Here we go again ...

... can she please commit an actual sin before we break out the New-Character-Must-Die pitchforks?

Please?

I saw Tilly as an annoying distraction on first appearance, taking time away from more interesting characters. But I admit Tilly did serve a narrative function and did it well.

Yemisi has one previous appearence and an interesting name. Curvy Clueless and Snippy Blue, the burrito gals, have had more screen time and don't even have names.

Jeph does what he does, and for what I'm paying, I can't complain. I'm sorry if my gripe ruffled feathers.

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #106 on: 03 Dec 2020, 18:24 »

Comic's up.

Well, at least Brun and Millefeuille have decent communication :-)
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #107 on: 03 Dec 2020, 18:29 »

Yeah, I'm thinking Brun is somewhere in the asexual range....

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #108 on: 03 Dec 2020, 18:36 »

"During this process, the dopamine receptors are tricked into believing they have fulfilled their genetic imperative."
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #109 on: 03 Dec 2020, 18:45 »

 :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
"...a couple people..."
I have this mental picture of Brun clinically analysing the performance and saying "I didn't quite catch all of that - I'll have to try it again, with someone else, to get enough data points..."
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Zebediah

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #110 on: 03 Dec 2020, 18:45 »

It’s not surprising that Brun’s sexual experiences weren’t terribly impressive to her. Sex is a skill like any other; you probably won’t be very good at it the first few times you do it. I’m guessing that her partner wasn’t very experienced either, which wouldn’t have helped. And it sounds like her motivation was primarily curiosity about the experience rather than actual desire for her partner. So yeah, it likely would have been awkward and frustrating and possibly painful. Not something she’d care to repeat. If she was already inclined to be asexual, that kind of experience would only have reinforced that inclination.
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ihaveavoice

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #111 on: 03 Dec 2020, 20:30 »

Another thing to consider is that while there are people who are legitimately Ace, it is not as cut and dry a kind of thing to pin down as being gay or bi (and those are complicated in their own rights). Mental and health issues can actually impact a person’s ability to feel sexual or attempt to have a relationship. I think that is part of why the use of label bothers me beyond labeling a broad group of people—aside from the fact I have seen and felt how being lumped into a label can hurt.

I'd just like to point out that health does indeed affect libido, but sexual attraction is a different thing. There is a specific kind of attraction that involves people theoretically wanting to do something more than just keep looking at another good looking person, even if they aren't feeling it with actual partners right now. That's something nobody ever feels the need to explicitly say, so I never knew, so despite the fact that I was aware of my libido just floating around sans target at times, and I knew what it was like for it to go away in a period of deep depression and then not be gone later, I assumed that I must have an issue with my sex drive and that was why I didn't feel these things that every societal message was screaming I was supposed to feel. I knew deep down that it wasn't true, which just made me feel even more broken and wrong. And honestly, it just sucks balls for people to attach the concept of asexuality to a medical problem. I get what you're saying about it being complicated for people to tell because the information isn't out there and people are complex beings, and I do agree about fandom declarations of characters' sexual orientations, but it also hurts for people who have realized a certain label fits them to see yet more reinforcement of the idea that something is wrong with them for it.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #112 on: 03 Dec 2020, 21:51 »

...That's how I'd describe a lot of sexual experiences I've had. Huh.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #113 on: 03 Dec 2020, 23:49 »

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
"...a couple people..."
I have this mental picture of Brun clinically analysing the performance and saying "I didn't quite catch all of that - I'll have to try it again, with someone else, to get enough data points..."

BRUN: complete deadpan and very flatly "One or both of us is very bad at this. That wasn't very long and I do not have enough datapoints to determine which. Please pick up a calisthenics routine to improve your stamina."

EDIT: Improving script format.
« Last Edit: 04 Dec 2020, 01:50 by Gyrre »
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #114 on: 03 Dec 2020, 23:58 »

Hmm.

Instead of trying to determine with utter conviction on perfectly insufficient data what sexuality Brun might possibly have, what about speculating about future romances ?


After all, theres some interesting candidates around:

Brun and who ? - though maybe not, if she's indeed supposed to be asexual. Still, she's certainly a more interesting candidate than the very linear and boring Renee romance.

Hanners and who ? - she seems to have had some big breakthroughs recently, so maybe that becomes an option ?

Sven and who ? - he tries so hard to grow ... so does this go anywhere ?

Momo and who ? - she definitely also is tipping her toe into the pool, after all she fancies Sven.

May and who ? - though I think it will be a while before that one actually does any romance, if ever.

Raven and who ? - ... at least I would love to have her back ...
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #115 on: 04 Dec 2020, 01:45 »

So, I'm thinking that Brun went through a phase of trying to fit into the common definition of 'normal' and found it unsatisfying. I can't blame her for having a weird idea of what classifies as 'romance' and 'intimacy' if her only sexual encounters were so utterly mechanical and unfulfilling for her. Like others, I wonder if this bad history may impact on and even impede developments between her and Millie.
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Gyrre

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #116 on: 04 Dec 2020, 02:09 »

So, I'm thinking that Brun went through a phase of trying to fit into the common definition of 'normal' and found it unsatisfying. I can't blame her for having a weird idea of what classifies as 'romance' and 'intimacy' if her only sexual encounters were so utterly mechanical and unfulfilling for her. Like others, I wonder if this bad history may impact on and even impede developments between her and Millie.

Can confirm trying to be "normal" sucks.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #117 on: 04 Dec 2020, 03:57 »

Yep. Wish I had given up on it sooner.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #118 on: 04 Dec 2020, 08:45 »

Hmm.

Instead of trying to determine with utter conviction on perfectly insufficient data what sexuality Brun might possibly have, what about speculating about future romances ?

Pintsize and who - ?

Well, there's this tugboat he fancies. Whom we've never seen. But he did commission a steel cock from Union Robotics...


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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #119 on: 04 Dec 2020, 10:45 »

Whom we've never seen. But he did commission a steel cock from Union Robotics...
That we've also never seen.  As transgressive as Pintsize is, you'd think we'd have seen evidence that UR had delivered this commission at the very least.
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Wingy

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #120 on: 04 Dec 2020, 10:47 »

Instead of trying to determine with utter conviction on perfectly insufficient data what sexuality Brun might possibly have, what about speculating about future romances ?
After all, theres some interesting candidates around:
How's this any different than shipping?

Be that as it may, I'm still rooting for Sven and May to get it on at least once, even if they never pair up for any extended period.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #121 on: 04 Dec 2020, 11:44 »

To be fair, until I started having sex with women, this was largely my experience with sex, too, and I am as far from ace as one can be.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #122 on: 04 Dec 2020, 15:54 »

Is "ace", as in "asexual", a recent coinage? I don't recall encoutering it further than two years or so back.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #123 on: 04 Dec 2020, 16:21 »

Is "ace", as in "asexual", a recent coinage? I don't recall encoutering it further than two years or so back.
I'd say I first encountered it around ten years ago, so I suppose it depends on what you consider recent. I'd say it's certainly more widespread now than when I first heard it.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #124 on: 04 Dec 2020, 23:34 »

Whom we've never seen. But he did commission a steel cock from Union Robotics...
That we've also never seen.  As transgressive as Pintsize is, you'd think we'd have seen evidence that UR had delivered this commission at the very least.

Ah, but we have seen its components in the process of being assembled. The glans, shaft, and testes had yet to be soldered together.
(Probably due to Google.)
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Wingy

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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #125 on: 05 Dec 2020, 13:51 »

Ah, but we have seen its components in the process of being assembled. The glans, shaft, and testes had yet to be soldered together.
(Probably due to Google.)
I'd settle for a scene where Pintsize is paying for the thing and it's in a box/bag on the floor. 
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #126 on: 06 Dec 2020, 10:12 »

Puzzled. How would a steel cock be any worse than the dildos we've already seen?
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #127 on: 06 Dec 2020, 12:02 »

One of then even went running around and was the subject of a handful of strips.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #128 on: 06 Dec 2020, 13:18 »

Puzzled. How would a steel cock be any worse than the dildos we've already seen?

Um… Pintsize.  It'll be worse.
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Re: WCDT 4406-4410 (Nov 30th to Dec 4th, 2020)
« Reply #129 on: 14 Dec 2020, 11:49 »

Is "ace", as in "asexual", a recent coinage? I don't recall encoutering it further than two years or so back.
I'd say I first encountered it around ten years ago, so I suppose it depends on what you consider recent. I'd say it's certainly more widespread now than when I first heard it.

I would consider ten years ago relatively recent, with regards to those matters.
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