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[will: wanton sex god]

Yup, my grandparents said theyd give me about 1000 for it, and i could probalby get some out of my parents
ive wanted an apple for a while now.
i dont know what to do.
i wont really game on it, i dont play as much, and i play WoW on my desktop...
so

[nickyandthefuture]

Definitely check with your college about getting an educational discount on an iBook.  The educational prices for the 12" model are $899 (CD-ROM drive) and $949 (combo drive) - add another $50 for a RAM upgrade (they only come with 256 megabytes, which is a bit of a joke - and don't buy RAM from Apple, buy it from Crucial or similar and stick it in) and you're set.

I'm assuming the 1000 was US dollars - if that's the case, you shouldn't have a problem.  One thing I would suggest is holding off for a while on purchasing it - the iBooks haven't been updated since October 2004, and are overdue for a speed bump.  It will probably be in the next couple of months, I would guess.

[Inanimate Object]

I'd definitely recommend an iBook. They're tough, so you can't break it easily. They're good solid computers. Good bang for your buck. I'd suggest getting a 14 inch model, the 12 inchers are nice for space concerns, but the 14 inch models are better designed. Also, upgrade to a combo drive. That way you can watch DVDs and write CDs. As nickyandthefuture said, more RAM is useful. It's not a necessity if you're only going to be doing word processing or web browsing. But if you're going to be doing anything with multimedia or multitasking you're gonna want to upgrade to at least 512.

BTW, good choice going with Apple.

[will: wanton sex god]

okay, so if i were to get this ram somewhere else, how difficult is it to install by yourself.  - id really like to hear only from someone whos done it themselves.

additionally, how are the 14 inchers better designed?

[Inanimate Object]

okay, so if i were to get this ram somewhere else, how difficult is it to install by yourself.  - id really like to hear only from someone whos done it themselves.

additionally, how are the 14 inchers better designed?

I've only done it on an older model (clamshell) but it's not too hard. On mine all you have to do is flip the keyboard up and unscrew a couple plates. I imagine it's a similar procedure on the new ones. There are probably plenty of online tutorials that can help. Search google.

As for how they're better designed:
Laid out better. More room to type.
Cools better because of the added surface area. The 12in books can get quite hot.

And it's always nice to have a bigger screen.

[pip_helix]

just speaking in general - before buying a computer through the school, or anywhere else, find out about tech support. see if the school has any kind of special warranty and a loaner program, should something happen.

i'm not a mac user, so i don't really have any suggestions there. i've got a dell, and i really don't recommend it.

[will: wanton sex god]

thanks for the help thusfar.
any additional would be so great

[salada]

yeah. dells might be cheap, but they're really not good for anything much at all. they're poorly designed, made using low-quality components, and usually targeted at people who don't know better (or just want a cheap machine).

i'm also a mac person, so i'd go with the ibook as well. one of the bonuses that you get with the 14-in screen is a slight processor speed bump (1.2 ghz to 1.33ghz). and since both are fairly small, portability doesnt really come into play here. i mean, it's not as if you're buying a 17in powerbook (you don't however, get a higher resolution display to go with the bigger size. both 1024x768).

another difference: the 12-inch model comes with a 30gb HD as standard, whereas the 14-inch comes with a 60gb HD as the minimum. i have a fair bit of music, so i need a bit extra space, but i don't game much, so not that much extra. depends how much of a data pimp you are i suppose.

'ts about all i've got.

[pip_helix]

they're poorly designed, made using low-quality components.

like the plug and play cd/dvd player/writer i had to replace 3 times under warranty!

the hell with dell (wow, that's catchy).

[LiterSize]

nihilist might be a good person to pm too... he is GOD on this board after all....

[will: wanton sex god]

^ if i had a bunch of specific questions, perhaps.
i figure hell drop by here eventually, and others may need the same help so hay

[Ozymandias]

Never.

EVER.

EVER.

Buy a Dell laptop.

[this post was written from a Dell laptop that regularly overheats, only has half its installed RAM, has a constantly blinking battery light for NO REASON, and a severely malfuctioning power cord that must be placed in awkward positions to power the computer properly. It is two years old and has been sent in to be serviced twice.]

[Trollstormur]

buy a mac, your education will thank you. You can't play games on it so you won't fucker yourself up that way, it's stable enough if you treat 'er right and it'll run everything you need.


(ibook, powerbook etc)

[Ozymandias]

If you're going into any computing field, don't bother with getting an Apple, of course.

Otherwise, it might be your most reliable bet.

[will: wanton sex god]

^
negative, that is what the family requests i do, but i have no interest in it.

i want to do english/journalism and music.


yup.


what does an ibook come with, as far as like prorams and stuff.

i can word process on something better than a notepad equivalent with an apple, right?


part of the reason is so i dont play more games also, to whoever posted that

[Mikintosh]

Never.

EVER.

EVER.

Buy a Dell laptop.

[this post was written from a Dell laptop that regularly overheats, only has half its installed RAM, has a constantly blinking battery light for NO REASON, and a severely malfuctioning power cord that must be placed in awkward positions to power the computer properly. It is two years old and has been sent in to be serviced twice.]

Literally almost all of my bad computer memories have been spendinging untold manhours keeping me & my sister's old Dell laptops afloat. Mine had the power cord problem, and my sister's had the overheating problem. Both of them had crappy speakers (worse than they looked), and my sister's made this weird humming noise whenever it was in sleep mode from day one. Also, their customer service was the suck, at least for me.

I really don't understand the Apple love, as the simplistic operating system and one-button mouse cause me nothing but problems when I'm working on the iBooks at school. I put my money on HP. Though my current electonic compu-thing was about $1500 and weighs a ton, it is a marvelous object and I haven't had any problem with it. Forget exactly which one it is at the moment, but the whole brand itself is good. Yes.

[Valrus]

I really don't understand the Apple love, as the simplistic operating system and one-button mouse

Look, I don't want to start a computer war here, but I am an Apple fan and I don't really think that blatant misinformation about their stuff should go unresponded to.

So: "simplistic operating system?" Look. It's got UNIX in it. I've dicked around with it enough to tell you confidently that OS X is no simpler than you want it to be.

As for the mouse: well, yes. To tell the truth, that's a thorn in the side of even the most hard-core Mac users too, as far as I can tell. But really, it's not that expensive to buy another mouse; further, even if I had gotten a two-button scroll mouse with my iMac, I probably would have shelled out for a more fancy one.

[Ozymandias]

Literally almost all of my bad computer memories have been spendinging untold manhours keeping me & my sister's old Dell laptops afloat. Mine had the power cord problem, and my sister's had the overheating problem. Both of them had crappy speakers (worse than they looked), and my sister's made this weird humming noise whenever it was in sleep mode from day one. Also, their customer service was the suck, at least for me.

I really don't understand the Apple love, as the simplistic operating system and one-button mouse cause me nothing but problems when I'm working on the iBooks at school. I put my money on HP. Though my current electonic compu-thing was about $1500 and weighs a ton, it is a marvelous object and I haven't had any problem with it. Forget exactly which one it is at the moment, but the whole brand itself is good. Yes.

Oh yeah. I forgot that the right speaker doesn't work.

And the Apple love(at least for notebooks) stems fromt he fact that they're just good, solid, reliable machines, which is something that you really, really want for a notebook. I wouldn't reccommend Apple for a desktop though.

[Mikintosh]

I really don't understand the Apple love, as the simplistic operating system and one-button mouse

Look, I don't want to start a computer war here, but I am an Apple fan and I don't really think that blatant misinformation about their stuff should go unresponded to.

So: "simplistic operating system?" Look. It's got UNIX in it. I've dicked around with it enough to tell you confidently that OS X is no simpler than you want it to be.

As for the mouse: well, yes. To tell the truth, that's a thorn in the side of even the most hard-core Mac users too, as far as I can tell. But really, it's not that expensive to buy another mouse; further, even if I had gotten a two-button scroll mouse with my iMac, I probably would have shelled out for a more fancy one.

Heh, I just realized my use of the phrase "simplistic operating system" was vaguely elitist and implied that I'm 1/100th as well-versed in computers as anybody here; I can barely navigate Windows XP without exploding my desktop. By simplistic, I just meant that for me, the lack of a good Windows Explorer/Start Menu-type infrastructure makes it harder for me to get around in my school's iBooks (although the fact that they skimped on memory when buying them's also part of it). I'm not saying at all that Apple products are bad (I have an iPod myself), I just didn't grow up with them.

[Inanimate Object]

I really don't understand the Apple love, as the simplistic operating system and one-button mouse

Look, I don't want to start a computer war here, but I am an Apple fan and I don't really think that blatant misinformation about their stuff should go unresponded to.

So: "simplistic operating system?" Look. It's got UNIX in it. I've dicked around with it enough to tell you confidently that OS X is no simpler than you want it to be.

As for the mouse: well, yes. To tell the truth, that's a thorn in the side of even the most hard-core Mac users too, as far as I can tell. But really, it's not that expensive to buy another mouse; further, even if I had gotten a two-button scroll mouse with my iMac, I probably would have shelled out for a more fancy one.

Heh, I just realized my use of the phrase "simplistic operating system" was vaguely elitist and implied that I'm 1/100th as well-versed in computers as anybody here; I can barely navigate Windows XP without exploding my desktop. By simplistic, I just meant that for me, the lack of a good Windows Explorer/Start Menu-type infrastructure makes it harder for me to get around in my school's iBooks (although the fact that they skimped on memory when buying them's also part of it). I'm not saying at all that Apple products are bad (I have an iPod myself), I just didn't grow up with them.

Actually, Mac can do most of the things that Windows Explorer can do. It has a find command to locate any program on your hard drive, and you can browse different folders in lists by opening your hard drive and telling it to display in columns. Also, in Mac OS X you don't need a start menu. It has the dock. You just put all your favorite apps in the dock and thy're there when you need them. No hunting through menus.

[Valrus]

Anyway, the point is that Mac OS X is wicked sweet and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Seriously though: unless you're planning to use your computer for games or to become an "IT professional" or whatever, you'll probably have a good time with a Mac. No viruses. I cannot stress this enough. And the iBooks do seem to me like a pretty good deal, especially since they have the same chip as PowerBooks due to IBM's shafting Apple right in the processors.

[ebullientsoul]

I've grown up with both macs and PCs.

I used to get lots and i do mean LOTS of crashes on macs, but they seem to be less frequent. that said, i actually want to be able to game on my machine, so I don't know if an apple is the right set up for me.

[MilkmanDan]

If you're going into any computing field, don't bother with getting an Apple, of course.

Why not?

[Ozymandias]

With the exception of visual design, it's going to be worthless. You generally want a Windows platform for programming or maybe Linux for IT.

[Valrus]

Not exactly true, since with the UNIX and all you can do programming in Java, C++ or Objective-C, Python, Perl, and myriad other languages. Since you can host web sites from your computer, you can get familiar with the Apache web server, write your own CGI, and use php and mySQL and other good stuff like that. And of course if you dick around with the Terminal, a lot of the UNIX stuff can transfer over well to Linux or any other *nix system.

Trust me on this; I've done it all myself.

That being said, though, it bears mentioning that most companies do use Windows, so there's a lot of stuff you won't be able to get experience with: IIS instead of Apache, C-Sharp or whatever the hell MS is making you write Windows apps in now, Microsoft SQL Server, Access, and plenty of other stuff I'm not familiar with since I'm a Mac user.

So, basically: If you want to go into a computing field, you can find an equivalent (often open-source) on the Mac for anything -- programming, databases, system administration, etc. -- you might do on the Windows side. But you won't be able to get familiar with the exact software that people use on Windows, and from what I've seen a lot of people look for that.

[will: wanton sex god]

okay so back on topic, 14 inch ibook is looking ideal, right?

what would be a reason to have a powerbook?

[Trollstormur]

powerbooks are better, but more expensive. They also don't look like a jolly rancher.

[will: wanton sex god]

better for what?

is there any thing that would warrant a powerbook purchase over an ibook one, for me?

[Inanimate Object]

Powerbooks are basically the "pro" models. They have higher system specs, faster processors, bigger HDs, more RAM. They also have slightly bigger screens. It goes: 12in, 15in, 17in.

If you're just getting a laptop for college, I'd still go for the iBook. It's a lot cheaper, and it doesn't seem like you need the power of a Powerbook. Also, one of the main cons of a Powerbook is how hot they get. Since they're made out of metal, they run really hot. The 17 isn't as bad because it has more cooling room, but with the 12 and 15 inchers, you're going to want to make sure you're wearing jeans before putting it on your lap.

[normz]

It depends what your used to i guess as for whether you go apple or whatever but when i was looking for a laptop for uni I went with a refurbished Toshiba laptop meaning that it is wicked fast (were talking 3.06 GHz, with 512 MB RAM and 80 GB hardrive) but also fairly cheap (it was about $AU1500) and I have a 17inch screen with a cd/dvd burner and tonnes of software plus a fully comprehensive 1 year warranty so I guess I got a pretty sweet deal but then again I have computer nerd buddies who set that up for me via e-bay so I guess you just gotta shop around for the best deal .... even have a look on the net to get an idea of prices but yeah I love my laptop and I havent had any problems with it but then again the Toshiba Satellite series are pretty good as far as laptops go *hugs laptop*

[will: wanton sex god]

Powerbooks are basically the "pro" models. They have higher system specs, faster processors, bigger HDs, more RAM. They also have slightly bigger screens. It goes: 12in, 15in, 17in.

If you're just getting a laptop for college, I'd still go for the iBook. It's a lot cheaper, and it doesn't seem like you need the power of a Powerbook. Also, one of the main cons of a Powerbook is how hot they get. Since they're made out of metal, they run really hot. The 17 isn't as bad because it has more cooling room, but with the 12 and 15 inchers, you're going to want to make sure you're wearing jeans before putting it on your lap.

mm hmm, i understand that theyre more powerful, and why, i understand what a faster processor and more ram and all that means, im asking what field one would have to be going into to actually need a powerbook

[MilkmanDan]

With the exception of visual design, it's going to be worthless. You generally want a Windows platform for programming or maybe Linux for IT.

Ok, bearing in mind that I think C# and .net in general can choke on my boner, I don't see what else I'm missing out on. I can run anything written for Linux, so what's the problem? Do you actually have any reasons, or are you just player hating?

[Valrus]

I'm sayin' bro!

[Inanimate Object]

Powerbooks are basically the "pro" models. They have higher system specs, faster processors, bigger HDs, more RAM. They also have slightly bigger screens. It goes: 12in, 15in, 17in.

If you're just getting a laptop for college, I'd still go for the iBook. It's a lot cheaper, and it doesn't seem like you need the power of a Powerbook. Also, one of the main cons of a Powerbook is how hot they get. Since they're made out of metal, they run really hot. The 17 isn't as bad because it has more cooling room, but with the 12 and 15 inchers, you're going to want to make sure you're wearing jeans before putting it on your lap.

mm hmm, i understand that theyre more powerful, and why, i understand what a faster processor and more ram and all that means, im asking what field one would have to be going into to actually need a powerbook

Graphics design, video editing, music production, and gaming. Stuff like that. All that can be done on an iBook too, it's just easier on a Powerbook.

[est]

can we maybe stop debating linux vs windows in a thread that Will started specifically to ask about Apple laptops?

he wants an Apple laptop. people who know stuff about Apple are helping him.  go start your own topic if you want to debate Apple vs Windows vs Linux for the umpteen billionth time.

[MilkmanDan]

This is true, but I was trying to determine if there was any specific reason why an Apple laptop wasn't suitable for a computing course, as opposed to starting that tired argument again. So I was trying to remain on the topic, but I guess I did rather invite the "NOES WINDOZE YUO, NOES APPLEZ!!!11!" debate. My Bad.

Seriously though, Is there any real reasons why an Apple laptop would be a problem for a computing course? REAL reasons, not just "LOL! They can't run X program that I don't need in the slightest."

[Ozymandias]

Windows programming is pretty much essential in the computing field. I'm only in my third year of CS and I've already had two classes that required the use of Windows APIs.

The first day of class in one of those courses someone asked "What if we have a Mac?" The professor just laughed.

[will: wanton sex god]

can someone give me a rundown on garageband? how useful is it, how powerful, and how easy to learn?

how do i start putting my own stuff into it...all that.
like i play guitar and bass guitar...so should i just get a mic and then i could record and put the file in? or yeah?

p.s. how is sound on ibook?

[salada]

i'm not really an audio person, but if by sound you mean speakers, they're like every other laptop speakers: tinny and terrible. invest in some sennheisers or hook it up to your stereo or something if you're going to use it for music.

[Valrus]

can someone give me a rundown on garageband? how useful is it, how powerful, and how easy to learn?

how do i start putting my own stuff into it...all that.
like i play guitar and bass guitar...so should i just get a mic and then i could record and put the file in? or yeah?

p.s. how is sound on ibook?

Regarding the p.s. first: I don't know about ibooks, but the PowerBook's built-in speakers (which I assume are the same) are surprisingly decent if you absolutely can't use external speakers or headphones. Still, they're laptop speakers. Don't expect much.

Regarding GarageBand: I have the following setup:

Microphone -> M-Audio AudioBuddy preamp -> iMic external sound card -> Mac.

and it works extremely well. If you want something simpler, this and this are viable options. From what I've seen and used, Griffin makes good stuff.

[Inanimate Object]

can someone give me a rundown on garageband? how useful is it, how powerful, and how easy to learn?

how do i start putting my own stuff into it...all that.
like i play guitar and bass guitar...so should i just get a mic and then i could record and put the file in? or yeah?

p.s. how is sound on ibook?

If you're going to be using Garageband, get a Powerbook. It will run on an iBook, but not incredibly well. My brother has an iBook 1GHz, and it will barely run. I'd suggest going with a 15 inch Powerbook, get at least 784MBs of RAM, and a large hard drive. I don't know about the Powerbook speakers, but the iBook speakers are decent, but not great. They don't have any low end, so they sound like you're playing your music through a tin can.

In terms of putting sound into it from your giutar and bass:
I wouldn't reccomend using a mic unless you have a sound proof room.
If you have an electric, you can plug in directly to the Mac using a big plug to little plug (don't know the actual names) converter and just plugging it into the microphone port. That's probably the easiest way to do it.

[Valrus]

Windows programming is pretty much essential in the computing field. I'm only in my third year of CS and I've already had two classes that required the use of Windows APIs.

The first day of class in one of those courses someone asked "What if we have a Mac?" The professor just laughed.

I'll agree that Windows programming is more useful in the industry, but computer science is platform-independent.

[will: wanton sex god]

here, jerks
http://forums.questionablecontent.net/viewtopic.php?p=176971#176971




anyway, i dont really think i can afford a powerbook :-/
hrm
i guess well see.

[will: wanton sex god]

perhaps im missing osmething or overlooking something but why would a powerbook be better...its like a .27 ghz processor differece...and id be getting ram oup to 768...so yeah...

[Inanimate Object]

perhaps im missing osmething or overlooking something but why would a powerbook be better...its like a .27 ghz processor differece...and id be getting ram oup to 768...so yeah...

Well, actually, you're right. I was remembering a time when there was a much larger margin between the two.

I guess if you got plenty of RAM, and a 1.33GHz model, you'd probably be okay. I'd suggest upgrading your hard drive too. The stock HD in a 14in model is 60GB. That's enough for a while, but you might fill it up after a chunk of time using Garageband. It all depends on how much you're intending on using it, and how good performance you want.

Another thing to consider is that the iBook scren only goes up to 1024X768 resolution. That might be a little cramped.

[will: wanton sex god]

hrm thats true, but the machine im on currently uses that resolution
hrmm


guh, if only i had 500 extra bucks laying around.

-edit-
the ram on powerbook is much faster.

shit, its like 700 bucks more though -_-

[Inanimate Object]

hrm thats true, but the machine im on currently uses that resolution
hrmm


guh, if only i had 500 extra bucks laying around.

-edit-
the ram on powerbook is much faster.

shit, its like 700 bucks more though -_-

After doing a little research, I found out that the powerbook also has a faster bus speed. 167MHz to the iBook's 133MHz. Check out everymac.com for complete specs of each model.

Like I said before, it really depends on how much you really think you need. You have to decide whether the extra features of the powerbook are really worth the money.

[Matteh99]

For most school stuff an iBook would do just fine.  Unless you are doing video editing, or crazy photoshop stuff or want to hook it up to a big display.  The 15 inch power book is really sexy and has a ton of features that you pay for but probably won't use.  DVI out for extended desktop, firewire 800, giga bit eithernet etc.

In the mac vs PC realm as long as you arn't doing somthing like cad or specific programing either one should be fine.  For example if you are majoring in drafting and your whole college uses auto cad the mac is a bad choice.

Eric

[Valrus]

here, jerks
http://forums.questionablecontent.net/viewtopic.php?p=176971#176971

Don't call me a jerk! I was helpful first and argumentative later!

Um, thanks, though.

[crazybritishsteve]

Best thing to do is ask your uni what they support and recommend. If they support mac, go ibook. If they don't, stop and think about how many problems you'll have if something goes wrong with it. I hate macs, but other people love them, so if you're not doing anything specific in your course that requires windows, go for the mac.

P.s. as an ex dell laptop repair technician, i have to say............

NEVER EVER BUY A DELL