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Author Topic: nintendo revolution controller.  (Read 23012 times)

Tedd

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nintendo revolution controller.
« Reply #50 on: 18 Sep 2005, 22:40 »

Quote from: Eldirial
but... thats not really the only gamer demographic anymore.

I mean, people will wait to see how it goes- might not be a huge release... But once they have a few games that are really... revolutionary, then people will buy them like hotcakes, I imagine.


You make a good point, but think about it; it was the original and biggest demographic. After that comes the older gen and girls (no disrespect to the women. at all. much love. please don't stab me.) but most kids from those ages can't afford higher prices!
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Eldirial

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« Reply #51 on: 18 Sep 2005, 22:46 »

Quote from: Tedd
Quote from: Eldirial
but... thats not really the only gamer demographic anymore.

I mean, people will wait to see how it goes- might not be a huge release... But once they have a few games that are really... revolutionary, then people will buy them like hotcakes, I imagine.


You make a good point, but think about it; it was the original and biggest demographic. After that comes the older gen and girls (no disrespect to the women. at all. much love. please don't stab me.) but most kids from those ages can't afford higher prices!


Yeah, but since nintendo isn't going with expensive HD dvd drives or Blu-Ray DVD drives, it should be the cheapest system in the next gen.

So, the price thing could easily backfire- especially if nintendo can put out things that appeal to all types.  A good metroid, a good Zelda- I would play those anyday on this new system over most things on the other machines.
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Yasser

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« Reply #52 on: 19 Sep 2005, 03:04 »

the only reason to buy a Nintendo console is for Nintendo games, their 3rd party support is almost non-existant, so it'll be interesting to see how they develope games to take advantage of the controller (which i don't really like, i prefer the boomerang double dildo for ps3)
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jhocking

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« Reply #53 on: 19 Sep 2005, 05:13 »

Quote from: Tedd
You make a good point, but think about it; it was the original and biggest demographic. After that comes the older gen and girls

I have been party to some long rant/discussions in which it has been concluded that the stagnation in the industry comes down to the homogenous gamer demographic.  Kudos to Nintendo for looking to the future and trying to mix things up, as opposed to the inbreeding that results from the short-sighted make-a-buck-immediately approach of most companies.

Eldirial

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« Reply #54 on: 19 Sep 2005, 10:32 »

Figured I would link to this- a rather good essay speculating about nintendo's ideas for this console- http://lostgarden.com/2005/09/nintendos-genre-innovation-strategy.html
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Valrus

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« Reply #55 on: 19 Sep 2005, 14:03 »

Quote from: jhocking
Quote from: Tedd
You make a good point, but think about it; it was the original and biggest demographic. After that comes the older gen and girls

I have been party to some long rant/discussions in which it has been concluded that the stagnation in the industry comes down to the homogenous gamer demographic.  Kudos to Nintendo for looking to the future and trying to mix things up, as opposed to the inbreeding that results from the short-sighted make-a-buck-immediately approach of most companies.


VERY YES.

I would also suggest that anyone who is unequivocally pooh-pooing this controller consider the fact that Nintendo probably paid a number of people a great deal of money to ensure that it doesn't suck. They've made controller mistakes in the past, but they're not idiots.
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Tedd

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« Reply #56 on: 19 Sep 2005, 16:44 »

I secede to your wisdom, O Wighty (wise + mighty) gaming gods of the interweb.




:D
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est

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« Reply #57 on: 19 Sep 2005, 17:00 »

don't get me wrong, i appreciate the effort they are going to to step outside gaming design paradigms and forge new territory in the uncharted wastelands of the imagination or whatever the hell, i just wish that fanboys wouldn't wank on so much about it.

yes, it will push the limits of what games do at the moment.

no, i don't think it will sell all that well.

yes, this is a goddamn shame.
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jhocking

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« Reply #58 on: 19 Sep 2005, 18:31 »

"You gotta think outside the box, man!"

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« Reply #59 on: 19 Sep 2005, 20:24 »

"Dude, What if... what if this is like, a big.... uh..."



WOO DEEP THINKING
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« Reply #60 on: 20 Sep 2005, 10:44 »

Quote from: Jarne
Quote from: ASturge
^

Not a chance. Seriously

No.


Qouted from The Economist September 17th - 23rd 2005 issue. "And because most of the money in the game industry is made from software, not hardware, Nintendo makes the most profit among gaming firms, even though it only has a 15% market share, notes Paul Jackson of Forrester, a consultancy."


Don't you know this is a discussion about video games?

Get out and take your heathen facts with you!

Although I will add that the above probably includes Nintendo's portable-console sales, so a strictly GC/Xbox/PS2 comparison would probably skew differently.

Quote from: DavidGrohl
 Grab your TV remote (if you can find it).  Grip it tightly and just hold it like that for about 15 minutes.  Not comfortable is it?  Holding your hand in a "C" / Soda can style way will get very annoying, especially if you plan on playing with the thing for an hour or more.  With a regular controller, your hand can relax on and take shape to the controller.

 Maybe if they were to offer a regular format controller to start with and then have an optional controller or maybe include it with the regular format controller, the Revolution wouldn't go down in flames.


1. With something like the Rev controller, you can't just put it out as an add on, it has to be part of the installed base so it's actually worth it for game developers to work with it.

2. I don't get how holding this thing is going to be any different from holding either end of a PS2 controller. Long knobbly bit, buttons up near the thumb... hell you've even got a groove in there for your index finger, so you don't have to reach up to the top of the controller for the trigger buttons.
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LiterSize

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« Reply #61 on: 20 Sep 2005, 11:10 »

Vgcats summed it up quite nicely.  I'm willing to give Nintendo the benefit of the doubt as well just because of RE4 and ToS... there's fight left in them!  Also, judging from the trailer, I imagine there'll be some kind of sword fighting game... I hope!  I mean, Tiger Friggin' Electronics has done it, so why not Nintendo?

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« Reply #62 on: 20 Sep 2005, 12:23 »

You mean there are people who still watch television? How quiant!
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Mnementh

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« Reply #63 on: 20 Sep 2005, 12:48 »



This is a mock-up, but before you get your pants in a twist, perhaps you should consider the fact that it might not look like that, but apparently there will be a cradle for it.

Change is good anyway.
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happybirthdaygelatin

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« Reply #64 on: 20 Sep 2005, 13:38 »

Good point, this is just the first public mock up.  Isn't the Revolution not even scheduled till first quarter 06?
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Tedd

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« Reply #65 on: 20 Sep 2005, 13:38 »

You and your liberal thinking.


Can someone tell me if this is bad? When I first scrolled down and saw that picture, my mind was screaming "RAPE! RAPE! RAPE!"
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Merkava

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« Reply #66 on: 20 Sep 2005, 13:40 »

Innovation is good an all, but, you know, I'd like to hear more about games. You know, the things we use the system for.

I'm expecting smaller developers to jump on the Revolution because of the signifigantly lower developing costs compared to the PS3 and XBOX 360. Since RPG's are pretty much the only games I play (besides the occasional out-of-the-ordinary action game), so this may be good news.
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Garcin

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« Reply #67 on: 20 Sep 2005, 14:50 »

One of the other scenarios that Gamespy reported on had the long thin controller in one hand and an ergonomic, hand-molded button device in the other.  

Jarne, I read that Economist article too, and found it fascinating.  For all the hullabaloo about how fast & spacious the XBox was, Microsoft ended up with less than half the market share that Sony got, and lost money.  There is plenty of evidence that bigger + fast does not equal better.

Also keep in mind that the GameCube was generally considered a failure, had the least appeal of all of that generation's devices for third party developer, and still allowed Nintendo to turn the greatest profits.  The moneymakers were games that Nintendo developed itself.  There is no apparent reason why Nintendo could make the Revolution a success on the basis of games it developed for its own device.

One of the demo games that Gamespy was privy too was a bass-fishing demo where twisting the controller twisted the fishing rod.  Someone has already mentioned sword-fighting.  What about a Harry Potter license where the controller is the wand?  Think that will sell?  Huh?  Specially if they combine it with a multiplayer system as seamless as XBox's Live?

And as for holding a controller becoming uncomfortable -- Americans spend an average of around 5 hours a day (give or take) in front of the tube -- and since most people are flipping the channel pretty consistently, we can imagine that most people have the remote in hand for much of that period.  We can imagine that the Revolution controller will be far more ergonomic than that.

So, with the industry in a state of uproar, and dozens of well known developers babbling all over the net about potential this and potential that, I think that at the very least it makes sense to reverse judgment.  I see no way that you can predict to a certainty that this will crash and burn -- especially after what happened with the DS.  Remember when people were saying that Sega's handheld would bury the Gameboy, because it had color & a larger screen.  Yeah . . . well -- didn't quite work out that way.

<-- not a Nintendo fanboy, owns a PS2 for Katamari goodness
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est

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« Reply #68 on: 20 Sep 2005, 15:04 »

Quote from: Mnementh
[teh sex]


okays, if there is something like that available for it from the word go, right out of the box, then i will totally get behind it.  that is pretty cool!
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happybirthdaygelatin

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« Reply #69 on: 20 Sep 2005, 15:43 »

If they don't make a new Duck Hunt and Hogans Alley I wil die 50 times and then some.
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Gryff

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« Reply #70 on: 20 Sep 2005, 15:45 »

Nintendo is aiming for a niche market, so why not make a controler that is a bit different to the norm? Sure, they're taking a risk, but I would back Nintendo to pull it off I think.

Also, I thing maybe waiting until we've actually used it before we start screaming about how uncomfortable and unweildy it is might be a good idea.

Samari

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« Reply #71 on: 20 Sep 2005, 21:54 »

I think what nintendo is doing with the controller may be analogus to MS adding the scroll-wheel to the mouse.  At first evryone was like "why the fuck would i need something like that?" now try giving someone a mouse without a wheel and you'll get it thrown at your head.
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will: wanton sex god

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« Reply #72 on: 20 Sep 2005, 22:33 »

^ i disagree wholeheatedly.

revo isnt adding one thing thats a little odd, its redefining the controller. big difference.
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Valrus

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« Reply #73 on: 21 Sep 2005, 04:55 »

Quote from: Moiche
owns a PS2 for Katamari goodness


What's up with that? Katamari Damacy is totally a Nintendo-style game. But whatever, fair play to Sony for luring the Katamari people to their system.
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Jarne

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« Reply #74 on: 21 Sep 2005, 08:29 »

IRT FifthFiend: Damn, I didn't think of that. Portable sales probably did contribute most of that. But still, Microsoft did lose money on the Xbox this generation and I'm not sure about Sony but that at least puts Nintendo at second place.

IRT Moiche: Bear in mind that Microsoft was trying to gain part of the market and where fully aware that they would lose money this generation.

And now, to talk to everyone: I remember reading somewhere that Nintendo had large amounts of cash in reserve (4 billion? don't hold me to that 'cus it's probably wrong), so they can afford to take risks. Even if the Revolution does crash and burn, Nintendo won't go away.
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jhocking

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« Reply #75 on: 21 Sep 2005, 08:38 »

Quote from: Valrus
What's up with that? Katamari Damacy is totally a Nintendo-style game. But whatever, fair play to Sony for luring the Katamari people to their system.

I know at least two nintendo fanboys who got a ps2 for the sole purpose of playing Katamari Damacy.

Something Witty

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« Reply #76 on: 21 Sep 2005, 09:08 »

Quote from: will: wanton sex god
^ i disagree wholeheatedly.

revo isnt adding one thing thats a little odd, its redefining the controller. big difference.


Remember the N64 controller? Remember how the first time you saw it, before holding it, you said "What the fuck is this? How the bloody shtifuck is this going to work? That loosk awful!"

Then, you used it. And said "HOLY SHIT THIS THIS WORKS HAUGHAAUGHGUAH!"

that si what I think is going to happen with the Rev controller.
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LiterSize

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« Reply #77 on: 21 Sep 2005, 11:08 »

I think we can all agree the rev controller is actually a fully functional lightsaber.



Oh man, that would kick so much ASS.

Jarne

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« Reply #78 on: 21 Sep 2005, 14:19 »

Attach two controls together and we have a starwars game where you play Darth Maul.
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jhocking

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« Reply #79 on: 21 Sep 2005, 14:39 »

If you think about it, one controller would be enough.  You wouldn't actually need two controllers because they'd be attached.



The next step once you have motion tracking controllers is to get a head-mounted display.  Finally all that lame VR hype would actually be true.

happybirthdaygelatin

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« Reply #80 on: 21 Sep 2005, 15:48 »

THE FUTURE IS NOW (almost)!
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Gryff

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« Reply #81 on: 21 Sep 2005, 16:04 »

THE FUTURE IS 2006! (finally - I thought we would never get there)

Tedd

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« Reply #82 on: 21 Sep 2005, 16:07 »

I thought I'd never get there. Psycho bitch-ass parents.


Maybe Trollsturmer was right. Murder suicide is a good date...for my parents.



Also, my new sig is amazing. <3.


Is it true that the Revolution will be backwards-compatible with the other Nintendo games?
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Jarne

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« Reply #83 on: 21 Sep 2005, 19:30 »

Yes, it will be backwards compatible. Gamecube discs can be put into the Revolution drive and the other games will be available online for an as yet undetermined price. I don't think the GCN discs will be available online though.
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Tedd

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« Reply #84 on: 21 Sep 2005, 20:14 »

Undetermined my ass. Nazi-bitches will sell for too much as far as I'm concerned.
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jhocking

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« Reply #85 on: 21 Sep 2005, 23:27 »

Quote from: Gryff
THE FUTURE IS 2006! (finally - I thought we would never get there)

"The future ain't what it used to be."

Quote from: Tedd
Also, my new sig is amazing. <3.

If it doesn't involve me, it rates a "meh" at best.

Garcin

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« Reply #86 on: 22 Sep 2005, 01:02 »

Quote from: LiterSize
I think we can all agree the rev controller is actually a fully functional lightsaber.



Oh man, that would kick so much ASS.


Yes that would be fucking incredible.  'Specially if you had, I don't know about 40 people running around a map, HALO style.
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Tedd

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« Reply #87 on: 22 Sep 2005, 03:12 »

Quote from: jhocking
Quote from: Gryff
THE FUTURE IS 2006! (finally - I thought we would never get there)

"The future ain't what it used to be."

Quote from: Tedd
Also, my new sig is amazing. <3.

If it doesn't involve me, it rates a "meh" at best.



I plan on sticking around for a while, and I consider you to be a pretty witty (LOL RIME) guy, so don't count on it being set in stone. I'm already thinking of changing the link quote. Goddamn I have ADD.
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jhocking

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« Reply #88 on: 22 Sep 2005, 05:18 »

Suddenly my attempt at sarcasm just comes across as raging egomania.  Of course, I suppose I should consider the possibility that I am simply a raging egomaniac.

happybirthdaygelatin

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« Reply #89 on: 22 Sep 2005, 09:10 »

Quote from: Tedd
Undetermined my ass. Nazi-bitches will sell for too much as far as I'm concerned.


God forbid they want to make money off something they made (or licensed for their systems) instead of being ripped off by a bunch of people using roms and emulators!  This automaticaly makes them comparable to a genocidal regime!
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neomang5

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« Reply #90 on: 22 Sep 2005, 13:13 »

Goddamn Right.
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Tedd

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« Reply #91 on: 22 Sep 2005, 13:17 »

Quote from: happybirthdaygelatin
Quote from: Tedd
Undetermined my ass. Nazi-bitches will sell for too much as far as I'm concerned.


God forbid they want to make money off something they made (or licensed for their systems) instead of being ripped off by a bunch of people using roms and emulators!  This automaticaly makes them comparable to a genocidal regime!


'Twas a joke.

But I get the feeling that it'll be a tad over-the-top.
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« Reply #92 on: 22 Sep 2005, 18:24 »

in addition to my previous recant and profession of love for the new controller let me just say that there was an awesome article about what Nintendo does best linked from just about everywhere presently.

Nintendo's Genre Innovation Strategy: Thoughts on the Revolution's new controller

choice quotes:

Quote
Nintendo makes the majority of their money by leveraging their brand recognition during the early to mid-stages of a genre’s life cycle. The power of the Mario character can establish a Nintendo game as an early genre king and help tap into a new market segment for great profit. However, as they get later into the life cycle, the standardization of the genre mechanics and the intense demands of the hardcore population reduces the power of the brand.


Quote
The Xbox, which focuses on highly mature genres catering to hardcore gamers has production costs of $1.82 million a title. The Gamecube costs half as much at $822,000 a title. The real kicker is that the Nintendo DS only costs $338,286 a title to develop for, even less than the Gameboy. Some of these costs have to do with the hardware and development kits, but for the most part they are derived from the scope of the projects. Being able to develop successful titles at 1/5th the cost of your competitors is a major boost to your bottom line.

Thus, Nintendo’s profitability and need to innovate go hand in hand. They need those new genres because the old ones quickly become too competitive and too expensive.



so basically, Nintendo make lots of money by bringing out weird new games with strong brand presence to drive sales, and seeing as they don't need to spend much on development and are the only ones in that particular genre at the time they rake in the big $$$.

once the genre is established as a breadwinner, the other dudes will sit up and take notice and start making new games in the genre, refining the ideas in those games down to a core feature set that fans of that genre enjoy, then pumping out new games that don't vary from that skeleton all that much.

we get new kinds of games, Nintendo gets lots of money, then everyone else gets lots of money when they take up the new genres and make lots of other games.  everyone wins!

yay!
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Eldirial

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« Reply #93 on: 22 Sep 2005, 18:58 »

Hey est, just to mention- I linked that at the top of the page a few days ago. XD

Anyways, I really hope this all works out- I will have a fun system to play.
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zmeiat_joro

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« Reply #94 on: 23 Sep 2005, 02:59 »

I had a strange dream. I was playing my old NES and when I looked at the back of the controller there was this slide button, on one side it said "exponential" and on the other "expediential". Weird.
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jhocking

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« Reply #95 on: 23 Sep 2005, 07:19 »

Good find, est.  Thanks for the link!

Quote from: Eldirial
Hey est, just to mention- I linked that at the top of the page a few days ago. XD

Really?  Huh, I wonder how I missed it.

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« Reply #96 on: 23 Sep 2005, 09:23 »

Quote from: Tedd


'Twas a joke.

But I get the feeling that it'll be a tad over-the-top.


Yeah I was joking as well.

As awesome sounding as I think the controller idea is now I'm curious as how it will shape up between now and when they actually put the revolution out.
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CRASH andor BURN

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« Reply #97 on: 28 Sep 2005, 11:43 »

I am so very excited for this. I'm sure it will sell just fine. Go the way of Sega? Not anytime soon. Just look at the price tags on all the other consoles. What do you think more parents are gonna buy their kids. What do you think my hardcore gamers are gonna want? The same thing they have had for 15+ years. No, my friends. Now is the time for a REVOLUTION!
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Valrus

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« Reply #98 on: 28 Sep 2005, 13:03 »

Quote from: CRASH andor BURN
stuff


THIS PLANE IS DEFINITELY CRASHING AND/OR BURNING!
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« Reply #99 on: 29 Sep 2005, 15:18 »

I've felt, especially lately with the glut of FPS games and "gritty" urban games that all seem the same, that there's very little more that can be done with traditional button input.  XBox has added 45876q55 buttons to their controller, but really it's all the same thing.  You push buttons, things happen.  

I think there is plenty of room for new ideas in gaming and Nintendo is leading the way showing us that pushing buttons isn't the only way to have fun.

After all, for 2000 yen you can get your girl a vibe as an add-on.
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