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Who else here has a boner for TURN BASED STRATEGY

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frullic:

--- Quote from: snalin on 13 May 2008, 05:10 ---
--- Quote from: Anyways on 12 May 2008, 16:14 ---It's not for everyone though. Because of the fast-pace it can be insanely frustrating.

--- End quote ---

Game speed: slow

That was the only way I was able to do the harder levels. Some on Frozen Throne is impossible at hard without a hundred saves and reloads if you don't use that.

But you have a point, there's a lot of strategy in RTS games, but definitely not as much as in TBS. The maximum number of resources in RTS is four, I have never seen any more than that. A TBS can have tens of them, all with different uses and prices (I play freecol with 11 of them). You have more micromanagement and strategic thinking in Medieval2s building and moving part than in Warcraft3, but you never get as stressed and thrilled and pumped up by wondering wheter to build levy pikeman or longbowmen as by zerging the undead with gunners.

--- End quote ---

Seriously, in my experience, a huge epic duel between you and a friend on HOMM V Hotseat mode is the most awesome thing, and I'm talking armies so huge there's lvl 5 units (black dragons, angels, titans, skeledragons, devils, emerald dragons) in the hundreds! Small units with numbers so large they appear as ex: "11k" then the magic. I had a bunch of redundant magic mirror  and magic resistance during the duel between me and my cousin. And I also had an Armageddon spell with too many bonuses that could cause tens of thousands of damage. I clicked it. My smaller units that were fire weak were slightly damaged, my larger stuff relatively unharmed. His skeletal army on the other hand, half gone. Then the fight went rough, ending between my golems and his zombies. Luckily my golems had a bunch of bonuses and even though their turn came seldomly, they owned whenever they could. Their prowess in combat in a tight finish earned me eternal bragging rights over him, including permission to say that the HOMM necromancers suck.

Alex C:
There's a stupid amount of strategy involved in RTS games if you're any good, and a lot of it is on the tactical engagement level. High level Starcraft play does indeed have flanking and, believe it or not, manipulation of individual units. Flanking, focus fire, targeting your own units in order to utilize splash damage to harm units you cannot detect... there's a lot of thinking on your feet. When it comes right down to it, the most valuable "resource" in a good RTS like Starcraft is attention. I'd go so far as to say what often seperates above average players from great players is the ability to quickly determine if an engagement requires micromanagement or if your time is better spent elsewhere.

Admittedly though, most players never get to that level, since most RTS games do end when a player falls victim to a stumbling block like the classic zerg rush, fall behind in tech or otherwise put themselves in a situation where micromanagement and tactical play can't cover for their mistakes in strategic play. Most battles are indeed won or lost well before battle is joined. Sun Tzu would have loved it.

Spluff:
Please explain to me how flanking has any effect whatsoever in Age of Empires or Warcraft. I cannot comprehend it.

StaedlerMars:
Man, the amount of battles I have won that I should have lost in RTS because I used 'tactics' is intense.

Basically in Age of Empires, I have beaten the game using just scouts in my military units on numerous occassions. They're fast, and if you do hit and run, they'll rip apart pikemen.

Alex C:

--- Quote from: Spluff on 14 May 2008, 15:30 ---Please explain to me how flanking has any effect whatsoever in Age of Empires or Warcraft. I cannot comprehend it.

--- End quote ---

Well, I have a Starcraft example: Zerglings own Dragoons. Dragoons suffer a weapon type disadvantage vs. small targets and their relatively large unit size just means you can crowd a ridiculous number of zerglings around them and tear them to shreds. So if you can manage to cut the dragoons from the herd for even a short period of time by ensnaring the zealots or ambushing with burrow or by simply abusing the terrain you can easily pop a few goons with minimal losses, which is pretty nasty considering the huge cost discrepancy between a couple dragoons and a humble zergling pack.

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