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[DecayingWaste]

Hardcore, thrash, grindcore, deathcore..
Your thoughts?

I changed the thread title to something actually resembling the contents of the thread. -JC

[Wraithzor]

Most of my music is an off-shoot of Hardcore. But I'm not so much into those other things although I listen to Cutting Pink With Knives a lot(was at their last show *brag brag*). I guess they're kind of synth-grindcore. I guess I have some trash too though. But nothing I can really call deathcore.

[Misereatur]

I think you could use some more lurking.

[DecayingWaste]

Even though I started this thread.. I really confused as to what bands are classed as what now.
Like, finnish-power metal.. Troll Metal.. Emo Screamo Deathmetal..?
Come ON!

[Gridgm]

ok firstly your first post should not be here it should be in the hi i'm new section...although mine was here as well hmm...

secondly are the genre's you've listed meant to have that much in common outside of DRI there isn't that much crossover between thrash and hardcore grindcore is good for stupidity but not if your lookign for somethign even slightly proficient, unfortunatly melbourne has far too much grind prominent in it's local metal scene (the only ones i think have wider popularity are fuck!...i'm dead and the berzerker) that being said i still have dvd's and cd's from both and enjoy my pig detroyer i'd just like to see more people following in the steps of alchemist or even gospel of the horns who do an odd twist on black metal.

in responce to your second post genre's only need to be as complicated as you want to make them yes there are subtle distinctions between some of them but i agree that you don't really need to point out if it's finnish or swedish power metal sounding

[bbqrocks]

Y'know, I like grindcore and I can't really say I dislike thrash, but I don't see why deathcore should be with them great genres.

[Tehz]

I'm gonna be blunt here.

All four "genres" are terrible, in my opinion. The worst shit out there right now if you ask me.

[bbqrocks]

But the majority of great thrash, grindcore and hardcore isn't 'right now'. It's about 20 or more years ago.

[KharBevNor]

Deathcore can be alright live, but it's so fucking cookie cutter, and none of the bands have any staying power.

[bbqrocks]

Apparently job for a cowboy are ok nowadays though, proper death metal instead of deathcore. Unluckily I haven't had a chance to check it out yet.

[KharBevNor]

I saw them live recently, they were alright.

[bbqrocks]

Yes, but whether it was deathcore or not is the question.


I greatly prefer death metal to deathcore.

[Johnny C]

The funny thing about hardcore is that while I respect what the vast majority of bands were trying to accomplish at the genesis of the movement, and I respect what some of them did accomplish, nearly all of the bands in the genre sucked. The only good ones were some of the ones that eventually stopped being hardcore.

[Kai]

I would generally add Gorilla Biscuits to the equation as well.

[Thrillho]

Bad Brains, Black Flag, Minor Threat... hardcore's my kinda music. I'd probably be straight edge were I not into other shit as well.

[StaedlerMars]

Early Beastie Boys makes me smile.

My knowledge of hardcore basically comes from the movie 'American Hardcore' which I thought was a pretty good movie as far as documentaries go.

[MadassAlex]

OP probably gets metal and hardcore mixed up. Jus' pointin' out.

Anyway, my favourite hardcore-related music is thrash metal. Pretty much making tough-guy-hardcore redundant since ever. Kill 'Em All is still an album that slays and makes Metallica feel bad that they ever turned away from sweetass early American thrash metal.

And yeah guys, death metal kicks the everliving shit out of deathcore. Deathcore's name is really, really misleading in that it doesn't actually contain the essence of death metal; just some of the peripherals, and replaces the rest with hardcore elements (that in my opinion, are kind of out of place if you're trying to draw on the bizarre extremities of death metal).

[MrBlu]

Propaghandi is Thrash... Progressive Thrash...

And I like some grind... Soo... good stuff...

[bbqrocks]

And yeah guys, death metal kicks the everliving shit out of deathcore. Deathcore's name is really, really misleading in that it doesn't actually contain the essence of death metal; just some of the peripherals, and replaces the rest with hardcore elements (that in my opinion, are kind of out of place if you're trying to draw on the bizarre extremities of death metal).

God bless ya.


Wikipedia says otherwise about propagandhi, but I don't listen to them. Don't we have a grind topic somewhere, anyhoo?

[Spluff]

outside of DRI there isn't that much crossover between thrash and hardcore

I dunno bands like early COC, Suicidal Tendencies, Municipal Waste are pretty much crossover thrash.

unfortunatly melbourne has far too much grind prominent in it's local metal scene

It's not just Melbourne, they leak down to Geelong too. Means you've gotta sit through 3 or 4 shitty grind bands to get to something decent.

[DecayingWaste]

See thing is.. What bands come under what classifications?
Like you see big arguments that go for like ten pages, on the genre of a band, and it always ends up being, "Who cares?! Just shut the fuck up and enjoy it" What would people class "August Burns red" as?
As I think they're my favorite at the moment.

[bbqrocks]

Oh, metalcore, definitely.

[DecayingWaste]

Cool, thanks.
=]

[Be My Head]

Guys, what's the difference between "Deathcore" and "Death Metal" ?

I like Death Metal like: Nile, Bloodbath, Cryptopsy, Arch Enemy, Cynic, etc...

I've seriously never really listened to any Deathcore, I'm wondering, I'm not planning on listening to any of it, but I'm interested in different opinions.

Here is wikipedia's explanation, is it correct for the most part?

"Though a sub-genre of metalcore, deathcore is heavily influenced by modern death metal in its speed, heaviness, and approach to chromatic, heavily palm muted riffing, dissonance and frequent key changes. Lyrics may not always be in the death metal vein, but traditional growls, and pig-like squeals are prevalent, often combined with metalcore vocals. Much of deathcore features breakdowns and melodic riffs, a trait which is attributed to the hardcore aspect of its metalcore influence."

I listened to some Job For A Cowboy on youtube and the vocals sound retarded, nothing at all like real DM vocals. Could wikipedia be lying to me?

[MadassAlex]

Guys, what's the difference between "Deathcore" and "Death Metal" ?

I like Death Metal like: Nile, Bloodbath, Cryptopsy, Arch Enemy, Cynic, etc...

I've seriously never really listened to any Deathcore, I'm wondering, I'm not planning on listening to any of it, but I'm interested in different opinions.

Here is wikipedia's explanation, is it correct for the most part?

"Though a sub-genre of metalcore, deathcore is heavily influenced by modern death metal in its speed, heaviness, and approach to chromatic, heavily palm muted riffing, dissonance and frequent key changes. Lyrics may not always be in the death metal vein, but traditional growls, and pig-like squeals are prevalent, often combined with metalcore vocals. Much of deathcore features breakdowns and melodic riffs, a trait which is attributed to the hardcore aspect of its metalcore influence."

I listened to some Job For A Cowboy on youtube and the vocals sound retarded, nothing at all like real DM vocals. Could wikipedia be lying to me?

Wiki could be lying to you. Deathcore is like kiddie death metal. It's basically hardcorish/metalcorish (depending on the band) with some death metal elements tacked on to make it seem extreme to the uninitiated. Listen to Cryptopsy's latest record. That's deathcore.
Now listen to Once Was Not. Technical death metal.

It's a weird genre, because melodic death metal is better at being melodic and other death metal is better at being extreme and deathy.

Maybe I'm just bitter because Melbourne has become deathcore central. 

[Patrick]

Also, lose the sig image or I will shit on you.

fix'd

[Melodic]

I think I like Tommy's explanation fine, but then where does post-hardcore fall under? I'm fairly certain Greg Ginn would piss on the graves of most post-hardcore acts.

Also, the key difference to me between any sort of metal, and any sort of hardcore, is that metal has this ugly groaning moan vocals, whereas hardcore is trying to get over the fact that their microphone doesn't work.

Also, original post fails hard. Thanks for fixing it, guys.

[MadassAlex]

Also, hardcore is all like CHUGGA CHUGGA CHUGGA while metal is all CHUGGA CHUGGA WHEEDLY WHOO.

[Melodic]

There was a thread similar to this awhile back, and there were 4 or 5 pages debating hardcore CHUG.

[Spluff]

My professional opinion is that death metal is more CHUG CHUG CHUG CHUG whereas deathcore is more CHUG BONK CRUNCH WAKKA MEOW CHUG SPLAT AIEEEEEEEEEEE CRUNCH THUD CHUG.

[Patrick]

This thread is now the Musical Onomatopoeia Thread.

CARRY ON MY WAYWARD SON
THERE'LL BE PEACE WHEN YOU ARE GONE
LAY YOUR WEARY HEAD TO REST
DON'T YOU CRY NO MORE *BWOOOONG*
*DUN DUN DUN DAAAAAAAAA, DUN DUN DUN DAAAAAAAA, BUUUH DUUUH DA DA DA! DUN BWONNNNNG, DUN BWONNNNNNNG*

[MadassAlex]

HAI2U I'M THE VAST MAJORITY OF HARDCORE PUNK

CHUGGA CHUGGA CHUGGA KERRANG CHUGGA CHUGGA

[billiumbean]

Applecore.

Fruity metal for those of us who groove on the alternative lifestyle.

[MadassAlex]

Except that would actually be Veg Metal, what you describe would be a kind of hardcore punk affiliated with fruit.

[Thrillho]

Cool, thanks.
=]

Once again... sig images aren't allowed on here, old chap.

[Be My Head]

So could Necrophagist be described as Neo-Classical Death Metal?

DUDUDUDUDUDA DOODLYOODLYOODLYOOH DUDUDUDUDUDA DOODLYOODLYOODLYOOH
DOODLYOODLY                                          DOODLYOODLYOODLYOOHDOODLYOODLYOODLYOOH


Anyone know of any Neo-Classical Metalcore? I'd like to hear it, because I like torturing my ears.

[MadassAlex]

Generally, we lump Necrophagist in with technical death metal bands, like Decapitated.

[Nodaisho]

Also, hardcore is all like CHUGGA CHUGGA CHUGGA while metal is all CHUGGA CHUGGA WHEEDLY WHOO.

Thanks for the sig.

Yeah, there is a bit of crossover between hardcore and thrash (called crossover), some of it is pretty good, what I have heard of early CoC isn't nearly as good as their later stuff (still decent), but ST is pretty good (barring that goddamn institutionalized song which should burn in hell while being sodomized by a thousand pitchforks).

Thrash also has some crossover with non hardcore punk, though I don't really know the difference between hardcore and normal punk. Anthrax and early Overkill fit that, and I think that the jersey/NY thrash scene might tend towards that.

I'm not really sure what makes death metal, don't listen to much but Sculptured, and that isn't really a standard example. What I have heard seems like it has as much speed as thrash, but less complex chord patterns. I have heard Wintersun described as melodic death, I like them, but not sure if that description is accurate.

Deathcore, I don't really listen to.

[MadassAlex]

Death metal is kinda like slower, bizarre thrash metal.

[s42]

Death Metal is just good. Personally, the main difference I've heard between Death Metal and the Deathcore such like things is a matter of one sounding not like shit, and one sounding like shit. The guitars also seem somehow cleaner in Death Metal. But then I'm no expert, and I avoid Deathcore like the plague, as well as most hardcore spin off genres.

[Leinad]

"August Burns red"
As I think they're my favorite at the moment.

You win the "My Favorite Poster" award. Good job on actually having good taste in metal, bud.

[Be My Head]

But what about his taste in "core", how's that?

[Tom]

good taste in metal

 


















 

[castingcall]

Thrash also has some crossover with non hardcore punk, though I don't really know the difference between hardcore and normal punk. Anthrax and early Overkill fit that, and I think that the jersey/NY thrash scene might tend towards that.

Yeah, Thrash Metal has a LOT of hardcore punk influence. The cool thing about Anthrax was when they teamed up with Public Enemy and produced their electronic/hip hop/metal album...which in turn, unfortunately, created Nu Metal [Slipnot, Korn, early Linkin Park].

The difference between punk and hardcore is really in the sound. Punk and hardcore [real hardcore, like Bad Brains, Black Flag, Minor Threat, The Germs] have most of the same subjects but a really different sound. Typically, hardcore is faster, louder, and the songs [I find] are a bit more about the struggles of every day people, though I could be wrong, I don't listen to a lot of punk.

I think the best way to hear the difference between punk and hardcore is to listen to say.....Guns Of Brixton, by The Clash, and then Sailin' On, by Bad Brains. Or something from the Sex Pistols, and then Out Of Step, by Minor Threat.
They have different roots as well. Punk really does start with the British [The Damned, Sex Pistols, The Clash], though theres a lot to be said for MC5 and Iggy Pop and The Stooges having a huge influence on punk.
Hardcore really started in D.C., in the early to late 70's, and early 80's....Bad Brains, then Minor Threat....The ever changing sound of Black Flag.

Anyways, I've found the best way to tell the difference between punk and hardcore is to listen to as much of each. Similar subject, similar passion, MUCH different sound...


*goes back into lurkdom*

[MadassAlex]

You win the "My Favorite Poster" award. Good job on actually having good taste in metal, bud.

How on earth is that good taste in metal?

[Spluff]

Apparently some people actually like metalcore, or we wouldn't be constantly assailed by millions of cookie cutter metalcore bands at every corner.

I'm guessing Leinad is one of these people.

[Thrillho]

Anyways, I've found the best way to tell the difference between punk and hardcore is to listen to as much of each. Similar subject, similar passion, MUCH different sound...

You're right about the difference in sound, hardcore is generally much heavier. As far as lyrical differences, I would say it's closer to punk being 'fuck everybody' and hardcore being 'fuck these specific people.'

[locafoca]

FUCK YES.

NO RELIEF NO RELEASE NO PEACE NONE SURVIVE NONE ALIVE GENOCIDE DROP DEAD NO REFRAIN ONLY PAIN ONLY PAIN NONE SURVIVE NONE ALIVE GENOCIDE

[Nodaisho]

I think this fits in this thread, since it is about thrash. What would you all say is the best album for someone to start listening to Anthrax? I've been hearing some of them on Pandora, but haven't listened to a full album yet.

[castingcall]

As far as lyrical differences, I would say it's closer to punk being 'fuck everybody' and hardcore being 'fuck these specific people.'

Ohhh exactly. Punk laid the foundations for being anti-establishment, rocking the boat. Hardcore took specific issues [racism, sexism, drug use] and really heightened the whole scene, which got pushed to the extremes with the radical anarchist punks...