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Atheist Penelope

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chronoplasm:

--- Quote from: Mr. Doctor on 14 Jul 2009, 08:22 ---
I'm an agnostic. I discuss with Atheists in the same level when I discuss with religious people. Because we, humans... didn't have, don't have and never will have enough technologic and winsdom to declare if God exist or not. We just THINK there's a God or not. We don't know.

--- End quote ---

True, but we do have enough technology and wisdom to figure out which possibility is more or less likely based on the evidence we have available to us.

For example, a study published in the American Heart Journal shows that intercessory prayers don't seem to have any helpful effect.  
http://pt.wkhealth.com/pt/re/amhj/abstract.00000406-200604000-00041.htm;jsessionid=KcTWHbQ1BpjGTXLhw8Vn8FLq1bXQCzyLGNcb2F83pJyZZZp2ZjM2!-1466262180!181195629!8091!-1
This study, and many others like it, seems to make the possibility of benevolent, personal gods that answer prayers less likely.

Then of course there's evolution, which has a lot more evidence going for it than creationsim. There is always room for doubt, mind you, but we should be aware that the scales of evidence tip starkly in favor of natural selection.

danman:
I do not know, but you really do not seem to get such reactions with children - they do not realise such pushing and are likely to believe anything their parents tell them (a biological trait of learning). Then , when that stops being an effect, (old enough age) it forms a part of  the person's beliefs, so simple emotional reaction would not make one lose the belief entirely - at most something with the outer 'demonstrations' of it.
Statistics say most people with religious bringing who become atheists, become atheists in around 14-16 y/o.
Also most people i know that became atheists (i was an sharp discussionist on internet forums about atheism ) had about the same general history - some day they realised that god does not exist.

danman:
Actually you are a bit off - we will truly never have enough technology and science to prove nonexistence of god - you can at most debunk his supposed manifestations. To disprove any idea (ex. god) pure logic is both necessary and sufficient.
It is enough to say that a) the contents of most religions esp. their teachings about their gods are self contradictory and flawed
b) for other ideas (pantheism) Ockham's razor applies - adding an entity which has no manifestation in this world is futile.

Is it cold in here?:

--- Quote from: danman on 14 Jul 2009, 10:53 ---Penny on the other hand (like myself only with some differences) came from a religious background, was indoctrinated about this from an early age, and rejected such teachings because of her own intellectual effort (ie. is an apostate). Therefore, she tries to enlighten everyone else, since she has a feeling that all of religion is horrible nonsense (that is why she switched).

--- End quote ---
But Pen-Pen usually doesn't go around trying to convert people to atheism. Dora had to draw her out before she discussed religion, and she didn't try to persuade Dora, she just vented instead. With Wil she expressed incredulity but didn't try to change his mind.

Pennelope in general seems to keep her opinions to herself unless she's provoked, which admittedly happens easily.

danman:


Fair point, although it seems hat up to now, there was no one to persuade. (all the other characters seem unreligious to me)

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