Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
WCDT - 6-10 September 2010 (1746-1750)
Tergon:
I almost agree... but I think the key issue here is that Marten really does have to "Handle" Dora right now. In much the same way you would, if you'll excuse the metaphor, handle a small injured animal. You need to help it, you need to take care of it, but to achieve this you first need to make sure it won't panic and lash out, hurting you or itself. As much as I do feel sympathy for Dora, particularly now that the predicted crash has arrived is here, the simple fact is that this is how she's behaving. Not rationally, not logically, but running off pain and emotion, and that's how Marten has to treat her if he wants to help.
I suppose in a very broad sense of the term, he is manipulating her. He's guiding her and helping her to move toward a resolution it seems unlikely she'd manage on her own. And in doing so he's treating her with kid gloves... not because he may want to, but because if he doesn't, it could so easily blow up in his face. I saw it as a particularly good turn of phrase for this reason - Marten has recognized the problem, and has chosen the manner in which he plans to face the problem. Now, the problem is Dora's trust issues, yes, but as long as she's running on emotion, she's letting herself be ruled by those issues. And if she's being ruled by the issues, then she's personifying the issues. In a very direct way, Dora is the problem, at least until Marten manages to get through to her. And, as such, he has to handle her carefully until he's dealing not with the bundle of pain and emotions, but with the lady he loves.
That's how I took "handle this Dora thing" to mean. Not that he's going to control and manipulate her, but that he's going to take this slowly and gently. More of a Handle With Care, if you will. And the fact that Marten not only recognizes that he should deal with this problem carefully, but actually does plan to deal with it, is something I see as a tremendous leap forward for them.
Graphite:
--- Quote from: jwhouk on 08 Sep 2010, 06:03 ---
--- Quote from: Graphite on 07 Sep 2010, 22:01 ---He did say, "It's something we've gotta fix", though. That implies that they're going to work on the issue in the future, but for this very instant he just wants to reassure her that he's not about to walk away from the relationship.
I find it pretty puzzling that Marten *isn't* mad, but hey, that's how he functions - he was mad, he thought about it, now he's calmly made a decision about it. It might help the situation if Dora had actually been allowed to see firsthand that Marten was mad, but she seems to be finally understanding, thanks to Faye's smackdown, that anger is reasonable in this situation and she was in the wrong, so I think that's what'll make the real difference here.
--- End quote ---
Y'all ever been in love? Ever been REALLY mad at the woman/man/thing you love deeply, for whatever reason? So mad that you storm off in the middle of the night? Then, when you come back, you're halfway ready to ream her/him/it out? And there she/he/it sits, looking sad and forlorn because they've made you so mad, and you suddenly remember all the reasons why you love her/him/it in the first place, and you can't possibly STAY mad at her/him/it.
THAT is what his happening here.
--- End quote ---
Yeah, you're right - upon further reflection, that is exactly the most plausible emotional response in the situation from a well-balanced character like Marten.
someone1074:
I'm on the side that feels that this wasn't handled well but I recognize that it could be because Jeph just might not want to write a lengthy and wordy comic for this resolution.
The only reason I disagree with how it was handled (and a few of the posters here) was solely out of personal experience. Every woman I've ever been with who did awful things or had insecurity issues went right back to behaving that way when treated with the kid gloves. It wasn't until the issue was completely explored, sometimes right at the height of an episode, that they began bettering themselves.
But again, that was personal experience. I recognize that there are unique people out there and, more than anything else, I recognize that this is a comic. If Jeph wants to write that Dora becomes a better person after just this, that's fine. Perhaps Faye got to her. That alone could plausibly suffice as a wake up call since I don't think anyone spoke to her like that before.
Carl-E:
--- Quote from: Tergon on 08 Sep 2010, 07:32 ---I almost agree... but I think the key issue here is that Marten really does have to "Handle" Dora right now.
<regretful *snip*, 'cause it's so good>
--- End quote ---
Thank you Tergon. That helps a lot. He does have to "handle" her until she's stable, and able to deal with what's happening to her. Whether she was contrite or psychotic (or asleep) when he got back, he'd have to adjust his approach until he could reach the real Dora, and not the bundle of pain and hurt.
Now please, stop pointing that broom at me. You never know if it's loaded...
raoullefere:
May I add that 'to handle' is often an idiom synonymous with 'to deal with' or 'to approach'? As in "I can handle that" or even "I've got a handle on it." (Swats casually at the idiom-folk with his duplicate UBMEOD to quiet them for a moment). I read that line as Marten saying "Okay, I think I know how I'm going to deal with these meltdowns Dora's been having," said meltdowns being the 'Dora thing,' which is why that's not a good word to bandy about too often.
I'll agree with Tergon that Marten does need to 'handle' Dora in the other sense; as he said, to help her. But I don't really think that's what he meant when Marten said that to Sven. Of course, he may be attempting to become more laconic, and thus make every word that can do double-duty.
(On that note, assuming Marten knows, as do I, that thing was originally used to mean 'meeting,' 'Dora thing' takes on an entirely new nuance, and Marten's laconic abilities quickly shoot up to EPIC.)
Edit:
--- Quote from: jwhouk on 08 Sep 2010, 06:03 ---Y'all ever been in love? Ever been REALLY mad at the woman/man/thing you love deeply, for whatever reason? So mad that you storm off in the middle of the night? Then, when you come back, you're halfway ready to ream her/him/it out? And there she/he/it sits, looking sad and forlorn because they've made you so mad, and you suddenly remember all the reasons why you love her/him/it in the first place, and you can't possibly STAY mad at her/him/it.
THAT is what his happening here.
--- End quote ---
Yes. That's what I meant about this being some of Jeph's best dramatic work, and why Tergon's crying, and I would be, if I weren't such a hard-ass. Been there, done that, from both positions.
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