Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
More than "NOT DORA"
Yellowstone:
--- Quote from: Jonesy on 19 Nov 2010, 12:03 --- Marten strikes me as too passive... He was unhappy in the relationship but he got dumped as opposed to confronting Dora and dumping her or at least confronting their issues. Look at Steve, he has been dumped twice and he still picks himself up and gets back to things.
--- End quote ---
I'm willing to grant that Marten could have done more to push Dora to get the help she needed to deal with her issues. But I don't think you can argue that he was unhappy in the relationship. There were unhappy moments in the relationship, to be sure, but on the whole Dora and Marten made each other happy. The face in the last panel of 1799 is not the face of a man who's been dumped from a relationship he wanted to get out of.
I also don't see what parallel you're trying to draw with Steve. If your argument is that he rebounds quickly from being dumped - well, Marten just got dumped. We don't know yet how long he'll take to pick himself up and get back to normal.
numbvox:
--- Quote from: hannahsaurusrex on 15 Nov 2010, 18:03 ---I'm interested in what all of you who find Dora so abhorrent or even just don't think she's quite right, would attribute to Marten's ideal partner.
--- End quote ---
Boobs, obviously.
Superkid11:
See the thing is, when Faye was working on straightening herself out she was single. She didn't have to struggle with a relationship like Dora has been.
Now that Dora's single she's in a much better position to do the same. Marten too.
H̶̵͔̦̟̖͍̑̏ͨͨͦ̔͡ȩ͎̻̳̘̜͉̜̖́̿ ̸̩̂̌̅̀w̵̨͖͍̟͔̋͒̅̎̆i͎͚̟̟̘̥͇̜̓͌ͨ͜͡l̴̨̘̰ͥͦ̊̔ͮ̾̿l͓̜̫̟̦͙ͪ̒ͭͤ ̢̘̞̩͙̲̒ͯ́̓̓̋ͣ̌f̨̮̘̄ͬ̍̽ͫ̈̈͑ͅį̻̝̯͖̼̜̜̏͠ͅn̡̜̹̦͊ͧ̔ͩ͗͆̓ͦd̷̥̭̝̼͓ͧ͗̎̉͢ͅ ͙̣̜̥̺̯̳ͨ̓͞į̛͉̥̘̤̗̺͆͒̇͗ͤͮ̓͋̀ş͓͈̐ͮ̽̔̾́̉ͫ͡ ̧̰̹̼̠̝ͮ͆̋̓͗͌͌̚t̵̜̟̣̗͙͔̏̌͡r͙̪͇͙͉ͤ͗͋̅̂̕͡u̱͚ͪ̏͡e̬͔̲̠͓̱̼̻̓ ̧͒̐̅ͯ͏̱̼̩͓l̪̖ͧͤ̆̍̍̀̕͜o̷͖̖̾̓͐̓̆͛͑̅v̘̦͈͈͐ͦ̅́ͩ̊͠e̜̫̰͒̈́ͤ͞ ̸͇̝̓̊ͪ̆ͅj̷̫́ͪ̈̒̂̓̅̑̕ṵ̡̧̱͊̃ͬͣͣ͋͛̎s̭ͦ̾̕͡t̖̙̲͍̫̗̗̜̋̍̒̆͋ͯͫͅ ̷̝̭̙̼͍̬͕ͮ̐ͨ̉a̷̝̲̙̩̘̼̣̜ͮͣͥ̾̑s̱͉̞̐͆͆̀ͅ ͭ͏̧͎̜͚̠̲̼̻̼I̢̜̪̱͂̓̒̒ͤ̀̈́̄ͯͅͅͅ ̮ͪ̃͐̎ͤ͒̄̓̃͢h̛͇͚̀̍͛̾͊ͣͤ́a̡ͧ̂ͧ̌̃͏̖̮͕ṽ̢̠̏̊̉̐̔̾ê͉͈͉̲̜̗̱̤ͩ͊ͧ̿͐̐̚.̩͚̗̬͍͕ͭ̉̎̍̋͟
(is that getting old ok i'll stop doing that now)
Xenmaru00:
Being single has nothing to do with working through your problems. in fact being with someone actually helps, especially if you trust them a great deal. the problem was Dora thinking singularly, she was thinking in terms of self, of only her. So she didnt see the problems, because to her, they were too weak to worry about. She started seeing them when Marten was around, but rather than take an active role and go "i dont like thinking like this. i have no reason to think like this. i must change this." she went "oh god, i need to leave him or else we'll just fight all the time because i'm jealous of everyone else even though he's with me of his own will."
That right there, is her taking a problem that truly stems from her, and making it everyone else's fault. She didnt break up with him for his sake, or because she was making him unhappy. She broke up with him because she was unhappy, and she saw the existence of everyone else in relationship to Marten as the source of her problems, when it was her that was the only true problem. She blatantly ignored that Faye not only was not constantly showing even slight interest in Marten, but she was actively and majorly crushing on someone else.
That type of reaction doesnt come from caring about others, that comes from caring about the self. i've seen people do that exact reaction all the time, and the one personality trait they shared was that they focused on themselves, and not in the way that they checked their movements and actions to make sure others got pushed around as minimally as possible. Now, with her being single again, the slight break in her mentality that began to appear because it was being pressured from all sides, is now going to repair, and reinforce itself.
Dora is effectively screwed, because Marten could have been able to end the cycle, but like we all agree, he's a bit too passive. Thus the key word is "could". He's supportive, but he's not pushy, and sometimes you need to be pushy. not a lot, but once in a while.
All that said, i'd like to see the Hannelore/Marten bond deepen some more. They always work well together. Then again...Hanners might Trance on Dora so...that might be an explosion that would be hilarious to see happen. But then again Hanners is working under Dora, and Hanners would probably be torn between the urge to defend, and the urge to keep a "normal" life...yet defending would-agh it's a cycle of confusion. Wow, Hanners is in a bad place.
Also, did anyone notice that after...uhh...what's her name. The one wi-Colette! Does anyone else get the feeling that somehow, Colette's gonna be blamed for this? Little Miss Bad Luck.
JackFaerie:
Before he gets with anyone else, I think Marten needs to work on self-assertiveness and developing a spine a lot more. Clearly Dora has a lot of self-reflection and working-on-herself to do before she's ready for another relationship, but she's not the only one. Just because Marten's issues are much more benign to others doesn't mean they aren't there. Before we, as readers, can try and decide what kind of girl Marten needs, he needs to actually be able to define what he needs for himself. And right now he can't.
I disagree with those who say Marten never found Dora attractive, but I agree that, regardless of whether or not he had some interest in her prior and regardless of what feelings he developed for her later, he dated her in large part because well--she was cute, he liked her well enough, and he was going with the flow. He knew they didn't really "match up" well--their different takes on sex and intimacy, their different music tastes (not a big deal in general, but something that mattered to him at the time), other small personality quirks--but went along with it anyway. If another decently attractive, decently nice and smart girl had come along instead, he would date her. He does not have the ability to discriminate and to actually seriously consider his dating choices. And once he starts dating someone, he is not able to let go. He followed Vicky all the way across the country even though she was clearly showing signs of not reciprocating the full extent of his feelings. He stayed with Dora long after it became clear the relationship wasn't truly making him happy (and without even bringing up any of his growing dissatisfaction), and was shocked to see it end at a point when to our outside perspective, the end was both obvious and necessary.
Once he's over Dora and single, and a marginally cute nice girl asks him out, can you imagine him turning her down? Not really. And once he starts dating her, it would probably once again proceed to a relationship, and would lead to yet another dating situation Marten just kind of fell into. But he needs to learn that there's more than marginal niceness and cuteness that he should be looking for.
People have mentioned that a guy like Marten could pretty well go with any girl. No. I don't think that's true. I think the problem is that Marten makes himself pliable and malleable enough to go with pretty much any girl. And he shouldn't. He needs to be less of a doormat and figure out what he actually wants in a girl, what kind of girl would actually suit him before he starts dating again.
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