Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

She doesn't have her hair up in a ponytail.

6 (6.8%)

Black really clashes with her eyes.

2 (2.3%)

That wasn't Splenda she put in her coffee.

4 (4.5%)

She got an extra ear piercing since yesterday.

5 (5.7%)

Faye has a scar on her right boob.

9 (10.2%)

Dora's hair was purple.

8 (9.1%)

She doesn't really need glasses.

5 (5.7%)

Pintsize has her entire BDSM collection uploaded into his memory.

24 (27.3%)

That WASN'T Kirk, but his brother Leeeeroooyyyy Jenkkinnnnsss!!!!

8 (9.1%)

Waffles taste better with chicken.

17 (19.3%)

Total Members Voted: 71

[The Seldom Killer]

I defend my opinions with vigor, but I hold them at a distance. If it seems like this is personal- well I'm tired, I'm not my best at objectivity right now. Again, reading what I said last week would help with that.

I wouldn't plan to depend on my parents either (though they're 75 miles away, not 3000 miles), but if one cared enough (and had the money to)  drop everything and flew over to see me the penultimate day after a major personal kerfuffle of mine, I'd expect them to act like I just had a major personal kerfuffle, not like it's been 6 months and I should stop moping and date that hot waitress. Tapability was funny the first time she visited; not this time.

I read what you wrote last week (at least I presume I have as it's dispersed across the thread and I hope I haven't missed the pertinent part you're referring to) it still doesn't change my position. I too will defend my opinion with vigour. My opinion is that it's funny and brilliantly so.

Even if my parents had travelled across, time, space, dimensions and defeated the end of level baddie to see me after a major personal event I still wouldn't depend on them for quality emotional support. I guess that's just the way they are.

[Emperor Norton]

What is up with everyone having to have extreme reactions to everything?

My own mother is hilariously inept at being emotionally supportive... I know that and I'm sure if this is normal Ms. Reed mode for dealing with emotional support, then Marten already knows this about his mother, too. I don't hold it against her, and honestly, you can tell she is ACTUALLY TRYING, even if she is awful at it. She isn't being a malicious bitch, she is just badly being a supportive mother, there is a difference (also, I would say that... overall she might know better how to deal with Marten's emotional shell than we do, so there may be some method to her madness that we don't get)

And also. ITS FUNNY. Almost everything Ms Reed has said is hilarious. Did people forget this was a comic again? And that some things are exaggerated for humor? Same with Sven and his lack of internal monologue, and him getting thrown out of his own apartment.

Also, as for "that would have been a disaster" that wasn't a condemnation of Faye. It was a condemnation of Faye and Marten TOGETHER. Two people can be perfectly wonderful human beings, and be perfectly awful for each other.

[Carl-E]

...Marten already knows this about his mother, too.

Which is why he tried to convince her not to come when she called, and then just sighed and accepted it.  Really, Marten expected no more or less from her.  Why should we? 

[Coffee_Kaioken]

I think I sense the psychological manipulation dripping from Mrs. Reed's words...

[Forgotmytea]

I'll just relax over here on my little yacht, eat popcorn and watch the incoming shipping battles a few nautical miles away. Anybody else anticipating a shit storm incoming and wanting to watch from the sidelines, you're more than welcome to join me. Beer's in the fridge, extra chairs in the closet below deck.

Oh Jeph there are some nights I love you. This is one of those nights.  

I've always found the sidelines very comfortable *grabs a beer and sits down*

[jwhouk]

The fact that we're speculating on what the #### she means in all this is indication enough that Jeph is a better scriptwriter than even we want to let on.

[Somnus Eternus]

I suspect this is comedy for those who don't have relatives like this. 

I also suspect that there are very few of those here on the boards...

Eh, she's a lot like my dad so far, and I'm still taking it relatively lightheartedly.  It involves kind of stepping out of my own head and looking at it from an outside perspective, but once I do it becomes less...mm. Painful to watch, I guess.

Though part of me suspects that this is Veronica's subtle little knife in Faye's gut for rejecting her son after letting him ride Faye's Emotional Roller Coaster (not that that's Faye's fault, in my opinion).  Moms can be like that, I've heard, for their little boys.  Heck, she was willing to go to prison for taking out Dora (joke or not, if Marten actually said yes? I think she'd have done it). This is downright tame in comparison.

[innermoppet]

... the Pugnacious Peach

Magnificent. This should be the new name for Faye.

That would be a fantastic T-shirt! A picture of Faye perhaps wearing a cute little indie headband with a flower on it, scowling, with both fists up like Rocky Balboa.

[Somnus Eternus]

... the Pugnacious Peach

Magnificent. This should be the new name for Faye.

That would be a fantastic T-shirt! A picture of Faye perhaps wearing a cute little indie headband with a flower on it, scowling, with both fists up like Rocky Balboa.

I would totes buy that tshirt.  And how.

[steveb]

It seems to me thinking back on Veronica's previous appearances in the comic that we have seen examples of her current
types of behaviour, but like most of the QC cast she is complex and there are other sides to her personality there as well.

To me it seems that Jeph is showing us this side of Veronica in such georgeous detail in order to flesh out Marten's back-story
(who is a much more major character).

People have been going on forever in this forum about Marten havin door-mat tendancies, This no longer just looks like a random character flaw but something rooted in issues from his childhood and makes me think that both sides of the Marten-Dora train wreck have issues from their pasts that need sorting out.
If you look back at Faye's history her character development would have just appeared like a random personality change if we had not been told something about her history. Similarly it would seem wrong for Dora to magically get over her issues without more of her back-story being shown.

Yes its very difficult to feel sypathetic towards V at the moment but I do wonder if the narrative reason for her visit (as opposed to the characters reason) is to set things up for some Marten character development.

[Dr. ROFLPWN]

What is up with everyone having to have extreme reactions to everything?

I don't think you realize the seriousness of the business going on in here. Let me tell you how serious this business is: you need to have an MBA and some Italian fucking loafers to be posting in this forum. You thought you could just come in here and talk about how funny some panel was? You thought WRONG, motherfucker. Crack open your literary analysis text, we are going to be here a while. Where is your psychological graph? Your shipping wall? Your thesis on who shot Faye's father? Get with the program here.

[Carl-E]

Steveb, well put!  And don't worry about the Dr. ROFLPWN, he's been a bit out of sorts ever since his thread was trashed...

I mean, I haven't even started  my thesis!  No MBA, either. 


Also, we already have an image...



Feel free to fix it. 

[Cybit]

I think Veronica is one of the most true-to-life, hysterical moms I've ever met.  Maybe because she completely reminds me of my mother (except my mother would never have hugged my ex), but everything she's done / saying is absolutely dead on for being a Mom.  In her eyes, she's seen heartbreak come and go, and so she sees Dora & Marten as just another relationship in the big scheme of things.  To anyone who has ever had a hard breakup, it never seems like that at all.  So Veronica's going to be looking at things a lot more big picture then anyone else, and she's probably somewhat amused / trying to desperately point out that Marten has all of these amazing single women in his life who he might be compatible with (Hanners, Marigold, etc).  She has to make sure he doesn't lose perspective of his life as a whole. 

As for today's strip, holy cow, I laughed HARD.  I completely approve of what Veronica said to Faye.  Because she's calling out the 900 lb gorilla out.  If Faye really just saw Marten as a friend, that might sting a little on the self-esteem front, but hell, Faye herself has decided that Marten and her going out was a bad idea, so why would she be so heartbroken about that comment?

Unless...Faye really isn't sure.  Right now, Marten functions as her emotional boyfriend, for lack of a better term.  Their friendship is basically Marten doing all the boyfriendly emotional things (being there for her when things go bad, etc etc), but with none of the physical aspects (except the occasional hugging).  Veronica may have picked up that while as Faye is dating Angus, Faye *needs* Marten.  As a mom, it's hard to see your boy struggling with being alone and lonely, when you realize his roommate / best friend is using him (perhaps in Veronica's eyes) as an emotional boyfriend. 

Why not find out how someone REALLY feels by dropping that line in?

Alternatively, Veronica just believes Faye about the entire "I don't have feelings for Marten that way" bit, and just dropped that line in as kind of a re-affirmation of "you made the right decision for the two of you", unaware that Faye probably isn't 100% sure about it. 

[Dr. ROFLPWN]

Steveb, well put!  And don't worry about the Dr. ROFLPWN, he's been a bit out of sorts ever since his thread was trashed...

I mean, I haven't even started  my thesis!  No MBA, either.  


Also, we already have an image...



Feel free to fix it.  

Why would you remind me of my faded glories, you cruel, cruel man.    I am as Ozymandias! All the works of my hands have become as dust!

(More seriously I am just being a sarcastic jerk.

As to the image, I like it, but it needs the headband, I think...The lettering is good though.

[Carl-E]

Sorry, must be my true nature slipping through 

As for the image, all I gots is MS paint.  I had to darken the couch to get the lettering to show, and did a pretty lousy job.  But yeah, if someone wants to put her into a "million dollar baby" outfit, feel free! 

[Olymander]

I have to agree with those others in that the actions of Mrs. Reed don't really bother me all that significantly.  Maybe it's because, as I think I mentioned somewhere or another, that I've seen this sort of behaviour before.  In real life.  So for me, it's "funny" in the sense that it often ends up being an "Oh God, remember that time when?" sort of thing.

As a random semi-related aside, and sparked by a memory of the person I was mostly responding to last week, I wonder if there's an age split in those that favor Mrs. Reed and those that don't, as in that there are more younger persons that don't favor Mrs. Reed and more older persons that do.  Doesn't really mean anything, just a curiosity bit.  And, of course, at that point we'd have to define how much older is "older" and how much younger is "younger". 

Oh, and Dr. ROFLPWN?  You can have your loafers.  I'll just find a nice heavy pair of steel-toed boots... (added humour value in that I weigh somewhere in the neighbourhood of a buck-five, so said boots will probably add 5 pounds to my weight!)

[Delator]

Alternatively, Veronica just believes Faye about the entire "I don't have feelings for Marten that way" bit, and just dropped that line in as kind of a re-affirmation of "you made the right decision for the two of you", unaware that Faye probably isn't 100% sure about it.

A lot of what you say makes sense, but think about it another way.

Faye did have feelings for Marten. She said as much.

Now Marten's mom says they never would have worked out...in spite of those feelings.

Now Faye's going to be worried that her feelings for Angus are masking the same sort of incompatibility.


*cue drama*


...I also have a new Theory Which Shall Not Be Named.


Don't fail me now Jeph.  

[iduguphergrave]

Now Faye's going to be worried that her feelings for Angus are masking the same sort of incompatibility.

Not only that, but Faye could interpret Veronica's meaning to be that she's the reason they wouldn't have worked out. I'm not saying that is what Veronica meant; it most likely isn't, but Faye's got much bigger self-confidence issues than she lets on and I can see her taking "You'd have been a terrible couple" to really mean "You would have been terrible for Marten. He really dodged a bullet there." Hence Faye's stricken look in the last panel.

It would have been ok for Veronica to state that particular opinion to Marten, but saying it to Faye was just a tad out of line (or she could have at least put it better). Then again she was already on a roll with the out-of-line-train already so why stop now?

[Black Sword]

I believe this would be known as "ship sinking" on TV Tropes. Hey, it's even linked already!

[Kugai]

Ahhh,

Back to the Sith Lord of Tactlessness, Darth Vanceuous

[AngryCallCenterAgent]

GAWDDAYUM, getting shot down by the mother. Speaking of which, wonder what Faye's mother would think if they did hook up?

[Heliphyneau]

I'll just relax over here on my little yacht, eat popcorn and watch the incoming shipping battles a few nautical miles away. Anybody else anticipating a shit storm incoming and wanting to watch from the sidelines, you're more than welcome to join me. Beer's in the fridge, extra chairs in the closet below deck.

You're gonna need a bigger boat.

*grabs a beer and a chair*

Oh God Faye's face is fucking priiiiiiiceless last panel.

Hell yeah it is.   

Mothers are supposed to be motherly; there's a reason that is a word, with the definition it does.

Yup, it's called 'being a stereotype.'  Individuals vary, and that includes those who happen to have spawned progeny.

...I also have a new Theory Which Shall Not Be Named.

I know what your theory is, and I hope you're wrong.     In any event, we'll find out what the deal is when Jeph's good and ready to show us.

*shuts up; munches popcorn*

[Cybit]

1) Veronica may not have (and probably doesn't) have any idea of Faye's self-esteem issues.  So, her comment isn't out of line without that knowledge

2) She's kinda right, all things considered.  Faye would just roll over Marten all the time, non-stop.  It would be a nightmare.  (Obviously not out of ill-intent, but just based on their respective personalities...)

3) I think if Veronica is as crafty as everyone is thinking...I think she's shaking things up on purpose.  Marten has a comfy little life, sure, but if she is being canny about all of this, she's shaking things up to get him out of his rut.  Make him focus on other things changing besides just the relationship. 

[leahneedsanap]

Unless...Faye really isn't sure.  Right now, Marten functions as her emotional boyfriend, for lack of a better term.  Their friendship is basically Marten doing all the boyfriendly emotional things (being there for her when things go bad, etc etc), but with none of the physical aspects (except the occasional hugging).  Veronica may have picked up that while as Faye is dating Angus, Faye *needs* Marten.  As a mom, it's hard to see your boy struggling with being alone and lonely, when you realize his roommate / best friend is using him (perhaps in Veronica's eyes) as an emotional boyfriend. 

Really?  So a lady can only be emotionally close with a dude if they are a couple, otherwise she's "using" him?  Faye has become a significantly better friend to Marten over time.  She was a supportive sounding board over Dora moving in (which she would not have been supportive of if she was in some sort of "emotional monogamy" sort of mindset about him), stopped being bothered by them being affectionate in front of her, lets him sound off about things.  Sounds like the relationship I have with ALL of my closest friends, male or female.  Yeah, she punched him after the break-up--when he was drunkenly trying to assault her, which is pretty much what is going on when a someone lumbers at you acting entitled to your body when you are saying no.  She respected Marten's wishes by not raging on Dora.  Before the breakup, during the porn conversation that precipitated it, Faye was clearly joking around and was as shocked as Marten was when Dora took it too far, and then clearly felt bad she'd played a role.  Marten called her "pretty much my best friend," so he clearly sees there as being a reciprocated bond.  Yeah, Marten doesn't open up to her as much as she does to him, but he doesn't open up a whole lot to anyone--even his girlfriend. When Marten is having an existential question, he mostly keeps it to himself unless asked.  If Marten is getting "used" by Faye, then Sven gets "used" by Wil.

Then again, if you are just stating what you think Marten's mom is thinking, and though I would find it highly unlikely that a successful sex worker isn't able to see nuance when it comes to varying types of intimacy and relationships, it would still make my misogyny-rage misplaced, for which I apologize and offer you up a psyduck  

[TheEvilDog]

Then again, if you are just stating what you think Marten's mom is thinking, and though I would find it highly unlikely that a successful sex worker isn't able to see nuance when it comes to varying types of intimacy and relationships, it would still make my misogyny-rage misplaced, for which I apologize and offer you up a psyduck  

Thats what worries me. Veronica is/was supposedly one of the most successful fetish models and dominatrices in the world. By definition, a dominatrix is supposed to be able to read people, developing in their own way, skills similar to a psychologist or pyschiatrist, so they know how people work, what their limitations are and how far you can push them. Veronica should be able to read people, otherwise she wouldn't be as successful as she is now, so why is it she's going out of her way to humiliate her son, insult his best friend and comfort the one who dumped him? Is she blinded by the fact that Marten is her son? Or is she unable to quite seperate her dominatrix persona from her motherly one? Or is this some sort of roundabout plan to help Marten? How? By breaking his confidence and grinding it into nothing?

I said this last week, but I do feel the need to say it again, whatever Veronica has in mind, she is serious danger of damaging her own relationship with Marten.

[Blackjoker]

What is up with everyone having to have extreme reactions to everything?

My own mother is hilariously inept at being emotionally supportive... I know that and I'm sure if this is normal Ms. Reed mode for dealing with emotional support, then Marten already knows this about his mother, too. I don't hold it against her, and honestly, you can tell she is ACTUALLY TRYING, even if she is awful at it. She isn't being a malicious bitch, she is just badly being a supportive mother, there is a difference (also, I would say that... overall she might know better how to deal with Marten's emotional shell than we do, so there may be some method to her madness that we don't get)

And also. ITS FUNNY. Almost everything Ms Reed has said is hilarious. Did people forget this was a comic again? And that some things are exaggerated for humor? Same with Sven and his lack of internal monologue, and him getting thrown out of his own apartment.

Also, as for "that would have been a disaster" that wasn't a condemnation of Faye. It was a condemnation of Faye and Marten TOGETHER. Two people can be perfectly wonderful human beings, and be perfectly awful for each other.

My commentary was more because it wasn't funny. I would disagree that they would be 'terrible' but that wasn't my main source of angry reaction. Last week was my source of angry reaction, and while most of it was just quiet groan the 'apologize for standing up for yourself' was kind of a wallbanger.

@Carl-E I see that picture as a kind of wrestling poster for some reason "and in this corner, the Pugnacious Peach!"

[Cybit]

Aye, that is intended to be seen from the aspect of Marten's mom, not as my own. (otherwise I'd have a lot of conversations to have with my female friends...)  

Marten's mom either (a) feels that Faye is the one for Marten, and knowing what she does about relationships, knows that if this is the case, the response from Faye will be very, very telling as to whether this is possible, or (b) genuinely believes Faye & Marten (can we assume that Marten talks to his mom on enough of a basis so that she has a vague idea of their relationship...though knowing Marten, he probably wouldn't bring up the entire "I want to date her but she doesn't want to date" aspect, seeing as Mom might come storming to see him afterward) are just friends, and doesn't think her comment should state anything but the obvious.  

Going further into Veronica's mind; if (a) is the case, then maybe she's trying to make Faye realize that the one she needs is really standing next to her all the time.  Plus, people in Faye's position can often assume they have someone like Marten in the bag (as long as he was single).  Hell, that's kinda Dora's big issue, she could never stop believing that Faye would always be a threat to them, and add in her general view of men (as scumbags), she believes that if Faye ever made a move on Marten, Marten would dump her for Faye.  Which, in my very newbie opinion, despite Marten's protestations to the contrary, would definitely screw with Marten, and he might actually do it, depending on how pissy Dora has been at the time and to what extent Faye would be willing to go to get him.    

Though the when Harry met Sally conversation that could spawn from this is an interesting one, and might actually be a good way to look at the Faye/Marten relationship as a whole for an alternate perspective.. (cliffs notes version for folks: the when Harry met Sally conversation is basically "can a guy and a girl just be friends successfully")  Also, it takes the entire "what's the difference between a really close friend and a significant other" conversation to a whole other place...but that's another can of worms.  

Though it does bring up a good point about Marten and Faye's relationship; would they be as close as they are without the romantic-y feelings they once had for each other?  Without the romantic feelings, Faye may never have initially opened up as to why she has issues, which deepened their relationship and is probably the sole reason it thrives after the shooting down of Marten.  

Though Faye's response to Marten's mom overall (all comments) makes me think she might believe that Marten and her didn't happen because she didn't want it to, not because maybe she wasn't right (or in her low self-esteem case, good enough) for him.  Basically, what it tells me about Faye is that even though she says they're just friends...there is more then "we're just friends" in her mind.  Veronica's remark took some of the garbage swept under the rug back out.   

I take your Psyduck and pet it on the head.  Also, I hug it, cuz it's adooooorable.  

[Mustakyy]

              OH DAAAAMMNN! BURRRN!               

Hmm, Im having problems deciding was that simply "wrecking-ball blunt comment" or just pure sith evil.. 

I think im going for the wreckingball-option, because I think Ms. Reed just doesn't know the gang THAT well to make such pinpoint precision strikes (even if she WANTED to?). But still, judging from the look at  Fayes face, that hit SOME kind of nerve. Which one, ill be damned if I know. So im not even gonna start to make any silly speculations. I think im just gonna see how the dust settles after the storm..


But while waiting....

I'll just relax over here on my little yacht, eat popcorn and watch the incoming shipping battles a few nautical miles away. Anybody else anticipating a shit storm incoming and wanting to watch from the sidelines, you're more than welcome to join me. Beer's in the fridge, extra chairs in the closet below deck.

Make room, ladies and gents, I aint missing this one..

*grabs a chair and a beer and joins the observer crowd*

[DJRubberducky]

I actually had a rather awful thought after reading this strip.

What if comforting Marten *isn't* the main reason for Veronica's visit?

What if she's also trying to distract herself from a traumatic event in her own life, taking her mind off her troubles by trying to focus on Marten's?

This speculation is what I'm clinging to for comfort as I see Ms. Reed go a little too far for my own comfort (but then again, I know that I would not do well in the BDSM scene, on either side of it, so I suppose that's not surprising).

[Cybit]

I actually had a rather awful thought after reading this strip.

What if comforting Marten *isn't* the main reason for Veronica's visit?

What if she's also trying to distract herself from a traumatic event in her own life, taking her mind off her troubles by trying to focus on Marten's?

This speculation is what I'm clinging to for comfort as I see Ms. Reed go a little too far for my own comfort (but then again, I know that I would not do well in the BDSM scene, on either side of it, so I suppose that's not surprising).

That would have been brought up by now, if anything.  Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I think Veronica's just being a typical Mom, because let's be honest, a lot of people here see Veronica and are like "crap, that's totally what my Mom would say / do." 

[Razgriz]

Yeah, she punched him after the break-up--when he was drunkenly trying to assault her, which is pretty much what is going on when a someone lumbers at you acting entitled to your body when you are saying no.

Please don't bring this up again.  It's been settled weeks ago and really looks like you're just trolling for reactions now.

[tomart]

Marten's mom either (a) feels that Faye is the one for Marten, and knowing what she does about relationships, knows that if this is the case, the response from Faye will be very, very telling as to whether this is possible, or (b) genuinely believes Faye & Marten ... are just friends, and doesn't think her comment should state anything but the obvious.  

 if (a) is the case, then maybe she's trying to make Faye realize that the one she needs is really standing next to her all the time.  Plus, people in Faye's position can often assume they have someone like Marten in the bag (as long as he was single).  Hell, that's kinda Dora's big issue, she could never stop believing that Faye would always be a threat to them, and add in her general view of men (as scumbags), she believes that if Faye ever made a move on Marten, Marten would dump her for Faye.  Which, ... despite Marten's protestations to the contrary, ... he might actually do it, depending on how pissy Dora has been at the time and to what extent Faye would be willing to go to get him.      

Good analysis, ...and further supporting my idea that Dora was maybe justified (in her mind, anyway) in ending a relationship that might have been doomed beyond my poor recognition...

Also, is it a coincidence that the only significant person missing from the poll (Faye) is the one V messes with?

[Carl-E]

There's been a lot of speculation in the last few comments about Veronica's "motives", but I really don't think she has any.  What I think several people are missing is the simple fact that we often have blind spots about the people who are closest to us, when removed by a generation.  I had them about my parents (my wife was kind enough to open my eyes to many of them), and still have several about my own children.  Some of it comes from incrementalism - we don't notice the small day-to-day changes that happen right under our noses and then we're surprised by what seems a sudden development.  But the worst come about when a child leaves home - they go through a great deal of growth and change without being observed, and then are expected to still be the same person when they come home (or home comes to them). 

Veronica isn't being purposefully mean, nor is she working under some grander scheme to snap Marten out of it in some bizarre reverse-psychological hit-and-run.  She's just being the mom she always was, to the boy she used to have.  And we see a big part of who Marten's become in her treatment of him.  We also see one reason he was so willing to move cross-country at the drop of a hat.  It's the same reason my wife and I settled halfway between our parent's homes.  Each one is 500 miles away, in opposite directions - we can visit once a year or so, but no one drops by on a whim...

And Kazukagii, you're going to have more people on the yacht than there are other boats in the "shipping lanes"!  Hope there's plenty of beer in the cooler. 

Where's the bottle opener, anyway? 

[Wraith11B]

A point that I haven't seen brought up, is it is possible that Veronica is referencing as to what would have happened had Faye and Marten been involved and the present situation had exploded.

It would be (very likely) far far worse than the present situation, as--and I'd like to think that I'm reading the characters right--Faye had a goodly percentage of Marten-strings.  Now, just because Dora came along, those strings were by no means cut, simply redirected and the tension on them was slackened.  Had they been tightened, there would have been a far harder fall than what's going on right now.

[cuzsis]

 Not exactly sure why everyone is treating V's relationship advice so seriously.

 This is from a woman who was so successful at her own relationship that she married a gay guy... 

 Advice about relationships are like buttholes....everyone's got one.

 -If the person giving you advice has been married/together for 10+yrs. You may want to consider it. They've got enough experience and wisdom to start seeing past most of the crap.

 -If the person giving you advice is giving you advice about what caused them to breakup/divorce. You may want to consider it. They've already screwed the pooch on this particular issue.

 -If the person giving you advice is none of these, then only consider it long enough to see if it makes sense and if it doesn't, don't bother about it. They are likely just talking out of their collective buttholes. I'm not saying they're doing it on purpose or to be mean...but they almost certainly don't know enough about relationships (much less the intricacies of yours, which you'll never be able to tell them all the minute details anyway without taking several years to do it) to give good advice unless they hit the monkey on the keyboard just right by accident. 

 Cheers!

[TheEvilDog]

-If the person giving you advice has been married/together for 10+yrs. You may want to consider it. They've got enough experience and wisdom to start seeing past most of the crap.

 -If the person giving you advice is giving you advice about what caused them to breakup/divorce. You may want to consider it. They've already screwed the pooch on this particular issue.

 -If the person giving you advice is none of these, then only consider it long enough to see if it makes sense and if it doesn't, don't bother about it. They are likely just talking out of their collective buttholes. I'm not saying they're doing it on purpose or to be mean...but they almost certainly don't know enough about relationships (much less the intricacies of yours, which you'll never be able to tell them all the minute details anyway without taking several years to do it) to give good advice unless they hit the monkey on the keyboard just right by accident.  

- In all fairness, Veronica and Henry were married for about 10 years before the divorce, that one kinda falls flat on its ass.

- Veronica and Henry divorced because of the fact Henry was gay, so unless Marten ended up following in his dad's footsteps, its two completely different issues, and thus any advice is next to useless in that context. It's like offering a hammer when what's needed is a screwdriver.

- This is about the only point I kinda agree with you with. Veronica is talking out of her own ass. From what I've gathered, Veronica really hasn't a romantic relationship since Henry and to be honest, I can't imagine it would have been that passionate. In fact, a lot of the evidence kinda points to Veronica having a lot of one night stands, pretty much the opposite of Marten and Henry. Pretty much any advice she gives is the same as when Sven tried to advise Wil about Penny and comparing it to teaching a Bedouin how to sail.

And the longer this story arc goes on, the more I wish Henry and Maurice were the ones in town again.....

[PenSwordAccord]

I will tell you why I am worried about this arc, and, yes,  I know that Jeph is highly unlikely to do anything like this.  This whole arc reminds me most uncomfortably of Turtledove's "World War" series and the Sam/Barbara/Jens storyline.  Not in the details, obviously, but in the general line of a guy getting dumped for no good/valid reason and everyone in his world supporting the cheating/dumping lady and crapping on the faithful guy.  The results were not pretty, and completely turned me off of reading any more of Turtledove's books.  I have to keep reminding myself to "trust in the author, Luke". 

Lee

pen & sword, in accord.
What is the sound of one hand clapping, anyway?

[DonInKansas]

I said this last week, but I do feel the need to say it again, whatever Veronica has in mind, she is serious danger of damaging her own relationship with Marten.

Either that or she's craftily trying to force him to sack up, blow his top, and shake him out of his stupor.  She's not stupid enough (and doesn't hate Marten enough) to just take cracks without a plan involved.

[Is it cold in here?]

In 447, Ms. Reed was downright humble about whether she'd be able to offer good advice given her relationship track record.

[rje]

Neh I stopped thinking awhile bad there's method in the madness. Veronica's just kinda being a sucky mom. Is that a bit disappointing since she kind of came off like Super Awesome Mom at first glance before? Yeah. Is it realistic? Oh hell yeah. I know plenty of people who have moms who aren't terrible, but they're just kind of...sucky. They might be judgmental, or overbearing, or kind of anal retentive, or prone to dismiss their children's opinions, complaints, or issues, but they still love their children very much, and are great in other ways.

So I'm not all GRR THAT WOMAN but I'd love to see - as part of the arc I ~hope~ Marten starts on, where he begins to take active control of his life, instead of being a passive observer - that he talks to her about her lack of real understanding. Or maybe Faye will!

Also today's comic made me lol, such a poke in the eye to the shippers (too bad that one dude left, I kinda wanted to hear his take on it, fufufu.)

[Bologna]

I really don't think Veronica has any sort of ulterior motive.  I don't think she realizes that she's coming across as insensitive.  I really didn't like what she was doing before, but for some reason I don't mind it as much anymore.  This is just who she is.  I don't think that Marten really expected her to swoop in and save the day, anyways.  Just a good ol' visit from mommy dearest.  


I do want to get the ball rolling on seeing what everyone else is doing.  Hanners, Marbear, Dora, Fayngus, etc. etc..  Let's get to that!  

[charybdis]

/climbs aboard yacht

I brought more beer. And some margarita fixin's. Pass the popcorn.

/attempts to find a free chair, gives up and sits on deck

[Carl-E]

Umm....

How many people does this tub hold, anyway? 

And where are the lifejackets?

 

[Dr. ROFLPWN]

Pah! Lifejackets aren't necessary, this thing is unsinkable!

[Skewbrow]

Passes a cup of chili flavored roasted peanuts around. Anyone? Clears some space in the lifeboat and sits down. Better safe than sorry.

[akronnick]

Are we going on a voyage of some kind, or are we just gonna sit in the boat at the dock and drink beer?

[Tergon]

Carefully avoiding the inevitable and predictable battle in the shipping lanes...

I just want to point out that Jeph nailed the artwork in this comic.  The expressions are excellent, and oddly enough the part that struck me most was Faye's lips.  Great emoting with each little smile, and then the surprised "Huh?" at the end... it's one part of facial expressions that has evolved, much like everything else in the artwork, but I thought this strip was really quite good.


In closing, I vote for sitting on the dock drinking beer.  Especially if there's a kebab shop nearby, though I will settle for fish and chips.

[pwhodges]

This is from a woman who was so successful at her own relationship that she married a gay guy... 

People don't come with labels, and don't necessarily know their own mind fully.  I have seen the fall-out from a similar breakup (reverse the sexes, and factor in three children), and it was not something to laugh about - so I'd suggest you don't in future. 

(That's friendly advice, not a moderator comment)

[Olymander]

Then again, if you are just stating what you think Marten's mom is thinking, and though I would find it highly unlikely that a successful sex worker isn't able to see nuance when it comes to varying types of intimacy and relationships, it would still make my misogyny-rage misplaced, for which I apologize and offer you up a psyduck 

Thats what worries me. Veronica is/was supposedly one of the most successful fetish models and dominatrices in the world. By definition, a dominatrix is supposed to be able to read people, developing in their own way, skills similar to a psychologist or pyschiatrist, so they know how people work, what their limitations are and how far you can push them. Veronica should be able to read people, otherwise she wouldn't be as successful as she is now, so why is it she's going out of her way to humiliate her son, insult his best friend and comfort the one who dumped him? Is she blinded by the fact that Marten is her son? Or is she unable to quite seperate her dominatrix persona from her motherly one? Or is this some sort of roundabout plan to help Marten? How? By breaking his confidence and grinding it into nothing?

I said this last week, but I do feel the need to say it again, whatever Veronica has in mind, she is serious danger of damaging her own relationship with Marten.

I think that if Mrs. Reed could separate herself from being Marten's mother, and was actually "working" (so to speak), then she might (read: probably would) be able to tell.  The thing is, she's not working.  She's on "vacation".  I don't know much about the "scene", but I've gotten the distinct impression that they make a very, very, clear difference between being "in scene" and being out.  I think this is related to how she's been being very direct with what's on her mind; she's relaxed and not working, and thus all the "control" that she needs for her job, she's dropped for the time being.  So in this respect, she's actually completely separated her dominatrix persona from her motherly one, in that if she was in her dominatrix persona (and thus working), she'd be paying more attention to what's going on.  Theoretically, anyway.

[ysth]

'Cause when love is gone, there's always justice.
And when justice is gone, there's always force.
And when force is gone, there's always Mom ("Hi, Mom!").