Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
Should Dora go out with Jim?
jwhouk:
--- Quote from: Blackjoker on 14 Jun 2011, 22:06 ---
--- Quote from: DSL on 14 Jun 2011, 19:37 ---Is it so much self-esteem as a lifetime of conditioning to lay low, stay off the radar, be nice, don't assert? He grew up among strong, domiant people, sought them out later in life ... One gets used to one's role fairly quickly until one realizes one hasn't gotten very far among the societally accepted road of advancement.
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Agreed, looking at how his mother behaved during her visit it seems more that Marten isn't unassertive so much as his mother surgically removed his spine around the time he was 4.
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...If this is the case, why isn't he playing hockey?
Tiogyr:
--- Quote from: Blackjoker on 14 Jun 2011, 22:06 ---
--- Quote from: DSL on 14 Jun 2011, 19:37 ---Is it so much self-esteem as a lifetime of conditioning to lay low, stay off the radar, be nice, don't assert? He grew up among strong, domiant people, sought them out later in life ... One gets used to one's role fairly quickly until one realizes one hasn't gotten very far among the societally accepted road of advancement.
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Agreed, looking at how his mother behaved during her visit it seems more that Marten isn't unassertive so much as his mother surgically removed his spine around the time he was 4.
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Offering the reason why Marten has low self-esteem contradicts the notion... how, exactly?
DSL:
I read self-esteem as one's regard of one's own value. One need not NECESSARILY have low regard for one's self to be non-assertive. They can go together and frequently do, but it's not mandatory.
pwhodges:
Just so. Specifically, I would say that I am basically non-assertive, and I do not have low self-esteem. Assertiveness has more than one aspect, of course; I avoid the conflict that could arise from asserting my choices against those of others, but I will take steps (within that) to do things I want to do for myself.
Tiogyr:
--- Quote from: DSL on 15 Jun 2011, 05:46 ---I read self-esteem as one's regard of one's own value. One need not NECESSARILY have low regard for one's self to be non-assertive. They can go together and frequently do, but it's not mandatory.
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There is a difference between simply being "non-assertive" and letting everyone you know just run over you all the time on any given thing.
I mean, what was the last time Marten was actually assertive about something that mattered? The time he moved halfway across the country for a girl that wasn't interested in him anymore in a fit of binge drinking fueled stupidity (remember, he was all set to back down again when Dora said "Fuck it, we're done").
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