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Oh, I, uh, wasn't really looking.

2 (2.9%)

Marten Reed, Professional Indie Ogler.

3 (4.3%)

"Not really looking, eh?" "Figuratively speaking."

2 (2.9%)

I'm not mad at you, I just think it's funny.

0 (0%)

You're not the only one who has $#!+ they gotta figure out.

0 (0%)

Sweetie, your problem's simple

1 (1.4%)

What DO you want from your life?

3 (4.3%)

Cheeseburger and a haircut!

0 (0%)

Creepy Haidresser!

7 (10%)

Hundred foot tube lined with WHAT?

5 (7.1%)

Snip!

2 (2.9%)

What DO I want? EPIPHANY!

2 (2.9%)

Hannelore!

2 (2.9%)

Wait, how did I know you were gonna be in my apartment?

6 (8.6%)

Why AM I in your apartment?

15 (21.4%)

It's been forever since we played music!

4 (5.7%)

Amir: "Hey dudes. I was wonderin' if you'd ever come back."

8 (11.4%)

Shower? "I'M GOING HOME"

8 (11.4%)

Total Members Voted: 61

[stoutfiles]

a big part of why Dora broke up with Marten in the first place: frustration at indie-boy's directionless passivity.

Dora made it quite clear why she broke the relationship up, and that was not the reason.

Just because it was never voiced in a strip doesn't mean it's not a possibility.  Dora being an ambitious business owner should be somewhat upset with her boyfriends total lack of direction and motivation to improve himself.  Not to mention their relationship was founded on Marten striking out with Faye.  Are there any ladies reading this? Do you consider Marten a guy you'd love to date?

All I'm saying is that Marten isn't much of a catch in my opinion, and until he decides to do something, anything with his life, then any breakups he has are justified by the other party. 

[Daniel Patrick Moynihan]

Marten's lack of direction has been hitting close to home for a few months for me, but Tuesday's comic could be a dramatic reinterpretation of a conversation I had in 2003 with an ex.  Except if this comic were about me, in between panels 4 and 5 there'd be an extra panel that reads "8 YEARS LATER".

[pwhodges]

Just because it was never voiced in a strip doesn't mean it's not a possibility.  Dora being an ambitious business owner should be somewhat upset with her boyfriends total lack of direction and motivation to improve himself.

Should?  That's for Dora to say, not us.  The only time I remember it coming up between them she was amused by it, rather: 610; and he's not always passive, either: 697 is hardly turning her off him.  Granted, those were a long time ago; but Jeph has not chosen to make Marten's aimlessness in life and work an issue between him and Dora, even though he has brought it into the comic a number of times.

[Throg]

Just because it was never voiced in a strip doesn't mean it's not a possibility.  Dora being an ambitious business owner should be somewhat upset with her boyfriends total lack of direction and motivation to improve himself.

Should?  That's for Dora to say, not us.  The only time I remember it coming up between them she was amused by it, rather: 610; and he's not always passive, either: 697 is hardly turning her off him.  Granted, those were a long time ago; but Jeph has not chosen to make Marten's aimlessness in life and work an issue between him and Dora, even though he has brought it into the comic a number of times.

I thought it had been made clear in 1962 that his passivity was perhaps not the primary issue, but was feeding into her other issues.  Namely, in spite of being a small business owner (in her late 20's, yet!), she still had issues of self-worth, and, well, panel 3 in that comic: she's afraid that he's with her because it's convenient, rather than he really wants to be with her.

_{(oh god i'm getting sucked into the psyches of characters from a webcomic)}

[thatchickliz]

That's not ambition, that's an uneasy feeling of directionlessness (is that a word?).

pwhodges got it (aimlessness), although I think directionlessness could be a word if the dictionaries would update more often to reflect new words.

[pwhodges]

I thought it had been made clear in 1962 that his passivity was perhaps not the primary issue, but was feeding into her other issues.

OK, I missed that.  None the less, it's part of her rationalisation of what happened more than something that actually came up between them, I'd suggest.

[Is it cold in here?]

Jeph said in his last appearance here that Marten doesn't even know what his goals are.

(moderator)
Good job, everyone! New people especially please watch: this is the right way to argue about the comic.
(/moderator)

[Schmorgluck]

I thought it had been made clear in 1962 that his passivity was perhaps not the primary issue, but was feeding into her other issues.  Namely, in spite of being a small business owner (in her late 20's, yet!), she still had issues of self-worth, and, well, panel 3 in that comic: she's afraid that he's with her because it's convenient, rather than he really wants to be with her.

So, if I'm reading you right, you mean that if Marten had been more assertive in general, Dora would have been less worried that he might be with her by default? I'm not sure I quite agree, but I must admit that it makes sense.

[cabbagehut]

Just because it was never voiced in a strip doesn't mean it's not a possibility.  Dora being an ambitious business owner should be somewhat upset with her boyfriends total lack of direction and motivation to improve himself.  Not to mention their relationship was founded on Marten striking out with Faye.  Are there any ladies reading this? Do you consider Marten a guy you'd love to date?

All I'm saying is that Marten isn't much of a catch in my opinion, and until he decides to do something, anything with his life, then any breakups he has are justified by the other party. 

I am a female person who sometimes dates male persons.  And actually, yes, I would consider Marten a good catch.  He's generally honest, he's good-hearted, he knows how to apologize, he is aware of his own faults and tries to be a good friend and partner.  He shows concern for others' feelings and is pretty sensitive to other people's wants and needs.  While he isn't very assertive, he also usually isn't passive-aggressive, either.  Sure, he might be frustrating to deal with at times, but he's usually pretty happy to go along with the flow.  I have a fairly strong personality, so this arrangement sometimes works for me.

Of course, I'm not Dora, so the point is completely moot - I'm just saying that lacking direction isn't necessarily what everyone considers a dealbreaker.  I don't really consider Dora that much more driven than Marten, though.  Yes, business-wise, she has shown good personal commitment and whatnot.  She has her own business, which is a successful one, but what does she want to do with it?  Is she happy where she is?  Unfortunately, when it comes to her personality, she blocks out things she doesn't want to deal with.  That, to me, is why I don't like her that much.  Not because she's a terrible person or anything (she clearly isn't), but I feel like she acknowledges her problems and then does very little to solve them while simultaneously criticizing other people's approaches to problem-solving.  I find that personality trait frustrating in a partner.

But hey, this could be a beginning of a wonderful, assertive Marten.  Cheeseburgers and haircuts.  But no meat-burps in the barber's face.  A thoughtful decision.

[SirDudley]

I've never had "meat burps" as Marten puts it. Meat farts, on the other hand, I have quite the experience with. If the two are related, then Marten has the right idea to go for the haircut first then go for the cheeseburger because the barber/hair stylist will not be pleased with the smell.

But yes, baby steps are vital in this situation. A meal and a haircut is a good start for Marten.

[gangler]

Depending on philosophies Marten has either achieved enlightenment, does not understand himself, or needs to be more ambitious.

I think it's more that he's in the process of getting what he wants right now, so it's a bit of a moot point. Social isolation has not been treating him well. Returning to the CoD a pretty big step for him in attaining happiness. Right now he's probably just looking forward to hanging out with the gang again.

[Carl-E]

I've never had "meat burps" as Marten puts it. Meat farts, on the other hand, I have quite the experience with. If the two are related...

Same bacteria, just lower in the digestive tract.  Fortunately, I don't have that particular problem. 





[tmi]Peppers, on the other hand, haven't agreed with me since my early 30's...[/tmi]

[themacnut]

It's not TMI as long as you don't say exactly HOW peppers disagree with you. Some things are best left to the imagination-or for us to choose not to imagine as the case may be.

[ink slinger]

...also who else thought that was Marigold at first?

Actually, I thought it was Faye and was confused as to why Jeph was drawing her so differently all of a sudden, while not making any changes to the way the other characters were drawn. I was also confused about the clothing, but that didn't figure into it until afterwards.

[LeeC]

maybe marten will focus on his music now and become a music teacher or a rock star!

[dragontart]

Are there any ladies reading this? Do you consider Marten a guy you'd love to date?

I'm not a lady, just female, probably making my answer moot:
No, but his lack of ambition is not a reason. People who'swth whose main (or only) goal in life is to obsessively accomplish something, or always need to do something, anything, quite annoy me, so that  part of Marten would be very relaxing.

[stoutfiles]

Are there any ladies reading this? Do you consider Marten a guy you'd love to date?

I'm not a lady, just female, probably making my answer moot:
No, but his lack of ambition is not a reason. People who's main (or only) goal in life is to obsessively accomplish something, or always need to do something, anything, quite annoy me, so that  part of Marten would be very relaxing.

I'm confused...people who have goals quite annoy you?  I mean, that's fine if they do, but a goal is something positive like doing well at work or writing a song.  A reason to get up in the morning.  Marten appears to have zero goals.  I never said he needed to obsessively accomplish something, I just want him to have a goal for his own well being.  I guess eating a hamburger and getting a haircut is a goal, but I was hoping for something a little bigger...something to improve himself.  It's been clarified many times before that Marten isn't a super happy guy, and i believe a goal would help change that.

[pwhodges]

No, she said clearly, as you quoted that people who are obsessive  about goals annoy her.  This is not the same as simply having  goals, though I note that some people seem to make little distinction (which is often the expression of a Protestant work ethic).

[jwhouk]

The punchline, IMNSHO, isn't because Marten really doesn't have goals in life. It's because that is how he deals with uncomfortable situations.

You just found out your dad is gay? Make a joke about it.

A girl who you chased across the country to date broke it off? Toss off a passing wisecrack to friends about it.

Another gal you were not only mildly interested in tells you she can't date because her dad shot himself in front of her? Non-sequitur into a joke about waffles.

Face it, kids: Marten's MO in situations where he has to face "the real world" is either humor, snark or smart-assery.

[Welu]

I took Marten's want more as simple than shallow. He's definitely thinking about things but is starting small with things he can achieve and then work up to what he really wants to do with himself. I also agree with wanting to see Faye give him his haircut.

Are there any ladies reading this? Do you consider Marten a guy you'd love to date?

Well, in terms of passiveness, my boyfriend is quite like Marten. I'm a mostly recovered ball of issues so being with someone very grounded works well for me. Our biggest compatibility is our sense of humour and that's the big thing that attracted me to him.
Marten's main goal is his music, playing guitar but he's said himself he's not so good at writing songs and the band's been disbanded _{(Couldn't help myself)} for a long time. It's a want in the back of his mind that's gone on hold. My boyfriend wants to be a comedy writer, which he's slowly working towards but unlike Marten, he's constantly doing little steps, rather than just wanting. My boyfriend's goal is related to his sense of humour but his goal is not what caught my attention.
That said, a nice, sweet guy who I can joke with and have a bunch of things in common with but not everything, so we can introduce each other to new things and always have stuff to talk about, is pretty awesome to me. Luckily I have that so I don't need to swoon over fictional Marten. 

[dragontart]

I mean, that's fine if they do, but a goal is something positive like doing well at work or writing a song. 

Why? Of course you could also ask me "why not". And I don't know.

It's indeed true that I don't mind people simply having goals and ambitions, like I don't mind people painting their walls pink. That's something I consider everyone's own business. I do mind people who try to paint my walls pink and think of me as weird when I find pink annoying and won't let them.
And I do find pink annoying, so I am not highly comfortable in a pink room, as I won't be in company of people whose whole life revolves about goals and ambitions which tends to be obvious in anything they think, say and do.
And as far as my experience goes, people are never satisfied with only painting their own walls.

So Marten would be quite pleasant company for me when it comes to that. But that's about it, there are way too many other things he'd need to have or to not have to be interesting to date. Actually I think we don't even know much about Marten.

[themacnut]

Welu, I think your boyfriend's got one up on Marten as far as passivity, he's at least taking steps toward his goals. When was the last time we even saw Marten so much as pick up his guitar and play something?

Hopefully we'll at least see that much sometime soon.

[DSL]

The punchline, IMNSHO, isn't because Marten really doesn't have goals in life. It's because that is how he deals with uncomfortable situations.

....

Face it, kids: Marten's MO in situations where he has to face "the real world" is either humor, snark or smart-assery.

That's actually the trait about Marten that I find most unlikeable. His sense of humor shows up at the most inopportune times. And can come across as insensitive. (Then again, I was frequently accused of that in my twenties, and it's said we dislike in others that which makes us see ourselves). Reading the strip, though, I've often thought Jeph wrote an awfully tolerant bunch of friends for Marten.

[jwhouk]

Some ink for the big guy (and he's right, they do look like some Godsmack cover band in the photo).

[Blackjoker]

The punchline, IMNSHO, isn't because Marten really doesn't have goals in life. It's because that is how he deals with uncomfortable situations.

....

Face it, kids: Marten's MO in situations where he has to face "the real world" is either humor, snark or smart-assery.

That's actually the trait about Marten that I find most unlikeable. His sense of humor shows up at the most inopportune times. And can come across as insensitive. (Then again, I was frequently accused of that in my twenties, and it's said we dislike in others that which makes us see ourselves). Reading the strip, though, I've often thought Jeph wrote an awfully tolerant bunch of friends for Marten.

I kind of saw it more that Marten was awfully tolerant of them. Faye tended to repay kindness with physical abuse and confusion. Steve is someone who on their best day can be frustrating and on their worst day make you want to put a fist through a wall. Dora had severe insecurities and manifested them in a lack of trust for Marten and essentially choosing her neuroses over him, deciding that he wasn't worth getting her head cleared. Hannelore, while more subdued now, was rather...off in the beginning. I could also point out that most people would have thrown Pintsize out a window or had him reformatted if he behaved towards them like he seems to behave towards Marten.

[DSL]

Thing is, Blackjoker, I think you're rightand I still think I'm right. The abuse you cite from Faye, Pintsize et al, I accepted as over-the-top comic strip humor but Marten's mispaced sassery was realstic enough to bother me. As I said, probably because it reminded me of something I regret about myself.

[cassie]

I kind of saw it as everyone was tolerant of one another. They all seem to be pretty aware of their issues (Marten knows he can say the wrong thing at the wrong time, often in an attempt to lighten the mood; Faye knows that she is abusive and was (?) incapable of being emotionally responsive; Dora knows she is pretty neurotic; Steve... well Steve might not be aware of his stuff, haha). They're tolerant of one another because they know that they have their bad moments too, that they're no better than the next person.

Anyway, I think Marten's comment about cheeseburgers and haircuts was just a joke. I doubt that that was his true ambition in life--he just has a sense of humor about his future, which is a good thing in my book.

[Kugai]

1983 - the year I turned 21

[themacnut]

Middle-aged fart.

Of course I'm only about 5 years younger than you so I really shouldn't be throwing that particular stone...

[stoutfiles]

I mean, that's fine if they do, but a goal is something positive like doing well at work or writing a song. 

Why? Of course you could also ask me "why not". And I don't know.

It's indeed true that I don't mind people simply having goals and ambitions, like I don't mind people painting their walls pink. That's something I consider everyone's own business. I do mind people who try to paint my walls pink and think of me as weird when I find pink annoying and won't let them.
And I do find pink annoying, so I am not highly comfortable in a pink room, as I won't be in company of people whose whole life revolves about goals and ambitions which tends to be obvious in anything they think, say and do.
And as far as my experience goes, people are never satisfied with only painting their own walls.

I agree with that.  His friends can't force him to be something he's not.  However, if something doesn't change, he will go to work, go to the coffee/bread shop, and go to the bar.  This is all he does and he's not very happy with his life.  For his own sake he should branch away from that and do something new.

So Marten would be quite pleasant company for me when it comes to that. But that's about it, there are way too many other things he'd need to have or to not have to be interesting to date. Actually I think we don't even know much about Marten.

Anytime we have Marten strips they're usually just Pintsize and Marten, aka Garfield and Jon Arbuckle.  Otherwise, Marten is basically the dull everyman and the story is told with he and us listening to the other, more interesting characters.  Hearing about Marten's day would make for a boring comic minus a few exceptions (bar hijinks, library hookups)

[dragontart]

I usually find it more interesting what's inside of someone's mind than how they spend their day, but that's not what the comic is about, thus Martens day would probably be uninteresting to read indeed. I guess the way the comic is told is the reason for me to think that I don't know enough about Marten to say I'd like to date him (if he were real. Also he has some other traits I'd find unfavourable, but still, he would be nice to have around.)

This is all he does and he's not very happy with his life.

Still not convinced that the first part is the reason for the second. But also not denying that it could  be, thinking of some of his comments way back.

[Carl-E]

1983 - the year I turned 21

I keep forgetting we're the same age...

[Interlude]

I agree that Marten's passivity played a large part in Dora's breaking up with him. Honestly, most people have more than one reason for making a life changing decision. Her own insecurities were one-- but a lot of it was that Marten never did anything to REALLY show her that he wanted to be with her because he WANTED her, not just because she was there. Marten could have done that when Dora asked to move in together-- but he chose Faye. I would not have handled that as well as Dora did. (I know I have my issues. Haha.) I know someone could argue that he just didn't want to move, or that he was just being a good friend...etc. However, I felt it was the completely wrong way to go about things. If he did not want to leave that apartment or was not ready to move in with Dora, he should have just said as much-- there was no reason to bring Faye into it at all. Dora was ready to take their relationship to the next level-- moving in and focusing on the development of the relationship as adults. Marten did not seem to be on the same page as her. This is a breaking point for many relationships. When one person is ready to progress as a couple and the other is not, it is very hard to stay in that relationship. At some point, you have to realize that the relationship is not going anywhere, and it would be best to end it.

I think Marten really liked her, but was he seriously considering a future with her? Dora is ready to settle down. Yes, she has issues to work through, but I think that would have been easier to do with someone who seemed to want the same thing out of the relationship. Knowing you want something more, but not being sure if your partner feels the same... Added to the fact that Dora is insecure to begin with. It is not a good combination.

[Tova]

I think that an interesting aspect of the last comic that no-one has yet mentioned (possibly because some here had a similar reaction?) was Marten's extreme defensiveness in the very first panel at Dora, who clearly (in my mind at least) was not criticizing Marten for looking at all (only laughing at him for the apparent contradiction).

Marten has spent a lot of time around two women who have acted quite possessively in the past. If Marten is now in a stage now where he's going to feel guilty or defensive every time he so much as looks at another woman, then that's an issue all of its own.

[westrim]

And people wonder why I don't chat with my barber.

[0kamisama]

Hopefully AFTER it's all been thoroughly cleaned...

[guayec]

ohgodohgodohgod
brrrrr
 

so creepy. cant stop shivering.

[akronnick]

Eewwww eeeewwww eeeewwww eeeewwww eeeewwww getitoff getitoff getitoff getitoff!!!!!!!!!!!!!





*shudders*

[Tova]

Suggestion for a new poll:

Complete Marten's sentence: "But I -"

[themacnut]

Yeah...won't ever even THINk of crawling through such a contraption. Meanwhile, Marten is thinking "if this is what having a goal is like, maybe I'll learn to be content being directionless..."

[pendrake]

For comic #1983...

1. I thought hairdresser girl was pretty cute until the hair-tunnel concept...

2. Despite hairdresser creepiness, she and Dora are absolutely correct in trying to drive Dora's point into Marten.

3. Unfortunately, creepy hairdresser girl probably completely negated Dora's sage advice with her giving Marten a severe case of "the willies."

4. I think art gallery visitors who go through the hair-tunnel will need an extra-strong cup of coffee from Faye's expresso-saurus.

[cesariojpn]

Is it just me, or are many of the glasses wearing folks in the QC universe abit....eccentric? 

Faye is a peach with "issues".......Sven is a songwriter douchebag.......Tai is a confused lesbian.....Penelope is *coughPizzaGirlcough*...........and on and on.....

[dragontart]

I always found off-cut hair to be rather soft and fluffy.

[Dust]

.. and now I'm gonna be up all night wondering just what happened in my barber's back room after I finally got a cut after 5 months.

[Mr. Doctor]

What the fuck? 
This is one of the creepiest strips Jeph has ever done. I agree with pendrake, she looked cute just until she started talking about that...thing.

[TinPenguin]

Anyway, I think Marten's comment about cheeseburgers and haircuts was just a joke. I doubt that that was his true ambition in life--he just has a sense of humor about his future, which is a good thing in my book.

I agree. I think it's missing the point to think it's anything but a joke. Of course it's also true - he does want those things, but he doesn't seriously think it's earthshaking. Making serious decisions about his life is not something that can be done in a few moments thought standing in a coffee shop.

However, as has been said, making jokes is his way of avoiding awkward situations, and in this case he is definitely doing that. Dora presumably wasn't expecting him to figure out what he wants from life right there and then, but what he's avoiding is having to agree or disagree with her. By making this joke, he gets himself out of having to say 'Yes, you are right, I need to do that' and committing himself to follow through, or coming up with a plausible reason why he disagrees. In other words, by the very fact of his joking about it, he is being non-committal. It's going to take a lot to shake that habit.

At least we can see that he is giving the matter some follow-up thought. Hey, some barbers can be very good people to bounce ideas off and to give you straight advice. And some of them are very good at being so creepy you want to claw your way out of your own clammy skin.

[Kazukagii]

....Right

Marten, this is the point where you get up and back the fuck away Some things are just better left to the  

I bet he doesn't take good enough care of his hair for it to be soft enough for a tunnel, anyway.

[WAYF]

I want to make a Duran Duran reference to suit the comic strip number and the current topic, but I really can't.

(click to show/hide)

Is There Something I Should Know About What You Do With My Hair?

But seriously, everything that we've said is creepy before (Jim and his conduct on a date springs to mind)... no. This is in another LEAGUE of terrifying.

[Blackjoker]

Reality itself has declared Marten cannot seize his destiny

1) Moves cross country to be with someone he loves, she can't even break up with him to his face.

2) Marten tries to quit job, gets there and is told he is fired.

3) Marten stands up to Dora after she walks on him one time too many, she dumps him.

4) Marten works up courage to enter coffee shop, Dora isn't there (ok, this is a maybe)

5) Marten talks to barber about pursuing dreams, gets the creepiest possible version of what a person is like with goals

I will say it before and will say it again, any time Marten tries to seize his destiny it knees him in the nuts and screams that it was assaulted.

[snubnose]

Jeph surely has a rich fantasy ... though this very idea is really just strange in my ears.