Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
WCDT January 9-13, 2012 (2096-2100)
jurialmunkey:
--- Quote from: Soulsynger on 13 Jan 2012, 04:34 ---
--- Quote from: jurialmunkey on 13 Jan 2012, 04:27 ---Long time lurker, first time poster etc. etc. etc.
In regards to: http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2091
[ ... ]
But, as life is not like tv, instead we have Marten being passive aggressive...
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Good first, nice and clean.
But thats a LOT of assumptions especially as to the emotional state of Padma. Getting the image of being "star-crossed lovers" in your head normally takes more time than they've had.
And even if she has it stuck up there, she should be much more emotionally and romantically experienced than to manouver Marten into a forced confession like that... at least, judging from the way she handled the Elliot-situation and the beginning of the Marten-fling she should be....
(I love assumptions btw.)
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By star crossed lovers, I mean in the Romeo and Juliet sense - they love each other but fate constantly stands in the way (fate in this case being a sick grandma). I was kind of being hyperbolic to stress the "lovers confusion" trope/angle. I'm not necessarily saying that Padma was trying to get Marten to profess his undying love, rather that she was just looking for some sort of verification that they were on the same page. Instead, what happened was Marten obliviously blundering into the opposite of playing it cool and making a joke rather than being serious and understanding. Basically, I'm saying that Padma was looking for a sign to say that the stars were aligned, but Marten's blundering instead made her feel as if the stars were crossed. My assumption is that for Padma to absolutely be sure to stay everything had to feel exactly right, and Marten's comment made it feel a little off. Imagine if she decided to stay and something didn't feel right, then her Grandma suddenly got really sick again. That sort of thing really weighs on the conscience.
jwhouk:
--- Quote from: pwhodges on 13 Jan 2012, 02:51 ---Have you never put off doing something because of the pain it will cause (to yourself even, not necessarily others), even though putting it off will cause more pain later? I know I have. So how about this:
Padma wanted to delay going; when she tried to arrange it, her family put pressure on her (and how they can!) not to change her plans (possibly even before their last night together, which is why she was so conflicted); she couldn't bear to tell Marten, and so avoided him until there was no further option. This avoidance was sad, though understandable in a flawed world; Marten's reaction was equally unfortunate, but somewhat understandable. I have sympathy with them both, but also would like to knock their heads together...
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You forgot one key thing: family may have done more than pressure. They may have done a Marten's mom number. "I'm coming to Massachusetts, I'm going to pick you up, and that is FINAL, young lady."
Either way, I agree whole-heartedly, sir.
idontunderstand:
--- Quote from: truestatic on 13 Jan 2012, 06:11 ---then it's clear the hard work of the mods must have paid off.
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Suckup! :-D
Anyway, I still contend that Marten just need a fucking hug. He felt rejected and acted childishly. Padma is losing part of her family, is moving away from friends and work and hometown, and on top of that has to deal with a guy who has no fucking clue (bedside strip recalled). It's understandable, it's human behavior, and I think regardless of whether Marten was "in the right" or not, he will regret this for the rest of his life. Unless, of course, he changes his mind.
Dr. ROFLPWN:
--- Quote from: tjradcliffe on 13 Jan 2012, 05:44 ---
--- Quote from: Dr. ROFLPWN on 13 Jan 2012, 05:09 ---But I also think that if you really believe he wasn't trying to hurt her, that he wasn't trying to give her a taste of her own medicine, that you give him way too much credit and are fooling yourself for Marten's sake, just a little :P
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People--even fictional QC people--are complicated and their motives are rarely pure. I'm sure there was an element of "getting back at her" in Marten's behaviour. But there are two important factors: 1) it really is her own behaviour he's putting back at her and 2) he has a right to protect himself emotionally.
She has withdrawn from him. She's gone from "I want to see more of you" to "I'm too busy right now to make time for you". Fair enough: she's not exactly been up-front about it, but she's young and confused.
For her to then turn around and say, "OK, having put you off and rebuffed your every approach for the last few days and given you time to experience emotional separation from me I now want to see you so you can go through the pain of separation again" is pretty second rate, and Marten has every right to say, "I've already done it once, I really don't feel like doing it again, thanks (you bitch)." That terminal parenthetical is certainly there, and doesn't do Marten any credit, but it's not the whole story.
Having been on the receiving end of behaviour like Padma's (and who hasn't? why do women DO that? Do they think we don't have any emotional reality of our own? If you prick us do we not bleat?) I've gotta say my sympathies are mostly on Marten's side here.
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...
I don't want to pick on you, but this is another really stellar example of Bad Posting, and it hits almost all of the three axioms Mr. Hodges was saying to avoid on the last page.
1.) Blame culture.
It's pretty obvious from sentence one that you are assigning blame, and more expressly assigning blame to Padma. This is folly. Even more dishearteningly, you are advocating the stance that Marten has justification, is morally correct, in hurting her because of her bad behavior. This is not true and the thread has already been over why that is multiple times over.
Why is there a need to assign blame here? What does it solve? Why not say that this is the result of both their mistakes, which is precisely what it is? Padma acted badly, and so did Marten. I'll admit, I personally handed Marten the lion's share in previous posts, but that is mostly because as protagonist I hold him to a higher standard. The fact of the matter is they both made a mess of this, and in the end it doesn't even matter who finished things or who started them. Blame isn't going to help anyone.
2.) Projection.
You are also, pretty obviously, projecting like hell onto the characters; your exacting speculative outline of Padma's motives (which I must remind everyone we do not know about in detail, no one here does save Jeph) speaks volumes about that, and then in the last sentence you freely admit that you have been in Marten's position and it sucked and stuff.
Don't do this. I cannot stress this enough. Do not project, no matter how strong the urge. Every time you, or anyone else, project yourselves onto Marten, Jeph wants to delete the forum. It's toxic: it ties everything up in very personal, heavily charged feelings, and honestly 99.99% of the time it's inaccurate for the simple fact that you aren't Jeph, so you don't know the character's motives or thoughts!
3.) Bigotry.
I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and assume you were not being sexist.
That said, it is...pretty insensitive to ask "why do women [play emotional games]?" One might ask in return, "why are men such inconsiderate pricks?"
What? They aren't, you say? That's a stereotype, you say? WELL maybe the same is true of women!
Also, gendered insults, like "bitch", used to demean, are not cool at all! Please try not to use them!
truestatic:
--- Quote from: idontunderstand on 13 Jan 2012, 07:47 ---
--- Quote from: truestatic on 13 Jan 2012, 06:11 ---then it's clear the hard work of the mods must have paid off.
--- End quote ---
Suckup! :-D
Anyway, I still contend that Marten just need a fucking hug. He felt rejected and acted childishly. Padma is losing part of her family, is moving away from friends and work and hometown, and on top of that has to deal with a guy who has no fucking clue (bedside strip recalled). It's understandable, it's human behavior, and I think regardless of whether Marten was "in the right" or not, he will regret this for the rest of his life. Unless, of course, he changes his mind.
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I KNOW RIGHT, but Dr. ROFLPWN pointed out how thankless their job normally is so I'm blaming peer pressure.
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