Topic: Strategy game discussion (Read 15508 times)

Gregorio · « **on:** 31 Mar 2012, 23:17 »

I'm one of those people who likes the idea of strategy games, but I tend to be insanely picky about them. I'm not into Warcraft-style "gatherresourcesnowgetabunchoftroopshurryup" games or the Japanese "rock-paper-scissors" turn-based strategy games. That doesn't mean I don't have games I enjoy. I love the Brothers in Arms series' sense of hectic maneuvering and proper usage of squads, and R.U.S.E.'s emphasis on territory grabs/flanking/terrain/maneuvering. I'm currently plowing through Valkyria Chronicles and enjoying myself greatly. I also dug Homeworld 1&2 back in the day, and plan on picking up Company of Heroes when my new computer finally gets here. I was just wondering if you all knew any PS3/360/PC strategy games that I may enjoy.

P.S., I'm sorry if I insulted anyone's tastes. I'll pick on a game if I don't like it, but I won't dismiss someone's opinions if they just have a different taste.

EDIT: Changed topic title for just strategy game discussion since some folks seem to be diggin' it.

ackblom12 · « **Reply #1 on:** 31 Mar 2012, 23:25 »

It seems like this may not be exactly what you're looking for, but if you liked Homeworld, you might want to look into Sins of a Solar Empire. It's a really great mixture of 4x and RTS with massive fucking space navies and multiple star systems on a map. It doesn't have a single player campaign really, but it's really fucing fantastic and they are coming out with a sequel in the next few months.

TheFuriousWombat · « **Reply #2 on:** 01 Apr 2012, 00:47 »

Although the campaign map might be too heavily turn-based for you, I would check out the Total War series, in particular Rome, Medieval 2, and/or Shogun 2. If you like maneuvering guys around the battlefield and enjoy using real tactics to win battles, it doesn't get much better than those games. Except instead of a squad, you have an army of hundreds or even thousands of soldiers at your command. Massive, incredibly intense battles complete with flaming arrows (and pigs), elephant herds, and massive cavalry charges ensure. One of my favorite tactics involves the false rout: send in a small number of troops to confront the enemy force. Once your guys take a beating, have them charge in the opposite direction. With any luck, the enemy force will break ranks and follow, drunk on the hopes of victory. Little do they know that you're leading them between two hills where a whole mess of archers will shoot them to pieces and then a bunch of heavy cavalry will ride down the survivors! Man do I love those games. And if the campaign mode with its fairly complex geo-socio-political manuevering and management isn't your thing, you can always just play randomized and/or customized battles to your hearts content.

snalin · « **Reply #3 on:** 01 Apr 2012, 13:06 »

The old X-COMs are pretty cheaply available on steam. They're pretty damn great too!

Mister D Nomms · « **Reply #4 on:** 01 Apr 2012, 15:37 »

I was really excited when I read the title, because I thought this thread would be about board games. Do you like strategy board games?

TheFuriousWombat · « **Reply #5 on:** 01 Apr 2012, 17:17 »

It's turn-based but Fallout Tactics rules. Ditto the Jagged Alliance series (especially JA2), actually. Those are both challenging, gritty, tactical squad-based strategy games with RPG-style elements set in great worlds with lots of thing to blow up and blast into a bloody mess. They're also really old and thus can be found for really cheap. I think they're both on GOG for $6 each.

Gregorio · « **Reply #6 on:** 01 Apr 2012, 20:48 »

I don't dislike turn-based at all, I'm just not into the rock-paper-scissors approach to it (as in stuff like the Advance Wars/Fire Emblem sense) .

The Total War games have been on my wishlist for years. I'll finally have a computer capable of playing them on the 10th. I've also played Jagged Alliance and Fallout Tactics in the past and enjoyed them. X-Com is one of the classics I've yet to try.

TheFuriousWombat · « **Reply #7 on:** 02 Apr 2012, 00:32 »

Re: The Total War series, I would skip the Empire and Napoleon installments. They're fine but have their fair share of issues that hinder total immersion. Shogun 2 is probably the most elegant and refined of all of them. I also found it a little limiting. Somehow taking over all of Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa in Medieval 2 feels way more badass than taking over Japan. Although if super fancy graphics are important to you, Shogun 2 is definitely the top of the heap in that regard. It's a gorgeous game, whereas Medieval 2 is definitely not (by today's standards anyway. I still think it looks pretty good though). A lot of people say Rome is the best. It's really good but I think those people are talking more about the leap Rome made from Medieval 1. In comparative terms, it's the most significant step forward for the series. But I don't think it's the best overall (unless you're a way bigger fan of Roman history than Medieval European history. I've found that makes a big difference in these games).

I would also check out Crusader Kings II. I haven't had a chance to try it yet but apparently it's similar to the Total War series but with more of an emphasis on unique characters. It's gotten lots of good reviews.

Gregorio · « **Reply #8 on:** 02 Apr 2012, 12:16 »

I think unifying Japan is interesting mostly because of how it was a city-state system (blend of Medieval/Renaissance Europe), and so many people tried and failed to unify it, but that's kind of here nor there.

I've heard the Warhammer: Dawn of War games also do interesting new things with the old RTS formula.

I also picked up the Pacific DLC for R.U.S.E., but have yet to try it out. If nobody's played it, R.U.S.E. works like a basic RTS, but with a better emphasis on securing roads/supply lines, and allows for a wide range of tactics (in the SP campaign at least). I've played through the game several times, trying out different tactics each time. I've done tricky stuff like setting up fake offensives to draw out enemies, then using paratroopers to capture their base when it's unattended, or just blitzkrieging through by using planes and artillery to clear way for armored pushes. It's just a really fun game, and it was sad it didn't get the attention that I believed it deserved.

Sorflakne · « **Reply #9 on:** 02 Apr 2012, 19:28 »

Might want to look into Hearts of Iron...play as any nation on Earth you want during WWII, and best part, you don't exactly have to follow the war as it actually happened barring a few specific scripted events, if the countries that do them are still in play (game starts in the 1930's and can potentially end sometime in the 1960's). Conquer the world as Egypt, or maybe Peru, or maybe Australia (wtf mate?)...or you can cheese it and play as America, I guess.

Mister D Nomms · « **Reply #10 on:** 02 Apr 2012, 19:52 »

Everybody put on a nice face and clean the place up. I'm bringing my friend over later to see this and I don't want it dirty. I'll bring carrots.

Gregorio · « **Reply #11 on:** 02 Apr 2012, 20:37 »

Quote from: Sorflakne on 02 Apr 2012, 19:28

Might want to look into Hearts of Iron...play as any nation on Earth you want during WWII, and best part, you don't exactly have to follow the war as it actually happened barring a few specific scripted events, if the countries that do them are still in play (game starts in the 1930's and can potentially end sometime in the 1960's). Conquer the world as Egypt, or maybe Peru, or maybe Australia (wtf mate?)...or you can cheese it and play as America, I guess.

I like the fact that you cheese it not by glitching or exploiting, but by choosing America, the ultimate cheat code.

Torlek · « **Reply #12 on:** 02 Apr 2012, 22:37 »

Personally I always found the cheese option in the full campaign to be playing Germany....at least until you got lost deep in the Soviet Union. Damn commies would never agree to an armistice and make me chase them all the way to Vladivostok.

Gregorio · « **Reply #13 on:** 03 Apr 2012, 00:08 »

Looking it up, the series actually looks pretty sweet.

schimmy · « **Reply #14 on:** 03 Apr 2012, 03:34 »

You can cheese it pretty easily playing Russia, too. If you just spend your entire time building tanks, scripted events can give you a decent industry, then you just sweep in a crush the Germany between the time they take France and the time the Allies launch their counter-offensive.

Oh man, I really can't recommend HoI 2 enough. I've not played HoI 3 yet, but I've not heard anything good about it - the developers have a knack for releasing broken games, then fixing them with expansion packs.

If HoI appeals, I highly recommend checking out the other games made by Paradox. They're probably my favourite developers at the moment.

TheFuriousWombat · « **Reply #15 on:** 03 Apr 2012, 10:39 »

While I definitely agree (still jonesing to play Crusader Kings II), I think it's worth pointing out to the uninitiated out there Paradox games generally come with a fairly steep learning curve. If you just want to dive right in and blow stuff up - and that would be very understandable - HoI is not the way to go. If you're cool with devoting several hours to figuring out how the game works then it's an awesome choice.

schimmy · « **Reply #16 on:** 03 Apr 2012, 10:55 »

Oh yeah I forgot about that. "Fairly steep" is putting it extremely lightly. It takes me hours, if not days, to even start to get to grips with how to play each game.

ackblom12 · « **Reply #17 on:** 03 Apr 2012, 11:15 »

Yeah, HoI is a very very good series, but understand that it's only really outpaced by Dwarf Fortress and Aurora in the learning curve department.

Gnomes2169 · « **Reply #18 on:** 04 Apr 2012, 10:12 »

Have you ever tried out TBS games? There's a series called Heroes of Might and Magic that goes back a few decades that makes this platform very interesting and involving, to say the least. Everything before 5 was made by a different company that went out of business, and then Ubisoft took over and I must say that they have done rather admirably with their two installments.

HoMM is sort of an epic TBS, you have champions and heroes running around leading ever-growing armies into battle with a multitude of other factions. You conqueror and fortify towns, hire minions and guide hero growth as they lead their armies by investing in skills that either improve their creature's effectiveness, or improve the hero himself. One of the best things about this game is that there is no right or wrong strategy (well, besides losing), you can constantly adapt and create new ways to defeat foes and there are always new strategies to unlock. The game is highly re-playable and highly enjoyable. So yeah... If you like/ can stand TBS games, I recommend it.

Gregorio · « **Reply #19 on:** 05 Apr 2012, 14:20 »

So my computer came yesterday, and I bought Company of Heroes, and it's really awesome. One problem I have with RTS games is that they frequently feel like just a bunch of little figurines running into each other, but zooming in on encounters just shows off my combat decisions and really draws me in. I was a bit worried about the Carentan counterattack mission where I was able to make one mass of random troops and rip enemies apart, but that strategy made me lose within 5 minutes in the next mission. I'm not a fan of the off-screen attack perks like artillery strikes, but it's hard to complain when the rest of the game is so fun.

I didn't realize that Hearts of Iron was made by the same company that did Europa Universalis (a series I enjoyed quite a bit). I'm really interested in world history from 1930-1950 as well as WWII, so it's been bumped up to a definite buy for me.

UPDATE- GAMES I'VE TRIED:

Company of Heroes is a lot of fun, but has the most fucked-up difficulty curve I've ever seen in a game. It starts out pretty easy until you get to the Red Ball Express mission where it took me over an hour of base-building, scouting, fortifying, capturing, defending, and tons of other crap, and segues into a bunch of straight-forward missions with reasonable difficulty.

Hearts of Iron 2 is going to be an ongoing thing for me. I boned up on the tutorial and started doing some stuff, but I've found that I can only handle the game in short bursts, like if I need to kill half an hour or so. Fun, but it loses my interest during extended plays.

Valkyria Chronicles is fun. Some of my enthusiasm wore off when I realized that I'll pretty much die on the first mission, then memorize all of the scene triggers and plow through it the second time.

Tried out the demos for Empires: Total War and Men of War and was put off by both. The former felt kind of wonky and stiff (though the naval battle was fun), while the latter was clunky and cumbersome to navigate. I borrowed my friend's copy of Rome: Total War and plan on installing it tonight.

Akima · « **Reply #20 on:** 19 Apr 2012, 20:17 »

Quote from: Mister D Nomms on 01 Apr 2012, 15:37

I was really excited when I read the title, because I thought this thread would be about board games. Do you like strategy board games?

I enjoy weiqi, though I only play socially.

TheNameWithNoNumbers · « **Reply #21 on:** 30 Apr 2012, 22:54 »

Quote from: TheFuriousWombat on 01 Apr 2012, 00:47

Although the campaign map might be too heavily turn-based for you, I would check out the Total War series, in particular Rome, Medieval 2, and/or Shogun 2. If you like maneuvering guys around the battlefield and enjoy using real tactics to win battles, it doesn't get much better than those games. Except instead of a squad, you have an army of hundreds or even thousands of soldiers at your command. Massive, incredibly intense battles complete with flaming arrows (and pigs), elephant herds, and massive cavalry charges ensure. One of my favorite tactics involves the false rout: send in a small number of troops to confront the enemy force. Once your guys take a beating, have them charge in the opposite direction. With any luck, the enemy force will break ranks and follow, drunk on the hopes of victory. Little do they know that you're leading them between two hills where a whole mess of archers will shoot them to pieces and then a bunch of heavy cavalry will ride down the survivors! Man do I love those games. And if the campaign mode with its fairly complex geo-socio-political manuevering and management isn't your thing, you can always just play randomized and/or customized battles to your hearts content.

YES.
I mean, Empire Total War's not for everyone, especially with the whole campaign system for me, technologies and shit.
Don't get me wrong, still good for me, just not the same...
As Rome, and Medieval II.

I remember playing the first two and how they were pretty goddamn good for their time (FUCKING SWISS PIKEMEN) and Rome changed it with the whole move system.

Oh. Also,
there's nothing like beating your enemy after an almost impossible fight.

PILGRIMS AGAINST DEM MAMLUKS.
FUCK YEAH!

snalin · « **Reply #22 on:** 01 May 2012, 00:47 »

Just beat my second campaing in Rome after this thread started - one short Sciipi, and one saxon in barbarian invasion. Makes me want to fire up medieval 2 again. I remember that it was wicked fun to torch witches all over Europe, and throw crusade after crusade towards the middle east, just to never reach Jersualem and be stuck pillaging in the mountains east of Constantinople. And to slaugther prisoners of war. Really, they went out of their way to make everything horrible that happened in European history really fun.

EDIT: rome+medieval2+imperial+napoleon is 50 Euros on steam. BAG OF FUN!

Gregorio · « **Reply #23 on:** 04 May 2012, 20:51 »

Right. I feel like a total Pleb, but I just can't get into the management aspect of Total War games. I really dig the actual combat, though. Currently taking a break from the genre as I've had my fill. Just got back into a shooter swing after picking up Serious Sam 3 in a Steam sale.

LTK · « **Reply #24 on:** 05 May 2012, 03:51 »

I'm not usually one to take an interest in strategy games - any RTS is likely to make me ragequit at the slighest sign of a counteroffense and anything turn-based fails to hold my attention for long - but I have to say I quite like what I see in this video of Master of the Arcane. It's a turn-based strategy game in which you're a wizard, Harry, and you go around summoning beasts, casting spells and making an empire. I might pick up the demo soon, but what's the impression you lot have?

Gregorio, if you liked Serious Sam 3 you absolutely have to get Painkiller from GOG for a tenner. It's the best shooter of demons since the glory days of id software ended.

Gregorio · « **Reply #25 on:** 05 May 2012, 18:48 »

Quote from: LTK on 05 May 2012, 03:51

I'm not usually one to take an interest in strategy games - any RTS is likely to make me ragequit at the slighest sign of a counteroffense and anything turn-based fails to hold my attention for long - but I have to say I quite like what I see in this video of Master of the Arcane. It's a turn-based strategy game in which you're a wizard, Harry, and you go around summoning beasts, casting spells and making an empire. I might pick up the demo soon, but what's the impression you lot have?

Gregorio, if you liked Serious Sam 3 you absolutely have to get Painkiller from GOG for a tenner. It's the best shooter of demons since the glory days of id software ended.

Painkiller has been my jam for like seven years, now, and despite the hate it got, I liked Bulletstorm as well. I'm waiting for People Can Fly's next.

I also heard recently that they made a pseudo-sequel to Panzer General 2. I'll have to check that out.

LTK · « **Reply #26 on:** 06 May 2012, 14:54 »

So, are you into the multiplayer as well? I've never bothered with competitive play in most games, but I still enjoy the single-player every time I replay it - which is usually every time a sequel/expansion/expandalone/whathaveyou comes out. I skipped Bulletstorm (GFWL) but there's another retro shooter (do we call it retro?) that's like Painkiller with robots, only not as good, but still a fun romp. One thing they both do well is the severing of limbs and mechanical parts respectively; Hard Reset's robots come apart very gratifyingly.

I also played the demo of Warlock to its limit, and I was surprisingly compelled. Monsters and magic make it much more exciting than plain old civ, so I went ahead and pre-ordered it on Amazon. Good thing I also have an address in the US, wink wink, or I wouldn't be able to use their download service!

ackblom12 · « **Reply #27 on:** 06 May 2012, 17:01 »

Downloading the demo for Warlock now. I actually kind of feel like the magic system in Warlock might fix some of the problems Civ V has due to the One Unit rule, specially if it ends up being anything like the Diciples/Masters of Magic style magic system. Also, Majesty is a pretty delightful comedic fantasy world so that's a bonus.

Edit: Yeah, this game is a ton of fun.

LTK · « **Reply #28 on:** 08 May 2012, 04:24 »

Six hours to release. Welp, time to start up the demo again!

Oh, cool, I defeated the rat mage this time in 46 turns. He put up a hell of a fight with those goblin spearmen, but at least he wasn't besieging me with trolls like last time.

ackblom12 · « **Reply #29 on:** 09 May 2012, 23:52 »

Alright, the game manual is bit useless at this time, but they are working on a more extensive guide for it, including a video tutorial.

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?606556-Warlock-Master-of-the-Arcane-Beginners-guide-Released!

IrrationalPie · « **Reply #30 on:** 29 May 2012, 17:45 »

Is it any good?

LTK · « **Reply #31 on:** 31 May 2012, 09:18 »

It's extremely competent and a ton of fun, but lacks the features that would truly give it depth. Like: multiplayer, diplomacy worth a damn, and more customisability in skirmishes, all of which is (hopefully) in the pipeline. Even so, it takes longer than expected to get boring. Just about up until now, in fact.

I'm pretty sure I just figured out what determines when the Lightning Bolt causes a combo. By now I'm the last person left on the wiki who's trying to figure it out. I wonder if multiplayer is too far away for this knowledge to give me an advantage.

schimmy · « **Reply #32 on:** 05 Jun 2012, 06:55 »

It's a neat game. Like LTK says, it's very competent, but lacks depth. The only problem I really have with it is that the diplomacy is pretty much completely lacking. I can't really tell the difference between an alliance and just being neutral, except that an alliance means the AI isn't likely to spontaneously declare war on you. Beyond that, there's not much use for diplomacy, except if you've not balanced your economy well, and have far too much of one resource, and far too little of another.

Still, I've sunk a fair few hours into it so far, and enjoyed all of them. It's just not really got that spark that made me get addicted to the Civ games. There just doesn't seem like there's a lot of variation in how you can play them game. You just need to make huge land grabs, and rush to be able to produce the most powerful units. Tactics are fairly negligible, so far as I can tell - the winner of the game is the one that can out-produce everyone else.

Gregorio · « **Reply #33 on:** 17 Jul 2012, 10:50 »

I snagged up the Men of War pack on a whim today, and I have to say that it's exactly what I've been wanting in an RTS forever. No base-building at all, just using the correct units to cover and maneuver, laying down defenses, attacking/counterattacking, etc. It's just so perfect for what I've been wanting.

Blyss · « **Reply #34 on:** 29 Aug 2012, 13:36 »

I'm going to date myself here - but my favorite strategy titles have been, X-com (can't recommend it enough, and can't wait for the reboot), Master of Orion 1 (2 was more than a little imbalanced), and Panzer General. All of these gave me hours and hours of fun and strategy filled nights.

Gregorio · « **Reply #35 on:** 29 Aug 2012, 21:51 »

PG has been my jam since like '95. My grandpa had it on his computer and I'd sit there with him. One of us playing it while the other helped. I was like seven years old and playing the game with my grandpa, while he was telling me all about fighting in WW2 with the 82nd. He died just last June.

I almost completely forgot about that.

snalin · « **Reply #36 on:** 30 Aug 2012, 00:15 »

Quote from: Blyss on 29 Aug 2012, 13:36

I'm going to date myself here - but my favorite strategy titles have been, X-com (can't recommend it enough, and can't wait for the reboot)

You'd probably also be interested in xenonauts. It's going into beta at the release date of the Firaxis game, and it's supposed to be more "true to form" (up to you if that's a good thing), in addition to some cool improvements.

Stratergy game people - what's the difference between napoleon and empire:total war? I've bought each game now, and just got through empire (did you know that by 1798, the Swedish empire controlled the entire world?). I'm wondering if I should do Napoleon first, or go straight for Shogun 2, which I've heard is fantastic.

Blyss · « **Reply #37 on:** 30 Aug 2012, 13:58 »

Xenonauts will definitely be on my radar now. Thanks for the link.

Pilchard123 · « **Reply #38 on:** 02 Sep 2012, 13:20 »

I've been playing Battle for Wesnoth recently. Either I suck at strategy games or it's harder than the ones I usually play. It took me half a dozen restarts to get through the campaign specifically said to be for beginners (The South Guard) on the easiest difficulty setting.

VonKleist · « **Reply #39 on:** 03 Sep 2012, 02:03 »

I´m definitely checking out Xenonauts because I loved X-COm.

Mmmmh, X-Com

.. just thinking of the graphics all blue and green and pixelated makes me feel fuzzy and all

Abyssalin · « **Reply #40 on:** 04 Sep 2012, 00:36 »

I'm a general fan of all Strategy Games, and yet i find myself drawn back to the Command and Conquer series constantly, I dunno what it is, i just like the idea that i alone am in charge of everything i build, of course it then removes that one favourite excuse that everyone uses "It was the computer's fault this happened!" Wheras in C&C it's more of a "I fucked up and didn't pay attention!"

That said i fully understand that this kinda game isn't for everyone, you should maybe consider it, especially considering how cheap the greats are (Red Alert 2), I got the entire first decade from my local game shop for £7.99 a couple of days ago, Games are old yet awesome.

ackblom12 · « **Reply #41 on:** 04 Sep 2012, 00:43 »

Speaking of C&C (my absolute favorite RTS series)...

They are releasing Command & Conquer: The Ultimate Collection. 17 games with Win 7 compatibility. Insane!

Abyssalin · « **Reply #42 on:** 04 Sep 2012, 00:51 »

Quote from: ackblom12 on 04 Sep 2012, 00:43

Speaking of C&C (my absolute favorite RTS series)...

They are releasing Command & Conquer: The Ultimate Collection. 17 games with Win 7 compatibility. Insane!

... I just started "squeeing" like a bloody school girl.. I am genuinely frightened of myself now.

Blyss · « **Reply #43 on:** 05 Sep 2012, 10:42 »

C&C Ultimate is probably on my christmas list now. That's a whole lot of awesomeness in one package.

Pilchard123 · « **Reply #44 on:** 22 Sep 2012, 08:58 »

Just started playing Warzone 2100. It's not bad, although the interface could do with a little tweaking.

http://wz2100.net/

ackblom12 · « **Reply #45 on:** 02 Oct 2012, 16:46 »

Command & Conquer: The Ultimate Collection has been released!

satsugaikaze · « **Reply #46 on:** 03 Oct 2012, 20:45 »

I have to admit that I totally raeg'd when they turned Command & Conquer: Generals 2 into a generic f2p C&C multiplayer game.

I was super hyped and nostalgic.

ackblom12 · « **Reply #47 on:** 04 Oct 2012, 16:53 »

By the way, I got a free copy of Civilization V to gift on Steam, anyone want it?

snalin · « **Reply #48 on:** 04 Oct 2012, 17:50 »

You got it with the XCOM preorder? It's such a sweet deal.

ackblom12 · « **Reply #49 on:** 04 Oct 2012, 17:55 »

Yuuuup.

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Author Topic: Strategy game discussion (Read 15508 times)

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