Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
WCDT: 2593-2597 (09-13 December 2013) Weekly Comics Discussion Thread
blacksinow:
--- Quote from: judemorrigan on 12 Dec 2013, 10:14 ---Oh, believe you me. I'm well aware of how not-random those questions are. The only reason I've never been diagnosed with social anxiety disorder is that I've never sought a diagnosis out. And fair enough, I suppose. But I still don't think it's a reason to not call her out on bad behavior.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting anyone tell her she's a bad person who's bad. But the fundamental message behind blacksisnow's suggetion is sound, even if it could be phrased rather more gently. (ie, something rather more along the lines of, "Marigold. We're your friends. We care about you. But you're acting terribly. You're going to seriously damage your relationships if you keep it up." And then offer what help one can, but not by enabling the bad behavior.)
--- End quote ---
Exactly! You MUST hold people in Marigold's position accountable BEFORE you can help them. By holding them accountable, you put them in a position that allows them to identify how terrible they have behaved. I am by no means saying we should crucify her, but put her in a position that allows her to be treated. We've seen the result of Momo attempting to educate her about dating, it hasn't worked out all that well. I think that she CAN be helped, but not babied or enabled. Is it wierd that I think Hannelore is more normal then Marigold?
Fluffy Dragon:
For those wondering why everyone else seem to be so upset with Marigold, ponder this:
She is basically saying that as long as Momo has that body, she has a debt to Marigold.
The way Marigold phrases it, it's not even a monetary issue... it's not "you still haven't paid me back for that body." it's "If it weren't for me, you would still be small." (I leave you to think of all the implications of that "small".)
now add how big of a deal becoming human-sized was for Momo, and how Momo didn't have to pay Marigold back... It was a gift.
and now Marigold has shown herself capable of going back on that, for a relatively minor thing.
Momo even decided on her own to work to pay Marigold back... this one insensitive act from Marigold walks all over that with combat boots.
so now ask yourself, could you trust a friend who did that to you?
Momo looks really hurt in panel #4.
Is it cold in here?:
We knew about the recently passed AI ERA from on screen conversation and Momo has talked about AI rights more than once. Jeph has hinted that he might have shown more of it if it were funny.
Even so, the QC society is still one in which a character can get away with routine physical abuse of an AnthroPC. The Pugnacious Peach would be in Pugnacious Peach Prison if she were regularly denting the head of a human roommate. Clinton blatantly objectified Momo even though he should have known better. There's been no mention of AIs in government and only one (Station) in a professional job.
Even Marten has some prejudice, being unwilling to drink the coffee at LanPark.
Anyone who detests how Marigold acts can take comfort in knowing that the strip is all about people healing and improving. We can look forward to seeing her grow.
Strip 2001, Momo offers to pay back Marigold for the chassis, and there's a later strip where Marigold confronts her for spending all her paycheck instead.
toffee-skye:
--- Quote from: Fluffy Dragon on 12 Dec 2013, 13:55 ---For those wondering why everyone else seem to be so upset with Marigold, ponder this:
She is basically saying that as long as Momo has that body, she has a debt to Marigold.
The way Marigold phrases it, it's not even a monetary issue... it's not "you still haven't paid me back for that body." it's "If it weren't for me, you would still be small." (I leave you to think of all the implications of that "small".)
now add how big of a deal becoming human-sized was for Momo... and it was phrased as a gift, and how Momo didn't have to pay Marigold back...
and now Marigold has shown herself capable of going back on that, for a relatively minor thing.
so now ask yourself, could you trust a friend who did that to you?
Momo looks really hurt in panel #4.
--- End quote ---
i found this strip upsetting and i completely agree with Momo (and Fluffy Dragon has put it much better than i ever could!).
people are debating ownership, and property, and it's true, Momo's chassis was bought for her by Marigold, was a gift, and is on her bank statement. it was something she bought to house her AI companion.
but Momo's chassis is so much more than that. it's hiking trips, it's working in a library, it's making friends and going to coffee shops, it's total independence and agency. were Marigold thinking rationally, she would not have stripped all of that meaning from the new chassis and made it into an object.
i think Momo is right in wanting to stay at Hannelore's. i wouldn't want to be around someone who reduced something that grants me my agency to just an object for the sake of blackmailing me. at that point, personally, i would cut all ties and never come back.
Warning - while you were typing 2 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your opinion on agency and AI.
Is it cold in here?:
I think Momo should hash it out with Marigold but should wait until Marigold has a chance to cool down and reconsider.
2097 is where Momo isn't paying back the chassis loan.
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