Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
WCDT 2887-2891 (2-6 February 2015)
Isyrion:
--- Quote from: DillyDolly on 06 Feb 2015, 09:46 ---
--- Quote from: Emperor Norton on 06 Feb 2015, 09:24 ---
So, I'm a bisexual man. Yes, bisexuals do not face the same amount of discrimination, but we do face it. But I'm also married to a woman and have kids. I "pass" as a straight man, and most people don't even know I'm bi. I'm not secretive about it, but I don't generally talk about it unless something brings it up.
--- End quote ---
Actually, the big difference with us and others in the LGBTQ community is we can blend in where ever we want, and it's usually easier to keep our orientation under the radar. But when we are out with people about being bi, we face as much or even more discrimination. You get people (gay and straight) who mistakenly assume we are in the closet, seeking attention, "confused" about our sexuality and/or the gay people who feel we are betraying the LGBTG community. Then there's the nutty people who believe that all bis are poly or want "one of each." This may be true for some people who are bi, but many of us. Even Dan Savage didn't *get* that being bi is a real thing for a long time—and he has admitted this. And *don't* get me started on platonic friends we come out to. Some of them are really cool, but a few that I've told (mostly gay/bi women, but some bi/straight dudes, too) seem to think it's an invitation to try to hook up with me.
So, I'm actually really discreet who I tell about my orientation in RL. I let people know on a need-to-know basis (close friends, family members, etc...).
--- End quote ---
I hear you on that, as a bisexual man. I VERY careful about who I come out to and so far only a small handful really know about my orientation (4 people to be exact). I can't even come out to my own family due to my father hating (and yes I mean real hate as in kill them for being gay or bi) anyone gay or bi (or anything else other than what he considers normal).
Anyways lets get on a more cheerful topic, I bet the reactions of the QC cast to Marten and Claire getting it on are gonna be rather Epic. Whats the bet on Tai literally squeeing so hard she passes out?
SugarSparkle:
--- Quote from: Technetium on 06 Feb 2015, 08:08 ---I kind of have an issue with how the whole story with Claire has gone. What makes the Martin-Claire relationship edgy/gutsy/controversial/interesting/etc is that trans people face a lot of problems that they shouldn't have to. At least in real life they do. I guess what bothers me is that Claire's existence in this comic, so far, is like a fairy-tale reality for trans people. Everything seems to be going the way that most trans people would want but few actually see (everyone she wants to be friends with accepts her, her family accepts her, the guy she pursues accepts her). Is this fair to the trans community? I am not trans or any other part of the LGBTQ spectrum, so I'm approaching this completely from the outside, but if I were to instead consider a different group that I belong to that is discriminated against (although I won't pretend it's anywhere near to the degree what trans people face), I would have a problem with a story about another character identified as being in that group and where the story basically wiped away all the struggles that members of that group face. By creating a story (again, I'd refer to it as almost being a fairy-tale) where a trans character never is shown having to actually deal with the kinds of injustices that real trans characters face, doesn't that cheapen those struggles?
I guess in the bigger picture of the comic, it seems like Jeph mainly creates characters that he likes and would want to be friends with. Homophobia, transphobia, racism... these things are essentially absent from the world of QC simply by the fact that they don't appear in any of the comic strips. Has there ever even been a single background character that didn't appear to be accepting of other ethnic groups or gender types? I can understand why he would want to create characters that he himself genuinely likes, but it kind of detracts from the whole idea that Claire or this relationship is particularly special, and makes her brother's reaction about her telling Martin about her gender type kind of silly. Why would her brother explode with that kind of over-protection if the characters live in a world where everyone is accepting?
That said, I like this comic and a happy ending like this can be nice in a kind of sugary way, I just wish sometimes the comic would approach these issues in a more challenging way.
--- End quote ---
But why should trans-issues be highlighted in everything? Not all trans-people have those issues. And I think it doesn't help those that choose to transition to see every single problem they may potentially face be focused on in every medium, as if that's how it will go. That's why many people are scared to do anything about their gender issues. I would love to see movies, shows, or read books or comics that have trans-characters that are 'normal' and blend in and aren't focused on because they're trans. This is what most trans-people want; to just transition and blend in. Most of us don't want to stick out. I also feel that expressing the need to see trans characters struggle and face problems merely perpetuates stereotypes. Not all of us have the issues you may think we do. I personally have had a smooth transition, my family has been accepting, all my friends have been accepting, in fact people from my past that I've contacted since have been supportive. I'm not only completely passable everywhere I go, but I'm also quite attractive (or so I've been told quite often). I know I got lucky in a lot of ways, but I think a lot of other trans-people have been in my situation. Many pass and blend in (or go 'stealth'), but you don't hear about that very much. Even in the trans-community, those in my position are often shunned or we're swept under the rug and not talked about. I like Claire and her story so far because it's more relatable to my life than most other trans-themed tales that I've heard or seen. I think it's completely fair that optimistic stories be told alongside the tragic or difficult stories. Smooth transitions aren't just fairytales, just as passability and acceptance aren't myths.
Aziraphale:
--- Quote from: Smallest on 06 Feb 2015, 01:06 ---
- A lot of people like more awkward undressing and find it sexy. The nervousness can be a bit of a rush, or the intimacy of knowing someone's letting you be there when they are nervous and that they trust you, or, if one's used to porn/movies/sexy sexy one night stands, the reminder that this person is really human and really there and not an airbrushed, unattainable thing can be sexy indeed too. I do cam modelling and sell some videos, usually custom, and my clients, especially regulars, love candidness, whether it's an awkward undress or giggling a bit or whatever.
So, the people saying it's unsexy/unsensual are, in my mind wrong on two counts, because it is not supposed to be sexy, and at the same time, many people would consider it sexy (do Marten and Claire? no idea, don't care as long as they're happy next comic).
--- End quote ---
Not sure if this is going to make sense, but here goes nothin'. For me, the part that I've bolded gets to what makes it sexy (to me). It can be hard to be that vulnerable with someone, no matter what your gender identity or sexual orientation or whatever. Maybe just speaking for myself here, but when you're in Marten's position -- someone isn't just offering consent, but putting themselves all the way out there, with all the trust and vulnerability that implies -- is a humbling experience. At that point, you've got a lot to live up to, because the implicit challenge of being on the receiving end of that kind of trust and openness (unless you're a colossal asshole) isn't just the acceptance of that person; it's meeting them from a similar place of trust, and putting as much of yourself into it as they are.
Like I said, not sure if that makes sense... just kinda how I've been looking at it.
Bodolza:
--- Quote from: BrusselSprouts on 05 Feb 2015, 22:04 ---Looks like Marten's tamper proof seal is about to be broken
--- End quote ---
Dude. <mod snip>
Dude. - Mod.</mod>
BrusselSprouts:
I totally agree SuperSparkle. Implying that every trans character needs to have their transition be the focus, or even directly mentioned at all. Its the same with Gay characters. You don't need to focus on their struggles with their sexuality, they can just be characters who happen to be gay. Claire is it implied to have had some problems in the past, at least enough for Clinton to be protective of her. And there's elements of her character that could be traced to her being trans (being a bit of a later bloomer, having to work up the courage to have her ears pierced etc) but that's not the focus. An LGBT character's job should be to be a character, not just to show people the struggles people in the community face. Not that there's anything wrong with those kinds of stories, they are stories that need to be told, but limiting LGBT characters to exclusively have that role is... limiting I guess.
Sorry for the long rambling post that may or may not make sense.
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