Comic Discussion > ALICE GROVE
Alice Grove MCDLT - December 2016
Samik:
--- Quote from: brasca on 04 Dec 2016, 04:44 ---I'm still curious about what control Pate has over Church. We've never seen him give an order so he may have some kind of telepathic control over Church. Consider what just happened when Alice went to kill Pate. Church grabbed her arm, but didn't crush it like he did Sedna's shoulder. Even if Pate would intricately explained every single detail of his plans to Church to prevent a misunderstanding this would still make improvising impossible when things don't go accordingly.
--- End quote ---
Assuming Church is under Pate's control, the simplest order set, expressed during or before the carriage ride, would be something like:
1.) Protect me.
2.) If possible, do not kill the other soldiers.
3.) Do not harm anyone else, unless you're attacked.
I suppose 2 and 3 could be reversed, but this gets you the behavior we've seen so far. Pate says to Alice, "You will do exactly as I say from now on, or I will allow Mr. Church to indulge himself further, at your personal expense." Church enjoys killing, but is restricted from doing so unless he's attacked or instructed. That's why you get the ear-to-ear grin when Ellie hits him with the pipe - he's literally thrilled that she did that, because now he's "under attack" and therefore permitted to indulge himself.
pwhodges:
He harmed Sedna without being attacked, though.
BenRG:
--- Quote from: pwhodges on 06 Dec 2016, 00:59 ---He harmed Sedna without being attacked, though.
--- End quote ---
That was a second-tier attempt to restrain her. She had ignored the clear warning when he put his hand on her shoulder (a first-tier attempt) and her continued violent behaviour released him to use... stronger measures to enforce the behaviour restrictions on her specified by his commander.
JimC:
--- Quote from: jheartney on 05 Dec 2016, 21:00 ---I had a completely opposite hypothesis about Church: what if he's not really a separate being? What if he's a telepathic projection of Pate's? That would explain the instantaneous motion, and the lack of any need for communication. it would also explain his being indestructible.
--- End quote ---
Not sure. Note that Alice recognised him *and* Sedna didn't.
I think at this stage we can think of him like a Pratchett Golem - Golem must work, Golem must have a master. [and Golem can harm a human if instructed by duly constituted authority]
brasca:
--- Quote from: Samik on 05 Dec 2016, 22:57 ---
--- Quote from: brasca on 04 Dec 2016, 04:44 ---I'm still curious about what control Pate has over Church. We've never seen him give an order so he may have some kind of telepathic control over Church. Consider what just happened when Alice went to kill Pate. Church grabbed her arm, but didn't crush it like he did Sedna's shoulder. Even if Pate would intricately explained every single detail of his plans to Church to prevent a misunderstanding this would still make improvising impossible when things don't go accordingly.
--- End quote ---
Assuming Church is under Pate's control, the simplest order set, expressed during or before the carriage ride, would be something like:
1.) Protect me.
2.) If possible, do not kill the other soldiers.
3.) Do not harm anyone else, unless you're attacked.
I suppose 2 and 3 could be reversed, but this gets you the behavior we've seen so far. Pate says to Alice, "You will do exactly as I say from now on, or I will allow Mr. Church to indulge himself further, at your personal expense." Church enjoys killing, but is restricted from doing so unless he's attacked or instructed. That's why you get the ear-to-ear grin when Ellie hits him with the pipe - he's literally thrilled that she did that, because now he's "under attack" and therefore permitted to indulge himself.
--- End quote ---
It seems to me that all the immortals tend to go berserker when the opportunity presents itself. Alice defeated Gavia quickly enough, but continued attacking her viciously until Ardent intervened. Sedna was ready to attack the space dwellers until Alice stopped her. And then there is the aforementioned Mr. Church showing any kind of emotion when under attack. It could be some kind of leftover programming that still influences Alice and Sedna, but controls Church.
There is still speculation as to whether Church can teleport and while the jury is still out on that I would say there is a limitation to his range. Pate threatens to break Gavia's arms since she's the only person present Alice cares about and isn't vital to his plans, however, she would still be valuable on the basis of where she's from. Pate could've threatened to send Church to Alice's town and kill one villager for every act of defiance. She cares for them and they are completely expendable to Pate, but if Church's teleportation is limited then this would not be a credible threat.
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