Comic Discussion > ALICE GROVE

Alice Grove MCDLT - THE END...?

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SmilingCat:
The meaningless thoughts of a psuedo-lurker:

I was left wanting more. And I hope we'll see more exploration of this particular universe in later stories.

The nightwalker bit had a sort of lovecraftian "things beyond our understanding doing things we can't comprehend", and in that context, I didn't feel bad about not having a payoff for that.

Still, left wanting more. Whether that's a good thing or bad thing is more a matter of personal preference. For me, it's a good thing.

Tova:
Obviously, you either liked the story overall or you didn't. It's kind of interesting to explain what you found satisfying or unsatisfying, but really, there's no need to bend over backwards to justify why you did or didn't like a story. It's not as though anyone can claim that you're mistaken about what is obviously a 100% subjective viewpoint. And it is interesting to read about what aspects of the story you did or didn't like.

Personally, I, like many others, did find the ending a little rushed. However, overall, I found the story reasonably enjoyable, and didn't find that the rushed ending soured the story for me. But for me, the enjoyment stemmed from watching the emotional arc of the characters, not so much in knowing concrete explanations of this, that, or the other. Hitchcock, for example, was famous for throwing red herrings into the story to bamboozle the viewer that never got explained. I am fine with all that. Again, whether you found there were too many loose ends is subjective.

I also agree with Welu's well expressed post above. The final page was nicely bittersweet.

There is something about fandom which occasionally I find perplexing or annoying, I admit, and this is something I've tried to approach before. One aspect of it is that while generally people will say "I enjoyed that," or "I disliked that, it's not my cup of tea." But it seems to be the fandom's bailiwick to say, "That was right," or, "That was wrong." This is what tends to provoke argument. But hey, if you felt that the comic was badly written, then as I say, that's fair enough. But unless you are a well regarded author yourself, forgive me if I don't take too seriously your ministrations on the right and wrong ways to tell a story.

If you're complaining about funding though Patreon a project you didn't like, I would have to point out that this is the very nature of Patreon - it's in a way speculative, in that you hold the artist in some regard, and you want to encourage their endeavours, but there is no guarantee that the fruit of the artist's work will be to your liking, and of course you are at liberty to cease funding at any time you choose.

The PDF was a nice gesture, and I personally will continue to fund.


--- Quote from: SmilingCat on 21 Jul 2017, 17:50 ---Still, left wanting more. Whether that's a good thing or bad thing is more a matter of personal preference. For me, it's a good thing.

--- End quote ---

Yes, it's better to leave your audience wanting more than to overstay your welcome. :)

retrosteve:

--- Quote from: Jeemy on 21 Jul 2017, 11:22 ---
--- Quote ---To suggest that he was obligated to, that he shouldn't have dropped the project when he felt like it, would be pure entitlement.
--- End quote ---

From Mr Jacque's Patreon, today:


--- Quote ---This Patreon funded the creation of my stand-alone sci-fi comic Alice Grove, and will fund more projects in the future. Contributors will get special access to all sorts of neat features like early comic updates, bonus comics not available anywhere else, Q&As, and other fun stuff.
--- End quote ---

People were most definitely paying for this comic. No, maybe he isn't "obligated" to provide them with a "proper" ending or to "resolve the plot threads" but if you are paying somebody to create, I don't think its unreasonable to expect things not to be abandoned mid-way. Its certainly not unreasonable to withdraw future patronage based on being told quite literally: Alice Grove is finished, and is as intended or I will drop projects whenever I feel like them.

That makes me feel that anything else produced by JJ will be to the same unfathomable yardstick. I am sure there is a list of people a mile long ready to continue paying the man and trying to support him but I am not one.

--- End quote ---

I think ultimately this is the measure of satisfaction. The number of people who remain with Jeph's Patreon or join it anew will be the review of how well Alice did. We can argue about it all day, and I think that's important to do, but the feelings of the readers will determine the continuing Patreon.

Jeph should by no means feel guilty about abandoning the story early. He did what he promised, to a level of quality that satisfied him. That's his part of the contract. Our part is to keep funding him for more, or not, as we each see fit.

Case:

--- Quote from: Jeemy on 21 Jul 2017, 02:18 ---Registered just to post my thoughts. I’ve lurked here for a long time as although I am interested to know what others think about AG, I always found the discussion a little too pseudo high-brow, I’ve never felt the point of this comic was to raise discussion about the exact physics of a situation, more the ethics.

I had to post my thoughts however as I am so surprised that a group of people who are accustomed to picking apart the holes in the viability of some of the writers’ conceits in terms of physics, quantum physics, logistics etc aren’t being more critical of this abrupt ending to AG.

--- End quote ---

--- Quote from: Jeemy on 21 Jul 2017, 11:57 ---
--- Quote ---Know what Patreon usually covers? Flight costs, printing costs, accommodation, shipping fees. Which would probably be considerably higher since Jeph moved to Canada a couple of years ago.
--- End quote ---
Keeping it brief as I have little more to say on the matter: Perhaps this seemingly patronising response is indicative of the fact that you think most people would not realize this.

I think most people would understand exactly this. I especially understand the costs involved for multiple reasons, I have decades of first-hand experience in many of the fields including printing, publishing, music recording and self-employment.

--- End quote ---

--- Quote from: Jeemy on 21 Jul 2017, 11:57 ---And you're right, I don't want to fund his Patreon anymore as I feel that this abrupt end to AG has not just been slightly odd, its been completely cut-and-run.

--- End quote ---

Sooooh ... basically you registered to tell us that AG sucks and that our discussion of AG sucks - mostly because we're having some nerdy fun with ze Deus-ex-entanglementz rather than appreciating the frustration you just had to communicate to us. That about the size of it?

Uhmmmmh, so ... you stayin' for lunch?

Jeemy:
To Case (don't know how to quote people).

No, I didn't think AG sucked. The first 80% or so was great. It had loads of potential - the frustration is due to the fact I really feel its been abandoned, not finished as always intended, like we are being told.

I didn't think your discussion of AG sucked; I lurked here because I was always interested to see what others thought, but mainly you guys' thoughts were on the physics of the world and events, whereas I maybe took more of the history of the planet, characters and events as the interesting part of AG. So I lurked but never chimed in as I have nothing to say on the physics side. Sorry to have caused offence.

I don't know why you picked the 2nd or 3rd quotes as they don't seem to relate to anything you are saying to me.

I just found it interesting, and maybe did not phrase it right, that while for a random example, a hearty discussion was held on exactly how the super-soliders could propel themselves in a vacuum. Yet when things like Sedna suddenly being able to tear her arm off and kill Church, where he'd previously been too fast and strong, people suddenly started to justify why this, and many other things within the end, could/should fit within the world view, where I feel they've been shoehorned in to get rid of AG quickly and with little reverence.

Yes, I really felt I DID have to communicate the frustration with AG to you guys, whether you care for my opinion or not. I've been here since the beginning same as you, and who else am I gonna tell? I was very let down by it and as I say, I'm getting sick of the way a lot of content is abandoned mid-production when promises of whatever kind have been made and money has changed hands.

And no I likely won't stick around which I am sure doesn't bother you one way or the other. What would I stick around for? AG is finished, QC is a bit of fluff really, all good fun, but not a huge amount to discuss or think about. I really thought AG was going to create a good story, and instead its been abandoned, not finished. So I certainly won't be paying for anything else from this author again. And this is my issue with the Patreon system and the abandonment of AG; yes artists have the right to stop due to any kind of pressure, and yes you invest on the basis of potential not firm product, but we are told AG is finished and as it should be, and that doesn't bear out the quality and potential of the first 2 or so years, compared what we've been served over the last 2 weeks....

Thats all I really had to say. Sorry for any offence caused to anybody.

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