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5 (9.6%)

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5 (9.6%)

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7 (13.5%)

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11 (21.2%)

Total Members Voted: 28

Voting closed: 17 May 2020, 18:54

[Thrudd]

.....
I agree that lately not a lot has been happening in QC, but I feel like a lot has been part of setting up new storylines. JJ has a history of planning narratives pretty well, so I am pretty hopeful. Most of the setup seems to have been around Brun, and now around Marten/Claire and possibly around Tai.
.....

I'll just pipe in with my anxiety in that his creative energy is going into this new project and QC is coasting on neutral.
Oh there is still direction and as you pointed out an eventual series of destinations have been mapped out but the drive just doesn't seem to be there at the moment.

[Is it cold in here?]

I can see Dora talking about a car accident, forgetting about Faye's history for a moment. But I would expect Faye to have a moment of thinking "WTF did you just say?" before realizing she meant nothing by it. It kinda seems Jeph forgot about Faye's past.

Welcome, new person!

I wondered about that too.

[FonnLath]

As for your assessment on Claire, I can't say I see that the same way. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this only the second time CLaire has gotten high, and only for a very specific reason this time (i.e. graduating)? To me that hardly qualifies as trying to redefine her as a stoner, at least at this point. Of course it's possible that JJ takes it into that direction as Claire could be susceptible to weed addiction due to some anxieties she may have. If so, perhaps the narrative could develop into not so much about Tai having a problem herself, but about Tai being an enabler/facilitator.

well second time as an event, though each event in the strip is spread over several pages, making it more of a story point
and between that ive had a literal TON of negative interactions with stoners thus giving me a negative outlook on recreational drug use, and
that im trans and LOVED claire being introduced as a wholesome person just trying to lvie a normal life at the start and dont approve of that
things turned for the worse to damage that image

[hedgie]

I suppose that there must be some dissonance here, but then again, I live in a university town in California, where weed is legal.  I don't touch the stuff, myself, due to the effects it has on me, but I'm used to people casually smoking it in public.  Honestly, I see it as just "normal", like when Hanners still smoked cigarettes.  TBH, it was the drunks that annoy me more.  Before the lockdown, I'd leave bars by about 8pm just to avoid the kids coming in and getting obnoxious.

[cesium133]

I'm with Bubbles on this. I don't care if people smoke marijuana, but dear god does that stuff smell horrible. 

[St.Clair]

As for your assessment on Claire, I can't say I see that the same way. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this only the second time CLaire has gotten high, and only for a very specific reason this time (i.e. graduating)? To me that hardly qualifies as trying to redefine her as a stoner, at least at this point. Of course it's possible that JJ takes it into that direction as Claire could be susceptible to weed addiction due to some anxieties she may have. If so, perhaps the narrative could develop into not so much about Tai having a problem herself, but about Tai being an enabler/facilitator.

well second time as an event, though each event in the strip is spread over several pages, making it more of a story point
and between that ive had a literal TON of negative interactions with stoners thus giving me a negative outlook on recreational drug use, and
that im trans and LOVED claire being introduced as a wholesome person just trying to lvie a normal life at the start and dont approve of that
things turned for the worse to damage that image

So, for you, she's gone from someone you like and/or identify with, to one of "them"?
Yeah, I see how that would be unpleasant.

[FonnLath]

So, for you, she's gone from someone you like and/or identify with, to one of "them"?
Yeah, I see how that would be unpleasant.

well little bit identify with, but also that she was introduced as just wanting to fit in as normal, as opposed to all the negative perspectives the far left and right portray trans
as being

[shanejayell]

WEll, with weed being legal in Canada, it also doesn't bother me.

Also I don't mind the scent, in small doses...

[Tova]

Completely out of context and not from this week, but I didn't feel like creating a thread just for this silliness.

How Pintsize deals with self-quarantine

[shanejayell]

Another strip where you can't tell if Pintsize is joking or not. 

[Autistic Vulture]

Wow.  A callback to a strip that ran sixteen years ago.

[shanejayell]

New strip up.



Yet another thing Marten and I had in common.

(Is it wrong I'd like to see a in-universe D&D club?)

[Gus_Smedstad]

It saddens me that I never met a girl like Clarissa during my school years.

... also, in reference to strip 131, I don't see pencil-and-paper RPGs as something immature, something that should be outgrown. D&D specifically, maybe, since it's not a very good rules system despite its overwhelming popularity, but not RPGs in general.

Done properly, a RPG session can be a sort of collaborative storytelling experience. Done badly, it can be a mindless exercise in rolling dice and collecting imaginary loot. Most games tend to be somewhere in between.

As for me personally, no, I haven't played since college. But that's entirely because I never found a group again of like-minded players.

This also applies to my boardgames. I haven't played a proper wargame since high school, because I didn't run into any opponents. I did run into Euro board game players here and there in the decades since, but right now I've got two bookshelves full of games of varying weight, from Carcossone at one end to High Frontier at the other, and no one who plays locally.

Not that you're going to see groups getting together during the pandemic, of course.

[Torlek]

(Is it wrong I'd like to see a in-universe D&D club?)

Given they're in Northampton, said club would probably exclusively play AD&D (but ironically) because they believe it is the "pure" way to play the game.

But there's been an absolute sea-change in the perception of board games and (to a lesser extent) RPGs over the last 15 years that's correlated with the mainstreaming of nerd culture. There's also been a huge growth in the quality (production values and marketing, there's still plenty of horrible playing games) in a lot of games too. The ones that are more likely to require an adult level of cognitive ability look sleeker now and less like spreadsheets.

[Gus_Smedstad]

The ones that are more likely to require an adult level of cognitive ability look sleeker now and less like spreadsheets.

Back in the day, wargame rules followed an unpleasant to read outline format, organized in a X.X or even X.XX heading format. One of the problems with High Frontier is that the rulebook still follows that format, despite being published in 2011.

6.1 ROCKET MODIFIED THRUST (Acceleration). Your modified thrust sets how many burns you may enter per turn, and how big a world you can land on without lander fuel (6.4C). It is calculated before your rocket moves, and is applied for its entire move. Use a blue disc in your Acceleration Track (2.4A) to show your modified thrust for this turn.

When I first started playing games, the rulebooks for the serious games were all like that, and I just kind of took it for granted that it was the "right" way to organize a rulebook.

[BenRG]

When you think about it, Clarissa is a merger of Claire (nerdy and awkward) and Faye (assertive and aggressive). Because of the fact that Jeph's footer note confirms that she and Marten had briefly flirted with being a thing, I'm wondering if Jeph is telling us that Marten has a 'type'!

Meanwhile, I suspect that Tai is making up in her head all these possible things that Marten could have been pressured into doing that he's covering up with an obvious self-conscious lie!

[TinPenguin]

Not that you're going to see groups getting together during the pandemic, of course.

In fact, I know several people who've been playing D&D via Skype* while in lockdown.

*other online telecommunication services are available

[BenRG]

That's something I'd like to see: Competitive esports RPing with face cameras and a 'narrator mode' where the GM or player can address just the spectators.

DM (Narrator Mode): "Alas! For our heroes don't know that they're walking into a devilish trap!" *Sadistic giggle*

[Gyrre]

As for your assessment on Claire, I can't say I see that the same way. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this only the second time CLaire has gotten high, and only for a very specific reason this time (i.e. graduating)? To me that hardly qualifies as trying to redefine her as a stoner, at least at this point. Of course it's possible that JJ takes it into that direction as Claire could be susceptible to weed addiction due to some anxieties she may have. If so, perhaps the narrative could develop into not so much about Tai having a problem herself, but about Tai being an enabler/facilitator.

well second time as an event, though each event in the strip is spread over several pages, making it more of a story point
and between that ive had a literal TON of negative interactions with stoners thus giving me a negative outlook on recreational drug use, and
that im trans and LOVED claire being introduced as a wholesome person just trying to lvie a normal life at the start and dont approve of that
things turned for the worse to damage that image

As a QA line inspector, I can very much relate to the negative experiences with stoners (and other drug-addled sorts). Suffice it to say that following simple rules (generally regarding PPE) is quite difcicult for some of them. Unfortunately, we're too short-handed on my shift at the moment to simply just can all of them.

[Tova]

I'm a little disappointed he's too embarrassed (or whatever) to admit his DnD past.

[BenRG]

I'm a little disappointed he's too embarrassed (or whatever) to admit his DnD past.

I agree; Tai isn't likely to mock him. She's more likely to drag him back into the shop screaming: "One of us! One of us!"

[oddtail]

I'm a little disappointed he's too embarrassed (or whatever) to admit his DnD past.

I agree; Tai isn't likely to mock him. She's more likely to drag him back into the shop screaming: "One of us! One of us!"

For me it's not even whether Tai would mock him. It's that he seems to think people who play D&D are lame or something? And I find that mildly annoying.

I think my perception is due to the flashback implying (to me) that he wasn't an avid player, he was someone who was roped into playing and just tried it at one point. Which is fine by itself, but "oh nooooo, I played D&D, no one must EVER KNOW" doesn't exactly paint him as the RPG geek type.

[Case]

As a QA line inspector, I can very much relate to the negative experiences with stoners (and other drug-addled sorts). Suffice it to say that following simple rules (generally regarding PPE) is quite difcicult for some of them. Unfortunately, we're too short-handed on my shift at the moment to simply just can all of them.

Go on, by all means - please tell me exactly how you feel about 'sorts' like me.

[Tyr]

I think my perception is due to the flashback implying (to me) that he wasn't an avid player, he was someone who was roped into playing and just tried it at one point. Which is fine by itself, but "oh nooooo, I played D&D, no one must EVER KNOW" doesn't exactly paint him as the RPG geek type.

Except he was PRESIDENT OF THE D&D CLUB... So clearly he liked it once he tried it.

[oddtail]

I think my perception is due to the flashback implying (to me) that he wasn't an avid player, he was someone who was roped into playing and just tried it at one point. Which is fine by itself, but "oh nooooo, I played D&D, no one must EVER KNOW" doesn't exactly paint him as the RPG geek type.

Except he was PRESIDENT OF THE D&D CLUB... So clearly he liked it once he tried it.

Objection withdrawn =D

[Welu]

An observation I've made is it seems Americans will use grades instead of saying "when I was 13" and I always have to look up the related age. Not something I've seen people in my neck of the woods (Ireland/UK) do, we would say the age. I'd have to think for a second to remember which school year applied.

[dutchrvl]

An observation I've made is it seems Americans will use grades instead of saying "when I was 13" and I always have to look up the related age. Not something I've seen people in my neck of the woods (Ireland/UK) do, we would say the age. I'd have to think for a second to remember which school year applied.

Even after having lived in the US for almost 13 years, this still trips me up, because phrases like 8th grade or 9th grade just don't automatically translate to a certain age....9th grade is 3rd year of middle school, correct? So about 14-15 years old then?

[dutchrvl]

I'm a little disappointed he's too embarrassed (or whatever) to admit his DnD past.

Interesting, my interpretation of the comic seems to be different from several others here.

To me he's not embarrassed about his DnD past itself, he's embarrassed because that's the thing he was peer-pressured into, in other words he let perceived 'geeks' pressure him into doing something, instead of the perceived 'cool' kids.

I don't read it at all as being embarrassed about playing DnD by itself.

[TinPenguin]

I agree. I don't think he's ashamed of playing D&D; he was quite relaxed and open (even a little proud, perhaps) about it in #134. It's that he doesn't think being peer-pressured by some of the lowest in the high school social hierarchy will earn many cool points with Tai, who he knows has done far crazier things than he has. He is probably wrong about that.

For what it's worth, if playing a tabletop RPG is the worst thing you've ever been pressured into, I'd consider that a mark of respect.

[Tova]

Yes, you're right. It could well be that he's embarrassed that he was peer-pressured into something that's not at all subversive.

[Zebediah]

(Is it wrong I'd like to see a in-universe D&D club?)

Given they're in Northampton, said club would probably exclusively play AD&D (but ironically) because they believe it is the "pure" way to play the game.

But there's been an absolute sea-change in the perception of board games and (to a lesser extent) RPGs over the last 15 years that's correlated with the mainstreaming of nerd culture. There's also been a huge growth in the quality (production values and marketing, there's still plenty of horrible playing games) in a lot of games too. The ones that are more likely to require an adult level of cognitive ability look sleeker now and less like spreadsheets.

Given that I am likely the only person here who is actually in a D&D group in Northampton: This misses the mark by a fairly wide angle.

My group is actually more representative of your second point. The DM is a department chair at Smith and most of the players are either tenured professors or fairly high in the Smith College administration. So it’s not just a game for hopeless nerds any more.

[BenRG]

My group is actually more representative of your second point. The DM is a department chair at Smith and most of the players are either tenured professors or fairly high in the Smith College administration.

I wonder if the students realise that their uncool peers with their uncool pastimes are the ones likely to grow up to hold the educational destinies of the cool kids' children in their hands?

[hedgie]

There's also the strangeness of webcomic time.  Given the age of the comic, by some reckoning, Marten was a teenager in the '90s, or at least an analogue of them back when D&D was all for nerds and "losers".  Now, in today's real-life world, it's a pretty mainstream pasttime. 

[Gus_Smedstad]

I agree. I don't think he's ashamed of playing D&D; he was quite relaxed and open (even a little proud, perhaps) about it in #134.

“I kind of outgrew it” isn’t pride. It’s viewing the game as something only children play. Also, QC isn’t always consistent; I suspect the way Jeph views Marten and his history now is a bit different from 16 years ago.

A little rant here - in high school I was the GM for a group (Traveller / The Fantasy Trip / GURPS, not D&D), and one of the players was a pain. Among other things, he was prone to throwing temper tantrums if things didn’t go his way. He once rage-quit a dungeon crawl because he put pretty much all his STR into a lightning bolt and rolled a miss. He wasn’t the worst player I ever encountered, but he was the worst I played with regularly.

After college he said he didn’t play games anymore because he “outgrew them.” So while Marten is hardly a condescending a-hole like that guy, it’s a phrase with strong negative connotations for me.

[dutchrvl]

In my personal experience, many people seem to use the term 'outgrew' even when they simply mean their interests changed over time, so for me the term doesn't have the negative connotation.

[Raptorofwar]

Wow. "Swords" guy and you instantly think fighter? D&D is unique in that the "cleric" is an excellent way to the death of your enemies. There's also nothing stopping you from being a cleric wielding a sword and in full plate armor.

[Thrillho]

Did I read right that we are discussing comic 131?

A point in the comic when Faye routinely punched martin and the characters threw hard Rs at each other?

I don't think we should put too much stock in 2020 Jeph's view or even 2020 written Marten's.

Also the characters are only graduating now so Marten is what, 23 now at most? I don't think everybody has grown up to own their nerd nerdhood by then. Some never do.

[Theta9]

Wow. "Swords" guy and you instantly think fighter? D&D is unique in that the "cleric" is an excellent way to the death of your enemies. There's also nothing stopping you from being a cleric wielding a sword and in full plate armor.

When I played AD&D, clerics could only use blunt weapons (typically a mace) - no edged weapons allowed.
Apparently the game has changed since 1987.

[BenRG]

Also the characters are only graduating now so Marten is what, 23 now at most? I don't think everybody has grown up to own their nerd nerdhood by then. Some never do.

It's my understanding that Claire was a graduate student, so she and Marten are probably closer to 25

[Thrillho]

I was still an asshole when I was 25 too and will say that when I am 40 about me now

I.e. people change

[dutchrvl]

Also the characters are only graduating now so Marten is what, 23 now at most? I don't think everybody has grown up to own their nerd nerdhood by then. Some never do.

It's my understanding that Claire was a graduate student, so she and Marten are probably closer to 25

I'm not sure if we ever got an age for Marten, but Claire was 24 when she was interning at the library, so I'm assuming that it is now at least a year later and she is at least 25.

According to a timeline created at some point, which I believe to be reasonably accurate, Marten was born in 1981 and about 2 years had passed in the first 3000 comics or so, which put comic 3078 around October 2005 (which would put Marten at 24 at that point). Assuming the passing of time has been more or less at the same pace plus a time jump around comic 3100 (I'm too lazy to actually work on the time line myself), I would put it another 1-2 years further in the future  or so, so Marten is probably 25-26 at the moment. Just guessing here though.

Edit: I found that timeline here

But looking at it again, some of it is off. For example. it has put Marten moving to Northampton in summer 2003 and meeting Faye in November 2003, but that can't be correct, because in comic 2332 Pintsize mentions he was Marten's only friend in Northampton for 2 years before he met Steve.

Anyway, it doesn't really matter. I kinda want to make a QC timeline myself, but at the same time I know I don't have the time to actually do it.....

[Zebediah]

Is that April’s timeline? The problem, as I recall, is that she was trying to reverse-engineer some consistency into a timeline that Jeph had never bothered to make consistent.

[Gus_Smedstad]

In my personal experience, many people seem to use the term 'outgrew' even when they simply mean their interests changed over time, so for me the term doesn't have the negative connotation.

Often they do mean it in a highly negative way, particularly if we're talking about subjects generally perceived as childish.

If you read the strip, it's explicitly stated that D&D is only for smelly virgins.

In the story from my personal history, there was no question what he meant. IIRC he said he didn't play games anymore because he "grew up."

[Mr_Rose]

It’s funny tragic that most often when people say they grew up it actually means they’re as immature as ever but they’ve changed the things they tell themselves and each other they like to fit a mould called “adult” that is sold in the form of lifestyle magazines and self-help books. 

[Nepiophage]

An observation I've made is it seems Americans will use grades instead of saying "when I was 13" and I always have to look up the related age. Not something I've seen people in my neck of the woods (Ireland/UK) do, we would say the age. I'd have to think for a second to remember which school year applied.

I think if you just add 6 you get the rough answer

[dutchrvl]

In my personal experience, many people seem to use the term 'outgrew' even when they simply mean their interests changed over time, so for me the term doesn't have the negative connotation.

Often they do mean it in a highly negative way, particularly if we're talking about subjects generally perceived as childish.

If you read the strip, it's explicitly stated that D&D is only for smelly virgins.

In the story from my personal history, there was no question what he meant. IIRC he said he didn't play games anymore because he "grew up."

Yes, sometimes people (like your personal example) do mean it in a negative way. I was merely commenting that somebody stating they "kinda outgrew something" does not by definition imply they are embarrassed, find it childish, or otherwise look at it negatively.

As for that strip, I don't see anything even resembling an explicit statement that D&D is only for smelly virgins. All I see is Faye who implies that Marten may have quit playing D&D out of fear of ending up a smelly virgin.It doesn't even mean Marten, JJ, or Faye actually think that.

[sitnspin]

An observation I've made is it seems Americans will use grades instead of saying "when I was 13" and I always have to look up the related age. Not something I've seen people in my neck of the woods (Ireland/UK) do, we would say the age. I'd have to think for a second to remember which school year applied.

Even after having lived in the US for almost 13 years, this still trips me up, because phrases like 8th grade or 9th grade just don't automatically translate to a certain age....9th grade is 3rd year of middle school, correct? So about 14-15 years old then?

Ninth grade is the first year of high school. Elementary school is K-5. Middle school is 6-8. High school is 9-12. Some  place have Junior High which divides things differently.

[Theta9]

Ninth grade is the first year of high school. Elementary school is K-5. Middle school is 6-8. High school is 9-12. Some  place have Junior High which divides things differently.

I went to school in the Los Angeles and Seattle areas, and both were arranged thusly:

K-6 = Elementary School
7-9 = Junior High School
10-12 = High School

Also having been born in the summer, I started kindergarten at age 5 and graduated high school at age 17.

[Torlek]

School divisions in the United States are all over the place. By and large, it seems to break down based on school population and necessary building sizes.

My elementary (primary) school was K-8 (5-13 y.o. for me) and high school was 9-12. I've seen middle schools broken out for 4-6 and 5-8 and junior highs broken out for 6-8 and 7-9 and even independent kindergartens bundled in with some Pre-K functionality. High school years are typically more uniform since there is a specified division between primary and secondary education but I've seen large schools that will section 9th grade off in its own building or a separate campus entirely while the 10-12 school will be labeled the Senior High School. Using age makes less sense than using grade because of the edge cases of particularly gifted children (we had a 10 year old in my high school pre-calculus class, but math was all he was taking advanced courses in) and children that are held back for whatever reason (poor performance, mental development issues or the particularly frustrating cases where the parents make the child repeat a grade or don't start them in school until a year later so they'll be stronger in athletics).

Now what's Byzantine is the way British schools are divided up.

[dutchrvl]

Right, so even within US not entirely consistent. Not to mention the concepts of freshman/sophomore/junior/senior also still trip me up sometimes.

For reference, I'm use to:
elementary school: 6 years, generally talked about as grades 3-8 (1st and 2nd grade are kindergarten)
middle education (i.e. middle and high school, we don't split those concepts): class 1 to class 4-6 (length depends on level of education)
higher education: college/university, typically started after 5-6 years of middle education (for college) or 6 years (for university). And no, the equivalent of colleges in the Netherlands are not quite the same as universities