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Author Topic: Heroes  (Read 63732 times)

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Re: Heroes
« Reply #250 on: 22 May 2007, 07:12 »

Things that bothered me. WHY DONT YOU JUST SHOOT THE SHIT OUT OF PETER!?!?!?!. You pull the bullets out and tada! All better.

YES. I was sitting there going, "Dude, you're stupid if you fly him up there and die. She's got a gun. Take the gun and shoot him."

I am looking forward to whoever it is who can see the girl when she tries to look for him. (I don't think it's someone that's been introduced or mentioned yet.) And I almost hope that someone stole Sylar's body vs. him still being alive, though that's probably not it. (I'm starting to get sick of him. I liked seeing his flaws when he was with his mom, but I'm bored with him now.) I really hope it doesn't get too much like X-Men though, because in the 5 years in the future episode, Nathan/Sylar wanted to exterminate them. Now that those two are "dead" and that won't be the future, there's still the possibility that they could have whoever ends up being president wanting to do it and I don't think it should be done.

About the post above, I'm not sure they are contagious necessarily, I think they just don't develop right away, but they do over time. It seems to be genetic, with the parents of the "heroes" having powers themselves. (Noah doesn't have any powers. If they had been contagious, he could have gotten them from Claire. Her real parents, however, have powers, as well as Peter and Mrs. Petrelli.)
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #251 on: 22 May 2007, 11:20 »

Dr Suresh said he thought he found Patient Zero, Patient Zero would be the first person with powers. (though, are powers contagious? they seem to have dropped a few hints now indicating that they may be. but more on that later) He had a name nothing else really. Most of those names came from a DNA repository. We know that Sylar clearly isn't Patient Zero, if fact he is a member of the second generation (assuming that there haven't been heroes since the 1600s) Linderman, Angela, Simone's Mom, possibly Pappa Petrelli (though I still have my doubts) and possibly Nakamura senior make up the first generation. If there was a Patient Zero, then obviously he would be a member of this generation. And he would probably be quite powerful. So, here's the question, do we know the name of Sylar's father? Is it possible that Sylar's name is actually Gabriel Gray Jr.? Could Suresh have been looking for Gabriel Gray Sr. and came across his son by mistake?

Actually, there's a hole in that theory that cropped up in the ending that leads to a potential theory I have. For one, no one ever said patient zero meant "the first," it could be more an Alpha and Omega thing, the beginning and the end of the string, with Sylar and Peter representing those ends. Notice that there were absolutely no duplicate powers. There were some vaguely similar ones, but no two people at the same time displayed the same powers (Short of Peter's mimicry). I get the impression they took a lot of the idea from the comic Rising Stars, where there is a set list of designated powers. I think the "Patient Zero" line is more along that than an actual chronological order of manifestation.

Though, if your theory turned out to be true and it were a matter of chronology, Sylar could still, technically, be the first due to Hiro's accidental journey to the past. To our knowledge, Sylar's parents didn't have any powers. His mother, at the least didn't. Many of the others, particularly the ones visibly younger than Sylar, had clearly defined lineage with powers (To the point that Linderman was even manipulating family lines to produce Micah, ala Mr. Sinister). With Hiro's journey back to feudal Japan, the lineage splits elsewhere. Over the course of four hundred years, a family line can be completely diluted to the point of being physically unrecognizable, but still carry certain genetic traits. If Hiro were to have a child back in that era, Hiro could be the first historically while not literally being the first powered individual to have developed. This is a completely stretched theory and not something I entirely believe, I think it's 80% likely the "Alpha and Omega" concept," especially after Charles Deveaux's comments, but it is something to chew on.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #252 on: 22 May 2007, 12:51 »

I smell a twist with him somehow sacrificing himself to save everyone else. Either way, I'm sure Peter will be dead at the end of the season or something terrible will happen to him.

Come on guys, you gotta admit I kind of called it...
I mean there's always him surviving and all that, but I'm pretty impressed with how close I was. I said that back on March 2nd!

He's obviously not going to be dead and will come back at some moment and everyone will cheer and smile at their tv sets.
« Last Edit: 22 May 2007, 13:06 by Lukeypoo »
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #253 on: 22 May 2007, 13:17 »

out of everything that happened in finale, the thing i am the most excited about is Hiro's trip to feudal Japan. that's the one thing that happened that i didnt predict ahead of time in some respect.
it was a total curve ball for me so i'm looking forward to seeing it played out.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #254 on: 22 May 2007, 13:31 »

Come on guys, you gotta admit I kind of called it...

So, are you looking for a pat on the back or a cookie? With the eight million theories we've all thrown around on here and elsewhere, some shit's gotta eventually occur along those lines. I can name over a dozen things I predicted that happened versus many I predicted wrong. Welcome to the world of serialized fiction. Throw out enough theories and the occasional instance has to stick, it's just the law of averages.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #255 on: 22 May 2007, 13:42 »

SO not as good as the last episode. They needed a well-made extra-long ep to do it properly, not this mess of glued-together ideas! I'm satisfied (for getting some closure, for cute things like Hiro looking badass, etc) but not totally blown-away by this ep.

On the one hand I'm pissed off by the thing with Sylar, but, on the other hand, I've really grown to like the character and the actor, so I don't think i mind too much. I hope the other guy Molly mentioned proves to be a worthy successor.

The show still has my love :) can't wait for next season!

EDIT: Best thing about this episode. The best thing...

...

...

... NOAH!!! :D
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #256 on: 22 May 2007, 15:46 »

Noah happens to be my brother's name.

I loved his reaction when he heard his name.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #257 on: 22 May 2007, 17:24 »

I believe that Nathan's probably dead though they could easily explain that, just when Peter was about to explode, Nathan let go and flew off quickly, allowing Peter to go supernova in the sky and fall to the ground alone.

Parkman's probably not dead either.

Sylar's blood trail was interesting.  As was the cockroach sitting on the edge of the open manhole cover.  Is that a clue or just a comparison?

And Micah's totally going to be macking it up on his new sister.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #258 on: 23 May 2007, 02:13 »


Sylar's blood trail was interesting.  As was the cockroach sitting on the edge of the open manhole cover.  Is that a clue or just a comparison?


in the first episode, Suresh was talking about the indestructability of cockroaches.  translation, Syler still alive

It's about time Nathan showed his balls.  I'm glad he went for that heroic style death (temporary tho it may be) and I'm glad everybody i thought was gonna survive did.

I'm putting it out that the one guy who molly can't find is the Hatian.  He's been gone a while and seems totally loyal to the Linderman group.

People who will return in the next series:
Peter, Duh
Claire's mother (basically ted, without explosive dangers)
Claude
That Dream Kid

also, Hiro = Kensei
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #259 on: 23 May 2007, 11:51 »

Well, I'm completely caught up now.

I have to admit, that I'm not totally impressed with the end.

There was a lot to like in the full series.  And I like that most of it flowed pretty well, with very few gaps.

However - it bugged me that episodes would end one way, and start up slightly differently.  They couldn't take the recorded ending, and start from there?  It also bugged me that Nikki and Hiro were both able to hit Sylar the way they were.  He had just stopped four bullets, and managed to not lose his grip on Peter - but he can't see Nikki coming, and can't stop Hiro?  Maybe I just missed it, but why didn't they show me that Hiro stopped time to stab him?  Was I just supposed to assume that this was going to happen?  Meh.

As for shooting Peter while he was going critical - might not be a good idea.  Look what happened when they shot Ted.  Boom.  I know that's what he wanted, but yeah - possibly sending him nuclear, not a great solution.

Yes, Nathan can let go of him in time to get away, we've seen how fast he can fly.

Yes, Peter can definitely survive the explosion, and the fall.

Yes, Hiro is most likely going to end up being Kensei. 

Sylar.

Hmmmmm.

When his eye rolled over, was it because he was utilizing Isaac's power again?  Or because he was dead?

If it's because he's dead, then indeed, someone had to pull him down into the manhole.  Otherwise, he could have crawled there himself.  Perhaps he saw it in the future.

So, if Sylar is alive - then let me get this straight:  Not one single hero actually died in the finale.  None. 

Peter - going to survive.

Nathan - easily explained survival.

Hiro - survived

Claire - survived

Parkman - questionable, but alive at the end of the show.

DL - questionable, but alive at the end of the show.

Nikki - survived - jessica too

Micah - survived

Molly - survived

Sylar - ???  unknown status at this point.

Isn't that interesting?

Even Ando is still alive, though he doesn't seem to actually have powers, besides bravery, and being in the right place at the right time for Hiro.

I guess I was expecting more of a finale for the 'finale'.

Oh well.  It's still entertaining, and I don't mean to imply that it isn't.

I just though it could have been a little better.

I'll still watch next season.  It's still one of the better series' on television.

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Re: Heroes
« Reply #260 on: 23 May 2007, 13:44 »

As far as Nikki and Hiro, getting the drop on Sylar, that's very easily explained and fairly obvious with his character, especially in Nikki's case.

If Sylar has one key flaw, it's that he's disgustingly arrogant and proud. That pride often puts him in an advantageous and intimidating position, but it absolutely fucked him there. Think of it this way, you're standing here in all your power and some wafish looking blonde woman walks up to you. Do you take her seriously if you're Sylar? He likes to toy with his victims. His thought process was probably along the lines of:

"WTF bitch? u kidding? OH SNAP! BITCH GOT THE ROID RAGE!"

He has to concentrate to use his more powerful abilities like telekinesis, when she walked up and tore the meter straight out of his hands, he was obviously taken aback, not much chance to block a follow through from a chick who's torn multiple men in half.

I explained the detail with Hiro already, but also after watching a second time, it all happened very quickly. He shows up, yells "Sylar" and gives him barely enough time to turn around before Hiro charged him screaming with a sword. Sylar was bloodied, battered and weakened. Most of the fight was gone out of him from and he had taken a serious beating from Nikki and Peter with Nikki's abilities. It all happened at a very fast pace and Hiro's already proven that he's faster than Sylar.

Also, watch that last shot in Sylar's eyes and the sinister smirk on his face AFTER he got stabbed. I'm not entirely sure he didn't know that was going to happen and almost looking forward to it. Fatalistic types are hard to decipher, just look at Kain of the Legacy of Kain series of video games.

According to creator Tim Kring, aat least one of them will in fact be dying. I think Nathan really is dead and I have the sinking feeling that Matt will pop up briefly only to die in the hospital after some vague closure with his pregnant wife.

Nathan's role is a lot harder to explain than some of you assume. Nathan's proven he's rather intelligent. He had no way of knowing when Peter was going to fully go critical and blow, if he dumped him, there's too much of a risk of him dropping back into the city too quickly and still causing massive casualties.

I'm worried about Parkman because, regardless of his powers, he took five bullets point blank in the chest and then sat in Kirby Plaza for at least five to ten minutes bleeding. He could survive, but it's going to be very much in limbo. He's my favorite character, but the only reason I can see him surviving is because his story seems far from over.

Also, just because it's the SEASON finale, doesn't mean it all has to be final. No intelligent writer or producer kills off the majority of their cast after the first fucking chapter, and that's what this is. They've got a rough plot outline of five years, and considering the staggering popularity, it'll be around at least that long. They've killed enough big characters (Simone, Isaac, Ted, Linderman, Thompson to name a few, and at least one of the limbo deaths will allegedly result in a KIA according to Kring), if they keep going, we have to start from square one with introductions. This was all just the first of many story arcs (Season two is set to encompass at least two, 'Generations' is said to only last to about mid-season), there's too much time left to go trigger-happy on such an excellent cast.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #261 on: 23 May 2007, 14:46 »

I didn't expect a massacre - just a little more than I got.  That's all.

Sylar was bloodied, battered and weakened. Most of the fight was gone out of him from and he had taken a serious beating from Nikki and Peter with Nikki's abilities.

Hmmm - so Does Peter now have a split personality?  Or just Nikki's super strength?

 :lol:
« Last Edit: 23 May 2007, 14:56 by Blyss »
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #262 on: 23 May 2007, 17:04 »

i'm hoping next season we get a decent explination as to what the hell happened to "The Organisation".  My guess is that Pappa Patrelli was killed by the others because, like Simone's father (who incidently was dying as well) he believed killing all those people was unnecessary.  Mamma Patrelli almost confirmed to have a power, and then we have Noah and Mr Nakamura who have shown no evidence of having powers, yet were included.  Hiro in Feudal Japan could be interesting, and I stand by that Syler is still alive.

My guess is Nathan being dead as apposed to Parkman or Peter.  Peter is quite obviously the story's protagonist, and Parkman needs closure still.  When Nathan died, like i said before, he went for a redemption death.  He saw his evil and died in pennance.  I dont Think its DL, i think he'll be ok

The only thing that still bugs me a little about the show is that fucking teaser at the end.  i mean its not like we weren't gonna see the next series, was it?  its like Pirates 2 where they just let it go into the sequel.  i'm sorry but that's a cheap ploy and i've always hated it

Also, Mrs Patrelli sleeping with Linderman?
« Last Edit: 23 May 2007, 18:12 by doki »
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #263 on: 24 May 2007, 01:11 »

i'm hoping next season we get a decent explination as to what the hell happened to "The Organisation".  My guess is that Pappa Patrelli was killed by the others because, like Simone's father (who incidently was dying as well) he believed killing all those people was unnecessary.  Mamma Patrelli almost confirmed to have a power, and then we have Noah and Mr Nakamura who have shown no evidence of having powers, yet were included.  Hiro in Feudal Japan could be interesting, and I stand by that Syler is still alive.

My guess is Nathan being dead as apposed to Parkman or Peter.  Peter is quite obviously the story's protagonist, and Parkman needs closure still.  When Nathan died, like i said before, he went for a redemption death.  He saw his evil and died in pennance.  I dont Think its DL, i think he'll be ok

The only thing that still bugs me a little about the show is that fucking teaser at the end.  i mean its not like we weren't gonna see the next series, was it?  its like Pirates 2 where they just let it go into the sequel.  i'm sorry but that's a cheap ploy and i've always hated it

Also, Mrs Patrelli sleeping with Linderman?

I dunno, reading the On-line Novels, Papa Patrelli seemed to very easily look at the bigger picture, sacrificing few to save many. However, Linderman did mention that Papa Patrelli was weak, perhaps he went soft later in life.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #264 on: 26 May 2007, 04:25 »

....

PETRELLI.


Sorry it annoys me when people spell their names wrong.
Carry about your business :)
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #265 on: 26 May 2007, 13:44 »

Can I say what a cool name Peter Petrelli is?

It's old school Stan Lee with the character's first and last name starting with the same letter, making it easier to remember.  Plus alliteration is fun.  He's the only one on the show like that, though, I think.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #266 on: 26 May 2007, 15:15 »

I heard from NBC himself that Linderman's first name is Linda
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #267 on: 30 May 2007, 10:03 »

I had a thought about super new bad guy.

We have someone who can read peoples thoughts, is it too much to think that there's someone who can read everyone's thoughts? Everyone at the same time? That would explain why when Molly thinks about him, she sees him looking at her.

It could make for an interesting bad guy.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #268 on: 30 May 2007, 17:13 »

You mean like...god?  :laugh:
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #269 on: 01 Jun 2007, 06:03 »

yeah, but without the fire and brimstone and all.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #270 on: 01 Jun 2007, 07:31 »

So, like Santa Clause, then?
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #271 on: 01 Jun 2007, 08:58 »

I'm gonna fucking kill Tim Allen.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #272 on: 01 Jun 2007, 10:09 »

Tim Allen is a true American, and if you spell Santa's last name correctly, the terrorists have already won.

Nathan Petrelli is also a true American, in the interest of staying on topic. Also, Hiro Nakamura, because he's the underdog, and if we Americans like anybody, it's the underdog: like the Yankees or the Patriots or Superman.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #273 on: 01 Jun 2007, 13:15 »

It would suck if Nathan were gone for good. It thought he was the most interesting character, hands down. Every other character seemed certain about everything, Nathan had the classic ambiguity to him. Plus, the guy who plays him has incredible screen presence. He's on some other level in terms of acting.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #274 on: 01 Jun 2007, 17:57 »

If Nathan comes back (and i really hope he doesn't) his character will be cheapened.  REDEMPTION DEATH people!
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #275 on: 03 Jun 2007, 13:55 »

If he thought he was going to die, whether or not it actually occurs doesn't affect the entirety of the act's selflessness.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #276 on: 15 Jun 2007, 14:55 »

I'm coming into this conversation late because I never really visit this part of the boards. Buth here's my 2 cents.

I loved the show all season, it's been one of my favourites by far (in fact I think it would be fair to say it out ranked all my older faves like 24, lost and prison break to take no.1).

I, like everyone else, absolutely ADORE Hiro, he is so awesome.

All that being said the finale was a HUGE dissapointment for me. They threw in so many hints at what the future may hold throughout the season and this was a total anti-climax for me I was so intrigued by Nathan becoming president and Sylar taking over as Nathan after killing the shapeshifter girl. Granted, they were all out to change the future but still... at least the final scene should have resembled the crowded street scene we kept seeing when we saw Peter explode. And then they could stop it somehow.

But most importantly, I hated the fact that Nathan flew Peter away as the "solution". First of all, Peter can fly, so why didn't he just fly away by himslef so Nathan wouldn't have to be sacrificed? Besides, it just seemes lame that in the end, Peter did get the power and that he wasn't able to control it. It just could have gone SO many different, and better, ways than this. And the way Sylar died was also anti-climactic, if he even is indeed dead. I just don't see the point of 90% of what was set-up throughout the season if this is how it ends. And the "teaser" for next season did nothing for me. Was that supposed to peak my curiosity and have me excited for another seasn of this, cause it failed.

I'm sad cause it was such an awesome show. I just hope Peter survived, which I think it's safe to assume and that Sylar didn't die either (which is more of a stretch but totally still possible) so that what we saw was not the end of the threat of a nuclear explosion and the future that we saw (Peter blowing up in a crowded street) could still happen. And maybe the new bad guy will be interesting (the one the little girl talked about).

Anyways, this was probably very incoherent and poorly expressed but I just had to vent.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #277 on: 16 Jun 2007, 22:49 »

And time for another round of "Why is No One Paying As Much Attention as Jonathan?"

If they followed too far along the entire path of the future, it would've turned out boring. Too predictable and all that. Beyond that, we don't know for certain that that future's been averted. A lot of comic books (The primary influence of the show) go with a sense of unalterable destiny, as in no matter how many details you change, the end result still occurs (As an example, when Hiro traveled back in time, he ended up being the person who gave Charlie the Japanese instruction book, making it a cyclical issue).

I dunno what cro0wded street scene you're talking about. Not a single one of Peter's visions involved a crowded street. In fact, the streets were outright abandoned in each and every vision, shy of a handful of people who were all there (With the exceptions of Claude, who'd run off, and Isaac/Simone who were dead) at the time of the scene. The only difference was it was night instead of day, which has been explained by the writers as being due to the portions of the future that were altered (I.E. Isaac was killed earlier than foreseen, Claire was saved, etc...).

I keep having to point this out to people: Peter was about to explode and could not control his power! It was taking all of his concentration to keep it under control and he would have had to make an extreme lapse to fly up, up and away from the crowd. Odds are VERY heavy that if he tried, he would've exploded right then and there. Sure, it's possible he might not have, but knowing Peter's prior characterization, that is absolutely not a safe and plausible calculated risk. Even shooting him held a risk. Nathans actions really were the absolute only choice.

My main gripe with your argument is: "It just could have gone SO many different, and better." I HATE when people say that about a story. If it could've gone better, how would YOU have done it better? Note that I will mean no offense or malice when I viciously tear apart the likely rampant inconsistancies and the fact you have no idea where they plan to take the show.

Damn, I miss Heroes. Even more with how disappointing the season premier of Rescue Me (The absolute only other TV show I watch with any regularity) was to me.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #278 on: 17 Jun 2007, 12:18 »

And time for another round of "Why is No One Paying As Much Attention as Jonathan?"
OK, as I will acknowldge in the rest of this post, you make some valid points. But, really, you don't have to act so arrogant and cocky about it. That's just rude.

If they followed too far along the entire path of the future, it would've turned out boring. Too predictable and all that.
I agree, but I never said they should have followed it exactly, just that it deviated too far off course to even make sense. Why set us up with certain expectations only to dissapoint us in the end?

Beyond that, we don't know for certain that that future's been averted. A lot of comic books (The primary influence of the show) go with a sense of unalterable destiny, as in no matter how many details you change, the end result still occurs (As an example, when Hiro traveled back in time, he ended up being the person who gave Charlie the Japanese instruction book, making it a cyclical issue).
I mentioned this as well, it is exactly what I hope will happen as it's the only thing that will save the show in my mind.

I dunno what cro0wded street scene you're talking about. Not a single one of Peter's visions involved a crowded street. In fact, the streets were outright abandoned in each and every vision, shy of a handful of people who were all there (With the exceptions of Claude, who'd run off, and Isaac/Simone who were dead) at the time of the scene. The only difference was it was night instead of day, which has been explained by the writers as being due to the portions of the future that were altered (I.E. Isaac was killed earlier than foreseen, Claire was saved, etc...).
The way I remember it there were lots of cars on the street and people walking on the sidewalks, Peter was in the middle of the street, we see Mohinder getting out of a cab, Nikki is there, I think Sylar too, the cheerleader... but also lots of innocent bystanders. Exactly what one would expect a main street in New York to look like in the middle of the day.

I keep having to point this out to people: Peter was about to explode and could not control his power! It was taking all of his concentration to keep it under control and he would have had to make an extreme lapse to fly up, up and away from the crowd. Odds are VERY heavy that if he tried, he would've exploded right then and there. Sure, it's possible he might not have, but knowing Peter's prior characterization, that is absolutely not a safe and plausible calculated risk. Even shooting him held a risk. Nathans actions really were the absolute only choice.
I thought about this, I'm not stupid. I just still don't like it.

My main gripe with your argument is: "It just could have gone SO many different, and better." I HATE when people say that about a story. If it could've gone better, how would YOU have done it better? Note that I will mean no offense or malice when I viciously tear apart the likely rampant inconsistancies and the fact you have no idea where they plan to take the show.

Damn, I miss Heroes. Even more with how disappointing the season premier of Rescue Me (The absolute only other TV show I watch with any regularity) was to me.
I'm not a writer and I don't think I have to be able to come up with a better ending in order to be justified in criticising how it was written. That being said, I -- like anyone else -- had envisioned some possible scenarios of how things might have gone before the season finale. They could have made it so that Peter would be able to control his powers (that was the whole point of the invisible guy training him) but perhaps to be safe Nathan would fly off with him anyway and be a big hero only Peter would control it in time and there wouldn't be an explosion (still a possibility, actually, since I don't recall there being a big explosion in the sky, or am I wrong?). Or Peter could have at least had enough control to fly away himself. He could have avoided getting the power to begin with. I don't know... like I said I'm no writer, but the wrters on the show ARE, and good ones too. All I am trying to say in this post and the last is that I was left very dissapointed, that's all.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #279 on: 17 Jun 2007, 13:41 »

I'm pretty sure we saw an explosion in the sky.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #280 on: 17 Jun 2007, 14:39 »

this is little off-topic but Sam Raimi's production company is currently trying turn Rising Stars tv-series.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #281 on: 17 Jun 2007, 17:16 »

Off topic or not, if that happens and it follows the comic to a T (And is finitely contained, obviously), I will shit my pants in excitement.

Concerning the response to my post, no offense, but you just sound like someone looking for something to be let down by. The ending was logical and persistent with the overall plot of the season and worked pretty much perfectly.
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philosopherqueen

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Re: Heroes
« Reply #282 on: 17 Jun 2007, 22:29 »

To each their own I guess, I'm glad you liked it but the fact remains I found it anti-climactic. And no, the last thing I wanted out of my favourite show was to be left so dissapointed that I'm not sure I'm even going to keep watching next season.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #283 on: 18 Jun 2007, 00:39 »

The ending was logical and consistent with the plot of the season.

So, from the very beginning of the season, the plot was heading towards a trainwreck of disappointment.

I prefer to think the season ended with "Your final thought." Anything afterward was epilogue.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #284 on: 18 Jun 2007, 02:39 »

Long story short - I was on and off with Heroes all season long, it had it's low points, admittedly few, and had stretches of great episodes, especially as we neared the end of the season. I was really looking forward to the climax of the season, which I thought they'd built up very well.

Having said that, the final episode was the most dissapointing, flawed, finale to a season since... well, i can't think of a worse one. It just wheezed and whimpered into the off-season. There must be at least 10-15 unexcusable mistakes, either moments they should have done better (the whole fight and particularly Hiro's little 'swordplay' were unexcusably banal) or which can only be explained by twisting any sort of internal coherence the show might have had up to that point into such knots, such convoluted sequences of logic, that it becomes just plain silly.

Now I'm willing to wait till next season and see if anything becomes clearer, but I don't see how most of it can (unless Bobby wakes up in a shower or something...). Sigh... It was good and entertaining while it lasted.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #285 on: 18 Jun 2007, 04:52 »

The ending was logical and consistent with the plot of the season.

So, from the very beginning of the season, the plot was heading towards a trainwreck of disappointment.

I prefer to think the season ended with "Your final thought." Anything afterward was epilogue.

I so agree, this season wasnt the epic showdown between Good vs Evil, thats lame. it was about the Prophecy of a bomb blowing up New York and prevent it from happing, kinda like saying "screw you to fate",  so it was logical and consistent. consistently is such a rare thing these days in storying telling.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #286 on: 18 Jun 2007, 06:01 »

See, that's where it appeals to me. Not every plotline logically ends in an epic showdown. In fact, sometimes the epic showdown ruins the plot by being completely out of place. Take Spider-Man 3, for example. Sure, it's badass for the Green Goblin and Spider-Man to team up and fight the big, bad guys; but it makes absolutely no sense in terms of where the plot was going the entire movie. It's just such a dramatic shift that it ruins what they were building to. What happened was exactly what they were building to and if you were let down, odds are you weren't following very closely (As can be noted by the fact that the majority of people I've debated the merits of the finale with here and elsewhere have completely missed plot points and major details).

My recomendation to people who were let down: most have admitted they loved the season overall, go back and watch it from beginning to end over a week or two. I didn't start watching until mid-season and watched it all the way through at each hiatus. Heroes, much like 24, is less episodic in nature and is meant to be digested over the course of a full storyarc. Not everyone can catch everything just watching week to week (Myself included). If you watch straight through, everything lines up perfectly and that's why I found it to be about the most satisfying first season of a show I've watched since Rescue Me.

One other thing people need to note: this is a basic TV show. Everyone was expecting a big, epic showdown, but that's simply not in the cards. It was on its first season, and no matter how succesful it was, it wasn't going to get that kind of budget.

Beyond that, if every character comes out happily ever after, you lose absolutely all sense of drama. Shit, my favorite character got shot in the chest five times and there's a good chance he might be killed off (According to the crew, at least a couple of the people left in limbo in terms of status will die), but this happens. It enhances the drama and gives the real world feeling that anything can happen.
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Ozymandias

Re: Heroes
« Reply #287 on: 18 Jun 2007, 10:38 »

I watched the entire season in 2 days.

It's still disappointing. You can just see that the plot was heading towards that disappointment better.

No, the show never gave the impression that it was leading up to an epic showdown with Sylar that determines the fate of the world. It rather limped towards the choices the 'good guys' would have to make in order to save it this one time. Still, it didn't make for good television, especially when Tim Kring was boasting that the season finale would be like a multi-million dollar movie it would be so epic.

Most shows seems to know how to end a season leaving audiences wanting the next season. Heroes just kinda ended the first season's plot, then said "Oh, here's kind of what next season is about."
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #288 on: 18 Jun 2007, 14:02 »

dude I'm jonesing for the next season of heroes, and other jonesing for it too.

what you wanted the New York to get destoryed?, 
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philosopherqueen

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Re: Heroes
« Reply #289 on: 08 Jul 2007, 12:39 »

*POSSIBLE SEASON 2 SPOILER ALERT*




OK, so it looks like Sylar's not dead. That's definitely giving me hope that season 2 won't suck balls.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #290 on: 09 Jul 2007, 09:41 »

So the only person that died with powers in the finale was Lindermann...

Oh well.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #291 on: 09 Jul 2007, 11:42 »

*Spoilers for Season 2*

Actually, not necessarily, it's been strongly hinted by the creators that at the least Nathan's dead, too. I don't get why people seem to act as if there wasn't enough of a death toll. Across the series we saw: Eve, Simone, Isaac, Charlie, Thompson, Ted and Linderman die off the top of my head. That's a pretty high death toll, especially considering that Thompson and Charlie were about the only ones that had really small roles.
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Re: Heroes
« Reply #292 on: 08 Aug 2007, 12:04 »

*in response to a spoiler post!*

I kind of wish Sylar was dead.  I didn't think he was the best antagonist.  And I'd like to see the show go in a new direction, which I think they will still do.  Sylar may not be the main antagonist of season 2! 
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