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[camelpimp]

There's a lot of hubbub about the Final Fantasy series, and it does make sense, as Japanese RPGs are dying somewhat and the FF series is really the few left worth caring about. But what about some of the lesser known RPGs? I contend that the first two Lunar games totally pwn the (admittly good) FF games of the time. It's a shame that the series never really went anywhere.

So what lesser known RPGs should be recognize?

[Storm Rider]

Shadow Hearts.

Seriously, Shadow Hearts.

[Cartilage Head]

 Okage: Shadow King. Square has also put out a lot of lesser known, but very good, RPGs over the years, like Threads Of Fate or the SaGa series.

[ScrambledGregs]

It's always easy to forget just HOW GOD DAMN MANY RPGs they were for the Playstation. Yes, Japan always had a lot of RPGs, but once the PS1 hit in the States, and FFVII sold a lot, that's when we began to see a veritable flood of RPGs over here. I could make an entire post out of just PS1 RPGs, really.

Anyway...

Arc The Lad series: The PS2 sequels not so much. But anyone who, like me, bought the gigantic Working Designs boxset of the original three PS1 games knows how great this series is. I played through all of 1 and 3, but 2 just dragged on too long for me. Someday I plan on going back and playing through all three games again. Imagine if Sony had actually released this before FFVII in the U.S. rather than relying on pieces of shit like Beyond The Beyond to fill the PS1's RPG library for the first year or so of its existence...

Front Missions series: I've only ever played through Front Mission 3, but what I messed around with the other games was quite fun despite the language barrier. It's a turn based strategy RPG only with mechs. You get to customize them, so think Armored Core meets FFT.

Xenogears: No, not Xenosaga. I know a lot of people hate this game, think its second disc is awful, pretentious, and boring...but man do I love this game. Yeah, it's clearly influenced by Neon Genesis Evangelion--despite the denials by the developers--and the plot is incomprehensible for the most part, but still a surprising deep and interesting game.

Tales series: These games are really hit or miss, but Tales of Symphonia was one of the best reasons to own a Gamecube. I love real time battle systems that have a feel of balance and polish, and this game has that in spades.

Suikoden series: These games are unfortunately hard to find, at least the beloved Suikoden II, anyway. Many fans seem to hate Suikoden 3 and 4, but I myself devoured 3 back in the day. It was the best RPG after FFX on the PS2 for awhile.

Star Ocean series: Again, another great RPG franchise that delivers at least passable RPGs every time. Star Ocean 2 was a pretty big deal back in the day; I know a few people who still bust this out and replay it every so often.

Shining Force series: My best friend and I have a borderline obsession with Shining Force 1 and 2, to the point that we rented Shining Force 2 so many times that we may as well have just bought it back in the day. A few years back he actually bought a Saturn and copy of Shining Force 3 off eBay, which was really good but just not as fun (or, obviously, complete) as the first two games. The games that they keep releasing with the Shining name are a mediocre tragedy compared to how amazing this series used to be.

Mana series: What a troubled path this series has walked!! Secret of Mana is still the best known in the States, though its Japan-only sequel (Seiken Densetstu 3) is legendary amongst those who have played it. I fondly remember Legend of Mana for PS1, though I also remember it being childishly easy. The modern day games in this series are forgettable and bland, sadly, and everyone longs for a next-gen, online capable remake or full fledged spiritual sequel to Secret of Mana.

Ogre Battle series: I know the last game in this series to be released was for N64, but still. Tactics Ogre for PS1 was all but wholesale ripped off by Square to make FFT, which says a lot about how underrated and influential this series was.

Grandia series: Like Star Ocean and Tales, Grandia has a rep for being "that other RPG series" that certain segments of the population obsess over. Grandia II was one of the best reasons to own a Dreamcast, but they eventually ported this game to other systems (I wanna say it was for PS2 and Gamecube, but that doesn't sound right). Like those two series, it has a real time battle system and its own unique feel and gameplay/skill systems.

Phantasy Star series: Anymore all we get is Phantasy Star Online-type games, but back in the Genesis/Master System era, this series was like Sega's quasi-rival to Final Fantasy. I always felt that these games were technically impressive in their day but are now unplayably bland and tedious. My friend who shelled out for Shining Force 3 also bought a used copy of Phantasy Star 2 for Genesis and we both regretted that decision.

[TheFuriousWombat]

I've mentioned this game dozens of times on this forum. Whenever I get the chance in fact: Arcanum
Holy crap is that game good. In fact it's not only my all time favorite RPG (possibly only behind the clicktastic mayhem that is the Diablo series) but it is one of the best games I have ever played. This game, for the PC, came out several years ago but it's aged incredibly well. Despite the dated graphics, it has one of the best plots, worlds, and character customization systems I have ever encountered. The world is a cyberpunk one. Essentially it is a land of magic in the throwes of an industrial revolution. Technologists and traditional mages vie for control while cities dot the map, some industrializing, others not so much. You'll encounter racial tensions, riots, assassins ect. ect. ect. On top of very fun combat (real time or traditional turn based, you decide) and incredible character creation skills. You can make any manner of character, from evil, gun wielding, pickpocket gnomes to valiant elven archers who can lob massive fireballs, or a diplomatic orge who excells in building automatons and brewing potions. Find this game, play this game, and lament the demise of Troika, its illustrious developer.

[Storm Rider]

There was a second Tactics Ogre game for the GBA a few years back. I really wish Atlus would make another sequel though.

[BillAdama]

Shin Megami Tensei, Disgaea, Valkyrie Profile, and Star Ocean kick the ass out of anything Square developed.

Xenogears has a lot of the elements from Neon Genesis Evangelion, but it has a far different approach to those elements.  I wouldn't be surprised if NGE gave them some of their ideas, but the whole Solaris/lamps class thing, all the different villains going around doing their own thing, Fei's whole struggle with identity and free will, etc aren't anything NGE did in more than a superficial manner.

The second disc would have been better except it's production was rushed.  I disagree that the plot is incomprehensible.  You just have to take fastidious mental notes in order to put all the pieces together.

Shadow Hearts is okay.  The first two have quite good main plots and some good characters, but *incredibly* boring battles.

Suikoden II and V are really good but other than those the series really hasn't done anything really good.  Suikoden I is rote and dull, and Suikoden III just has a really confusing battle system that becomes a pain to try to control.  And the entire series is notoriously over-easy.

[Storm Rider]

You know that Valkyrie Profile and Star Ocean are Square games, right?

Personally, I own a almost completely untouched copy of Valkyrie Profile 2. I dunno if it was necessarily bad, but I didn't really get into it at all.

And I didn't find the combat in Shadow Hearts boring at all. Certainly no more than mashing the 'Fight' command over and over again.

[ScrambledGregs]

@StormRider: I forgot about the GBA Tactics Ogre game. I think one of my friends bought it, but as soon as FFTA came out, he forgot all about it.

Also, Valkyrie Profile 1 and Star Ocean were ENIX games, technically, since SquareEnix didn't exist back then.

I'm with you on Valkyrie Profile 2. I bought it the same day that I did FFXII, thinking that once I beat that game I would get more into VP2. Three chapters in, and I don't like VP2 at all. I feel like the game would work so much better as 2D, which is why I think so many people like the first. Also, apparently the first game has actual storylines for the Einherjar (sp??).

[BillAdama]

You know that Valkyrie Profile and Star Ocean are Square games, right?

Personally, I own a almost completely untouched copy of Valkyrie Profile 2. I dunno if it was necessarily bad, but I didn't really get into it at all.

And I didn't find the combat in Shadow Hearts boring at all. Certainly no more than mashing the 'Fight' command over and over again.

Star Ocean and Valkyrie Profile are Tri-Ace games, which are published by Square.  There's a difference.  They're not Square games any more than Arc the Lad and Growlanser are Working Designs games.

Shadow Hearts battle system was boring because mostly all enemies die in one or two hits and never pose any kind of threat to you at all.  I'd say, it's equally boring as every Final Fantasy in the last ten years.  There's absolutely no need to use any kind of strategy at all except in the third game, which has one of the worst character casts ever.  You're just kind of attacking enemies over and over, and hardly ever even healing.

Valkyrie Profile games aren't really for people who love Final Fantasy.  There's a different approach to storyline and a very different battle system that requires planning and strategy, and a platforming element that adds diversity to the dungeons.

Valkyrie Profile is to Final Fantasy as indie music is to mainstream music.  People who like getting the same thing over and over from the latter won't really get into the former because even if they give it a chance, they judge it by whether or not it has the elements they expect from the latter.

[Storm Rider]

Of course I'm not comparing Valkyrie Profile to Final Fantasy, they have almost nothing in common. I'm just saying that I did not really enjoy Valkyrie Profile 2. Maybe I'll go back to it eventually, but I have a huge backlog of games and it is not high on the list.

[ScrambledGregs]

Valkyrie Profile is to Final Fantasy as indie music is to mainstream music.  People who like getting the same thing over and over from the latter won't really get into the former because even if they give it a chance, they judge it by whether or not it has the elements they expect from the latter.

That's the worst comparison I've ever heard, considering that every FF is almost entirely different despite some common mythos, whereas Valkyrie Profile 2 is basically Valkyrie Profile 1 with 3D graphics and a shitty story. Valkyrie Profile is more like a band that released an album in 1999 which everyone loved, and then released one last year that is essentially the same thing with better production. Final Fantasy is like a band that releases an entirely different album every two to three years, which fans gripe and argue about over which is the best.

[camelpimp]

Just wondering: any of the Shadow Hearts fan played Koudelka?

...and I totally weird for preferring Koudelka over the Shadow Hearts games. (Well, maybe not SA2, 'cuz that was funny as shit.)

[Falcon Imperator]

SH2 Man Festival! Probably the most hilarious game sequence I've ever seen.

The Jade Cocoon games aren't talked about much, but the only really amazing one is the first one, for Playstation. I don't think I've seen that much customization as far as aesthetics go in a long time.

[Johnny C]

Cory tackled SaGa series with a brief mention. I dug those games.

[Cartilage Head]

 Dang I can't believe I forgot Jade Cocoon! Fucking great game right there. The sequel was lackluster, but I have rarely enjoyed a videogame as much as I did the original Jade Cocoon.

[Johnny Evilguy]

I have the original version of Suikoden II with case, I think I bought it off a kid for 10 dollars... I was planning on selling it on Ebay and then forgot about it.


The first RPG game I played on PS1 was Wild Arms... I still think the directors of the Matrix stole the bullet time effect from that game... (Character Jack has a move where he hits them with a sword and the entire camera rotates while in is in mid air)

Play the original because its funny seeing lego characters defeat gigantic dragons.

The original game's remake version for the PS2 is called Alter code

I knew someone would upload this eventually!! 

Favorite fight of the game... Any villian with their own theme music is badass...

BTW: the spells have funny names because you can rename them... sometimes its better than the original
It is also very hilarious to change their names in reverse... (for example: I called my Haste spell "Slow") just so you can see your friends mess up in battle...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IMdELvoqN0&mode=related&search=

The soundtrack is highly recommended...=)

[Dimmukane]

I have the original version of Suikoden II with case, I think I bought it off a kid for 10 dollars... I was planning on selling it on Ebay and then forgot about it.


The first RPG game I played on PS1 was Wild Arms... I still think the directors of the Matrix stole the bullet time effect from that game... (Character Jack has a move where he hits them with a sword and the entire camera rotates while in is in mid air)

Play the original because its funny seeing lego characters defeat gigantic dragons.

The original game's remake version for the PS2 is called Alter code

I knew someone would upload this eventually!! 

Favorite fight of the game... Any villian with their own theme music is badass...

BTW: the spells have funny names because you can rename them... sometimes its better than the original
It is also very hilarious to change their names in reverse... (for example: I called my Haste spell "Slow") just so you can see your friends mess up in battle...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IMdELvoqN0&mode=related&search=

The soundtrack is highly recommended...=)

Yeah, I was gonna mention this one sooner or later.  I've played bits and pieces, before I gave it to a friend for a birthday present.  He had recently bought one, and the disc was too scratched for him to continue past the first area. 

[Merkava]

There's a lot of hubbub about the Final Fantasy series, and it does make sense, as Japanese RPGs are dying somewhat and the FF series is really the few left worth caring about. But what about some of the lesser known RPGs? I contend that the first two Lunar games totally pwn the (admittly good) FF games of the time. It's a shame that the series never really went anywhere.

So what lesser known RPGs should be recognize?

Japanese RPG's aren't dying out at all, but whatever.

Shadow Hearts is an incredible series. They're the only other recent series I can remember that appropriately balances comedy and drama and does it artfully and with passion. From the New World may be the "lightest" of the three games, but it's still darker than most other RPG's, and has been one of the few RPG's in recent years to provide me with a totally fulfilling experience (another example would be Dragon Quest VIII). All three games are exceptional, the only problem with the first two being a lack of difficulty. FTNW's gameplay is the best of the series and actually forces you to use all of the options available to you.

[ScrambledGregs]

I would daresay Japanese RPGs are going through another flowering. I think JRPGs in the 2D style got good in the 16 bit era and perfected in the 32 bit era. Now we have developers finally 'getting' the differences between fundamentally 2D RPGs and 3D ones. I've been playing through Star Ocean 3, and it feels so painfully awkward because they hadn't quite grasped what to do with 3D graphics, let alone how to make a fully 3D game playable. I find myself constantly missing the enemy in battles or having to maneuver Fayt around so I can be standing at the EXACT angle to allow me to open a chest.

[ackblom12]

FTNW's gameplay is the best of the series and actually forces you to use all of the options available to you.

Yes, but does it have a Vampire Pro Wrestler who wields a frozen trout as a deadly weapon!?

[Trollstormur]

Here's a really unknown tabletop RPG:

Valherjar

Premise: It's modern day and THE MOTHERFUCKING RAGNAROK HIT SO WARRIORS ARE COMING BACK TO LIFE WITH MOTHERFUCKING POWERS BASED ON THE NORSE PANTHEON. PLAY A TIRE-IRON WEILDING BIKER OF ODIN OR A FUCKIN' SAMURAI OF THOR, IT'S ALL COOL

[ScrambledGregs]

I think tabletop RPGs in general are lesser known because practically no one plays them. I mean even in geek circles, that's pretty geeky stuff. Not dissing it or anything, just sayin' is all...

[Dimmukane]

I wanna learn the Conan the Barbarian tabletop RPG.  Because Conan eats babies.

[B!shop]

Shin Megami Tensei, Disgaea

I further agree with these two choices. Disgaea is such an awesome, light hearted Tactical RPG (which really have made a resurgance, haven't they?) and SMT: Nocturne (Or Lucifer's Call, but Nocturne is such a better name) is a really enthralling, if difficult, game.

[camelpimp]

I do agree, Disgaea is awesome, of what I've played of it, but honestly I just couldn't slog through the whole thing. I must have been spoiled by FFT, I guess.

[ScrambledGregs]

Disgaea, and Nippon Ichi Software games as a whole, are the sort of experiences you have to commit to wholly, not unlike a thick, complicated novel or a series of difficult equations. They are worth the effort, but they are also not casual sort of games.

p.s. Disgaea 1 was just re-released, so if you don't want to pay a lot of eBay, it should be back in stores/on Amazon/on Nippon Ichi America's website.

[quanticle]

What about Escape Velocity: Nova?  I think it should count as an RPG because of the many RPG-like elements that game includes. 

Examples:
 - leveling up == getting a better ship
 - interaction with NPCs allows for choices that significantly impact the storyline and outcome

[Merkava]

FTNW's gameplay is the best of the series and actually forces you to use all of the options available to you.

Yes, but does it have a Vampire Pro Wrestler who wields a frozen trout as a deadly weapon!?

No, but it does have Frank, who beats Joachim in sheer absurdity.

[ackblom12]

....it just got moved a bit higher on my Gamefly list.

[Scandanavian War Machine]

i liked Wild Arms 3 alot. it was my first PS2 game. i never played any of the other games in the series but 3 was alot of fun for me.

[Postino]

Vanguard Bandits was an amazing SRPG that was done by working designs. Also Legend of Dragoon was absolutly amazing, once you figured out the correct timing for the battles that is.

I must profess my love for all that is Lunar, I loved those games so very very much.

And lets point out some of the new additions, Xenosaga 1&3 were very good both battle wise and story wise, Xenosaga 2 not so much. Rogue Galaxy while lacking in story had many other element that made it a joy to play.

[0bsessions]

Yay! I get to contribute ones that haven't been named. First, I'm going to reiterate a couple many others have mentioned, though:

The Suikoden series: I loved every single one, outside of IV. I thought IV was utter garbage and considering how far off the timeline it is from the other four, I try to ignore its existence. The first three were brilliant in every way for me, with II being the pinnacle of RPG on the PS1 for me (Yes, I think it mops the floor with FF VII). For the longest time, III was my favorite PS2 RPG, but then V came along and blew me out of the water. I wasn't expecting much after loathing IV, but it brought the epic feel back to the series. It combined all the best elements of the first two and expanded upon them with some beautiful graphics.

Grandia II: I've yet to play the first or third games, but Grandia II simply had one of the best battle systems I have ever seen in an RPG.

Chrono: I cannot believe I didn't see anyone mention the Chrono series. Chrono Trigger is one of the top SNES RPG's and I'm one of the people who really enjoyed Chrono Cross. I recommend them to anyone.

Skies of Arcadia: Unfortunately, it only saw release on a pair of systems that never got much press for their RPG's (Dreamcast and Gamecube). You play a noble sky pirate and the ship battles were incredible. The story and characters were pretty old school corny, but by the end you really get sucked in.

Golden Sun: This pair of games never got half the press it deserved. Incredible games. If you've got a GBA or a Nintendo DS and like JRPG's, I strongly urge you to find these two games. The gameplay is just incredibly fun and it's a beautiful game.

Mario RPG Series: I've played three games in this series. Super Mario RPG for SNES is an absolute classic. Mario & Luigi for GBA is incredible as well as its sequel for DS. If you like Mario and you like RPG's, there's no good reason to miss them. For those of you who missed out on Mario RPG way back when, rumor has it it's coming to the Wii Virtual Console this year.

[Storm Rider]

Chrono Trigger isn't lesser known, really.

And Nintendo has confirmed that Super Mario RPG is getting a Virtual Console release, they just won't give a date.

[ScrambledGregs]

Regarding Obsessions' post: has anybody played Suikoden Tactics?? It's apparently a semi-sequel/prequel to Suikoden IV and is NOT VERY GOOD. I picked it up used for 17 bucks and have played maybe two hours of it before becoming bored. It's as if everything Suikoden IV touches turns to ash.

I wouldn't say the Chrono series is 'lesser known', seeing as how both games got excellent reviews and Chrono Trigger routinely makes lists of the 'best game ever' or 'best RPG ever' persuasion.

Outside of Mario RPG, I could never get into the Mario RPG games. I guess they're just not RPG enough for me. That was my main complain about Paper Mario for Gamecube. Everyone says that because you're required to do timed button presses and action/platformer, combat is less tedious. I found the opposite to be true. Every time I had to backtrack through a dungeon and/or fight the same enemies over and over, it was frustrating and irritating to have to time everything right.

[0bsessions]

I referenced Chrono Trigger in the same manner some had mentioned Xenogears. Both are very well known RPG's, but get nowhere near the press of Final Fantasy, and that is the general idea of what the topic creator said. Beyond that, Chrono Cross isn't that well known outside RPG fans, not nearly to the extent of its predecessor.

I have heard of Suikoden Tactics and avoided it entirely based off the tie-in to Suikoden IV. With how much of a letdown that game was, I saw no point in wandering into a genre I don't even like (Turn based strategy doesn't much appeal to me) to play a game spun off a game I don't like. I do wish they'd release a port of the Suikogaiden games in the US. For anyone not aware of them, they're two card based RPG's based around the time frame of Suikoden II. The main protagonist is Nash (A supporting character from Chris' story in Suikoden III) and you run into a whole lot of characters from the first two games. I've never been able to give them a try, unfortunately.

[Johnny Evilguy]

Wow, was Suikoden IV really that bad? I was going to try it out after the great stories from the first 3 (especially III and the Luc plot)...


Lesser known RPGs... how about Persona series? I played part 1 on playstation and it was pretty damn difficult...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=dgT9saAq_vE

Here is the review for number 3 in the series...

If you look at how the main character summons his "Persona" I don't think this game will be coming out in the United States 

I mean, who knew that shooting yourself in the head is the only way to summon powerful spirits to fight for you? what happened to materia....

[Merkava]

....it just got moved a bit higher on my Gamefly list.

No, really. He's a German man taught ninja skills by a secret society of Brazilian ninjas, and when he picks up items to use them as weapons, he just attaches them to his hilt.

[0bsessions]

I wouldn't say it's the WORST RPG I've played. I'd put that as Legend of Dragoon or Grandia XTreme.

It's more a matter of, after playing the first three, which I'd say are some of the greatest games ever, it was exceedingly mediocre. The battle system is overused crap (Three person party), there wasn't a single interesting character (Outside of Ted, and he was a secret character anyway), the army battles (Usually a shining point) sucked out loud, the story was flat and uninteresting (Being that it takes place so long before the others, it kinda takes you out of the overall plot), the sailing was utterly boring (Take Wind Waker's sailing, subtract fun and add random battles, you get the idea). It was just a mediocre/bad game, especially when compared to the other four incredible games in the series. As I said, fortunately it's set 300 years before the rest of the series and can be pretty much ignored. I DEFINITELY advise the fifth one, though. Honestly, I'd say it's my favorite of the series now.

I wish they'd announce a sequel. I've had to go through two games without any Yuber now.

[Postino]

I wouldn't say it's the WORST RPG I've played. I'd put that as Legend of Dragoon or Grandia XTreme.

How can you say Legend of Dragoon was a bad game? It had a great story and the battle system was both challenging and kept the battles interesting and fun. Plus the characters were memorable, especially the one that died.

[ScrambledGregs]

I wish they'd announce a sequel. I've had to go through two games without any Yuber now.

Dude, Suikoden V has been out for months!! Or do you mean a direct sequel to Suikoden III??

It's amazing to me how many people dislike Suikoden III since that is one of my favorite RPGs for PS2. I think all the elements they tried for worked very well--even things that could have been annoying turned out really well. I absolutely loved play the post-game Luc scenario, too. So great.

[Storm Rider]

I have a copy of Suikoden V that I played for a few hours and then sort of forgot about. I dunno if it just isn't my style or what, but I don't like how the game more or less requires you to collect characters, but doesn't give you any direction on when or where to get them.

[0bsessions]

I wish they'd announce a sequel. I've had to go through two games without any Yuber now.

Dude, Suikoden V has been out for months!! Or do you mean a direct sequel to Suikoden III??

It's amazing to me how many people dislike Suikoden III since that is one of my favorite RPGs for PS2. I think all the elements they tried for worked very well--even things that could have been annoying turned out really well. I absolutely loved play the post-game Luc scenario, too. So great.

Ummm, it seems you missed a bit of my post. As I mentioned, five is my favorite or the series so far. I mean another sequel sometime soon.

In response to Postino, the story for Legend of Dragoon didn't much impress me and the entire thing just reaked of trying to cash in on Final Fantasy VII (A game I didn't care for to begin with).

Storm Rider, note that you don't HAVE to recruit everyone. It definitely increases the enjoyment of the game if you do, but it's not required. Towards the middle of the game, you recruit a character who can do detective work to scout out potential recruits. Basically just talk to everyone and you'll get most of the job done. I'd recommend you give it another shot, the storyline is truly epic.

[Storm Rider]

Right, but the game is hard as a BITCH if you don't recruit everyone. Or at least, that's how it ended up for me about 10 hours in (maybe a little less? It's been a long time so I don't really remember). Like, I was in some dungeon and just dying nearly every battle because the random encounters were unbelievably hard. Either I was severely underleveled, which is strange because I hadn't had any really trouble beforehand, or I was in the wrong place, which I don't think I was.

Maybe I'll go back to it during the summer when no games come out ever and I'm sitting around the house a lot without school every day, but I have so many other games to go back to it's not honestly high on my list.

[Postino]

In response to Postino, the story for Legend of Dragoon didn't much impress me and the entire thing just wreaked of trying to cash in on Final Fantasy VII (A game I didn't care for to begin with).

Okay I have to say I am now curious, what about LOD reminded you of FFVII? I honestly cannot think of any similarity between the two games. Well maybe the fact that they both killed off a main character but other than that they are extremely different.

[0bsessions]

You spend half the game as the blonde, spikey haired protagonist hunting around the mysterious, platinum haired man in black for starters. Beyond that, I honestly can't remember a whole lot about the game, it was years ago that I played it. I just remember it being very bland.

[NealsonLewison]

Skies of Arcadia is one of my fav rpgs, also one of the few i've actually beat.... man i love that game.... it was orginally on dreamcast but if you have a wii or gamecube, you should definately pick it up

[WhatImFightingFor]

Doodes, Legend of Legaia for PS. Loved the battle system. Unlike the FFs your characters would move and then stay where the enemy they attacked was, rather than move back to a line. And attacking was made more, personal, you could chooose various combination attacks to make each battle different. And then there's the whole, the armor and weapons actually change what they look like on the characters thing, big + id say. Wild Arms 2nd Ignition aswell was a great game. Contrail seriously tied Squaresoft in their RPG goodness.

[0bsessions]

That battle system idea you mention was actually used in Chrono Trigger. I'm not sure, but I think they're the first ones to have used it. Grandia II and Suikoden III used the same idea. I don't understand why more RPG's don't use that system.

[Dimmukane]

Doodes, Legend of Legaia for PS. Loved the battle system. Unlike the FFs your characters would move and then stay where the enemy they attacked was, rather than move back to a line. And attacking was made more, personal, you could chooose various combination attacks to make each battle different. And then there's the whole, the armor and weapons actually change what they look like on the characters thing, big + id say. Wild Arms 2nd Ignition aswell was a great game. Contrail seriously tied Squaresoft in their RPG goodness.

Legaia 2 sucked ass, though.  Just another RPG that looked incredibly bland to begin with, story was pretty bland, dungeons were incredibly frustrating, all the item shit pissed me off, story sucked, they completely changed the way the wrist-thingys worked.  I was expecting to play a sequel to the first, not a 'lets try to reinvent stuff and use the most generic graphics ever'.  Didn't even have CGI like the first one. 
[/rant]