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Author Topic: The Drum Thread  (Read 59408 times)

Abigmoron

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #50 on: 23 Feb 2009, 06:54 »

If you play only on an electronic kit you won't learn how to have a good feel. Plastic feels nothing like hitting skins.

Also, it would be a supreme waste of money to get an electronic set and then never bother learning anything seriously, in my opinion.

For another point of view, I played an electronic drum-set for like 3 years and found it very very helpful due to the lack of parents wanting to kill me when I played at 2 in the morning.

You'll outgrow it, but you can then go out and get an actual set.
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KeepACoolin

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #51 on: 23 Feb 2009, 12:00 »

I have a Ludwig Accent Custom Pro back home, but need to get a bigger place so I can move it out of my parent's basement finally :P

and since I didn't see him mentioned, I have to give it up to Travis Barker, for the variety of shit he can play and play well
oh and I've got to take some of it back from him for doing Soul'ja Boy covers


but for styles I got to give it up to Neil Peart


Also, curious what cymbal brands everyone favors, I'm partial to the Sabian B-8 thins I'm using, nice crisp sound
Ooh, this is the first mention of the one man I simply cannot stand.  I'm referring to Mr. Travis Barker.  I don't want to alienate anyone, so I'll leave it at that. 

I admit that Neil Peart is a very good, skilled player, but I dislike his style.

As for cymbals, I love my Paiste 2002s.  John Bonham, Alex Van Halen, Larry Mullen, Jr., and Patrick Carney (among others) all use them.  They have beautiful tone and are perfect if you like classic rock sound.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #52 on: 23 Feb 2009, 13:30 »

I can think of few machine-hammered cymbals I've ever enjoyed playing.  My current set-ups has Sabian HHX and HHX Legacy models, as well as a few cheaper Dream Bliss models to hold me over until I get the cash for some K Constantinoples.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #53 on: 23 Feb 2009, 14:39 »

It's funny how in the guitar world there have emerged two brands of virtuosos- cheesy, over-the-top wankers (see: Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Yngwie Malmsteen) and classy, widely respected players (it's hard to make an example here because of differing tastes and opinions but they are everywhere) but you basically can't have a drumming thread without mentioning Neil Peart or Mike Portnoy.
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Fatstrings

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #54 on: 23 Feb 2009, 17:23 »

Before you hate me, I respect Barker for his skills, not his talent, all I'm going to say


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kyleg

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #55 on: 23 Feb 2009, 18:12 »

If you play only on an electronic kit you won't learn how to have a good feel. Plastic feels nothing like hitting skins.

Also, it would be a supreme waste of money to get an electronic set and then never bother learning anything seriously, in my opinion.
Springing for an electric set to learn on is fine. Costs a heck of a lot less than a real set. Plus if you wind up not liking drums, you aren't out a whole lot.

It's a bigger waste of money if you ask me, to buy a real set and never play it, than buy an electric set and never play it.
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KeepACoolin

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #56 on: 23 Feb 2009, 18:31 »

It's funny how in the guitar world there have emerged two brands of virtuosos- cheesy, over-the-top wankers (see: Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Yngwie Malmsteen) and classy, widely respected players (it's hard to make an example here because of differing tastes and opinions but they are everywhere) but you basically can't have a drumming thread without mentioning Neil Peart or Mike Portnoy.
I personally believe Neil Peart has a little wanker in him.  That's  why I dislike him.  I respect him very much, but I just cannot like his playing.  Portnoy, although he does play for a more complex and technical band, I find to be more enjoyable to listen to.  Maybe that's just me.  But my ultimate standard remains John Bonham: no one had better sound (driving, heavy, brooding, but still musical), he played for my favorite band, he played several styles well, and he was very, very talented for a mainstream drummer despite being largely-self taught.  I admire and like virtuosity; I love sound and creativity.
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Fatstrings

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #57 on: 23 Feb 2009, 19:08 »

I wouldn't say the best way to figure out if you like drums is to get an electric set, I've never played around with one that had the comfort of an acoustic

plus I've only ever played one electric that I actually liked the sound of

I'll stick by acoustic all the way
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #58 on: 23 Feb 2009, 20:08 »

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #59 on: 23 Feb 2009, 20:46 »

At the request of some musical friends who are in need of a drummer, I'm going to begin looking into assembling my own (acoustic) kit piece-by-piece. However, for the time being I'm somewhat limited on space and capital. So, without making too big a deal out of it, any simple suggestions for the most rudimentary kit possible? I'm thinking of trying to find a cheap bass drum, a snare, and then maybe some brushes for versatility. Think that'll work?
« Last Edit: 23 Feb 2009, 22:18 by SirJuggles »
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #60 on: 24 Feb 2009, 01:11 »

best advice i can give regarding drum purchases is don't be cheap. if you try to save money by going with the inexpensive stuff, you'll end up spending just that much more when it breaks and you have to buy the expensive stuff 3 months from now. keep in mind that these are things you hit with sticks and step on over and over and over and over.

if you want to go new, get yourself a Pearl Visions (VSX or VX model) kit or a Yamaha Stage Custom kit. Both will last you a long, long time and sound very good, especially considering how much they cost, which is between $429 and $699 for the shells, depending on where you shop. You will then need a hardware set (hihat, snare and cymbal stand, plus bass drum pedal), and you should budget AT LEAST $200 for that. Based on my personal experience, Pearl's 800 and 900 series stuff is excellent, but it will up your initial purchase price quite a bit. I've been using an S900 snare stand for about 6 years now, and an 800 series hihat stand for 12 years, with no problems from either. From there, figure you've got to at least have a pair of hihats, a crash cymbal, and a ride cymbal. Cymbal packs are the most economic way to go, but they'll still run AT MINIMUM $149.99, and that's for a Paiste PST3 set, which is only a pair of 13 inch hihats and an 18in crash/ride cymbal.

No joke, a decent drumset that you won't have to add bunches to, or replace parts quickly, will run you between $1000-$1200. Big investment to be sure, but what you get will be of quality, and it will last you for years, literally.

Really, you need a solid snare and bass drum. you also need a good set of hihats and a good ride cymbal. crashes you can kind of skimp on to start, but eventually you'll want to put some serious cash into those as well.

If you're looking to buy used, start trolling ebay for orphan bass drums and single snares. I would HIGHLY recommend a maple shelled bass drum. It'll have a nice and warm sound with enhanced low end. For a snare, I prefer brass snares. They're all I use, and what I'd strongly encourage you to look at. They'll work in any situation with the right heads and right tuning. You can make them warm like a wood snare, you can make them have the bite and nastiness of a steel snare, and you can do everything in between. I have eleven snares at the moment; 1 is copper, 2 are steel, 1 is aluminum, 1 is maple, 1 is mahogany, 5 are brass of varying depths, shell thickness and age.

Pearl is BY FAR the brand I recommend the most. They give you a lot of product for a relatively minimal cost, especially considering the quality.

If you want to learn, and learn quickly, pick up Tommy Igoe's "Groove Essentials 1.0" package, it's got a DVD and a book that reference one another. If you can't learn the very basics of drumming by watching this video, you probably should forget music and consider quilting as a hobby instead. Also, Ted Reed's "Syncopation" is a great book that everyone has, as is "Stick Control". Carmine Appice's "Realistic Rock Method" is wonderful, even if he is kinda a tool.

Later on, Steve Smith's "History Of The US Beat" is an incredible DVD that you'll want to pick up.

remember when starting out that you need to stay relaxed and loose and use your wrists and fingers. don't tighten up and don't swing your arms wildly. you could potentially end up doing damage to your body that will come back to haunt you later.


As far as people I look to for motivation, here's a little list:
-Steve Smith (in my opinion, the best drummer alive today)
-Gene Hoglan (for his rubber arms. a body that big should not move that fast. plus he's a super nice guy)
-Derek Roddy (incredible speed, power, and endurance)
-John Longstreth (for his finger control and ambidexterity)
-Mike Bordin (for his feeling, and he hits the drums so hard it's almost comical)
- Hillary Jones (for being super smooth and tasteful)
- Paul Leim (for being an absolute pro. he's on loads and loads of records and almost no one knows who he is)
-Patrick Wilson (great feeling, especially on Weezer's "blue" record)
-Daniel Svensson (being way tasteful)
-Buddy Rich (the best ever. period.)



« Last Edit: 24 Feb 2009, 01:52 by turtlspinr »
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evernew

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #61 on: 24 Feb 2009, 07:14 »

« Last Edit: 24 Feb 2009, 07:17 by evernew »
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #62 on: 24 Feb 2009, 07:53 »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yjVM2zmmiA


if we're talking strictly skills...
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #63 on: 24 Feb 2009, 08:29 »

^ Most boring thing I've ever seen.
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KeepACoolin

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #64 on: 24 Feb 2009, 10:18 »

Agreed.
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turtlspinr

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #65 on: 24 Feb 2009, 12:14 »

Darren Cesca having good technique and a Berkley degree doesn't mean he's exciting to watch. I always found what he did with Goratory to be very boring, as was what he did with Vile and Pillory. Only the recording he did with Arsis was an enjoyable listen. Burn In Silence was decent, but the drum sounds were awful.
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Dazed

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #66 on: 24 Feb 2009, 13:48 »

Thank you for once and for all proving my point that having amazing chops doesn't make you good at music. I will probably never have that guy's skills, but I will almost certainly never sound that bad.
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Abigmoron

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #67 on: 24 Feb 2009, 14:55 »

At the request of some musical friends who are in need of a drummer, I'm going to begin looking into assembling my own (acoustic) kit piece-by-piece. However, for the time being I'm somewhat limited on space and capital. So, without making too big a deal out of it, any simple suggestions for the most rudimentary kit possible? I'm thinking of trying to find a cheap bass drum, a snare, and then maybe some brushes for versatility. Think that'll work?

Trutispinr's advice is good advice if your the type of person who will be unsatisfied with mediocre sounding equipment.  I've never really been bothered by mediocre gear, and just recently got a drum set for 200 dollars so here is what I'd recommend if your like me and seem to have no ear for the nuances of good equipment.

Go on Craigslist for your area and look around for drum sets in the 200-300 dollar range and go try them out (Bring someone along if you need someone to help you differentiate between bad and decent drums).  Some will be awful and others will be good enough that you'll enjoy hearing them.  Bonuses to look for include upgraded cymbals and bass drum pedals.  I was lucky enough to get a ZBT crash with the kit I bought, which isn't great by any means, but is much better than the crap cymbals most sets come with (and goes well with the B8 hi-hat and crash/ride that my parents were nice enough to get me for my birthday). 

If you're limited for space and don't have room for all the toms that these sets come with, just don't use them.  Put 'em in a closet.  It'll still be cheaper this way than buying a individual snare, snare stand, bass, bass pedal, and cymbal stands.  I'm stuck in the smallest room in my house, so one of my toms is currently gathering dust.

The only thing you really need to upgrade is the cymbals.  Stock cymbals are the worst.  I'd recommend something like this (http://tinyurl.com/c4euam) or this (http://tinyurl.com/cckqvn).  Again, these aren't great cymbals, but they are satisfactory to me.  If money is extra tight, just buy a set of high-hats.  The other cymbals aren't necessary, just nice to have.

Good luck with all this!  Hope it works out.
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Dazed

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #68 on: 27 Feb 2009, 13:29 »

Hey drumming enthusiasts/The Drum Thread, I finally got around to doing a little more recording, and amazingly, on a day where I wasnt fucking up horribly too much (today). So, since I think it actually came out decent, I figured what the hell, let's share with the drum thread. Everything is done in 1 take, recorded on a USB headset mic into garageband. Anyway, I recorded three songs, enjoy.

Air Blower by Jeff Beck
http://www.mediaf!re.com/?imhjmuyjmiz

Plume by Smashing Pumpkins, just to get something from within our lifetimes  :-D
http://www.mediaf!re.com/?qtzwmywhwjm

Starship Trooper by Yes, the live version. There's like, a 10 second gap around 3 and a half minutes while I fast forward through some acoustic interlude nonsense.
http://www.mediaf!re.com/?yjozzfmzqyw
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Be My Head

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #69 on: 27 Feb 2009, 16:20 »

Wow, that was really good. You clearly have a much better sounding kit than I do! And a little more discipline to actually learn songs all the way through :P

My only 'criticism' is your foot could use some strengthening. Do you play heel up or heel down? I play a hybrid of both.
« Last Edit: 27 Feb 2009, 16:25 by Be My Head »
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Dazed

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #70 on: 27 Feb 2009, 16:30 »

I'd recommend buying some badass headphones and playing along with stuff. It's how I practice songs now, and it really helps with timing and learning things period.

Also, thanks, and I play heel up. I have the bass drum pretty heavily muted right now, and none of those songs are particularly bass heavy at all. I'll record some more foot-technical shit later this weekend. My right foot is actually pretty damn solid, my left sucks though.
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Be My Head

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #71 on: 27 Feb 2009, 16:34 »

I've got some headphones (Sennheisers), but I really have to mute everything in order for me to hear things properly, so I guess I'll get around to doing that eh?
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #72 on: 27 Feb 2009, 16:44 »

Possibly yeah, I mute all of my stuff.

http://www.vicfirth.com/product/buynow/product.php?button=SIH1

I use those, they are very quality stuff.
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Be My Head

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #73 on: 27 Feb 2009, 17:27 »

Thanks for the link, I'll definitely pick up a pair when I have the money.

I'll have to ask my bandmates whether or not I can plug these into anything (we're pretty low budget right now)
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KeepACoolin

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #74 on: 27 Feb 2009, 17:34 »

I use those same models and I think they're phenomenal for the price.  They're also pretty awesome for airplanes and just general music listening.
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Miniluv

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #75 on: 01 Mar 2009, 00:05 »

I have the same pair that I use for recording. I like them better than the $149 Shure Iso Earbuds.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #76 on: 01 Mar 2009, 06:41 »

First of all: two good references (1984, The Simpsons).  Second: does anyone else HATE earbuds?  I think they're really, really uncomfortable.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #77 on: 01 Mar 2009, 10:10 »

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uneducatedweasel

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #78 on: 02 Mar 2009, 17:13 »

Lo people. Been lurking for some time, thought I may as well add my thoughts.

+1 on those bose headphones. Having used the cheapest set I could buy for many years it was nice to hear bass again.

In terms of getting an upgrade to stock cymbals, I can really reccomend new staggs. The most recent run is unbelievable for the price. Really punch above the "name brands".

Fav Drummers would be the standards (Bonham, Moon, Mitchell etc). In terms of slightly more esoteric choices I would say Guy Davis of Reuben. His fill construction has really changed the way I play. That and he's a nice guy.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #79 on: 02 Mar 2009, 17:54 »

Nothing wrong with the classics.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #80 on: 06 Mar 2009, 08:29 »

My favorite drummer is probably Gene Hoglan

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tJbZLQ4Qy4
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #81 on: 10 Mar 2009, 07:40 »

Hey guys, what are some good ways to develop limb independence? I notice that oftentimes I can't get away with playing something different on my right hand and foot, so that when I hit the ride or hi-hats, say an extra time in the measure my right foot will follow along. It's just a tad bit annoying.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #82 on: 10 Mar 2009, 11:32 »

Practice, really. Try playing the part with only your feet until muscle memory will play it for you. Then use your hands to play along.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #83 on: 10 Mar 2009, 13:52 »

What really kills me, and I don't know why, is two handed hihat stuff.  I can never transfer properly with my right hand from hat to snare.  It's kind of annoying because I really want to play Sunday Bloody Sunday and some Foo Fighters stuff.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #84 on: 10 Mar 2009, 16:47 »

Yeah, both those issues are really just practice, practice, practice, practice, practice. Limb independence is pretty much the hardest thing.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #85 on: 10 Mar 2009, 18:46 »

I agree.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #86 on: 14 Mar 2009, 20:22 »

I spent 7 months learning theory, independence, and rudiments

BUT

I sorta suck with playing with people!

Any effective ways to work on this, other than the obvious play with lots of people a lot?
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #87 on: 19 Mar 2009, 18:43 »

Hey guys, what are some good ways to develop limb independence? I notice that oftentimes I can't get away with playing something different on my right hand and foot, so that when I hit the ride or hi-hats, say an extra time in the measure my right foot will follow along. It's just a tad bit annoying.


you know what? I'm just gonna go ahead and say it: rock band.

i'm not bullshitting you.



Alright here's something I've always wondered about: The Drummer's Poop.

I don't know if anyone else has experienced this, but since I incorporate a lot of double bass into my practice sessions, my lower body moves a lot. Has anyone experienced having to take a really wicked dump right after or during practice sessions often?
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #88 on: 20 Mar 2009, 10:24 »

hmm no, can't say i have.


in other, drum related, news i finally went and picked up my drums from my parents' house last week and i am so stoked. i haven't really played them much in quite a long time but now they are in my living room, accessible at all times. it is great.

espescially because my buddy is bringing over his computer today and we are going to record so many goddamn songs! whoooo
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #89 on: 21 Mar 2009, 13:28 »

Back when I was still an active drummer (fuck me, it's been 4 years) I had a lot of what you mentioned, Troll. Probably not to the same extent, because most of my left leg's movement was just me getting very active on a hi-hat.

So after not having played drums for several years, I'm thinking of getting back into it. I've never actually owned my own kit, but I know how to tune drums and all of that shit. I'm just wondering if I should save up and spring for a really amazing, high-end kit (like a Ludwig Vistalite, I plan on doing a lot of recording and maybe even gigging) or if I should just stop drooling over pretty gear, get something less expensive, and just upgrade as I keep going on with my music.

Also, everybody here should listen to some goddamn Caribou. I've only ever heard the one song "Twins" (thanks, Tommy) but holy SHIT I've never heard anything that amazing out of a single drummer.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #90 on: 21 Mar 2009, 13:33 »

Man, no matter what you do never, ever stop drooling over pretty gear. It is a part of our souls.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #91 on: 21 Mar 2009, 18:17 »

Drooling over pretty gear is okay, blowing tons of money on it when you've already proven you're capable of just stopping playing it is bad! Buy something cheap until you figure out whether or not you really want to keep drumming, then upgrade.

Speaking of upgrades and expensive things, does anyone have one these? http://zildjian.com/EN-US/products/productDetail.ad2?catalogID=1011&typeID=11&productID=1223

If so, is it awesome? I think I want one.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #92 on: 21 Mar 2009, 23:31 »

Well, I mean, I never really wanted to stop in the first place, but I never owned my own kit because neither of my parents ever thought it was important enough for them to put up with that kind of noise. I still dick around on my practice pad from time to time, but I've gotten so rusty that I would basically be starting over.

But if I had a kit, you can be damn sure I'd be playing that sucker at least as much as I do my guitars.
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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #93 on: 22 Mar 2009, 07:10 »

Eh, still, start cheap. Build up, replace, upgrade etc. as you progress.
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Trollstormur

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #94 on: 23 Mar 2009, 08:13 »

Speaking of upgrades and expensive things, does anyone have one these?

I've played with something similar before, and I really like them. That fella from Absu uses one and he makes it work.
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kyleg

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #95 on: 21 Apr 2009, 19:37 »

http://s386.photobucket.com/albums/oo310/kguillemette/?action=view&current=031.jpg

Just made my first major upgrade. Got a 10" deep Pulse maple snare to replace the crappy one I'd been using. Has completely reignited my interest in playing and improving. I couldn't stop paradiddling for like 2 hours. If there was anyone around, I would have easily drove them insane.
« Last Edit: 21 Apr 2009, 19:40 by kyleg »
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Dazed

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #96 on: 29 Apr 2009, 13:25 »

Hello Drum Thread, check this shit out:



YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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KeepACoolin

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #97 on: 02 May 2009, 19:14 »

Pretty.  Very pretty.
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Waferman

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #98 on: 03 May 2009, 12:46 »

Melanie Campell is my favorite drummer. In Frog Eyes, the drums are used less like a metronome or a conductor and more like another instrument.

No drum solos, though.

Drum solos, in my opinion, suck.
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Patrick

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Re: The Drum Thread
« Reply #99 on: 03 May 2009, 13:27 »

Melanie Campell is my favorite drummer. In Frog Eyes, the drums are used less like a metronome or a conductor and more like another instrument.

See also: Janet Weiss in her work with Sleater-Kinney. I am also partial to her work as the drummer for Steven Malkmus and the Jicks but she kicked ass in S-K.

That cymbal looks awesome, I bet it sounds bitchin'. I had a buddy back in the day who made his own one of these, but instead of shooting rivets into the cymbal, he just used electrical tape to attach some pennies to the cymbal. Sounded pretty convincing!
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