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Author Topic: Starcraft 2  (Read 95284 times)

Alex C

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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #50 on: 29 Apr 2010, 13:53 »

Void Rays have that "holy shit" factor I just can't shake.

I haven't played yet 'cuz I need a key, but I think void rays look a tiny bit clunky from a micro perspective, since they move with their enemy and you have to retarget fairly quickly to maintain their charges. The fact that they can chase things well is a plus considering the way they attack, but I bet it would get hectic fast if a good player was trying to hit and run my void rays and lure some of them near AA structures, particularly since you lose so much damage potential if you can't stay on top of things.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #51 on: 29 Apr 2010, 14:09 »

They're basically 'toss Guardian Aspects. They work best against stationary targets and structures.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #52 on: 29 Apr 2010, 15:49 »

Ive had a few rounds go to a late enough endgame where I had about 8-12 thors up and they absolutely devastate any "big" units the other races throw at you. Their special nukes the christ out of structures but no units are tough enough to really warrant the use, given how much damage your army is dealing if you have thors up as it is. Ultimately I find they are more useful in situations where your army is less mobile than your opponent's, great to have positioned for map control over fast dps pushes.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #53 on: 29 Apr 2010, 17:25 »

3 separate thoughts:

- Thors just make me miss Goliaths. Mostly because they were the only great ground-to-air unit Terrans had.

- Also, the most effective use of Terran I've seen has been rushing Reapers into your opponent's workers, and then while he's on his heels, building Banshees (supported by Vikings if necessary) to finish him off.

- I'm very, very glad that I've been playing all day and haven't seen "bide my time, mass battlecruisers, instant death." I don't know if that's still possible at this point, but it seems a rarity, which is nice.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #54 on: 29 Apr 2010, 17:28 »

I've seen mass cruisers once.

Right before I obliterated them.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #55 on: 29 Apr 2010, 17:31 »

Excellent. I've seen the same with mass carriers. Good to know that shit's taken care of.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #56 on: 29 Apr 2010, 18:23 »

It seems to me air units in SC2 are support and harassment, not armies. Rushing to air can win you the game depending on your race and your opponents race (e.g. Protoss vs. Terran should never have an early aerial victory, Terran vs. Zerg can) resulting in specific moments in the game when an air army will win it, but brood lords/carriers/battlecruisers are not a viable endgame frontline strategy vs. a competent opponent. They will, however, make delightfully short work of production.

Also:

- Also, the most effective use of Terran I've seen has been rushing Reapers into your opponent's workers, and then while he's on his heels, building Banshees (supported by Vikings if necessary) to finish him off.

This is the most annoying thing v. Terran. It makes every beginning strategy against them A) scout to check for Reaper rush, B) if confirmed rush to Protoss: forge/photon cannon in the middle of production, Zerg: speedlings, Terran: Marauders w/ concussion or Reapers a little bit faster.

It is the worst.
« Last Edit: 29 Apr 2010, 19:10 by Ozymandias »
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #57 on: 29 Apr 2010, 19:38 »

Yeah, it's about as bad as not rushing a Zerg play fast enough so that he's able to get a good number of Hydralisks and those fucking Guardian-esque things going.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #58 on: 29 Apr 2010, 22:09 »

I've been watching a lot of HDstarcraft and Huskystarcraft lately, and Husky going "Thor is here" in his Governator impression voice is absolutely magnificent.
The HDH invitational going on has been pretty good so far. I'm definitely happy with the players they've got and its made for some very entertaining matches. TheLittleOne is always a delight to watch, especially in the TLI matchup he played against Nazgul (game 2 is a fantastic round that should make everyone happy) and shows a lot of diversity in this tournament.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #59 on: 30 Apr 2010, 04:39 »

On the air thing, I've seen a lot of videos where the brood lords slaughter all ground units the opposition has. They have much better range than most (al?) ground-to-air units, and the broodlings effectively prevents the opponent from using speed to catch up to that range. Epic, epic units.
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Ozymandias

Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #60 on: 30 Apr 2010, 08:15 »

Well yeah, if your opponent has gone all ground and you've got the lords, you've got the game. It's one of the most frustrating and impressive things about this game: everything has a purpose and you have to know what's coming and what to build against it all the time.

Except ultralisks.

Ultralisks have no purpose.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #61 on: 30 Apr 2010, 08:53 »

I haven't seen them in action, but I just saw a video of a 3/3 Ultralisk take down 798 0/0 Zerglings with speed and glands. How the hell can that not be worthwhile?
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #62 on: 30 Apr 2010, 09:03 »

Poor ultralisks. They've always been sorta crappy; the only times I've ever really used them is during team games when I realized some newb was being carried by his teammate and didn't really get the whole concept of "focus fire." They soak bullets pretty alright, but it's not like you can truly tank in these games very easily. Did they at least do a better job of making their size less of a pain in the ass?
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #63 on: 30 Apr 2010, 11:57 »

http://www.gosugamers.net/starcraft/images/screens/sc2_zerg_262_big.jpg

This should be the best gauge of how big "ultra" really is.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #64 on: 30 Apr 2010, 13:05 »

Do they die as easily as Thor? They basically look like Zerg's Thor.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #65 on: 30 Apr 2010, 18:38 »

I checked out a wiki and it looks like Ultras have a lot more health than a Thor and can be considerably more armored after upgrades, which is nice. So much depends on micro and pathing though when it comes to melee units. If it can consistently mulch marines and tank down zealots they may have something there, but I've seen movies of good players abusing that fancy shmancy protoss Forcefield trick and frankly, they scare the crap out of me, so color me forever skeptical on the ultra's size. Obviously Ozy's opinion doesn't inspire any confidence either.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #66 on: 30 Apr 2010, 19:01 »

I haven't seen them in action, but I just saw a video of a 3/3 Ultralisk take down 798 0/0 Zerglings with speed and glands. How the hell can that not be worthwhile?

Was that confrontation really in competitive play or just people fuckin' around? Because yeah, an ultra can probably take down an epic amount of speedlings, but there's no reason for them to ever directly confront the ultra ever.

Thor is a worthwhile unit if used correctly. Thorship (attaching a Thor to a Medivac and flying him around) is the new Reaver drop, plus they provide decent anti-air support.They will pretty often lose to sheer numbers and, obviously, are easily countered by Marauders or Immortals, but are not too hard to use effectively.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #67 on: 30 Apr 2010, 19:30 »

Yeah, if nothing else their ground to air splash damage sounds like it'd be a great middle finger to extend to mutalisk swarms who want to pounce on your siege tanks. If Goliaths taught me anything it's not to underestimate the power of deterrence.
« Last Edit: 30 Apr 2010, 19:33 by Alex C »
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #68 on: 01 May 2010, 00:18 »

Was that confrontation really in competitive play or just people fuckin' around? Because yeah, an ultra can probably take down an epic amount of speedlings, but there's no reason for them to ever directly confront the ultra ever.

well, example of mass zerglings would be to soak their damage/attention to allow ranged to stay otherwise safe in distance, nothing like a mass of lings to plug a choke point for big units
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #69 on: 01 May 2010, 09:20 »

So yeah I got into the beta yesterday (pre-order whoo), and am basically unstoppable with terran and protoss. My question is, how the hell do you play zerg now? Like, I just can't seem to be effective with them, and I used to be almost unbeatable with zerg back in the day.

EDIT: Yeah, chrono-boost might be the most gamebreaking thing in the game.
« Last Edit: 01 May 2010, 10:17 by Dazed »
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #70 on: 01 May 2010, 13:33 »

Yeah, I can't get the hang of Zerg either. But I was never big into them in the first one, so I just attribute it to my inherent racism.

A good Zerg player is pretty much unstoppable mid- to late-game, though.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #71 on: 01 May 2010, 14:04 »

My question is, how the hell do you play zerg now?

My brother got in and he says the answer is more roaches.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #72 on: 01 May 2010, 17:40 »

I had no intention of doing this but...

[email protected]

I got a beta key today, help me get my Starcraft boots back on guys.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #73 on: 01 May 2010, 22:48 »

team liquid is holding a gold> tournament right now so if anyone wants to practice with me hit me up at velocifero.velocifero
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #74 on: 01 May 2010, 23:07 »

- Thors just make me miss Goliaths. Mostly because they were the only great ground-to-air unit Terrans had.

Well fuck me http://www.gametrailers.com/video/protoss-relic-starcraft-ii/64799

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/drakken-laser-starcraft-ii/64795
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/unexpected-encounter-starcraft-ii/64680

Seriously I know all you guys are really psyched for the multiplayer but I am really fuckin' pumped for the campaign because that's where all the serious shit goes down.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #75 on: 02 May 2010, 01:07 »

nice vids, cant wait.  when is the expected release date at this point?
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #76 on: 02 May 2010, 01:16 »

This year.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #77 on: 02 May 2010, 01:21 »

Kerrigan, Kerrigan!
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #78 on: 02 May 2010, 01:28 »

Well the sweetness lies in the fact that the original units from Starcraft are still in the game, it's just that they're not in multiplayer.
I mean there's a Goliath and a Scout right there guys

EDIT: And I would totally not be surprised if they played up this "Kerrigan gets redeemed" thing. As much of a cheesy ending it would be to the saga, I wouldn't mind.
Also I want to see Mengsk get impaled on something. Mengsk Sr, I mean. Man that guy is a total faggot.
« Last Edit: 02 May 2010, 01:30 by satsugaikaze »
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #79 on: 02 May 2010, 02:23 »

Reminds me that I just installed Starcraft, but haven't finished it.

I'm going to kill some reavers right now, if you'll excuse me.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #80 on: 02 May 2010, 09:51 »

Honestly, I'd rather see Jimmy live up to his word than see Kerrigan get redeemed.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #81 on: 02 May 2010, 13:50 »

Sounds like a Heel Face Turn. It's a classic trope of kids' cartoon shows for the good guys and bad guys to team up against an even bigger bad guy (Apocalypse or however you spell it in the X-Men cartoons comes to mind).
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #82 on: 03 May 2010, 01:37 »

I'm not quite sure - was Kerrigan really evil? I've not yet reached brood war in my fresh play-through, but as far as I can remember, she wasn't trying to wipe out humanity/the protoss, just getting controll over the zerg. Sure, she betrayed the good guys, but she just left in the end, instead of trying to murder them all like the Overmind did.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #83 on: 03 May 2010, 01:49 »

Kerrigan's ultimate goal in Brood War was to unite the Zerg under her command, yes, but there's an inherent problem in that the Zerg are fundamentally an organic version of Star Trek's Borg. They exist solely to spread and assimilate new races into their pool of genetic material.

By virtue of leading the Zerg, Kerrigan is A Big Problem.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #84 on: 03 May 2010, 05:07 »

I would be very disappointed if there is a redemption of Kerrigan in all honesty, I like her as the backstabbing harbinger of destruction for the universe much much better.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #85 on: 03 May 2010, 05:47 »

Yeah, blizzard definitely needs to ease up on the whole redemption thing. Keep some bad dudes bad, please.

Also, as far as the multiplayer in beta goes, does anyone know how they determine the favorability before the match? Like, during the loading screen when it says a team is favored, slightly favored, or even. 'Cause, I have yet to be favored in a single match, and yet I keep winning, not sure if that's how it's supposed to work or if the system even serves a purpose really?
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #86 on: 03 May 2010, 10:53 »

Alright, so I think I'm getting the hang of Starcraft with the Terrans again. I still need to get the hang of proper build order and how many of what buildings to build etc etc. I'm not building anywhere near fast enough to keep up with opponents of any real skill at this point.

Protoss are damn irritating to play against thus far.

Edit: mainly I think it's the issue of I have very little idea of what mixture of units to use for countering (haven't had a chance to seriously look and memorize) and dear lord I forgot how fast you have to be to keep up in this game.
« Last Edit: 03 May 2010, 10:56 by ackblom12 »
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #87 on: 03 May 2010, 11:46 »

I've been playing on my brothers beta account off and on a bit now and terran vs. toss is actually the only damn matchup I ever seem to win right now. I think it's because protoss's anti-air seems pretty vanilla sans void rays and the few games I've survived to mid-game with have allowed me to medivac my troops around with impunity (also I <3 banshees). It beats trying to just muscle in with siege tanks and such, anyway, since protoss ground is damn nasty (fuck charge) and obviously immortals vs. siege tanks isn't the best matchup.
« Last Edit: 03 May 2010, 12:13 by Alex C »
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #88 on: 03 May 2010, 12:00 »

I had a dream where Jim Raynor was my dad.  It was pretty rad.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #89 on: 03 May 2010, 14:25 »

This year.

They finally got a little more specific: it's now officially July 26th.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #90 on: 03 May 2010, 16:21 »

JUST IN TIME FOR MY BIRTHDAY
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #91 on: 03 May 2010, 22:41 »

This year.

They finally got a little more specific: it's now officially July 26th.
27th...

Either way, horay!
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #92 on: 03 May 2010, 23:02 »

ugh fighting mutas as terran suuuuucks
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #93 on: 03 May 2010, 23:06 »

Fighting terran as terran sucks. First you both get reapers. Then you both get banshees. Then you both get vikings to counter the banshes and during that time you have both expanded ones. And then starts the macro fest.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #94 on: 03 May 2010, 23:35 »

ugh fighting mutas as terran suuuuucks

Ironically, your answer may be moar Thor.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #95 on: 03 May 2010, 23:35 »

Granted, it's about the only damned time I think life might call for more Thors, but still!
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #96 on: 03 May 2010, 23:41 »

thors value increase tenfold once you reach about 8 of them, because they devastate any air force with mass splash damage. I'm stuck in this awful place where I am trying to master hot key/control group production so i am losing matches just due to mental lag, my record has shrunk down to 46-62 :(
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #97 on: 04 May 2010, 01:05 »

Yeah, and Thor get a big fat damage bonus against light critters. They're custom made for tearing apart mutalisk that get too close. Great deterrence.
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #98 on: 04 May 2010, 02:26 »

so watching beta matches on youtube, just wondering but are bunkers almost useless now?
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Re: Starcraft 2
« Reply #99 on: 04 May 2010, 04:54 »

The only place I've seen bunkers used is in expansion protection and reaper rushes. I think people figure that you'd rather have more marines pumping out more dps than more long-lived marines.
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