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New AnPC fashions. Cardboard all the way!

"Don't draw attention to it!"...Oh come on, its right in front of you!

Doo Dozem Cupcakes. (Shh, don't tell Dora!)

Umbersdood!

Bariste Vikings.

All bakers are berserkers... Except Elliot.

Godfather Negotiation...minus the checkered table cloth.

Faye & Padma - Its like bizarro world...

Awkward conversation

Okapi induced BSoD!

[Blackjoker]

I don't know if Hannelores expression is from trying to visualize an Okapi in space or a kind of odd consternation at someone following the conversation for this long.

[Emperor Norton]

Actually, hands clasped in front of her, while looking more downwards except when she speaks to Elliot seems a very shy stance.

Yes, if she was arching her back forward and raised her chin and smiled while holding her arms that way, it would look more flirtatious. There is more to the "flirtatious girl" stance than clasping the arms in front of you like that. In fact if you look closely even when talking to Elliot, she only raises her head as little as necessary. She looks at him by raising her eyes. And her facial expression is DEFINITELY not flirtatious.

So in my opinion, Jeph created a perfectly natural shy pose. Its also why he draws Hanners that way regularly.

[Carl-E]

Specious claims? 

You can't do that on the internet! 

 

[Is it cold in here?]

"It was a rhetorical okapi! You actualized it!"

[Kobukson]

Wait...if the "tallening" (as I like to call it) is due mostly to the spine, wouldn't that imply that the okapi would not grow taller significantly since their spine is horizontally oriented rather than vertically oriented and so gravity is not compressing the vertebrae down like springs?  If so, this would explain Hanner's reaction to me in that she was thinking "what, are you thick?" while poor Bakery Guy doesn't even know what an okapi is, hence his comment.

[Kugai]

Hannerboyfriend?

Hmmm, interesting.  They seem to have quite a few similarities.

This should prove interesting - Both with the possible union of TSB and CoD and further interaction between these two.

[TheEvilDog]

Hannerboyfriend?

Hmmm, no. (Especially after Elliot accidently created a BSoD with that Okapi question.)
Hannerfriend? Maybe. (Just heaven help him in case he ever mentions giraffes or tapirs)

[Carl-E]

Hannerboyfriend?

FYP

Ninja'd anyway.

[TheEvilDog]

Ninja'd anyway.

Ninja?

Ninja'd!

[Border Reiver]

Of course it's not truly "At Ease".  He's moving, and his head and eyes are not straight to the front. 

[The Duke]

Is the painting behind Hannelore one of the prints that Jeph made with four or the girls as the seasons?  Also, if anyone knows what I'm talking about can you link to them so that others may be enlightened?

It's been seen and noted before...

And I probably brought it up after you did then, too.  Oh well.

[TheEvilDog]

Poll results

Kinda hostile negoitations  0 (0%)
All's fair in coffee and baked goods  23 (37.7%)
Synchronised complaining  11 (18%)
Faye should never be allowed to set terms  1 (1.6%)
Neither should Padma  4 (6.6%)
tSB's boss is...a secret!  5 (8.2%)
tSB's wall and window art is kinda nice  6 (9.8%)
Wholesale for-What?!  1 (1.6%)
Faye Versus Padma! Round Two! Fight!  10 (16.4%)

Total votes - 61

[Carl-E]

Is the painting behind Hannelore one of the prints that Jeph made with four or the girls as the seasons?  Also, if anyone knows what I'm talking about can you link to them so that others may be enlightened?

It's been seen and noted before...

And I probably brought it up after you did then, too.  Oh well.

No, no one else in the thread even mentioned it.  But it struck me, and when you mentioned it this time...

Well, my wife says I have a lousy memory.  Can't remember anything she says.  But it seems my memory's more visual, not auditory.  Except music, but those are patterns, like math.  Not dry, boring stuff like words. 

[pwhodges]

Hannerboyfriend?

aaaaaaaand out come the Hannelore/Elliot shippers #jeezguys #jeez #seriously #daaaaaaang

Tsk! Tsk!

No reason not to be friends, though.

[DSL]

Two coffee houses, both alike in dignity
In fair Northampton, for the scene is here,
from secret strife break forth to new mutiny,
where cupcakes make barista words unclear

From forth the counter space of these two foes,
Pugnacious Peach and Padma talk of trade
Of bread for bean, and bean for bread
Can such talk be without bosses made?

As baker and barista spin their scheme
OCD girl and berserker talk of space
and effects of its low gravity
on the male of the okapi race

The fearful parsing of this pixel'd tale
and continuance of ship and forum lore
is naught but moderator could remove
and which Jeph endeavours to ignore

The which, if you with f5 key attend,
what here shall miss, his toil shall help you umbersdanb

[iduguphergrave]

Please give me your address so I can deliver the 50 internets you just won.

[SirDudley]

*applauds DSL's adaptation of Romeo and Juliet's prologue*

[akronnick]

*clap*



*clap*



*clap*



*clap*



(and so forth...)

[CompSarge]

Two coffee houses, both alike in dignity
In fair Northampton, for the scene is here,
from secret strife break forth to new mutiny,
where cupcakes make barista words unclear

From forth the counter space of these two foes,
Pugnacious Peach and Padma talk of trade
Of bread for bean, and bean for bread
Can such talk be without bosses made?

As baker and barista spin their scheme
OCD girl and berserker talk of space
and effects of its low gravity
on the male of the okapi race

The fearful parsing of this pixel'd tale
and continuance of ship and forum lore
is naught but moderator could remove
and which Jeph endeavours to ignore

The which, if you with f5 key attend,
what here shall miss, his toil shall help you umbersdanb

This just made my day.

[tomart]

"The fearful parsing of this pixel'd tale"     Golden!  

Hanners' shy arms pose is common in anime & manga.
And I think she's flummoxed by the glaring flaw in his logic:  
To whatever extent the male spine expands, the female's would expand proportionately, negating any comparative change!  
Her face is like, Jeez... (automatically reducing her estimate of his intelligence.)  Poor Hanners; most people will disappoint you.


'Ere yon he stumbles back, worn and weary
from the ever-growing thicket of widening, branching paths,
though never twice the same far-winding way;
by yet another tvtropes link led astray.
 
 And thanks, Carl, for a clever new sig:
"my wife says I have a lousy memory.  Can't remember anything she says."

[Akima]

Two coffee houses, both alike in dignity

Bravo! Very clever! We are not worthy etc...

Hanners of all people should know that there is no "lack of gravity" in space; objects in orbit (like space-stations and their occupants) are in free fall, in a gravitational field not much weaker than on Earth's surface. I know people often do talk about "zero-g" etc. but I'd expect Hanners to be more exact.

[Grantzilla]

Two coffee houses, both alike in dignity
In fair Northampton, for the scene is here,
from secret strife break forth to new mutiny,
where cupcakes make barista words unclear

From forth the counter space of these two foes,
Pugnacious Peach and Padma talk of trade
Of bread for bean, and bean for bread
Can such talk be without bosses made?

As baker and barista spin their scheme
OCD girl and berserker talk of space
and effects of its low gravity
on the male of the okapi race

The fearful parsing of this pixel'd tale
and continuance of ship and forum lore
is naught but moderator could remove
and which Jeph endeavours to ignore

The which, if you with f5 key attend,
what here shall miss, his toil shall help you umbersdanb

[iduguphergrave]

Two coffee houses, both alike in dignity
In fair Northampton, for the scene is here,
from secret strife break forth to new mutiny,
where cupcakes make barista words unclear

From forth the counter space of these two foes,
Pugnacious Peach and Padma talk of trade
Of bread for bean, and bean for bread
Can such talk be without bosses made?

As baker and barista spin their scheme
OCD girl and berserker talk of space
and effects of its low gravity
on the male of the okapi race

The fearful parsing of this pixel'd tale
and continuance of ship and forum lore
is naught but moderator could remove
and which Jeph endeavours to ignore

The which, if you with f5 key attend,
what here shall miss, his toil shall help you umbersdanb

[0kamisama]

Sorry to be one to blow a big hole in your logic shield, but if Hanners grew up on a space station, where (presumably) there would be little gravity, wouldn't the constant weightlessness have made her much taller?


Oh, and what movie is the slow clap from?

[akronnick]

The effect of weightlessness on height only lasts while you're weightless.

[Method of Madness]

Oh, and what movie is the slow clap from?

CItizen Kane.  Watch it ASAP.

[Boomslang]

Oh, and what movie is the slow clap from?

Rosebud

Okay, I'll admit, I've never actually watched Citizen Kane. And I feel bad about it, I really do, but considering that's one of the most common memes on the internet, based on one of the most lauded movies in cinematic history, it's legitimately strange to me that someone is ignorant of both sides of it.

Kind of like finding someone who thinks Greenland is the size of North America.

[Method of Madness]

Watch it.  Also:

throws a 2 at her

There's no such thing as 2.

[pwhodges]

Have you come across Flatland?  It's a story built on attempting to explain or demonstrate concepts that don't exist in your listener's framework.

[Skewbrow]

The weightlessness vs. length of spine topic is somewhat more complicated. The effect is real and can be observed on Earth as well. IIRC we all lose about half an inch during every day due to compression of the disks in our spines (a bit more, if we strain ourselves, like run a marathon or something), but regain it during the night, as the stress on the disks is absent. But:

• in all sci-fi the orbital space habitats have simulated gravity caused by spinning the station about an axis, because
• otherwise visiting a toilet becomes messy, and
• if you spend an extended period of time in zero/low gravity, then returning to normal gravity becomes problematic: IIRC some of the Soviet cosmonauts developed heart problems upon returning to Earth, NASA has studied the matter as well, and IIRC reduction of bone density may also occur. The latter would surely make any attempt to grow taller in this way a bad idea.
• OTOH sci-fi writers also emphasize the merits of half-gee sex: less strain in supporting yourself or your partner, but still enough pressure applied to the right spots.

Yeah, Hanners would certainly be aware of the first point, as she has grown up at a space station.

Why are we analyzing this to death? (ok that was a dumb question) Let's just hope that Hannelore and Elliott are about to find a new friend.

[DSL]

Sorry to be one to blow a big hole in your logic shield, but if Hanners grew up on a space station, where (presumably) there would be little gravity, wouldn't the constant weightlessness have made her much taller?


Oh, and what movie is the slow clap from?

Jeph had her say on Formspring the station spun to simulate 1g around the rim. ... That'd be a huge space station, much bigger than 2001's double wheel, unless you wanted to spin it fast enough to cause other problems.  But, yeah, even if that wasn't the case, she's been living in surface gravity for years now, and would have shrunk by now. ... Whoops, I see Skewbrow has been here whilst I was typing, and in greater detail.

Also, glad you liked my Shakespearean foray; my favorite is actually Henry V but that doesn't apply to the CoD/tSB storyline ... At least, not yet. And I do need to see Citizen Kane.

[Carl-E]

EVERYONE  needs to see Citizen Kane.  Also The Maltese Falcon, Casablanca, and The Third Man. 

And for a second tier of cultural references, The 39 Steps, Kind Hearts and Coronets, and the original Psycho. 


-----------------------------------


This message brought to you by the former President of the Purdue Film Society (1984)

[TheEvilDog]

Watch it.  Also:

throws a 2 at her

There's no such thing as 2.

Thats the whole point you muppet.

[Is it cold in here?]

I think he was quoting Futurama. Bender had a nightmare in which he saw a 2, and Fry consoled him by saying there was no such thing.

[iduguphergrave]

If you look closely during Bender's "nightmare" you can actually see the 2. It amused me 

[Near Lurker]

You know, this is making me wonder why Hannelore even has the strength to stay upright on Earth...

[Method of Madness]

Cold is correct, as is IDUHG.  And PW, I've heard of Flatland but I've never read it.  I'm pretty sure it's in the public domain, though, so I'll check Gutenberg.

Modifier: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOn_ySghN2Y About 10 seconds in, on the bottom.

[pwhodges]

Flatland:  You need the pictures, so try this.  Gutenberg has text only, and there's a version with ASCII art, which I guess will be pretty poor; these are linked from the end of the Wikipedia article I linked to before.

[Deadlywonky]

to generate 1g artificially, you would need a habitat with a radius of 224m to spin slowly enough so that you did not get sick every time you turned your head (minimizing Coriolis forces) resulting in a ring habitat with a circumference of 1.4km on the outer wall

[Kugai]

to generate 1g artificially, you would need a habitat with a radius of 224m to spin slowly enough so that you did not get sick every time you turned your head (minimizing Coriolis forces) resulting in a ring habitat with a circumference of 1.4km on the outer wall

Or an Omega Class Destroyer   

[Method of Madness]

PW - Thanks so much for that!  I'm downloading the ePub version right now.

to generate 1g artificially, you would need a habitat with a radius of 224m to spin slowly enough so that you did not get sick every time you turned your head (minimizing Coriolis forces) resulting in a ring habitat with a circumference of 1.4km on the outer wall

That sounds like the setup for an overly complicated "your mom" joke.

[Skewbrow]

to generate 1g artificially, you would need a habitat with a radius of 224m to spin slowly enough so that you did not get sick every time you turned your head (minimizing Coriolis forces) resulting in a ring habitat with a circumference of 1.4km on the outer wall

In an attempt to reverse engineer your figures: that radius gives a centrifugal acceleration very close to 1g, if the angular speed is exactly 2 full revolutions per minute, so I assume that was the target. Apparently by calculations and testing they have found that at that rate the nausea is tolerable.

Trying to figure out the cause of nausea is giving me a headache. At the moment my best theory is that it is caused by the difference of Coriolis forces experienced by the person's left ear and right ear. Unless I fumbled the math that difference is at its peak, when your nose (= the direction of your rotating head that bisects the angle between your ears) is pointing in the 'bending' direction of the floor. Another way of looking at it is that your one ear is then travelling along the rotation of the habitat while the other is travelling against it, and thus the ears experience different 'local gees' causing nausea.

When your nose points in the direction of the "flat floor", then the motion of your ears is parallel to the axis of rotation, and then the Coriolis force is equal to zero.

Anyway, 1.4km /30 seconds is slightly over 100 mph. That outer wall is really moving.

[Is it cold in here?]

Space station options: get acclimated to the Coriolis force, as people get used to being on rocking ships, or do a small station on a long tether from a counterweight. Refinement: make your nuclear reactor your counterweight, using the distance to reduce the need for shielding.

Why am I spending a sunny day designing space stations for imaginary people who already have their own?

[Deadlywonky]

Because it's great fun.

Skew, to the best of my knowledge (one of my lecturers at uni), the nausea is caused by a form of travel sickness: if you are standing, facing the direction of spin, and you rotate your head 90 degrees to the left, your eyes tell the brain that the body is stationary,  but because one ear is accelerating into the direction of travel, and the other accelerating away, the perception is that the head is tumbling forwards, as this is not backed up by the eyes, the nausea results.

Cold, that is an idea that's been trialed, NASA looked at it on some of the Gemini missions (11?), and were able to generate a small measurable (but not felt) acceleration around the ATV using a long tether. It is probably the most practical method for a small habitat at the moment, but it would be very difficult to dock any spacecraft to the module, due to the circular flightpath, unless you had a docking tube running to the center of rotation.

one proposed method is having a centrifuge area where the astronauts sleep, as they'd be immobilized they could be exposed to much greater rotation, hence the module could be much smaller. as a result it could be part of a ship (although from memory the destroyer from B5 didn't have anything big enough to be realistic)

[Is it cold in here?]

Try this only with an empty stomach:

Get in a swivel chair, spin around in it like a kid would, then lean forward.

[rje]

Compression of the spine, eh?
Does that mean if you lost a lot of weight (say 100 lbs) you'd actually grow taller, because of less weight compressing?
(I am an inch and a half away from 6 ft and I know it's dumb but I want that inch so bad arg)

[TheEvilDog]

Compression of the spine, eh?
Does that mean if you lost a lot of weight (say 100 lbs) you'd actually grow taller, because of less weight compressing?
(I am an inch and a half away from 6 ft and I know it's dumb but I want that inch so bad arg)

I'm literally just under 6ft, not that 5'11" crap, I mean I am that fraction under 6ft. So, yes, I know your pain.

[BlueMark]

one proposed method is having a centrifuge area where the astronauts sleep, as they'd be immobilized they could be exposed to much greater rotation, hence the module could be much smaller. as a result it could be part of a ship (although from memory the destroyer from B5 didn't have anything big enough to be realistic)

That doesn't make sense. Extended bed rest is physiologically very similar to zero g - that is how they do studies on the effects of long duration flights.  You need g-force to stress your bones and prevent decalcification, but even in high g fields there is very little stress on your skeleton during bed rest. Nope. Sleeping quarters are in the low g-sections near the axis.

A full g equivalent is not necessary for long durations - a small fraction should be sufficient to keep your bones healthy and strong. Muscles may be less developed - but that is easily addressed with exercise. The minimum G force needed for long term health is not known, but a half g would seem reasonably safe, and hopefully 1/3rd g too if we are ever to do more than visit Mars. Recent research suggests that it may only be necessary to spend relatively short periods of time exercising in artificial high g on a regular basis to maintain health in zero or very low g environments. So it should be the gym, not the bedrooms in the high g section.

But ... that all applies to healthy adult astronauts ... not a growing child. HannerDad would have been remiss to allow a growing girl to grow in less than a constant, stable 1 g environment.

[BlueMark]

Compression of the spine, eh?
Does that mean if you lost a lot of weight (say 100 lbs) you'd actually grow taller, because of less weight compressing?
(I am an inch and a half away from 6 ft and I know it's dumb but I want that inch so bad arg)

I'm literally just under 6ft, not that 5'11" crap, I mean I am that fraction under 6ft. So, yes, I know your pain.

Get an inversion table, or make some friends in the BDSM community who have a rack. You can gain that extra height ... but it will only be temporary.

[Boomslang]

I know there have been studies of invertebrates in freefall- have they done any experiments with mammals in space, to view the results on the offspring? I haven't heard of any, and that'd be quite instructive, I'd think.