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[LeeC]

MCU US Government: The avengers are too dangerous to stop major threats because of collateral damage

Also MCU US Government: Lets nuke NYC to stop Loki

[Torlek]

It was actually the World Security Council that was going to nuke New York. So it was the secret, shadowy world government.

[LeeC]

Why Thor ISN’T Immune to Electricity

[TheEvilDog]

Disney are making a final push to make Endgame the highest grossing film of all time. They're doing this by rereleasing Endgame in selected theatres with a deleted scene after the credits. Considering they're 30 million dollars off, they might just do it.

[LeeC]

Well Avatar re-released too so its par for the course.

[Tova]

Disney are making a final push to make Endgame the highest grossing film of all time. They're doing this by rereleasing Endgame in selected theatres with a deleted scene after the credits. Considering they're 30 million dollars off, they might just do it.

That is a kind of marketing genius, but they could take this a lot further.

They ought to have, say, three different “deleted” scenes, and show just one of them after the credits of each screening so you need multiple viewings to see them all.

And one of them should be rare.

[Cornelius]

A bit like the ending of Clue, you mean?

[Tova]

Yeah, except not with the crucial metaphorical "whodunnit" scene, just a bonus scene.

[TheEvilDog]

That is a kind of marketing genius, but they could take this a lot further.

They ought to have, say, three different “deleted” scenes, and show just one of them after the credits of each screening so you need multiple viewings to see them all.

And one of them should be rare.

Haha, I can see someone trying that. But the truth is that Endgame is nearing the end of its cinematic run and Disney are looking to start pushing Toy Story 4 now. It certainly would have been a feather in Disney's cap if they could have made it the highest grossing film in history, but they'll have to settle with it being the most successful film they've ever done instead.

[LeeC]

Something always bugged me about the end of Ragnarok and how the Asgardians fare at the beginning of Endgame.

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They end up taking all the refugees (that survive the trip) to earth to resettle. But why not Vanaheim? We even see Vanaheim in Thor 2 and it turns out at least one of the Warriors 3 is from there. So why not go to Vanaheim to regroup? I am sure they, being kinsmen of a sort, would be willing to put them up and get them back on their feet rather than Norway, Midgard where they try to be human.

Its a nitpick to be sure, its just something that stood out to me.

[TheEvilDog]

Its to do with Thor's mental state.

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In a relatively short amount of time, he loses his mother, father, his friends the Warriors Three. Hela cuts out an eye. He destroys his own home. Then half the Asgardian refugees are killed by Thanos and Loki and Heimdall are killed right in front of him. And even after he forges Stormbreaker, he fails to kill Thanos, allowing the Mad Titan to snap his fingers. Hence why we get Lebowski Thor in Endgame. He sees himself as a failure, as a hero, as a king and as an Asgardian. And he's probably so desperate for some connection to his family that he goes back to Norway where Odin said "It could be Asgard". If he went to any other of the Nine Realms, people would still look to him as the King of Asgard, and he probably hates that thought, believing himself to be unworthy. In fact, that's why he's elated when 2013!Mjolnir came to him after talking to Freya.

[Method of Madness]

I really liked Far From Home. Saw it last weekend.

[LeeC]

[BenRG]

@LeeC,

Yeah, I start to get confused too.

[Theta9]

WAT

[dutchrvl]

The Room was definitely an underappreciated solo adventure of the winter soldier

[Tova]

Ha ha, The Room may have been many things, but I sincerely doubt that underappreciated is one of them.

[TheEvilDog]

Disney and Sony have failed to reach an agreement, so guess who is no longer going to be in the MCU. I'll give you a clue, his name rhymes with Hider-nan.

Instead Sony are going to go for a 3rd reboot...

[BenRG]

This is going to be very awkward for the MCU because Spider-Man: Far From Home explicitly set Spider-Man up as the new Earth-based primary character of the MCU.

[Tova]

They will work something out, I'm sure. They are extraordinarily good at this. I doubt they would have walked away without a plan B.

[JoeCovenant]

Either way, if Tom doesn't keep the role of YFNS-M then it'll be a bloody shame.

He's not been the most *true to actual comic* realisation of the character, but he has certainly been the most likeable/realistic 'kid thrown into a world of superherodom'.

[TheEvilDog]

Well with Spider-man still up in the air, might as well pass on some news from the Disney expo.

- There's going to be a She-Hulk series on Disney+, along with Ms. Marvel and Moonknight getting their own series.
- John Walker, aka USAgent will be in the Falcon and Winter Soldier series, played by Wyatt Russell.
- The "What If" series will have 23 episodes, one episode per film in the MCU.
- The episode for Captain America: the First Avenger is likely to be "What If...Peggy Carter became Captain Britain?", after two images were shown, one of Peggy in the Vita Ray pod and another of her charging ahead with a shield that had the Union Jack on it.

[Blue Kitty]

Don't forget this

[TheEvilDog]

Didn't forget.
Didn't know it was happening.

[BenRG]

I know Kamala Khan is going to appear, either in an animated form or in a live-action show. However, I really, really want it to be a Miss Marvel/Squirrel Girl team-up.

[Theta9]

Don't forget this

True story: a few months ago I picked up the first couple volumes of Unbeatable Squirrel Girl and no sooner do I say "OMFG this is the BEST THING EVER" than I discover Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur, falsifying my previous statement.

[Blue Kitty]

I know Kamala Khan is going to appear, either in an animated form or in a live-action show. However, I really, really want it to be a Miss Marvel/Squirrel Girl team-up.

They did that! I liked it

[LTK]

Regarding Endgame.

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Time travel is

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FUCKING

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BULLSHIT

[TheEvilDog]

To be fair, the writers of Endgame discuss this.

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Basically they wrote themselves into a corner with how Infinity War ended. There was no coming back from such a fundamental change in the wake of Thanos' snap. Granted, the "time heist" kinda felt like an end-of-season-clip-show, but what could they do? The bad had won and achieved what he wanted. Most of their allies were in dustbins or blowing in the wind. The stones were rendered useless. Its not so much that time travel is bullshit, its that they tried to keep people from guessing what would happen across both films that they shot themselves in the foot.

I mean, I would have loved it if we had gotten the scene where Cap tells Thanos "so long as one person stands up against you", we didn't get it, but it was implied. Just that one moment where Thanos realised he could never win...and then Nebula could have stolen the Infinity Gauntlet off him. But we didn't.

Time travel wasn't the best way they could have solved the problem, but it could have been worse. Far worse.

[Tova]

Yeah, they could have had a female character upstage the males. The fans would have stopped overlooking the film’s flaws real quick.

[BenRG]

The thing to remember is that the Stark-Pym time-travel system seems to have the assumption that all connected decision paths in any given universe are connected on a quantum level. So, using the system, you're not only going to certain time and space coordinates but also choosing between connected time-lines too.

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That's very obviously how Steve Rogers got back at the end of Endgame.

This 'connected multiverse' concept seems to be key to several aspects of MCU Phase 4. So long as the time-lines have a common origin point (probably by way of the use of the Stark-Pym system), you can travel 'sideways' between them. Basically a fifth direction of motion that is only accessible via the Quantum Realm.

[LTK]

That's still very spoilery, Ben. Surprisingly, this aspect was the one thing that didn't get spoiled for me.

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Steve living his whole life in the same timeline is still bullshit because Hulk said at the beginning you can't change the past. So unless there was a stable time loop and Steve merely fulfilled his destiny by going back to his own time, it couldn't have been done. And this timeline was definitely not the one where Steve has always been in the past.

Also let's not forget that the price for saving this timeline was fucking over at least one other timeline, because Loki got the Tesseract back and they couldn't do shit about that. Unless I'm forgetting something and this would have happened anyway.

I can see how they wrote themselves into a corner with this but that's no excuse. Thanos's plan had always been asinine anyway, and he gets so close to realizing this when he says he sees how unhappy people are with the result, but then he simply assumes the problem is with them instead of him. Yeah, you collapsed every civilization and ecosystem in the entire universe, but you took issue with people not being grateful for it.

His plan to make a whole post-scarcity universe instead actually made sense! Nobody would have agreed with it still, but there's an 'ends justify the means' aspect that would actually have made Thanos's "The hardest choices require the strongest wills" shtick justified. There would be a better universe at the end of it, but people won't accept that because they're too attached to the status quo, yada yada. It practically writes itself.

[JoeCovenant]

You know what's worrying?

These writers are paid so much money it's criminal...

But are we meant to believe that they wrote Infinity War and Endgame at different times?
And if so... HOW could they be ALLOWED to write themselves into a bloody corner?

[TheEvilDog]

Sony and Disney have reached a deal to allow Tom Holland to play Spider-man for at least two additional films. So that's going to cover the third Homecoming film and a future Marvel Studios film. My guess will be it's going to be an ensemble film.

[BenRG]

FWIW, the MCU Spider-Man is young enough that the ensemble film could be the rumoured Young Avengers.

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I believe that Marvel Girl and Lady Hawkeye have already been confirmed to appear in upcoming Disney+ shows

[BenRG]

It occurs to me... seriously: Why not use Miles Morales if Tom Holland becomes unavailable to play Peter Parker for whatever reason?

But are we meant to believe that they wrote Infinity War and Endgame at different times?
And if so... HOW could they be ALLOWED to write themselves into a bloody corner?

We know this isn't true. Endgame was originally in pre-production as Infinity War Part II. I can't believe that the broad strokes of the film's story weren't in place before Infinity War wrapped. FWIW, I liked the use of time travel and, most importantly, I think that the hinted drawbacks/side effects are ensuring that it cannot turn into an easy reset button...

At least it isn't initially written that way but never underestimate what a poor hack writer may do some time in the future. Genies out of bottles and all that.

[Method of Madness]

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So unless there was a stable time loop and Steve merely fulfilled his destiny by going back to his own time, it couldn't have been done. And this timeline was definitely not the one where Steve has always been in the past.

We can't 100% know that. I'm not saying I like the idea, but it's been my interpretation from the start and it's at least possible.

[Thrillho]

Meth I cannot believe that was your comeback post

[Method of Madness]

Don't call it a comeback, I've been here for years.

[Pilchard123]

They did at the end of GotG 2, but IDK if the James Gunn thing caused problems with that.

[Gyrre]

To be fair, the writers of Endgame discuss this.

(click to show/hide)

Basically they wrote themselves into a corner with how Infinity War ended. There was no coming back from such a fundamental change in the wake of Thanos' snap. Granted, the "time heist" kinda felt like an end-of-season-clip-show, but what could they do? The bad had won and achieved what he wanted. Most of their allies were in dustbins or blowing in the wind. The stones were rendered useless. Its not so much that time travel is bullshit, its that they tried to keep people from guessing what would happen across both films that they shot themselves in the foot.

I mean, I would have loved it if we had gotten the scene where Cap tells Thanos "so long as one person stands up against you", we didn't get it, but it was implied. Just that one moment where Thanos realised he could never win...and then Nebula could have stolen the Infinity Gauntlet off him. But we didn't.

Time travel wasn't the best way they could have solved the problem, but it could have been worse. Far worse.

Wrote themselves into a corner my left asscheek. Thanatos has gotten the Infinity Stones at least twice in the comics . They had 30+ years of comics history to pick, choose, and improve from.

Any talk of writing themselves into a corner is just BS excuses for them being pretentious asshats and trying to keep fans from guessing what they were doing. I can't tell you how many excited posts I saw for people brining up Adam Warlock or Secret Wars or some other thing I've only got ancillary knowledge of. And these writers wanted to keep the fans from guessing. Good writing should be somewhat predictable. Especially when it comes to subjects the viewer has intimate knowledge on.

[Blue Kitty]

Shang Chi trailer just dropped

[LeeC]

So... the next Marvel phase is here...

Fantastic. Four-got about a lot of these coming out but I am intrigued.

[Farideh]

I'd better start saving up my money for movie tickets.

[BenRG]

MCU is in trouble and Marvel know it. It shows in the captions in the trailer-thing.

COVID19 could not have come at a worse time, with Endgame, the biggest challenge facing the franchise was to maintain its momentum and convince audiences that the story wasn't over; that there was still reason to continue to follow the series. So much more momentum has been lost and you can see in the trailer that Marvel are deliberately referencing the excitement of phases 1-3, claiming that, no matter how different it is, you'll still get the same positive buzz from the experience.

Post-COVID entertainment marketing is going to be weird, isn't it?

[dutchrvl]

Somehow I think Marvel will be just fine. Maybe phase 4 won't be quite as massive as what came before, but what could be, really?

[Tova]

Yeah, that trailer struck me as the polar opposite of a property in trouble.

[BenRG]

Really? It struck me as: "Hey, do you remember us? Do you remember that you liked us? Well, we're coming back and we want you to see that you should still like us!"

[dutchrvl]

Well, I suppose everybody will interpret things differently, but I think you’re reading way too much into this. If there is one franchise that does not need to worry about people coming to see their movies, it’s marvel, and people are yearning to start going to theaters again.
The beginning of this trailer to me is simply strong marketing by reminding people even more of what strong emotions movie-watching can bring. Most of it is more about the cinema experience itself than marvel anyway (even though they obviously would always be using clips from their own movies to make that point).

But hey, that’s just how I watched it.

[Torlek]

This is not a franchise that is struggling. This is a franchise that knows it is strong enough to throw the weirdest shit in its arsenal at the wall and make it stick.