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Author Topic: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)  (Read 499840 times)

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #900 on: 03 Aug 2015, 16:23 »

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #901 on: 03 Aug 2015, 21:08 »

No no no no no no no.

I knew this would happen eventually. 

Although part of me wonders why this is such a big deal.  I mean, Becky is 18, right?  So she can do what she wants?  Granted, if her parents are paying for college, they can easily withdraw her support and pull her out, but...she's still an adult and doesn't have any legal obligation to follow Commandment #__.  But I suppose her dad won't be so easy to convince...
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #902 on: 03 Aug 2015, 23:07 »

He already did pull her out. It's a big deal if he draws attention to the fact that Becky is staying there while not a student as she currently has nowhere else to live.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #903 on: 03 Aug 2015, 23:30 »

Things are going to be rough for a few days but, depending on how this goes, this could end up a good thing for Becky. Nothing good could come of her being in limbo and hiding out in Sal and Billie's room indefinitely. I think that, if he talks to Joyce, the conversation will be very interesting to read.

That said, I wonder if Joyce is going to end up getting in trouble with her parents for 'hiding' Becky and maybe because she is 'letting her misbehaviour continue' as if Joyce had any way to stop it.

Although part of me wonders why this is such a big deal.  I mean, Becky is 18, right?

It isn't that simple. A lot of folk still hold a very Roman view of families and family power dynamics. Although it isn't Biblically justifiable, I know that some men see themselves as a Paterfamilias and regard the members of their household as something over which they have been divinely granted absolute tyranny. As his daughter, Becky's dad may regard her as his property to which he can do as he wants until said 'property' is transferred to some other man at her marriage. Like a Roman, such a man would regard the idea of a girl or woman ever having independent agency over herself as incomprehensible nonsense.

Granted, if her parents are paying for college, they can easily withdraw her support and pull her out, but...she's still an adult and doesn't have any legal obligation to follow Commandment #__.

No legal obligation but he may regard what he perceives as his divine mandate to trump any human law. He could easily be as much of a threat to Becky's safety as Blaine is to Amber's if he decides that Becky is 'beyond repair'. 'Honour' crimes are rare in this particular culture but not unheard of.
« Last Edit: 03 Aug 2015, 23:54 by BenRG »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #904 on: 04 Aug 2015, 00:00 »

I have a feeling that somehow, Dina is going to kick his ass.
I don't know how, but I stand by my guess.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #905 on: 04 Aug 2015, 01:32 »

You know, it is entirely possible (although somewhat unlikely) that we are doing Becky's dad a disservice. After all, we only have Becky's word for what happened when she was withdrawn from Anderson. It is possible that Becky, upset and riding several emotional roller-coasters (including Joyce telling her that there was no chance of anything happening between them), exaggerated events somewhat.

It will be interesting to see everyone's reaction if his first reaction, upon seeing Becky, is to burst into tears, hug her and thank God that she's safe.

[edit]
More likely, this whole thing could very easily get hugely complicated. If Becky refuses to go with her father and claims that she is in peril from him, then, irrespective of her status vis the college, the Administrators would be obliged to hand the matter over to the police (possibly even the Feds if state borders have been crossed).

My guess is that Becky's father is one of those men who, no matter how morally self-righteous, has a strong aversion to making a public spectacle of himself, especially in a dispute where he is unlikely to get his way. I think that he’ll decide that he’d prefer Becky within easy reach of someone he knows and trusts (Joyce) than her missing and on the run whilst doing who knows what to support herself. He’ll transfer her to Indiana State but will sternly instruct Joyce that she must have intensive moral sermonising sessions with her at least daily to ‘cure’ her of her ‘deviancy’ and that he’ll hold her personally responsible for the outcome.

This means that we will witness occasional calls to Joyce from Ross asking for status reports, the practical upshot of which will be that Joyce will become a skilled and plausible liar. When graduation comes, it is possible that Joyce may never be able to go back to her home church because Ross will have her cast out for being party to his daughter’s behaviour.
« Last Edit: 04 Aug 2015, 03:13 by BenRG »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #906 on: 04 Aug 2015, 03:19 »

I... honestly don't see that happening.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #907 on: 04 Aug 2015, 03:28 »

I... honestly don't see that happening.

Which part? My previous post contains two nearly diametrically-opposed options.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #908 on: 04 Aug 2015, 04:10 »

Pretty sure that's Becky's dad in the background of the last panel....

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #909 on: 04 Aug 2015, 04:14 »

I... honestly don't see that happening.

Which part? My previous post contains two nearly diametrically-opposed options.

I posted before you edited your post, s'coooz me.

But Willis has said that he hates writing Becky's father, so option number one seems implausible.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #910 on: 04 Aug 2015, 04:17 »

Has Becky's dad shown up yet?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #911 on: 04 Aug 2015, 04:27 »

Has Becky's dad shown up yet?

Yep; he's in the last panel of today's strip (8/4/15)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #912 on: 04 Aug 2015, 04:40 »

Willis hates writing Becky's dad? This is an example of me not knowing things because I've only ready Shortpacked! and DoA. I could understand why it would be distasteful to write a character like Becky described, but the way that was worded suggests there's other reasons...
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #913 on: 04 Aug 2015, 05:20 »

Has Becky's dad shown up yet?

Yep; he's in the last panel of today's strip (8/4/15)
Sorry, I meant had. As in, before today. His appearance today is why I asked.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #914 on: 04 Aug 2015, 05:39 »

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #915 on: 04 Aug 2015, 05:45 »

So no, just in a flashback.

(And thanks, I always forget about the tags)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #916 on: 04 Aug 2015, 06:48 »

I really don't see this as a tearful reunion. Other than I don't see this as ending in anything other than tears. I rather doubt he will be as overtly evil as Amber's father, but still harmful in his controlling ways as he tries to 'fix' his daughter. The last time he tried to do that he pulled her out of a Christian school and made her come home, because apparently the school wasn't doing a good enough job or something. I doubt this encounter is going to go any better. And being legally an adult is one thing.. Becky might be eventually allowed to go free, legally. What happens to her between now and when the law forces the issue is another matter. Not that I think things will go that far, this is Willis' writing after all. But this still has the hall marks of Becky being outed as a vagrant staying at the school, quite possibly having the to make the choice of being forced to go back home or becoming homeless and jobless in this city. Alternately someone could help her cut all dies with her family and arrange funding to enroll in Joyce's school properly.

There is another factor people haven't brought up. Joyce has been ducking her own very religious and controlling family over this issue for a while now. It will be getting back to them soon. I doubt they are going to be any happier about the situation than Becky's parents are. They might even want to do the same thing and try to pull Joyce out of the school as it is obviously a 'corrupting influence'.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #917 on: 04 Aug 2015, 06:59 »

@Neko_Ali,

WARNING! Spoiler Picture

My guess is this might be Joyce's reaction when Ross informs her that he'll be telling her parents that she is "conniving in my daughter's sin" and will insist that they 'discipline' her. That might even go so far as to him to promise to raise it publicly during the next church service and turn it into a matter for their broader community.

He strikes me as that kind of a guy, especially if he can't get his own way with Becky for whatever reason.

Either that or Danny tells Joyce that he's attracted to Ethan; Joyce doesn't know whether to be morally scandalised or horribly jealous of a 'rival'.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #918 on: 04 Aug 2015, 07:12 »

meh, I doubt Joyce would see Danny as a 'rival'. I mean she always new on some level that Ethan was gay and not attracted to her. I've said before I think that's why she started dating him. He was a guy, but he was safe because he wouldn't try to rape her like the ass at the party did. Remember when she ran out of the class, Ethan was the ONLY person she didn't see with her rapist's face. Also it was a lower level safe as it let her have the 'boyfriend experience' without engaging in  pre-marital hanky-panky.

They were a kind of co-dependent couple... Each acting as a beard for the other for different reasons. But now that Joyce is in her 'I must help the gays!' mindset I think she would be equally delighted and repulsed by the idea of Ethan and Danny smooching. (Because it's all about the sex you know....) Much the same reaction she had over Becky and Dina. That shock/horror expression seems more like she just walked out of the room and saw Becky's dad in the foyer....
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #919 on: 04 Aug 2015, 15:21 »

At any rate, the preview art Willis posted for November 10th shows that things are about to get very real.

SPOILERS
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #920 on: 04 Aug 2015, 15:30 »

(click to show/hide)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #921 on: 04 Aug 2015, 15:35 »

At any rate, the preview art Willis posted for November 10th shows that things are about to get very real.

SPOILERS

I'm going to spoiler tag this even though it's the dumbest possible theory:

(click to show/hide)

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #922 on: 04 Aug 2015, 15:51 »

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)

Back to the subject of Becky's rights vs. her dad's beliefs...I guess I've been an atheist so long I no longer understand religious fundamentalists and their ironclad patriarchal beliefs.  So even if Becky is legally an adult, Ross can still fuck things up for her.  Sigh.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #923 on: 04 Aug 2015, 15:52 »

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #924 on: 04 Aug 2015, 15:54 »

Why are so many people looking up spoilers?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #925 on: 04 Aug 2015, 16:03 »

BECAUSE THEY'RE THERE.

Honestly, I don't mind spoilers.  Knowing what's going to happen doesn't ruin the story.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #926 on: 04 Aug 2015, 16:12 »

I only see them because I follow Willis on Tumblr. I don't consider the image previews to be spoiler-y usually because they're close-ups and seem to be to show off big expressions. Although I also seem to be in the minority for taking them at face value and have no interest in speculating about them.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #927 on: 04 Aug 2015, 16:14 »

I think he's about to run into Amazi-Girl
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #928 on: 04 Aug 2015, 23:53 »

I've got this weird feeling that there is something that we're not being told yet. Ross could have legitimately gone to the College Administrators, told them that he was looking for a missing family member and arranged a meeting with Joyce through them (Ruth would likely have passed on the message or the admins would have texted Joyce's cell with-it). Instead he seems to be trying to stay off IU's radar. I'm wondering if his actions at Anderson have led to official concerns about him and Becky's safety being raised.

Regarding the spoiler: Ross is obviously a strong man and could seriously hurt someone. However, it's far enough ahead (90+ strips) that, for example, it could be something completely unrelated like the outcome of Raidah shooting Sarah in class in a moment of drug-fuelled vengeance, as a random example.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #929 on: 05 Aug 2015, 00:10 »

I've got this weird feeling that there is something that we're not being told yet. Ross could have legitimately gone to the College Administrators, told them that he was looking for a missing family member and arranged a meeting with Joyce through them...

I see several obstacles to this scenario, actually. One of which is that administration putting a random person in contact with a student without that student's consent is probably a FERPA violation.

I sometimes work at an information desk for a university, I know for a fact that if I get a call asking ' is [insert name here] a student here' or 'how can I contact [insert student here],' it's illegal for me to give out that information, the only exception being that if they say it's an emergency I can transfer them over to the police department. That's probably what Ross would have to do in this case, but if he tells the police his (adult) daughter is missing, he'll have to answer questions, and when she is found the police will get her side of the story, and he probably doesn't want that.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #930 on: 05 Aug 2015, 01:13 »

The point is, why is he even having to ask 'is Joyce Brown a student here'? The Browns would have confirmed it to him if he was still on speaking terms with them. He didn't need to talk to Joyce, only ask Admin to pass to Joyce a message to call him regarding Becky and give them the Browns' telephone number to verify that he is legit. As I say, everything about this suggests that he's been burning bridges, even with those with very similar beliefs to him.

A lot of it can be explained by impatience. Instead of wanting to find Becky and spend the necessary time to persuade her to do as he asks, he clearly wants to go storming in and forcibly drag her off to what is effectively a privately-run prison camp now because he's a man and men act decisively or some other gender identity inadequacy complex delusion.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #931 on: 05 Aug 2015, 05:57 »

The point is, why is he even having to ask 'is Joyce Brown a student here'? The Browns would have confirmed it to him if he was still on speaking terms with them. He didn't need to talk to Joyce, only ask Admin to pass to Joyce a message to call him regarding Becky and give them the Browns' telephone number to verify that he is legit.

Legitimacy means very little in the eyes of FERPA. I'm telling you, it doesn't matter if a person knows their parent's phone number, home address, birthday, and eye color, if they're trying to contact a student they are either going to get transferred directly to university police or I'll eventually have to hang up on them. He could have the Browns pass a message to her, based on this phone conversation I think that already happened.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #932 on: 05 Aug 2015, 06:09 »

Since he's putting up 'missing persons' pictures and questioning random students in the halls he may have already run into an administrative brick wall. Becky has been at the school for a couple of days now. Coming to see Joyce seems like the most likely thing she would do since they were best friends. And I got the feeling their circle of friends was pretty small. Joyce may have been the only one they couldn't get in contact with, so now Ross has come to see for himself. Or maybe he didn't even think to call administration at all. Either out of mistrust or a desire to handle it himself. I imagine either way a guy wandering around the campus asking where his daughter is may raise a few red flags with what recently happened with Amber's dad showing up and doing the same thing.

I am wondering where exactly they are. The checkerboard floor looks the same as when Dina was following Jacob and Radiah. They then went into the elevator so that Jacob could 'walk her home', with Joyce and Ethan coming out. So is this the ground floor of the co-ed dorms they all live in? The rest of the area seems to be lounge and meeting areas, which makes a little bit of sense to have. But the colleges I've been in the dorms are separate from the lounge and meeting room buildings. Dorms didn't have lounge floors, just entryways that led straight to the dorm halls.

It looked like Ethan and Joyce didn't go outside from the time they came out of the elevator to finding Dina outside the LGBTQ meeting room, which makes me think they're all in the same building. Her walking out and seeing Ross could blow the whole thing open. Even worse is if Ross sees her in the meeting room and jumps to conclusions.

Also, was anyone else amused that today's character tags were just Dina, Ross?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #933 on: 05 Aug 2015, 06:26 »

The Hall of Residence most of the main (and secondary) characters live in has a large and grand entrance hall, based on this strip. I agree that they are currently in the entrance hall of that building.

There are a lot of significant time-jumps to factor in here. The Questioning Meeting is taking place at Galasso's, a favoured watering hole for students that is either on or nearby the campus. So, for whatever reason, DMW has skipped over the journeys from and to the Hall of Residence.

Regarding the issue of Amber's dad, I strongly suspect that his actions, combined with what is going to follow in this arc, will lead to IU instituting much more stringent campus security, possibly including locks on the communal entrance doors and CCTV coverage of exterior areas and entrances. This may ultimately make it harder for Amber to operate as Amazi-Girl and may lead to her setting up an box room off-campus as her 'Amazi-Loft' from where to operate.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #934 on: 05 Aug 2015, 06:31 »

The questioning meeting is taking place in the residence hall, but Galasso has delivered pizza there.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #935 on: 05 Aug 2015, 12:37 »

I'd enjoy this arc more if we hadn't just had the whole parental bad influence thing happen recently.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #936 on: 05 Aug 2015, 13:56 »

Dina's thought bubble made me laugh.

"I must save her from herself." is a worrying phrase.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #937 on: 05 Aug 2015, 14:05 »

I think we are going to see a different direction of the whole parent/child disagreement thing. Amber's dad isn't just some poorly intentioned but well meaning father. He was a vicious bastard with huge anger management issues intent on criminal kidnap, at the very least. Becky's dad is trying to do what he things, what he was taught, a good, Christian father will do and save his daughter from her wicked and evil ways... He's wrong, but he is I think working from a genuine position of love, which cannot be said of Amber's dad.

As a side thought... I don't think the hospital entrance and ambulance picture is indicative of violent action. I've got a sneaking suspicion that will we wind up a screaming match between Becky and Ross, with the other cast standing by horrified or trying to chime in and Ross winding up collapsing due to stress/heart condition whatever. It's a bit cliche but a valid way for both sides to get past the argument over who gets to control Becky's life and and to an attempted reconciliation.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #938 on: 05 Aug 2015, 17:44 »

I'm hoping Dina says nothing before she speaks to Becky.

She's not stupid, and I'm sure she has some memory of Becky's feelings about her father.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #939 on: 05 Aug 2015, 21:26 »

Hmm. I have a feeling Dinah is taking Becky's dad to a place that does NOT include Becky. She knows things went badly with bringing Amber's dad in, she had a flashback and everything, and Dinah doesn't seem the type to mechanically make the same mistake so soon.
I'd enjoy this arc more if we hadn't just had the whole parental bad influence thing happen recently.

Dude, I started reading about eight months ago. If I hadn't gone on a two day archive binge, I wouldn't know what you're talking about. It's recent only in comic time.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #940 on: 05 Aug 2015, 23:21 »

I'm actually quite worried for Dina's safety. If she deliberately leads Ross on a wild goose chase, he might get angry and I've got the feeling he's one of the sort of alleged 'Christians' who think that hurting or even killing someone outside of his ridiculously narrow definition of 'person' is not morally wrong.

It will be a horrible shock for Joyce if she sees someone whom she's probably been assured by her parents is a morally good authority figure unmasked as a barely-controlled violent psychotic. I think that her parents will have a hard time explaining it to her and, if they don't have a good excuse, it could destroy their relationship with her.
« Last Edit: 06 Aug 2015, 02:01 by BenRG »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #941 on: 06 Aug 2015, 04:32 »

Would Willis really repeat the plot point of a violent parent, though?
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Welu

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #942 on: 06 Aug 2015, 04:47 »

I think this will be more like Walky and Sal's parents. A much less overt "evil" and more realistic parental fuck up.

Neko_Ali

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #943 on: 06 Aug 2015, 06:47 »

I think a little more on point.. Becky and Joyce grew up together. I'm sure she's been around Ross a lot in her life time. If he was some barely suppressed rage a holic, she would be well aware of it by now. And Becky surely would have mentioned he was violent and abusive instead of just a controlling fundamentalist patriarch.
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Welu

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #944 on: 06 Aug 2015, 12:56 »

Thought: I'm guessing we're supposed to read Dina as thinking, "The last time I let a father in, something bad happened." but I wonder if she might be thinking, "Amber told me about her father and he's awful. Maybe Becky hasn't mentioned her father because he's okay?"

I doubt it, especially based on her expression in the last panel, but it crossed my mind.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #945 on: 06 Aug 2015, 16:20 »

Hooo boy
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #946 on: 06 Aug 2015, 21:41 »

As I suspected, Dinah's DECIEVING Becky's father! Why do I worry it'll happen that Becky chose this precise moment to go shopping? Or Joyce?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #947 on: 06 Aug 2015, 23:14 »

Ross's speech patterns are very strange. I noticed it really from the start; it's more like he's reading pre-written and rigorously-grammar checked policy papers rather than saying what's on his mind. Is it deception? Is he trying to appear reasonable when he is not?

I called that he wouldn't recognise a triceratops. I'm just shocked that he knows what a Pokémon is!
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #948 on: 07 Aug 2015, 05:41 »

That honestly does not surprise me. There was a bit of a kerfluffle a while back, mostly as a joke but I suspect people like Ross would take it seriously, that Pokemon was evil because it supported evolution. Not that it showed 10 year olds wandering freely around the countryside with no adult supervision capturing wild animals that were also sentient and self aware and forcing them to fight... But because they could evolve in game. Even though evolution that they argued against doesn't work like that. They were offended by the very presence of the word. Becky and Joyce's parents very much seem to fall into that stereotype. Not that it would matter. He'd still think Dina was evil for wearing a dinosaur costume because the Earth is only 6000 years old and the fossil record is a lie told by Satan. So therefore she is a servant of the evil one because you know, science.

As for why it sounds like Ross is reading from some badly written script... Because he is. One of the key things in this kind of fundamentalist, extremist brainwashing is making sure that the people do not question what they are taught. Constant repetition of the stories and lies that make up whatever the cult thinks or is supposed to think and repression of any kind of free will or independent thought. So yeah, when asked their opinion they do pretty much sound like robots just repeating back what they were told because that's exactly what is happening. That's why critical thinking and questioning ideas are the worst things for these kinds of cults.... and therefore considered some of the worst sins by them.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #949 on: 07 Aug 2015, 12:45 »

It's interesting reading two people who don't use contractions but they have very different speaking styles.
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