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How will the archaeophiles break into the bunker

Ardent upgrades their steam shovel into a Dig-o-matic
The old fashioned way since Alice doesn't want Arden'ts secret to get out
Alice punches her way through
Sedna shoots her way through
They actually find the door and just enter in that way

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Author Topic: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016  (Read 13128 times)

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #50 on: 14 Aug 2016, 11:03 »

Do those oval windowed internal doors resemble any current noteworthy/notorious US buildings? I've seen them on a late 60s IT suite in the UK, albeit not in a panelled room, but doubt that's the inspiration...

Also, any new thoughts on Geography - threads past. Illi crater is interesting, I would have thought the blink would have  filled in nuke craters, and is Illi = Illinois a fair assumption do you think?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #51 on: 14 Aug 2016, 11:27 »

Anyone else notice the scene outside this guy's window? Looks like he's in a flooded city. New York after a sea level rise, perhaps?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #52 on: 14 Aug 2016, 12:05 »

Anyone else notice the scene outside this guy's window? Looks like he's in a flooded city. New York after a sea level rise, perhaps?

I did and those buildings must be built of some highly durable material to survive 5000 years of neglect. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #53 on: 14 Aug 2016, 16:11 »

Is that supposed to be teeth? Looks very weird. At first I thought it's a moustache. If they are teeth they are very weird teeth, or maybe I'm just not familiar with some anime conventions.

I'm talking about the fourth panel of the last Alice Grove, can't find a way to link to it directly.
« Last Edit: 14 Aug 2016, 16:31 by zmeiat_joro »
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #54 on: 14 Aug 2016, 18:40 »

Is that supposed to be teeth? Looks very weird. At first I thought it's a moustache. If they are teeth they are very weird teeth, or maybe I'm just not familiar with some anime conventions.

I'm talking about the fourth panel of the last Alice Grove, can't find a way to link to it directly.

You have to click on the "archive" link to get the link to the particular page.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #55 on: 15 Aug 2016, 06:56 »

Looks the same to me as most conventional cartoon ways of depicting teeth.

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #56 on: 16 Aug 2016, 10:38 »

Looks the same to me as most conventional cartoon ways of depicting teeth.

But definitely not the way Jeph usually draws mouths though. Its a very US politician smile I think, doubtless intentionally. Possibly the way the lack of significant lips accentuates that, but he seems to draw many characters without much in the way of lips.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #57 on: 16 Aug 2016, 12:42 »

Looks the same to me as most conventional cartoon ways of depicting teeth.

But definitely not the way Jeph usually draws mouths though. Its a very US politician smile I think, doubtless intentionally. Possibly the way the lack of significant lips accentuates that, but he seems to draw many characters without much in the way of lips.

Definitely the way a certain other cartoonist (who looks an awful lot the same as this character) likes to draw teeth though. 


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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #58 on: 16 Aug 2016, 14:53 »

Oh gawds, he looks like the love-child of Gendo Ikari and Bill Gates.  That is most certainly a recipe for disaster.

I'm starting to get a Big O vibe from this story.  The world was magically reset after an apocalyptic war and we have this mysterious character ruling over what appears to be the partially submerged ruins of a major city much like Paradigm City's Alex Rosewater.  Perhaps he is a fusion of all 3.   
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #59 on: 19 Aug 2016, 10:08 »

New Comic!

Alice is proposing to punch her way through the roof of the bunker. She says this with the sort of calm expression that tells me that she entirely expects this to succeed. This, by the way, puts her in the Superman-level in terms of brute physical strength.

Suddenly, I find myself wondering just what the upper limit of her strength might be, assuming that she has one. Could it be that her standoffishness may be because she lives in a world of cardboard (warning TV Tropes link)?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #60 on: 19 Aug 2016, 11:12 »

New Comic!

Alice is proposing to punch her way through the roof of the bunker. She says this with the sort of calm expression that tells me that she entirely expects this to succeed. This, by the way, puts her in the Superman-level in terms of brute physical strength.

Suddenly, I find myself wondering just what the upper limit of her strength might be, assuming that she has one. Could it be that her standoffishness may be because she lives in a world of cardboard (warning TV Tropes link)?

Possibly.  Even though Alice was evenly matched with Sedna if the fight continued there was likely to be a lot of collateral damage (Ardent and Gavia) and for that matter when she first fought Gavia she might have thought she was up against another immortal and didn't want her town to be destroyed in the fight.  As such she may prefer to talk rather than fight considering what the outcome could be.  However, I think outliving everybody probably affects her psyche in ways we couldn't possibly understand. 

Congratulations to all those who predicted Alice would punch her way in. 

The little guy wants to visit with Ellie, but I doubt she'll be speaking alone.   
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #61 on: 19 Aug 2016, 12:00 »

Interesting that its just "little guy".  That must say something about his/the country's political system if he's the head honcho and not recognised. But then maybe  he's not the country's boss.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #62 on: 19 Aug 2016, 12:04 »

I doubt that he's boss of much more than the flooded city and its immediate surroundings. Post-Blink Earth doesn't have much in the way of long-range communications and certainly doesn't seem to have the population to support standing armies of any significant size. Most regions seem to be mostly autonomous to the point where very little seems to be known about the world outside of them (even by people like Alice, whom you would expect to want to keep informed).

Basically, whatever power the Little Guy has would come from his ability to offer Ellie something that she wants.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #63 on: 19 Aug 2016, 13:47 »

Having seen Alice and Sedna with whatever their superpowers are, Gavia's use of nanotech, Ardent's discretionary and recreational use of non-baseline body modification, I'm wondering if the little dude is a have- or a have-not for this stuff. Given that he's physically small yet leads some kind of big organization complete with big goons, I'm betting on him having some new specialness that we haven't seen yet.

also, I wonder if he and Alice will have a "hello again, old [enemy|friend]" moment
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #64 on: 19 Aug 2016, 14:00 »

Having seen Alice and Sedna with whatever their superpowers are, Gavia's use of nanotech, Ardent's discretionary and recreational use of non-baseline body modification, I'm wondering if the little dude is a have- or a have-not for this stuff. Given that he's physically small yet leads some kind of big organization complete with big goons, I'm betting on him having some new specialness that we haven't seen yet.

also, I wonder if he and Alice will have a "hello again, old [enemy|friend]" moment

That's what I'm thinking otherwise the next scene is going to be very anticlimactic.

He has to know about Alice since the intelligence gathering would've undoubtedly required a visit to her village.  And he probably knows about Sedna since they've been following a trail. 

If he's not another immortal he could be another space dweller possibly marooned or defected and didn't lose his nanotechnology. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #65 on: 19 Aug 2016, 16:57 »

"So, we meet again old friend"
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #66 on: 19 Aug 2016, 23:33 »

"ALICE! THE BLONDE GODDESS ENDURES!"

"Oh god, it's the creepy fanboy! Before we start, no, I will not tattoo my autograph across your backside!"
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #67 on: 20 Aug 2016, 01:13 »

. Post-Blink Earth doesn't have much in the way of long-range communications
It must have something that travels orders of magnitude faster than a Struthi cart for the communications to have reached him. And even if you posit something as low tech as a carrier pigeon network then there's a substantial body of work just getting the pigeons distributed to what must be a huge network of agents. And there must be a huge number of agents because Alice/Sedna's route has intersected with an appreciable number which can only be at random. Reckon there's a lot going on we haven't been told about yet.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #68 on: 20 Aug 2016, 03:33 »

. Post-Blink Earth doesn't have much in the way of long-range communications
It must have something that travels orders of magnitude faster than a Struthi cart for the communications to have reached him. And even if you posit something as low tech as a carrier pigeon network then there's a substantial body of work just getting the pigeons distributed to what must be a huge network of agents. And there must be a huge number of agents because Alice/Sedna's route has intersected with an appreciable number which can only be at random. Reckon there's a lot going on we haven't been told about yet.

They might have telegraphs.  I don't see the lines anywhere, but maybe the mysterious stranger in the fancy carriage might have the lines running underground. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #69 on: 20 Aug 2016, 03:43 »

Heliographs perhaps?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #70 on: 21 Aug 2016, 08:34 »

"So, we meet again old friend"

On a totally unrelated topic, I was once privileged to go on a few business trips to Japan, separated by at least six months. At one point I picked up a slang Japanese phrasebook, and was all hyped up about being able to try out my new street slang. When I got off the plane, a business contact from my last trip was there to meet me. I sprang my cool new expression on him, which according to the phrasebook meant "good to see you again".

His face paled in horror. 

After he got his composure back, he told me not to use that expression again. He said it was only used by Yakuza and gangsters, and it was roughly equivalent to "so, we meet again, my deadly enemy."

Bad phrasebook. Bad. Bad.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #71 on: 21 Aug 2016, 08:41 »

My nipples explode with delight.  :-D
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #72 on: 21 Aug 2016, 12:53 »

My hovercraft is full of eels!
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #73 on: 21 Aug 2016, 14:23 »

Well sell them at the fishmarket then  :D
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #74 on: 25 Aug 2016, 18:07 »

Strip is up!

And our mystery man has a name.  Although his goon doesn't appear to be a Randy Milholland doppelgänger like I thought.

It would also appear that he has steam technology at least or possibly an early internal combustion engine in that carriage
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #75 on: 25 Aug 2016, 18:11 »

It appears we have a gray-haired Elliot with odd contact lenses there.  :roll:
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #76 on: 25 Aug 2016, 19:33 »

I don't think those are contacts.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #77 on: 25 Aug 2016, 20:59 »

This tiny individual seems oddly terrifying somehow.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #78 on: 25 Aug 2016, 21:37 »

I'm liking this guy less and less the more I see of him
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #79 on: 25 Aug 2016, 22:19 »

I've no idea what that pile of muscle standing next to Ellie might be (and think about how tall and broad she is when it towers over her like that) but something tells me that it isn't good news or particularly defensive in nature. This will almost certainly end in some kind of fight.

I'm liking this guy less and less the more I see of him

I think that Jeph couldn't have made Mr Pate's alignment more clear unless he'd given the character a tee-shirt with 'Primary Antagonist' written on the front! :-P
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #80 on: 25 Aug 2016, 22:33 »

The fact that he has a big goon working for him may indicate that he's just a normal human with hired muscle.  As such Ellie might not have any problems introducing him to Alice since she just said she'd punch a hole into the bunker and knows she could make short work of him.  However, this could be misdirection.  Mr. Pate may be another immortal, but prefers to have underlings do his dirty work unless he has to get involved.  He knew about the bunker and that could be due to him being around at the time of the blink.  I would find it odd that he wouldn't know anything about Alice considering everything they know about Ardent and Gavia would require his spies visiting her village. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #81 on: 26 Aug 2016, 07:51 »

I am curious about this little guy.

Is he wearing smartglasses or is it just an artistic choice that we can't see his eyes?

Is that a solar panel on top of his carriage?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #82 on: 26 Aug 2016, 12:38 »

Sure looks like a solar panel on top of a steam engine. Steampunk City?

It is a bit strange, ominous even, that Pate (I first read it Date - either it's a confusing font, or I need a new prescrition) and his agents are totally disinterested in Alice+Sedna.
  • Either Pate knows something about them that we don't, and can therefore afford to ignore them.
  • May be Alice and/or Sedna is one of those agents?

Anyway, Ellie knows she needs to stay in friendly terms with Pate. May be he really has been their main source of hints of good sites to dig, may be he is financing/supplying the team of diggers? Or, just is capable of making their life uncomfortable enough that Ellie thinks it's simpler to humor the man.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #83 on: 26 Aug 2016, 14:00 »

It could be both
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #84 on: 26 Aug 2016, 16:58 »

The fact that he has a big goon working for him may indicate that he's just a normal human with hired muscle.  As such Ellie might not have any problems introducing him to Alice since she just said she'd punch a hole into the bunker and knows she could make short work of him.  However, this could be misdirection.  Mr. Pate may be another immortal, but prefers to have underlings do his dirty work unless he has to get involved.  He knew about the bunker and that could be due to him being around at the time of the blink.  I would find it odd that he wouldn't know anything about Alice considering everything they know about Ardent and Gavia would require his spies visiting her village.

He either knows nothing about Alice and Sedna, or everything about them.

The heterochromia goon -- are we sure that's Mr. Pate's and not Ellie's? He just appears out of nowhere.  http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MismatchedEyes

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #85 on: 26 Aug 2016, 17:00 »

Solar panel or windshield. Maybe both, if a certain tech I'm reading about matured in time to survive the Blink. There's a person under the panel, where a driver would be on a stagecoach or carriage. Front part, if what looks like a radiator grille is in fact a radiator grille, suggests an internal combustion engine.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #86 on: 26 Aug 2016, 21:45 »

The heterochromia goon -- are we sure that's Mr. Pate's and not Ellie's? He just appears out of nowhere.

He's wearing the same white-shirt/gray-suspenders combo as Mr. Pate and his cap looks like a chauffeur's cap, so I think he's probably the driver whose legs we can see in the first panel. He may have been shutting down the carriage engine, or at least banking the fires, while Mr. Pate started chatting with Ellie.

Edit for further thoughts:

Front part, if what looks like a radiator grille is in fact a radiator grille, suggests an internal combustion engine.

The smokestack, though, strongly suggests a steam engine.
« Last Edit: 26 Aug 2016, 21:52 by Storel »
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #87 on: 27 Aug 2016, 08:26 »

It's obvious that Mr. Pate is not the slightest bit interested in Ellie or her discoveries this time, and really wants to meet her guests. He's not really being very subtle about it either. More evidence for the ubergeek assessment.

His glasses seriously glow, like Dale's. I have to wonder what available technology makes that possible, and what makes it useful. Are these AR glasses? HUD with internet connection? Or just a way to see in the dark? Any of them seem impossible post-blink to me, and his carriage doesn't seem to have advanced beyond the Industrial Revolution, so what's his technology deal?

Solar panel? How is that combined with the apparent steam engine? Or maybe they're totally separate, and the solar panel is the power source for his glasses or some other tech hidden in the carriage?
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #88 on: 27 Aug 2016, 11:22 »

Solar panel? How is that combined with the apparent steam engine? Or maybe they're totally separate, and the solar panel is the power source for his glasses or some other tech hidden in the carriage?

You can generate steam with solar heat; it could be an ultra-efficient light-to-heat converter material that was dug up at some point in the past. Note the lack of smoke coming from the cart so it is unlikely to be using coal or wood to heat its boiler.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #89 on: 27 Aug 2016, 12:50 »

Note the lack of smoke coming from the cart so it is unlikely to be using coal or wood to heat its boiler.
Ideally you arrive at your destination with the fire just going out, so not necessarily.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #90 on: 27 Aug 2016, 15:16 »

Plot Twist:  The Glasses are May
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #91 on: 28 Aug 2016, 04:31 »

Note the lack of smoke coming from the cart so it is unlikely to be using coal or wood to heat its boiler.
Ideally you arrive at your destination with the fire just going out, so not necessarily.

True, but if this carriage is steam driven then it would need to lug around its fuel source since there isn't much wood to burn out there and I doubt there are any colliers.  I could be wrong since the wagon train could've passed through some settlements that have coal for sale, but if this carriage is like a locomotive without tracks then it would need wood or coal.  It could also have an internal combustion engine, but unless it's very fuel efficient it's even more unlikely that there would be a gas station along the way to refuel which would make such a vehicle unreliable.  As such it is quite possible that it runs on some advanced solar power technology that was recovered as BenRG conjectures. 

As for the glasses Mr. Pate may prefer mirrored glass to obscure his eyes either because it looks intimidating or to disguise some abnormality.  I find it difficult to believe that anything as sophisticated as Dale's glasses could be found intact and still be operational after so many millennia and even if it miraculously did work there isn't any internet for it to link with. 

However, it may be a gift from someone who does possess such technology.  Perhaps Mr. Pate is a collaborator of the Praeses and for his loyalty he's rewarded such trinkets. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #92 on: 29 Aug 2016, 15:15 »

I'm pretty sure Heterochromia Goon was the tall guy we only saw the torso of in the "two weeks previous" strip.

He looks like he was badly broken and put back together uncarefully.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #93 on: 30 Aug 2016, 04:46 »

Possibly. But also, when the population is large enough, there will be people who are taller than 6ft10in and have shoulders the size of barn doors. Such a person is more likely than your Joe average to get hired as security. Even if they have the character of an Elliot-like gentle giant.
Mismatched irises add to the fear factor (meaning that the character will hardly ever be tested).

The point was that with enough natural diversity in the population, there is less need for bio-engineering folks to meet rare specs. That's why China did well in the Olympics.
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FunkyTuba

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #94 on: 30 Aug 2016, 15:25 »

..with enough natural diversity in the population, there is less need for bio-engineering folks to meet rare specs...

Sure... your point is well taken and is valid for natural populations. This population is being carefully selected for our viewing pleasure by Mr Jacques... I think Chekhov's Heterochromia might apply  :claireface:
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retrosteve

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #95 on: 31 Aug 2016, 12:32 »

Sure... your point is well taken and is valid for natural populations. This population is being carefully selected for our viewing pleasure by Mr Jacques... I think Chekhov's Heterochromia might apply  :claireface:

Well, TVTropes has this to say about plot devices involving heterochromia:

Quote
When a character has differently colored eyes, it may represent one of the following:

    Duality Motif: Differently colored eyes foreshadow/reinforce a dual nature about the character.
    Electronic Eye: One eye is cybernetic.
    Glass Eye: One of their eyes is a prosthesis.
    Magical Eye: One eye grants them magical powers.
    Mark of the Supernatural: Marks the character as special in some way, whether as magical, nonhuman, or something else entirely.
    Real Life: Heterochromia iridum Bear in mind that while healthy individuals can have this, it is often a sign of medical problems.
    Red Right Hand: To foreshadow/reinforce something evil about the character.
    Shared Unusual Trait: Two or more characters have differently colored eyes because they're related or connected somehow.
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Neko_Ali

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #96 on: 31 Aug 2016, 13:08 »

Given that the left eye is almost white and only has a pinprick of an iris, while the other is normal size, I'm think it's a glass eye and not heterochromia.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #97 on: 17 Sep 2016, 14:10 »

Given that the left eye is almost white and only has a pinprick of an iris, while the other is normal size, I'm think it's a glass eye and not heterochromia.

Glass eyes are usually made to look as real as possible -- why would someone make a glass eye that looks weird? I'm thinking the left eye is more likely to be natural (and have had some kind of injury or disease).
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BenRG

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #98 on: 17 Sep 2016, 14:14 »

Given that the left eye is almost white and only has a pinprick of an iris, while the other is normal size, I'm think it's a glass eye and not heterochromia.

White irises and pinprick pupils are usually an easy visual cue for blindness or injury. It's possible that we're about to find out the upper resilience limits of the Immortals.

"What happened to his eye?"

"I fired an artillery rail-gun into his face."
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Storel

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - August 2016
« Reply #99 on: 17 Sep 2016, 14:43 »

Or, if Alice is only recognizing his type rather than him, personally, the strange eye may be some kind of weapon system.

I'm thinking that she recognizes him, though. Like someone else said, I bet she took him apart once, and Mr. Pate put him back together.

Why would she be so nervous if she's already beaten him before? Well, maybe she only beat him because she had a weapon available that she doesn't have now.

On the other hand, you'd think he'd show more recognition of her if she'd beaten him up in the past. So maybe she is simply recognizing his type.

On the gripping hand, if he were a recognizable type, wouldn't Sedna recognize him too? Argh, I wish Jeph would go back to 2 strips a week. So much uncertainty!
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