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What will they find in the bunker?

A rocketship without any signs of plot twisting
No rocketship, but some answers to our many questions will be found
The last AI
The Holy Grail
Only what they take with them.

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Author Topic: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017  (Read 11092 times)

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #50 on: 16 Jan 2017, 13:00 »

Now they've found the Transport Shuttle, the net task is to find something to fuel it with and getting the exit clear.   It looks like the Shuttle is some kind of Launch Tube/Bay.  It's going to be interesting to see where the exit is and how they're going ot dig it out if they have to.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #51 on: 17 Jan 2017, 09:40 »

New hypothesis for why Pate is bringing Alice along: her pre-Blink skillset included piloting. Thus the question in last week's strip where Pate implied Alice knew how to get an orbiter out.

I concur with the idea that the hanger doors lead to an opening in a sheer cliff. So the archaeophiles weren't wasting their time - there was no way to get to the hanger entrance, or even know it was there. Once Pate & Co. force the doors open, it'll be a clear shot to orbit.

Like the way Jeph is taking advantage of an illustrated narrative's ability to effortlessly create large spaces. If this were cinema they'd have to either build a giant set or resort to CGI.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #52 on: 17 Jan 2017, 09:43 »

My idea is similar but I'm imagining that Jeph already has a 'money shot' in mind where, as they approach the end of the electromagnetic launch rail, the hanger door doesn't open so they have to blow it open. The last panel is thus a dramatic shot of the shuttle emerging from a huge explosion.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #53 on: 17 Jan 2017, 11:11 »

I'm not convinced that Alice and Sedna were part of Pate's plan. He wants into orbit, so he needed the techno archaeologists to find a spacecraft. He knew in general at least about the existence of pre-war beings like Alice because of Church. But he never bothered to go collect them. It wasn't until Ardent came into play that he decided to get involved. I would say that he sees Ardent's ability as a shortcut to get into space. Now that he has an orbiter, he doesn't need to spend the time and expense to get it working if Ardent can do that with a touch. Alice and Sedna are complications. Without them he can easily force Ardent to do what he wants. He can't ignore them because they would keep coming after him to save Ardent. Forcing them to work for him though keeps them in line for a little while. Depending on how arrogant he is, he may think he can keep them under control in space. Or once the orbiter is working again he just might have Church buy him enough time to launch with only Ardent on board. He could just leave them all there and launch with just Church, but it seems unlikely that he would give up such potential power that Ardent represents.
« Last Edit: 17 Jan 2017, 15:13 by Neko_Ali »
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #54 on: 17 Jan 2017, 14:38 »

Pate needs Church with him in orbit, to be able to demand things from the Praeses.
Maybe he wants to rule the solar system, or get a nanotech upgrade or  two for himself; longevity and Gavia's offensive/defensive powers for a start.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #55 on: 17 Jan 2017, 18:01 »

Pate needs Church with him in orbit, to be able to demand things from the Praeses.
Maybe he wants to rule the solar system, or get a nanotech upgrade or  two for himself; longevity and Gavia's offensive/defensive powers for a start.

I think this is right. Pate and Church are a double-act, like Penn and Teller. Except in this case it's the shorter one who talks.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #56 on: 17 Jan 2017, 20:53 »

It'd be funny (and be a "kick the dog" moment) if he sacrifices Church to launch the spaceship...
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #57 on: 17 Jan 2017, 23:32 »

Pate needs Church with him in orbit, to be able to demand things from the Praeses.

I would laugh my butt off if the first thing Cupressence says when they walk into its arboretum is: "Ah, Mr Pate. We've been waiting for you for a while; as you've noticed, we went to some small trouble to attract your attention and bring you here."
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #58 on: 18 Jan 2017, 04:40 »

I'm not convinced that Alice and Sedna were part of Pate's plan. He wants into orbit, so he needed the techno archaeologists to find a spacecraft. He knew in general at least about the existence of pre-war beings like Alice because of Church. But he never bothered to go collect them. It wasn't until Ardent came into play that he decided to get involved. I would say that he sees Ardent's ability as a shortcut to get into space. Now that he has an orbiter, he doesn't need to spend the time and expense to get it working if Ardent can do that with a touch. Alice and Sedna are complications. Without them he can easily force Ardent to do what he wants. He can't ignore them because they would keep coming after him to save Ardent. Forcing them to work for him though keeps them in line for a little while. Depending on how arrogant he is, he may think he can keep them under control in space. Or once the orbiter is working again he just might have Church buy him enough time to launch with only Ardent on board. He could just leave them all there and launch with just Church, but it seems unlikely that he would give up such potential power that Ardent represents.

Sedna may not have been part of the plan since she kept to herself so few people probably knew of her location, but I'm fairly certain Alice was always going to factor into Pate's plan.  Ardent and Gavia wouldn't have left on their own to find a spaceship without Alice leading them so if they stayed put in her village sooner or later Pate would've arrived with Church to persuade them.  Perhaps he was planning to visit when he received enough intelligence, but had to postpone it when Alice left the village.  If he didn't need Alice he could have just ordered Church to kill her there or after he revealed his intentions.  As for Sedna he doesn't have a need to kill her since Church easily outclasses her and since she's from the past she has valuable knowledge he could use so capturing her is just an unintended bonus.  He won't leave them behind because they could cause trouble while he's away and he needs hostages so that he can intimidate Ardent into doing his bidding.  Ardent might be willing to sacrifice his life to thwart their plans, but he wouldn't risk everyone else. 

Strange that there isn't a lot more dust after 5000 years, but it's like Pate said they knew how to build bunkers in the old days. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #59 on: 18 Jan 2017, 05:03 »

What I was saying though was that Alice isn't necessary for Pate to get what he wants. Ardent provides a possible short cut to get him into space, while Alice and Sedna are problems to him. Right now he has them managed. But she doesn't want to work for him, and the longer he keeps her around the more chance she has to do something about it. We don't know that Church could kill Alice and Sedna. He was able to hurt Sedna, but again it's back to we don't know what their real capabilities are.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #60 on: 18 Jan 2017, 05:48 »

What I was saying though was that Alice isn't necessary for Pate to get what he wants. Ardent provides a possible short cut to get him into space, while Alice and Sedna are problems to him. Right now he has them managed. But she doesn't want to work for him, and the longer he keeps her around the more chance she has to do something about it. We don't know that Church could kill Alice and Sedna. He was able to hurt Sedna, but again it's back to we don't know what their real capabilities are.

Yes, we don't know what Church's full potential is which means Pate might need her to pilot the spaceship.  Pate knows a lot about Alice, but she knows nothing of him and only recognized Church as being one of her kind.  Church showed no sign of recognition, but then again his expression rarely ever changes.  It's possible he told Pate everything he knows about the known immortals and if Alice knew how to pilot a spaceship and Church remembered this then most likely Pate knows too.  However, even if he doesn't need her to pilot the ship like Sedna she has knowledge of the past which makes her too valuable to dispose of like Ellie.  While it may be a bit of a juggle to keep two lesser powered immortals at arms length Alice and Sedna know what Pate is willing to do and what Church is physically capable of doing.  Keep in mind Sedna is still recovering from her injury so if breaking Gavia's arm isn't enough he might up the ante by ordering Church break to Alice's leg if she doesn't need it to fly the ship. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #62 on: 18 Jan 2017, 21:52 »

And we're really getting on with the show now

The big show

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #63 on: 20 Jan 2017, 06:41 »

[Pate] could just leave them all there and launch with just Church, but it seems unlikely that he would give up such potential power that Ardent represents.
I don't think that he can leave them all there, at least unless he's prepared to stay in space forever. Bear in mind that (a) there's a second shuttle next to the one he and Church are gokng to use, and (b) Alice and Sedna remember most, if not all, of the tech necessary to revolutionize the world to pre-blink tech. Now, (a) is a stretch, since Church could wipe out all the other shuttles, but (b) is a real risk: Pate can't afford to fly away and come back to face the ground side with a reinvigorated tech tree, particularly if Ardent can super-power it.

No, I think that Pate needs to tie off those loose ends before he can leave.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #64 on: 21 Jan 2017, 10:04 »

Up.

Sedna getting all nostalgic:-)

Looks a bit timeworn though. Gonna need that Ardent fixup.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #65 on: 21 Jan 2017, 10:15 »

It wasn't making complete sense, until I realised I've spent the afternoon reading manga so was taking the panels from right to left by mistake!

If Pate just wants to bombard the Praeces in orbit, then the children might not be too happy about the effect on their friends and family (assuming such social structures still exist).
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #66 on: 21 Jan 2017, 11:08 »

Sedna as a space pilot confirmed?

Pate, old son, I hate to break this to you but Sedna was coming down to see her old bird again anyway.

What I'm worried about is that the Valkyrie is clearly a combat spacecraft. The temptation it's going to put in Pate's way to attack one of the orbital habitats or one of his foes on the planet will be enormous.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #67 on: 21 Jan 2017, 11:59 »

Alice Grove takes place on our Earth, confirmed.

Absurd romanticisation of 1940s Britain still happening in the future, confirmed.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #68 on: 21 Jan 2017, 12:25 »

But, using the name "Valkyrie" indicates that they were referencing it from the other side.

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #69 on: 21 Jan 2017, 12:31 »

Well after everything I suppose Pate now thinks they are on first name basis. 

If Pate just wants to bombard the Praeces in orbit, then the children might not be too happy about the effect on their friends and family (assuming such social structures still exist).

He wants to talk to the Praeses, but he needs to get there and get his foot in the door.  Normally Mr. Church could help him with that, but he might not be as effective in zero gravity so having a spaceship with weapons can compensate for that.  Of course it might not be the same vehicle after Ardent upgrades it and since he could will it to be a civilian mode of transportation it might not have any weapons to threaten the Praeses into negotiating.  It would also be a good way to turn the tables on Pate.  After 5000 years it will definitely need to be upgraded so it can be restored to working order as well as accommodate 6 people.  Since it was built for war most of the space is probably weapons payload. 

Alice Grove takes place on our Earth, confirmed.

Absurd romanticisation of 1940s Britain still happening in the future, confirmed.

Well for these 2 veterans yes, but Great Britain might as well be Atlantis as far as Ardent and Gavia are concerned.   
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #70 on: 21 Jan 2017, 12:42 »

Indeed, but our future is also their past. ;)
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #71 on: 21 Jan 2017, 12:58 »

... Ardent upgrades it and since he could will it to be a civilian mode of transportation ...
Has Ardent any control whatsoever over his tech upgrade process?  I thought (eg http://www.alicegrove.com/post/130233090364/and-were-back ) he had no control whatsoever.

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #72 on: 21 Jan 2017, 18:52 »

Alice Grove takes place on our Earth, confirmed.

Absurd romanticisation of 1940s Britain still happening in the future, confirmed.

Well for these 2 veterans yes, but Great Britain might as well be Atlantis as far as Ardent and Gavia are concerned.

Nah... they might actually have heard of Atlantis.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #73 on: 21 Jan 2017, 21:50 »

I looked back a while ago and realized we've known Jesper's first name since the beginning! I wonder why nobody's used it.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #74 on: 21 Jan 2017, 23:00 »

I don't know, but I have to admit that my first reaction was, "Who the heck is Jesper?"  :psyduck:
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #75 on: 22 Jan 2017, 04:33 »

I looked back a while ago and realized we've known Jesper's first name since the beginning! I wonder why nobody's used it.

Jesper would be fine if he really was just some mayor of a far away town, but he's dropped the pretense so it's more appropriate to address him by his surname. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #76 on: 22 Jan 2017, 13:34 »

So,  we're settin' up for the ride of the Valkyrie   ;D
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #77 on: 22 Jan 2017, 14:38 »

I think Pate used his forename to show his power over them by implying intimacy.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #78 on: 22 Jan 2017, 16:33 »

This article on the use of first names vs surnames may be of interest:
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/shortcuts/2013/apr/02/why-first-names-just-for-friends
Strange. I'd hate if someone called me Mr. (Surname). Just...no.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #79 on: 22 Jan 2017, 18:30 »

So,  we're settin' up for the ride of the Valkyrie   ;D

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #80 on: 22 Jan 2017, 21:54 »

Welcome, new people!
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #81 on: 23 Jan 2017, 04:37 »

... Ardent upgrades it and since he could will it to be a civilian mode of transportation ...
Has Ardent any control whatsoever over his tech upgrade process?  I thought (eg http://www.alicegrove.com/post/130233090364/and-were-back ) he had no control whatsoever.

Alice theorized that he can subconsciously influence what he upgrades:  http://www.alicegrove.com/post/129355329554/ardent-thought-about-bread-and-turned-gavia-into-a.  Unfortunately, it hasn't been tested out beyond a water pump, wind up toy bird, and now a flash light. 

Why is calling him by his surname more appropriate?

Because it reduces the intimacy by several steps. It makes it clear just how minimal you want your your relationship with him to be.

Indeed.  And this guy means business.  For the sake of brevity I call him Pate here, but this is definitely someone you would address as Mr. Pate in real life. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #82 on: 24 Jan 2017, 05:09 »

Is anyone else a little thrown by the pacing here? The story was moving pretty sedately for the first 160-170 pages or so, and then in the last fifteen comics, the speed has ramped up drastically, with pretty little in between to signal the speed change. I thought that the pacing before was too slow for a webcomic that updated with four to six panels once or twice a week, so I think the new speed here is a little better, but seeing as we still know practically nothing about our villain, his goals, his history, (and by extension all those questions about Mr. Church as well,) I'm still not sure how I feel about the new direction.

(Also, minor note: I know that Mr. Church is fast, but he isn't infinitely fast. Should Jesper really be standing within arms reach of the people he is forcing to do his bidding?)
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #83 on: 24 Jan 2017, 05:16 »

(Also, minor note: I know that Mr. Church is fast, but he isn't infinitely fast. Should Jesper really be standing within arms reach of the people he is forcing to do his bidding?)

I'm taking this as a key indicator of one of the strongest aspects of Pate's personality: He's arrogant and enormously confident in his ability to out-think as well as gain and maintain an advantage over his foes. He's so sure that he has Alice and Sedna under his thumb that he can't even be bothered to pretend that they're a threat to him. It's sort of Lex Luthor dialled up to 11 with Church standing in for the Kryptonite ring.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #84 on: 24 Jan 2017, 05:36 »

Is anyone else a little thrown by the pacing here? The story was moving pretty sedately for the first 160-170 pages or so, and then in the last fifteen comics, the speed has ramped up drastically, with pretty little in between to signal the speed change. I thought that the pacing before was too slow for a webcomic that updated with four to six panels once or twice a week, so I think the new speed here is a little better, but seeing as we still know practically nothing about our villain, his goals, his history, (and by extension all those questions about Mr. Church as well,) I'm still not sure how I feel about the new direction.

(Also, minor note: I know that Mr. Church is fast, but he isn't infinitely fast. Should Jesper really be standing within arms reach of the people he is forcing to do his bidding?)

I haven't noticed a change in pacing.  Important things are happening now and while there could be some additional panels that provide exposition a lot of it would be filler.  We didn't really need to have a scene with them returning to the wagon to get Ardent, or attending to Sedna's wounds, or where Gavia was the whole time since I can assume Pate had her close by to intimidate Alice which brings me to why Pate is willing to risk getting so close to Sedna.  Yes, she could kill him before Church could intervene, but it would likely be the last thing she'd ever do unless he wanted to let her witness the brutal murder of all her companions first. 
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #85 on: 24 Jan 2017, 06:56 »

I moved the name discussion here.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #86 on: 24 Jan 2017, 12:12 »

Btw, the Valkyrie here looks somewhat like the real Valkyrie XB-70 bomber, especially from the back:
http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/Visit/MuseumExhibits/FactSheets/Display/tabid/509/Article/195767/north-american-xb-70-valkyrie.aspx

Alternatively, Jeph could be thinking of the StarCraft air unit...

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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #87 on: 24 Jan 2017, 20:54 »

Is anyone else a little thrown by the pacing here? The story was moving pretty sedately for the first 160-170 pages or so, and then in the last fifteen comics, the speed has ramped up drastically, with pretty little in between to signal the speed change. I thought that the pacing before was too slow for a webcomic that updated with four to six panels once or twice a week, so I think the new speed here is a little better, but seeing as we still know practically nothing about our villain, his goals, his history, (and by extension all those questions about Mr. Church as well,) I'm still not sure how I feel about the new direction.

(Also, minor note: I know that Mr. Church is fast, but he isn't infinitely fast. Should Jesper really be standing within arms reach of the people he is forcing to do his bidding?)

I haven't noticed a change in pacing.  Important things are happening now and while there could be some additional panels that provide exposition a lot of it would be filler.  We didn't really need to have a scene with them returning to the wagon to get Ardent, or attending to Sedna's wounds, or where Gavia was the whole time since I can assume Pate had her close by to intimidate Alice which brings me to why Pate is willing to risk getting so close to Sedna.  Yes, she could kill him before Church could intervene, but it would likely be the last thing she'd ever do unless he wanted to let her witness the brutal murder of all her companions first.
I don't so much mean in panel-to-panel storytelling, I'm referring to the rate of game-changing events. In the first 160 pages, we had Ardent showing up (Which set the story into motion), and then a good bit of time before Gavia showed up. Then, there was a small reveal with history when they went into town, and then another good bit of time before Gardent and Avia snuck out, which is only a significant scene because it revealed to us the nanobot thing. More time goes by, and Ardent's superpower is revealed. Another good bit of time, they meet Sedna, and then after a bit longer Gavia loses all her nanotech. Finally, they leave, and go to the new set.

That took 160 pages.

Now, in the past 20 pages, we've had the new villain show up, a failed escape that resulted in the death of a minor character and the injury of a main character, introduce another superhuman, have the villain take control, get access to what they're looking for, and find the ship that they need. It's about a third the amount of story motion we had before, but in an eighth the amount of pages.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #88 on: 25 Jan 2017, 12:16 »

Don't be too hasty, we still have to

*Find the exit to the Hanger and clear it
*Check if the Valkyrie is even Spacewothty or if Ardnet will have to 'Repair' it
*Find out if there is Fuel for it and if there is, if it's still viable after 5,000 years

And after all that, we still have to fly into Space to the Space Habitat that Gavia and Ardent are from in order for Darth Pate to talk to the Praeses.

And a lot can happen in between all that as well.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #89 on: 25 Jan 2017, 14:31 »

I JUST FIGURED IT OUT! AG is not the same universe as QC, but it the precursor to: http://dord.horse/
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #90 on: 25 Jan 2017, 15:10 »

They could all be the same one!
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #91 on: 25 Jan 2017, 21:23 »

Multiverse!
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #92 on: 26 Jan 2017, 13:19 »

By the way, the design of the Valkyries reminds me of these '80s games:


I used to play them back in the day. They were pretty cool.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #93 on: 29 Jan 2017, 13:55 »

Strip is up.

So Ardent's upgrade works on advanced machinery, but I wonder if he subconsciously sabotaged it.  We'll soon find out.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #94 on: 29 Jan 2017, 15:15 »

I think that we might be about to find the upper limit of Ardent's 'upgrade' capability.

(click to show/hide)
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #95 on: 29 Jan 2017, 18:38 »

I don't know - to me, it looks like he turned it into a big, green glob of Jell-O.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #96 on: 29 Jan 2017, 19:36 »

Wait, what? It looks gold to me.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #97 on: 30 Jan 2017, 00:06 »

I'm sorry, but that's a giant golden vagina.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #98 on: 30 Jan 2017, 02:10 »

I thought it was a Pringle.
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Re: Alice Grove MCDLT - January 2017
« Reply #99 on: 30 Jan 2017, 02:19 »

You know what it looks like the most?



No-one could have believed... (Without the heat ray turret, of course)
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