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Author Topic: Frances The Mute  (Read 19047 times)

rudeboy

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #50 on: 18 May 2005, 13:40 »

The Mars Volta is a horrible band. They're terrible. Maybe I went into the album prepared to hate it, but the songs really really really do NOTHING for me. Every instrumental is incredibly uninspired and retarded. I don't need to go deaf from hearing some asswipe playing too close to his amp. Their lyrics make no sense, and I don't need that bullcrap metaphorics, because even translating it isn't worth it. Oh yes yes, everyone's entitled to their opinion, but anyone that has been around and listens to.. you know.. MUSIC.

Oh and one thing, I don't get why people would even consider comparing At the Drive-In and The Mars Volta, their barely in the same genre, just a band member being the same.
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Kai

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #51 on: 18 May 2005, 18:14 »

Alright. So I went ahead and downloaded Frances The Mute (I've only heard whatever the fuck their first album was, and thought it was horrible.) Who knows, maybe they don't annoy me as much.

After about the first listen here, I'm on the "Meh" Status. It's not hard to understand what they're saying, and the music isn't that weird. It's different, but I've heard much more avant-garde and out there stuff. Overall, I'm actually mostly enjoying it; not to a point where I'd purchase it, but it's better than the horrendous original record.
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but the music sucks because the keyboards don't have the cold/mechanical sound they had but a wannabe techno sound that it's pathetic for Rammstein standars.

marenpoop

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #52 on: 18 May 2005, 20:48 »

Quote from: Robbo

Oh, and how can youunderstand the vocals?  EDIT Ok, I've train my ear because I listen to Death Metal and I wouldn't be able to understand if I hadn't done that. Not that many people do or see a point to doing it, but they all seem clean and easy to hear to me.


It's not a matter of understanding the VOCALS, it's understanding the lyrics. They're pure wankery.
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marenpoop

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #53 on: 18 May 2005, 20:50 »

Thinking good concept albums are not being made anymore is not a reason to stop trying. That's like saying in the 90s, when american cars were absolutely horrible, that they should have stopped making them.

and The Wall was overrated.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #54 on: 18 May 2005, 22:05 »

Where's the whole "people's taste may vary" option?

Look, Mars Volta are decent musicians.  The drummer is very talented, as is the keyboardist, and the bass and guitar aren't shabby either.  Whether or not you think they're wankers doesn't really change the fact that they're good.

So you don't like prog.  Fine.  Understandable.  Most people prefer songs under 5 minutes as opposed to songs with 5 minutes of crickets.  Whatever floats your boat.  Some of us do like the crickets.  That's not to say that I don't like short simple music, too.  Hell, one of my favorite bands are The Black Keys, and their stuff is as simple and quick as anything (except maybe Ramones songs).  That doesn't mean I can't enjoy wankery.  It's really foolish to say "Oh,  I'm going to limit myself to a certain genre because that's my image" (I'm not saying everyone here is doing that, but it's something I've seen around my town).  If you don't like the style Mars Volta play, fine.  Cool.  If you don't like their albums, fine.  Cool.  I don't like Decemberists (oh crap,  I just blasphemed) but I don't claim they suck....they're just not my style.  Similarly, The Mars Volta aren't the worst band in history...they're just not your style.  Big deal.
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Johnny C

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #55 on: 18 May 2005, 22:19 »

Yeah, I like the Minutemen about as much as I like TMV.

WARNING: TASTES MAY DIFFER.
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Tartar Martyr

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #56 on: 19 May 2005, 01:33 »

Tastes May Differ = True

Proclaiming that the Mars Volta are a bunch of no talent wankers = Retarded

You can dislike their music for any reason you wish, but denying the talent in the band is just ignorant.  Drums, Bass and Guitar players in tMV can play circles around their counterparts in any other current popular rock group.  I would include keyboards, but keyboard players are a dying breed.

For examples of this, listen to Drunkship of Lanterns on De-Loused.  The guitar solo, rhythm holds while guitar pulls against it, then the guitar turns around and plays with it and it feels like the song has taken off but the tempo is the same.  More examples?  Any of the sick blues lines Omar lays down on Frances the Mute.

Yeah, you can say they are just a deriviative of early King Crimson and Yes.  But there is nothing else like them, at the level they are doing it, being produced today.
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Empty Friend

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #57 on: 19 May 2005, 15:17 »

Quote from: Empty Friend
To each his own, Napoleon :-p


I'm quoting myself cause I said all of this 2 months ago.  So yeah, if they're not your style, fine.  Saying they suck is like saying Eric Clapton doesn't know how to play a guitar.
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Outshined

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #58 on: 19 May 2005, 19:49 »

Saying that it is pointless for musicians to continue writing concept albums is like saying novelists should just give up writing fiction.  That's just an ignorant thing to say.  A concept album, done well, is a perfectly valid approach to writing and creating music.
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rudeboy

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #59 on: 19 May 2005, 20:33 »

Saying they are talented is like saying Good Charlotte isn't assholes for using that one Specials line. I could easily take my friend's guitar, and make it out of tune purposely, play it upside down, and near his amp and sound like a total asshole. It doesn't mean that I have talent. I have nothing against long songs, heck, one of my favorite bands is streetlight manifesto, and their songs are pretty long, and stretches out even longer, live.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #60 on: 19 May 2005, 20:43 »

Quote from: rudeboy
Saying they are talented is like saying Good Charlotte isn't assholes for using that one Specials line. I could easily take my friend's guitar, and make it out of tune purposely, play it upside down, and near his amp and sound like a total asshole. It doesn't mean that I have talent. I have nothing against long songs, heck, one of my favorite bands is streetlight manifesto, and their songs are pretty long, and stretches out even longer, live.


Do you even play a musical instrument?  Some of their stuff is pretty damned complex, a good example being the bassline in Eunoch Provocateur (from their EP), and most of the drumming.

Look.  You don't have to like them.  Or their style.  You can think their brand of psychadelia prog is a cop out and wankery and everything else, but that does not mean they're not good musicians.

I can't stand Rush.  I think their songs are unimaginative and cliche, and not particularly interesting musically.  That doesn't mean I can't acknowledge that they're damned talented musicians.  The same goes for Mars Volta.  You don't need to like them to acknowledge that they're decent musicians and that other people with different tastes can legitimately enjoy their music.  It's not like I'm asking you to say that Blink 182 are the best punk band ever, or something equally ridiculous.
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Praeserpium Machinarum

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #61 on: 20 May 2005, 03:43 »

Quote
It's not like I'm asking you to say that Blink 182 are the best punk band ever, or something equally ridiculous.


they aren't?

...bloody hell...
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rudeboy

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #62 on: 20 May 2005, 03:48 »

Quote from: sp2
Do you even play a musical instrument?

I play saxophone, and I'm learning bass.
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mahlon

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #63 on: 20 May 2005, 09:13 »

Quote from: marenpoop
Thinking good concept albums are not being made anymore is not a reason to stop trying. That's like saying in the 90s, when american cars were absolutely horrible, that they should have stopped making them.

and The Wall was overrated.


Except... Cars are pretty much something we need to live (isn't that pathetic?) I haven't heard a good concept album in years. Maybe I just hate the idea of concept albums period, or maybe I just hate the Mars Volta and their dumbass looking Afros, or any band with Afros (aside from the guy in TV on the Radio). Personally, I think the Mars Volta kind of rips off Coheed and Camrbia, especially with this whole concept album shit.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #64 on: 20 May 2005, 09:30 »

Quote from: mahlon
Personally, I think the Mars Volta kind of rips off Coheed and Camrbia, especially with this whole concept album shit.


If anything, it's the opposite.  The Volta guys have been doing weird experimental shit for years.  Check out De Facto, which was some experimental electro-dub they messed around with.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #65 on: 20 May 2005, 09:36 »

Quote from: rudeboy
Quote from: sp2
Do you even play a musical instrument?

I play saxophone, and I'm learning bass.


So you don't play drums or guitar or keyboard and don't have much experience on the bass.  Well, as someone who has several years of experience on the bass, and who plays with folks who've been playing guitar for over a decade, and decently talented drummers, I can tell you that the stuff Volta does is not easy introductory level stuff.  They have some amazing basslines (mostly on their earlier stuff, given), they have some technical guitar riffs, and they have some very very very technical drum beats.  They are much more technical than most of the bands you probably listen to and think are hot shit on a stick.

You're learning the bass, so I suggest finding their song "Eunoch Provocateur" and sitting down with it and learning the bassline.  Come back to me when you're finished and tell me they're still shitty musicians.
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marenpoop

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #66 on: 20 May 2005, 11:08 »

The talent is there, but they have used it for evil. EVIL I SAY. they've gone and made utterly pretencious songs and attempted to pass it off as some work of concept genius about some kid they knew who looked like frankenstein.
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mAlice aforeThought

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #67 on: 20 May 2005, 11:13 »

but utterly pretentious songs are the best kind!

(yes, i'm quite fond ov the mars volta.  but i do wish someöne would explain to me exactly where the hell the song 'frances the mute' is to be found.  outside ov overpriced import vinyl, i mean.)
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Outshined

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #68 on: 20 May 2005, 14:03 »

Quote from: marenpoop
The talent is there, but they have used it for evil. EVIL I SAY. they've gone and made utterly pretencious songs and attempted to pass it off as some work of concept genius about some kid they knew who looked like frankenstein.


Pfft... you act like you have never heard a pretentious band before.  Some of these indie acts are the most pretentious shmucks I've ever heard and you practically worship them for it.  It's practically a requirement to be in the music industry anyway.
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Marslo

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #69 on: 20 May 2005, 23:16 »

Here we have an expresion.

''I hope that they wont try to pull off a Frances the Mute.''

Meaning 10 minutes of live static in the name of art.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #70 on: 20 May 2005, 23:30 »

Quote from: Marslo
Meaning 10 minutes of live static in the name of art.


Pink Floyd basically did some stuff just like that in the song "Echoes" on Meddle.  No one really calls them "no talent wankers."

It's just "hip" to hate the Mars Volta.  Okay, cool, whatever.  Just be aware of WHY you do what you do.
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Johnny C

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #71 on: 20 May 2005, 23:43 »

Nobody calls Pink Floyd wankers? Clearly someone hasn't been reading Your Band Sucks on Something Awful.
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marenpoop

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #72 on: 21 May 2005, 01:08 »

everyone including your mom is a pretencious wanker!
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rudeboy

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #73 on: 21 May 2005, 07:21 »

The really is no right or wrong when it comes to music taste. Some people just don't think static feedback is music. I am one of them. And I haven't found any tabs for that song, . . . like I'd want to play that. It just sounds like contant hammering on one note.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #74 on: 21 May 2005, 09:46 »

Quote from: rudeboy
And I haven't found any tabs for that song, . . . like I'd want to play that. It just sounds like contant hammering on one note.


A) Tabs are for pussies and no-talent wankers.
B) It you think it's constant hammering on one note, you clearly can't pick a bassline out of your ass.
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zekterellium

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #75 on: 21 May 2005, 10:12 »

the mars volta are too boring for me to take them seriously. sure, they have their odd moments, but their experimental for the sake of being experimental, and not from a genuine desire to create that kind of music.
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MetaPop

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #76 on: 21 May 2005, 12:13 »

So naturally, what we should do is learn our lessons from The Mars Volta. We should take what we like, leave what we dont, be inspired, disgraced, enlightened, put off, turned upside down, inside out and off entirely and use them as we would any other band; influence for further, better music. Everything is valid in some small way, whether it teaches us what to do or what not to do; The Mars Volta are a good object lesson in what really flies as far as experimentalism and skill goes. Now we build on it.
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ASturge

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #77 on: 21 May 2005, 12:17 »

Olivia Tremor Control are pretty experimentallyishyness at times.

Awesome band.
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kikanjuuneko

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #78 on: 21 May 2005, 12:49 »

Quote from: mAlice aforeThought
(yes, i'm quite fond of the mars volta.  but i do wish someöne would explain to me exactly where the hell the song 'frances the mute' is to be found.  outside of overpriced import vinyl, i mean.)

Because no one else has: it's a b-side for the single for 'The Widow'.
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Johnny C

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #79 on: 21 May 2005, 14:00 »

Quote from: sp2
A) Tabs are for pussies and no-talent wankers.

...and for people who listen to indie music that's so richly produced or interwoven, such as Interpol, that it becomes at times impossible to discern what notes are being played by which guitar.

I've been playing guitar for three years and I still use tabs. I use them rarely, but I still use 'em.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #80 on: 21 May 2005, 17:16 »

Quote from: Johnny C
...and for people who listen to indie music that's so richly produced or interwoven, such as Interpol, that it becomes at times impossible to discern what notes are being played by which guitar.


I'm not going to comment on this.  It'd be way way way too easy.
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KharBevNor

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #81 on: 21 May 2005, 17:46 »

Quote from: sp2

A) Tabs are for pussies and no-talent wankers.


Oh man, that really drips some serious snobbery.

Tabs are just a shorthand version of sheet music without a proper time notation. Next thing, sheet music is for posers. And frets? I mean, what the fuck is up with that? Anyone with an ounce of talent knows inately exactly where he need to put his fingers.
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Johnny C

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #82 on: 21 May 2005, 18:26 »

Yeah, but frets make proper harmonics easier.
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blindsuperhero

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #83 on: 21 May 2005, 18:30 »

Eh?
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Johnny C

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #84 on: 21 May 2005, 18:34 »

For harmonic tuning purposes, you know.
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Empty Friend

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #85 on: 21 May 2005, 19:09 »

Quote from: sp2
A) Tabs are for pussies and no-talent wankers.


I cry massive amounts of douchebaggery.   A Tab that tells which scale structure a solo or whatever single note whatnot is in is much more effective than sheet music.  Same with certain types of chord structures... seeing as how there are 14 places to play an E on a 24 fret guitar. Ass.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #86 on: 21 May 2005, 19:34 »

My point is this.  Most music is simplistic enought that you can figure out the notes pretty much on your own.  This goes for pretty much ALL rock music.  It's a shortcut.  Frankly, I don't even think sheet music is really necessary when trying to figure out most songs.  It's one thing if you're playing classical music with 5 movements that lasts half an hour a piece.  But a 3 or 4 riff song?  Please.

I told rudeboy that before he sits there and claims music is easy without having played it, that he should go, pick up his bass, and try one of the riffs.  The riffs in Eunoch Provocateur are very clear and easy to isolate from the rest of the song.  It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure it out.  You don't even need perfect pitch.  You need about half an hour and about as much talent as your average chimp (and I'll point out that more than half an hour has been wasted by folks like rudeboy talking about things they don't know jack about).  Playing that part is more difficult.

You don't really learn music by picking up tabs, at least, that's not how I've always learned it.  You learn it by playing along and picking it up bit by bit.  Tabs are a way of saying "I don't really care enough to actually learn how the song is crafted, I just want to play it."  You realize exactly how much tabs are for pussies and wankers when you see someone looking for tabs for solos instead of just soloing themselves.  Additionally, being unable to find tabs for a song is not an excuse to not play a song.

Frets are another story, but I have a hell of a lot more respect for someone who plays a fretless, because that does take skill.  This also includes instruments like trombone and various orchestral string instruments.
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Conatonc

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #87 on: 21 May 2005, 22:29 »

Quote
The really is no right or wrong when it comes to music taste. Some people just don't think static feedback is music. I am one of them.


The fact that you seem to think that this is all that The Mars Volta is doing shows that you have written the band off without bothering to really listen to them.

It's been a few months since Frances came out, and I've decided that there's enough cool music on the album to make up for the tiresome stretches of electronic noises and birds chirping. There's about 50 minutes of good music here- unfortunately the album is 75 minutes long. Still, there's something to like in every song, especially Cygnus and L'Via L'Vaquez.
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Outshined

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #88 on: 21 May 2005, 23:13 »

I rather like "Miranda that Ghost Just Isn't Holy Anymore" myself.  Once you get past the initial stretch of eerie, moaning ghost sounds, there is actually some sincere and interesting poetry to be found.  ...And then they rock out.

I find myself quoting the album all the time... extracting particular lines for recycling in another form as writing or art.

I think TMV is really still finding it's legs... this album went perhaps too far in the experimental direction, and I think by the next album they will have established a nice balance and make something really worthwhile.
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sp2

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #89 on: 22 May 2005, 00:12 »

Quote from: Outshined
this album went perhaps too far in the experimental direction, and I think by the next album they will have established a nice balance and make something really worthwhile.


It sounds to me that they'd disagree.  It sounds like they were more or less glad that they put a lot of people off.  Personally, I think this album really has a lot of great parts to it, and while it may not be casually listenable, it's still a damned good album.  It's all a matter of personal opinion whether or not they like something, but I severely doubt Volta are going back to the style of ATDI.  Their stuff as TMV has gotten more experimental, and Omar Rodriguez's solo stuff was hella messed up (given, I enjoyed it, but I'm probably in the minority).
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ASturge

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #90 on: 22 May 2005, 01:39 »

I've been playing guitar for about 4 years now, and i still occasionally use tabs.

In what way am I a pussy- wanker?
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Frances The Mute
« Reply #91 on: 22 May 2005, 01:47 »

Quote from: sp2
My point is this.  Most music is simplistic enought that you can figure out the notes pretty much on your own.  This goes for pretty much ALL rock music.  It's a shortcut.  Frankly, I don't even think sheet music is really necessary when trying to figure out most songs.  It's one thing if you're playing classical music with 5 movements that lasts half an hour a piece.  But a 3 or 4 riff song?  Please.


I can get the odd thing by ear now, but tabs are still a huge help.  You have to have been playing for quite some time to figure out anything, as you have to know pretty much every note, basic chord (majors, minors, sevenths and fifths) and scale as an instinctual response. Plus, it does depend on what music you listen to. Looking at my favourite bands, Therion have three guitarists (not to mention the bassist, a couple of balalaika players and a whole bloody orchestra), Skyclad flourish on doing trade-off solos between guitar and fiddle, and so on. Even the simplest music I listen to regularly, black metal, can actually be pretty hard to work out by ear because of the distortion and the tremolo picking techniques.

For all your elitism, I would probably have given up guitar already without tabs, as they allowed me to be able to hammer out a few familiar riffs and tunes within weeks of starting out, without which I would have almost certainly got piss bored of the chord shapes, scales, progressions and 12 bar blues that were all the earliest lessons in my guitar book consisted of.
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blindsuperhero

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #92 on: 22 May 2005, 03:24 »

Quote from: Johnny C
For harmonic tuning purposes, you know.


But... when you play harmonics, you don't use the frets
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Frances The Mute
« Reply #93 on: 22 May 2005, 06:58 »

Quote from: Conatonc
The fact that you seem to think that this is all that The Mars Volta is doing shows that you have written the band off without bothering to really listen to them.


that my friend is a complete bullshit speculation. i am forced to listen to it everytime i ride in the car with my friend jess. if anything that's all she plays.

edit: and if it's so easy to pick out the bass then let's see you fucking tab it out, i'm one to think tabs are a last resort, but to you it's just an asshat that doesn't know shit about who you're talking about but yet continues to talk like you know what process i took . . . douscheclown
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Kai

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #94 on: 22 May 2005, 13:55 »

Hey, no need to be calling each other Douchebags or assclowns. Flame Wars aren't cool.
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but the music sucks because the keyboards don't have the cold/mechanical sound they had but a wannabe techno sound that it's pathetic for Rammstein standars.

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #95 on: 22 May 2005, 14:00 »

^ Quiet, Doucheclown Assbag!
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Praeserpium Machinarum

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #96 on: 22 May 2005, 14:26 »

insulting just isn't what it used to be... but hell I will join in; you are all dendrofile bonobos ;)
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Outshined

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #97 on: 22 May 2005, 15:21 »

Quote from: Praeserpium Machinarum
insulting just isn't what it used to be... but hell I will join in; you are all dendrofile bonobos ;)


Isn't that some guy that, er, -likes- plants?
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BusterKeaton

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #98 on: 26 May 2005, 14:11 »

The mars volta in general

Pro's
Dude some of these guys were in ATDI!!!!
They sing in latin and spanish!
Tribal/bossa/capo percussion!
A falsetto to make the vienna boys uneasy!
The seem to be writing there songs as classical compositions now!
Excessive stage antics!!(using the drum kit as gymnastic equipment)

Con's
They sing in latin and spanish
Tribal/bossa/capo percussion
A falsetto to make the vienna boys uneasy
The seem to be writing there songs as classical compositions now
Excessive stage antics (using the drum kit as gymnastic equipment)

In closing, Its all how you look at it
Personally i liked Deloused in the comatorium more
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moonman9j9

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Frances The Mute
« Reply #99 on: 26 May 2005, 17:36 »

I absolutely LOVE Frances the Mute.  


Hi, by the way.
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