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Author Topic: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?  (Read 33947 times)

Ernest

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Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« on: 27 Nov 2006, 05:53 »

Just wondering.  I've heard him lauded all over this board, and I tried listening to him, but I just don't like him.  He's boring to me.  Anyone else share my opinion?
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Where I come from, we usually just shorten that to "yee-haw!"

IronOxide

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #1 on: 27 Nov 2006, 05:57 »

No, nobody, ever. This is not a place to form your own opinions. This is a place for us as a collective to form one opinion. We will now be mean to you for forever because you're *shudder* different.
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Gryff

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #2 on: 27 Nov 2006, 05:59 »

Thread over.

greenMonkey

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #3 on: 27 Nov 2006, 06:04 »

I have Illinois and Michigan, and while I will admit they are both catchy, I am not impressed by either.
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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #4 on: 27 Nov 2006, 06:16 »

Dude, he's writing songs about every state in the US. I'm sure he'll get around to Tibet eventually.


Personally, Sufjan's been pretty much all I've listened to lately. I think he's great. You can't tell me "John Wayne Gacy, Jr." is a truly haunting song (well, of course you COULD, but..).
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ImRonBurgundy?

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #5 on: 27 Nov 2006, 06:52 »

I don't dislike him, per se, but I couldn't get into his music when I tried.
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Kyros

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #6 on: 27 Nov 2006, 06:55 »

I don't dislike him, per se, but I couldn't get into his music when I tried.

I'm in the same boat.
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ScrambledGregs

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #7 on: 27 Nov 2006, 07:19 »

I did not want to like Sufjan Stevens, let alone actually listen to him. I guess it was sheer music nerd pride--if someone so great could exist without my prior knowledge, it couldn't be good. Furthermore, if I never heard it, it would always remain terrible in my mind.

I picked up Michigan when I saw it used at my local record store. I liked it. Then I listened to it more and I really liked it. Then I went mad one day and bought 5 or 6 albums, with Illinois on the top of the pile. I listened to it two times in a row and thought to myself, "well, shit...it's better than Michigan." This is one of those times when I think all the hype and critic heavy petting was spot on the money.
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Gryff

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #8 on: 27 Nov 2006, 07:26 »

I like Sufjan Stevens

E. Spaceman

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #9 on: 27 Nov 2006, 07:27 »

I like Sufjan  Stevens
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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #10 on: 27 Nov 2006, 07:29 »

He's like Marmite. While you're supposed to either like him or hate him, he's actually - although an interesting concept - rather bland and uninteresting.

Storm Rider

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #11 on: 27 Nov 2006, 07:34 »

I dislike Sufjan Stevens.
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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #12 on: 27 Nov 2006, 07:58 »

He has sopme really well written songs, but I believe he is completely overrated.  Like, woah.
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Ernest

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #13 on: 27 Nov 2006, 10:12 »

He's like Marmite. While you're supposed to either like him or hate him, he's actually - although an interesting concept - rather bland and uninteresting.

Thank you.  My sentiments exactly.
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Where I come from, we usually just shorten that to "yee-haw!"

Hat

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #14 on: 27 Nov 2006, 13:21 »

No, I don't dislike Sufjan Stevens.

But thank you for showing an interest.
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Valrus

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #15 on: 27 Nov 2006, 18:13 »

I believe your question has been answered: Yes. Someone here dislikes Sufjan Stevens.
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SensoryOssuary

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #16 on: 28 Nov 2006, 04:40 »

Personally, I think Sufjan Stevens represents all this is bland and turgid in modern independent music.
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salada

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #17 on: 28 Nov 2006, 04:52 »

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öde

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #18 on: 28 Nov 2006, 05:34 »

I can't be bothered to pirate his music.
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Kai

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #19 on: 28 Nov 2006, 05:46 »

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but the music sucks because the keyboards don't have the cold/mechanical sound they had but a wannabe techno sound that it's pathetic for Rammstein standars.

IronOxide

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #20 on: 28 Nov 2006, 08:18 »

I want to have Sufjan Steven's gae babies whether or not I'll admit it openly. I can barely contain myself.
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SensoryOssuary

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #21 on: 28 Nov 2006, 11:02 »



2. Swelling in style or language; bombastic, pompous; as, "a turgid style of speaking."
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Storm Rider

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #22 on: 28 Nov 2006, 11:04 »

I need to project my love of pussy-ass music onto people with testicles.
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pat101

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #23 on: 28 Nov 2006, 16:12 »

I like Sufjan Stevens, I just haven't been bothered to listen to him in many months. I'm sure I'll get around to it yet.

The Eyeball Kid

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #24 on: 28 Nov 2006, 17:54 »

I need to cling to something. Anything. Sufjan helps
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TrueNeutral

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #25 on: 28 Nov 2006, 18:16 »

I neither like nor dislike Sufjan Stevens.

I like and dislike parts of Sufjan Stevens his music.

I mean what is it with the whole "having to like everything an artist ever did before you can say you like them"?
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ScrambledGregs

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #26 on: 28 Nov 2006, 21:30 »

I am listening to Michigan right now and masturbating furiously to violent, objectifying porn while thinking up sexist jokes and drinking Bud Light, and wearing a hat that says "Wine 'em Dine 'em Sixty-Nine 'em" just to spite all of you. Sufjan Stevens is manly music for manly men!! Have you ever seen the guy?? He's pretty ugly, but sad, beautiful things come out of him, like fresh smelling farts from the ass of a diseased weeping willow tree. Yeah, trees don't have asses with which to fart from. Sue me, why don't you?!
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schimmy

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #27 on: 28 Nov 2006, 21:38 »

Dude, he's writing songs about every state in the US. I'm sure he'll get around to Tibet eventually.
How is it that I'm the only person to have found this funny?

edit: I like Sufjan Stevens, there are only few songs of his I don't approve of. (I'm staying away from the Christmas Box Set like the plague)
The thing I like the most about him is how verbose his albums are. They seem to last forever, so I've taken to starting listening to them from random tracks, since it's unlikely I'll get around to listening to all of them otherwise. That's how I found Romulus on Michigan after months of owning the album. It basically means that Sufjan's albums have a much longer replayability factor than bands such as the Decemberists, where I find I can only listen to an album (i.e. Picaresque) only a couple of times a month, or I get bored of it.
« Last Edit: 28 Nov 2006, 21:43 by schimmy »
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KharBevNor

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #28 on: 29 Nov 2006, 00:38 »

"OH, looky, this guy writes about unusual things and uses long words and song titles how ORIGINAL"
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schimmy

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #29 on: 29 Nov 2006, 00:42 »

Was that sarcasm? Because I'm pretty sure writing about unusual things counts as original.
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KharBevNor

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #30 on: 29 Nov 2006, 00:46 »

I'm going to write an insipid singer-songwriter album about all the things I step on during the day! It's going to be so amazing!
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[22:25] Dovey: i don't get sigquoted much
[22:26] Dovey: like, maybe, 4 or 5 times that i know of?
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Rubby

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #31 on: 29 Nov 2006, 00:52 »

drinking Bud Light
There's your problem right there.

As for Sufjan, I like him. Don't really know what more to say.
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schimmy

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #32 on: 29 Nov 2006, 01:27 »

I still don't get it, Khar. Are you saying that Sufjan isn't original, or that originality isn't important?
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TrueNeutral

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #33 on: 29 Nov 2006, 01:44 »

No, I'm pretty sure he's saying that some things don't get songs written about them because there don't need to be any songs written about them, yet that's what Sufjan Stevens keeps writing songs about.

Now I feel like writing a song about how some people keep writing songs about things that don't get songs written about them because there don't need to be any songs written about them.
« Last Edit: 29 Nov 2006, 01:46 by TrueNeutral »
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KharBevNor

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #34 on: 29 Nov 2006, 01:47 »

No, I'm pretty sure he's saying that some things don't get songs written about them because there don't need to be any songs written about them, yet that's what Sufjan Stevens keeps writing songs about.

Pretty much. Also, that writing songs about unusual things isn't really terribly original. Each individual thing may be original, but tons of people have written about random esoteric things before. You can't claim originality just because you're the first ever person to write a ballad about balancing six club flyers on a can of aerosol or something.
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[22:25] Dovey: i don't get sigquoted much
[22:26] Dovey: like, maybe, 4 or 5 times that i know of?
[22:26] Dovey: and at least one of those was a blatant ploy at getting sigquoted

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schimmy

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #35 on: 29 Nov 2006, 02:01 »

I'd argue that you can. Originality is doing something that's not been done before, even if it is abysmally mundane.
Now, I don't claim to be some huge repetoir of knowledge about the subject of Sufjan's lyrics, I only own Illinois and Michigan, and I don't pay much attention to the actual wording of most songs, so I can't say I know what they're all about.
What I can say, however, is that I enjoy Sufjan's singing and instrumentation. So if it's alright with you, I'm going to go ahead and listen to him anyway.
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ScrambledGregs

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #36 on: 29 Nov 2006, 07:05 »

I would argue that his song titles are just as often red herrings as they are actually about 'unusual' things you would assume they're about due to the title. In the end, it doesn't matter, because I still like him. I will admit that he needs to change up his style a bit, though, and that two albums of Illinois material was way too much.
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IronOxide

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #37 on: 29 Nov 2006, 07:16 »

Because Khar, it is ever so original to scream your percieved ills of society over over-distorted guitars!
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Gryff

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #38 on: 29 Nov 2006, 07:44 »

Storm Rider

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #39 on: 29 Nov 2006, 08:14 »

Because Khar, it is ever so original to scream your percieved ills of society over over-distorted guitars!

Except that if, you know, you knew anything about metal as a genre, it would be obvious that it is so ridiculously broad that those descriptors don't come anywhere near to encompassing a fraction of what metal bands do artistically.

But thanks for playing!
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KharBevNor

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #40 on: 29 Nov 2006, 08:57 »

Because Khar, it is ever so original to scream your percieved ills of society over over-distorted guitars!

Even if the metal bands I enjoy do not have any particular lyrical originality (and many of them do) it would be made up for by the fact that they have well written and original music that is often pushing boundaries or achieving high levels of technical excellence and accomplishment. The only metal bands that rely on lyrical gimmicks (omg i will write an album about every state oh my how quirky and hip i am so amazing omg omg) tend to be jokes. You don't see me feteing Lawnmower Deth as the greatest thing since sliced bread.

The point I am making is that Sufjan is not some sort of musical god because he has decided to write songs about unusual things. At the end of the day, his voice is unspectacular and posseses no inherent charm and power and his musical arrangements are shallow, pedestrian and bland. His actual lyricism is average and all his songs sound fucking identical. This is not to say his music is unpleasant, I could listen to it happily, but it is neither interesting, innovative nor engaging. If I were to pick up my guitar right now and slap a few fingerpicked blues progressions to a song I wrote in twenty minutes about an amusing prank at my halls of residence, I would be entirely as original as Sufjan Stevens.
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[22:25] Dovey: i don't get sigquoted much
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[22:26] Dovey: and at least one of those was a blatant ploy at getting sigquoted

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Ernest

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #41 on: 29 Nov 2006, 09:15 »

Anyone else dislike Bright Eyes?  I dislike him.
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Where I come from, we usually just shorten that to "yee-haw!"

ScrambledGregs

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #42 on: 29 Nov 2006, 09:51 »

I like when people pronounce their opinions in a way that suggests they are absolute fact. I'm not saying I'm right and Khar is wrong, I'm just saying I don't like when people express their opinions and insinuate that I (and others) have fallen for some kind of musical con artist who has 'convinced' a lot of people he is amazing, when he is actually "unoriginal", "gimmicky", "shallow", and all of his songs sound "fucking identical."

I know, I know. I'm taking this too seriously, and too personally, and it is your opinion; I know you're not trying to say it is FACT that we should all bow to. But still...
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Johnny C

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #43 on: 29 Nov 2006, 09:57 »

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ScrambledGregs

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #44 on: 29 Nov 2006, 10:20 »

Forget I said anything. All we're going to do is sit here arguing back and forth about our opinions. I fully accept the fact that people can think Sufjan is unoriginal shit. I'm ok with it, really I am.

I'm gunna go suck my thumb in a corner and hope Khar doesn't come murder me.  :laugh:
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Johnny C

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #45 on: 29 Nov 2006, 10:36 »

No, no, it is okay to express your opinion. I merely posted that image because I saw this moving into flame-war territory.

As far as Sufjan goes, I think it's very interesting and compelling that he uses the history of each state to explore the human condition. I also consider his music to be very well-written and performed, for the most part. I just wish the bastard would focus.
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The Eyeball Kid

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #46 on: 29 Nov 2006, 10:43 »

I haven't heard alot of Sufjan, but if the purpose of art is to provide momentary transendence from our fate, then 'Chicago' is art and delivers what is needed - a hymn, an assertiton of transience that lifts you out of it for a second and lets you almost accept your fate or the fate of your loved one.
In other words i played it when my grandfather died and my mother cried and i played it on repeat and the death thoughts got a bit easier. So art... he's a Christian, he can write a hymn
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TynansAnger

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #47 on: 01 Dec 2006, 06:18 »

Here's an article I wrote for the Maroon, the Univeristy of Chicago newspaper:

http://maroon.uchicago.edu/online_edition/viewpoints/2006/11/21/lets-be-objective-here-sufjan-stevens-sucks/
I hate Sufjan Stevens, and I?m not afraid to admit it.

I realize that since I go to school in the state of Illinois, saying that could get me trampled by an angry horde of indie kids. Maybe they are members of the Facebook group ?I Chose UChicago Because of Sufjan Stevens? or one of the hundreds of other groups dedicated to Sufjan. But whenever someone goes on a diatribe about how awesome Sufjan is, I have one question that has yet to be fully answered: ?Why??

You?d think that with all the inane comments, screaming female fans, and accolades, people would be able to explain why they like Sufjan. Instead, people seem surprised to be asked that question in the first place.

Some of the answers I?ve heard: ?His music is pretty.? Beethoven?s music is pretty, but I don?t think anyone would choose the U of C because the CSO performs a rousing rendition of the Fifth. Another one is ?he?s a multi-instrumentalist.? So is the guy playing the tuba and a cymbal on the Chicago street corner for change; I don?t see any 17-year-olds throwing their bras at that guy.

Let?s look at Illinois for a moment. Despite so many claims that the album ?defined Illinois,? there is absolutely no musical trace of Illinois in the album. If you were going to make an album about Illinois, wouldn?t you want to include music made famous by Illinois, like, you know, Chicago blues? Instead, Sufjan made a chamber-pop album without any hint of Illinois-themed music and justified it by creating lyrics devoted to factoids about Illinois that can easily be found on Wikipedia.

Illinois is less about the state of Illinois and more about Sufjan Stevens. While the indie press has praised the album, it?s not really all that different from the praise they gave to Greetings from Michigan or Seven Swans, Sufjan?s past albums. So why is Illinois the first Sufjan album to chart, to cause hundreds of Facebook groups to start, and to propel Sufjan to the height of the indie world?

To find the answer, look to Sufjan?s film counterpart in overrated indie stars: Zach Braff. Like Sufjan, Braff has been called the voice of his generation, a title his flick Garden State doesn?t merit. The reason Braff is called that is not because he is the voice of his generation, but because he seems to be. Braff has called himself the voice of his generation, and since he tried to express that in a movie, who are we to question him?

Although I must confess my iTunes playlist is dominated by indie stars of the ?80s such as the Minutemen, H?sker D?, and Mudhoney, I would be an idiot if I joined the many who claimed that indie bands were so much better then and that the fame of Nirvana and the Internet killed indie rock. What I will claim, however, is that technological changes have dramatically altered standards in indie music. In the ?80s, even buying a guitar was a struggle. Now, anyone with a couple hundred bucks can buy a guitar and quality computer software and make a complete album.

While this change is amazing in that it democratizes the process of making music, it also serves to dramatically increase competition for gaining attention. As a result, gaining fame has become more based on asserting superiority over the rest of the pack and less based on letting the music speak for itself. People like Zach Braff have succeeded more for their claims of changing the world than for actually changing it.

While Sufjan has not made an overt claim of his superiority, his claim to fame is his absurdly pretentious and unmanageable 50 states project. While Greetings from Michigan characterized the state much better, Illinois was more famous simply because it meant that Sufjan was actually pursuing the project.

Let?s put Sufjan?s goal in perspective. He is 31 years old, and to accomplish his goal, he would have to release 48 more albums. Now let?s compare him to the most accomplished performer in rock and roll history?Bob Dylan. Bob Dylan is 65, and he has released a total of 37 original albums?11 of which he released before he turned 31. Considering the short life span of indie bands fame and the fact that Sufjan continues to release Christian albums and outtakes from other state albums, he?ll be lucky to release five state albums.

Of course, if Sufjan were to accomplish his goal, it would be the greatest accomplishment in pop music history. Yet as someone who grew up in Michigan and spent his entire musical career recording in Brooklyn, he?d have no connection to any of the states he wrote albums about. But at least the goal seems like it would be a big accomplishment; at this point in history, bark, not bite, is the key to artistic fame.
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penpen17

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #48 on: 01 Dec 2006, 09:20 »

I'm starting to get sick of Sufjan's voice, but he is pretty damn good at writing songs and composing instrumentation.
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ScrambledGregs

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Re: Anyone here dislike Sufjan Stevens?
« Reply #49 on: 01 Dec 2006, 10:32 »

A few comments:

1) Did Braff ever claim he was the voice of his generation?? I have never heard that before.

2) You're confusing the praise and audience of Sufjan, which you don't like, with his music, which you don't make much criticism of at all.

3) Do screaming teenage girls really go to Sufjan concerts?? Do screaming girls even exist anymore??

4) Who said that the album defined Illinois?? Some actual critic in another magazine, or just some idiot on Facebook??

5) Even if Braff and Sufjan danced on stage together shouting "we are your voice, generation of our's!" it doesn't change the fact that I think the Illinois album is amazing and Garden State is a good movie. Sure, Garden State may not hold up to the all time greats, but when you compare it to 90% of the other smash hit movies of today that teens and young adults flock to, it's like fucking Citizen Kane.
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