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Some Stupid Asshole Invented A Taser Shotgun

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dennis:

--- Quote from: Scandanavian War Machine on 14 Feb 2008, 11:24 ---
--- Quote from: Slick on 14 Feb 2008, 08:55 ---Man, how often has anyone here had to defend themselves with lethal force? I'm not asking that rhetorically to argue in a snide sort of way, I'm asking seriously.

--- End quote ---

my friend Stevie got robbed at gun point last week, buddy JD got jumped twice but luckily he just stood up to them and they turned out to be cowards, TJ got his teeth knocked out with brass knuckles recently, and the same guys that knocked his teeth out also broke some girls ribs and tried to throw her into the ocean. those are only the recent examples that i can think of; there's definitely more that i won't go into.

feel free to feel as safe as you want but i sure as shit don't. these are people i know and i live in an extremely small town surrounded by several other, equally small towns. and this shit still goes down.

and that fails to mention all of the herion/crack/meth addicts who wouldn't hesitate to rob and/or kill you (several of whom are people who i used to call friends,unfortunately).

...and that's my rant.


--- End quote ---

So, are you saying that if you're robbed at gunpoint, it's ok to kill the robber?

I think your anecdotes do not really stand up to scrutiny.

If you're robbed at gunpoint, the robber has the jump on you to begin with. If you go for your gun when he's already got a gun pointed at you, you're going to get shot.

If you're assaulted by a group that doesn't have lethal weapons, then deadly force isn't justified. If you shoot them, your self-defense excuse isn't going to stand up in court. (As an aside, there is no such thing as "legal" killing. All killings are illegal, but some are excused by the law as being in self-defense. When you mount a self-defense defense, you are admitting to homicide.)

And I live in the third largest city in the United States, and I have yet to be assaulted. Just because you live in a small town and get assaulted, it doesn't mean that violence is rampant everywhere. I mean, I could go hang out in MLD territory wearing the wrong colors and probably see some violence, but that doesn't mean I need a gun.

Also, drug addicts aren't unhinged killers. What a ridiculous thing to say.

dennis:

--- Quote from: Slick on 14 Feb 2008, 16:39 ---For the record, I did not bring up MAD (since when is that a commonplace acronym?), though that is a possible consequence of what I brought up. I mentioned the arms race, because the notion that 'others pose threats to me, thus I can have a gun if I am responsible with it and use it only in self defence' is part of what motivated the arms race. Let's all just get 'nuclear deterrents' and we'll never get robbed, guys!
If any old punk on the street can have get his dirty little mitts on a pistol, why can't I have an assault rifle? Because if two of the fuckers break in on my house to rob my priceless heirlooms, I wan't to be able to fuck their shit up and protect my family.

--- End quote ---
Mutually Assured Destruction has nothing to do with guns. Guns are fundamentally different from the weapons involved in MAD mainly because they're not weapons of mass destruction. A gun is designed to kill one thing at a time. People are allowed to own guns. People are not allowed to own WMDs. You can't have any type of bomb, much less a nuclear weapon anywhere, for obvious reasons.

It is simply riskier to shoot someone who also has a gun. That is all.

Scandanavian War Machine:
@Dennis
are you going to stand (or sit) there and tell me that if somebody raped and murdered your whole family you wouldn't want them to die? what if they did it right in front of you, with no law enforcement around, and you had a gun in your hand? would you shoot them? i fucking would.

the idea that "murder is never right, no matter what" is idiotic, idealistic, and naive. sometimes, people just need to die. i'm sorry we don't live in candyland but shit happens.

yes, my examples from my own life were weak but that's just my life. that's all i have to go on. they may not seem bad to someone from a city (not you necessarily, i don't know where your from) but i grew up in a place where that shit just didn't happen so when something like that happens, it's a big fucking deal. it's scary when you've never seen that kind of violence before, to all of a sudden have it crashing through your doors.

if i was robbed at gun point, i wouldn't want to kill the person; that would be silly. i would however, try my damnedest to really hurt that person, if i could, then call the police.

i know all drug addicts aren't maniacs, that's obviously ridiculous. i tend to overuse hyperbole.
one of my best friends is a heroin addict and she's lovely. but many of my other ex-friends who are now constantly doped-up have actually taken to stealing and other sketchy activities. so it seems to me that the next step couldn't be far-off.

i'm pretty sure i sound like a huge jerk thoughout most of this post but i don't want to try to find a p.c. way to say it so i'll just leave it as is. sorry.

also, on a semi-related note: i really liked what you said about guns a couple posts ago. you basically said what i wasn't articulate enough to say.

Scandanavian War Machine:
@tommy
first quote: that's not what i was saying.

second quote: i'm supposed to respect someone who doesn't value their own life, let alone others lives? i fail to see the logic in that.
let's say someone is rushing into a crowd with a bomb strapped to their chest. you would be opposed to me shooting that person in the head and saving dozens of other lives? that's moronic.

now quit ganging up on me. i went to american public schools and can't defend myself.

jhocking:

--- Quote from: dennis on 14 Feb 2008, 16:32 ---Let me flip this question around: What is the purpose of a gun that doesn't fire when the trigger is pulled?

--- End quote ---
Given that you didn't answer the question, I'm guessing you thought I was arguing with you. That's okay though, other people already answered.

Also, I missed this post until dennis quoted it:

--- Quote from: Scandanavian War Machine on 14 Feb 2008, 11:24 ---my friend Stevie got robbed at gun point last week, buddy JD got jumped twice but luckily he just stood up to them and they turned out to be cowards, TJ got his teeth knocked out with brass knuckles recently, and the same guys that knocked his teeth out also broke some girls ribs and tried to throw her into the ocean. those are only the recent examples that i can think of; there's definitely more that i won't go into.

--- End quote ---
Dude, where do you live? Remind me never to go there.


--- Quote from: Scandanavian War Machine on 14 Feb 2008, 17:07 ---@Dennis
are you going to stand (or sit) there and tell me that if somebody raped and murdered your whole family you wouldn't want them to die? what if they did it right in front of you, with no law enforcement around, and you had a gun in your hand? would you shoot them? i fucking would.

--- End quote ---
I scoured his posts rather carefully, and I cannot find the part where he said that. Could you provide a quote?

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