Fun Stuff > CHATTER
The Great Porn Debate
jimbunny:
Is your proposition, Slick, that porn films have a greater influence on the decision-making of their audiences than do non-porn films? Violent and misogynist characterizations are rather prevalent in our culture. Do we have to ban them as well, because they also "make it easier for such a person to later rationalize rape when they see someone they want but can't have"? What's so special about porn?
That there's no implied judgment of the act by the film's creator; that it's a fantasy portrayed in a "realistic" manner, with either unrealistic or absent consequences... these conditions are present in widely-viewed, non-pornographic films--though very rarely in regard to rape, much more likely in regard to murder or drug use. Such actions have been successfully stripped of their psychological trauma and glamorized, escaping the stigma that still sticks to rape. In my view, a ban on such "rape fantasies" in film boils down to enforcing a moral standard.
Now, what I'm not saying is that the only reason we object to rape is the stigma attached to it; I'm firmly convinced that it's a grossly immoral act. Nor am I saying something like "I'd rather we had rape, than murder" or anything that might imply that one was worse than the other, or one more OK. But isn't there a hypocrisy in banning a simulated rape fantasy in film, when what amounts to simulated murder fantasies are commonplace?
ruyi:
He prefaced it with "for example," so I'm guessing that's not necessarily his personal view but rather just a demonstration of what would constitute a valid argument.
Fenriswolf:
I'm going to do YET ANOTHER half-arsed half-drunken post (dammit, this is a terrible habit) and simply say: I have discussed these topics with myself so much I don't even know where to start any more. It seems intuitive to me that sometimes rape is realistic in films and sometimes it seems to be for the gratification of sick fuckers and those who don't know it any better. It seems intuitive to me that if we're not going to talk about sex in a candid manner with our kids and if it's going to be "naughty" and "dirty" culturally, and if the whole men-always-want-sex while women-have-to-be-tricked stereotypes are going to be continually shoved down our throats and then if on top of that mainstream porn is gonna be extremely objectifying, borderline violent and apparently no fun for anyone then it's going to create some fucked up ideas about sex in our youth.
And yeah, a large percentage of women have been raped. I would go so far as to say most women have been sexually assaulted in at least a minor way. Sex crimes are almost impossible to convict. Habitually women are disbelieved and judged when they report their attack. It's everywhere, it's not just bogeymen, and we seem to spend most of our time going "la la la I can't heeeear you". So of course with a backdrop like that glorified sexual violence is really fucked up
That is all
P.S. Don't think I'm getting all offended over here, I'm rather enjoying the debate. Mostly I'm just a bit frustrated at my own inability to gather my thoughts. Siiiiigh
jimbunny:
--- Quote from: ruyi on 04 May 2008, 22:16 ---He prefaced it with "for example," so I'm guessing that's not necessarily his personal view but rather just a demonstration of what would constitute a valid argument.
--- End quote ---
You're right--I think I jumped the gun a little. Sorry about that.
So, then, not so much at Slick anymore (certainly not so argumentatively), but I think my point still stands.
...Of course, saying "my point stands" is a bit ridiculous in the face of anyone's personal experience with rape--I guess such is the case with any debate, really. Keeping an eye for the reality of the issue, it's prevalence in society, and our own ignorance to the facts and their effects (and if we are so fortunate as to be so ignorant, to the experience itself) is a vital part of such an argument. However, discussions about something even one remove from rape itself can and unavoidably will be complicated by a number of social and cultural issues and values.
RedLion:
This argument is ridiculous.
Rape is one of the very few things where there's no moral gray area. It's bad. It's never acceptable. It shouldn't have a place in porn, because it's being fairly "realistically" depicted.
End.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version