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Soooo...

AMAZING BOOOOOOOK
- 12 (10.1%)
Stephenie Meyer is a GENIUS
- 4 (3.4%)
You're all wanks
- 103 (86.6%)

Total Members Voted: 89


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Author Topic: Twilight Series  (Read 183807 times)

Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #450 on: 04 Dec 2008, 18:26 »

Today I gave my students a very, very difficult test.  I smiled over and over as they discovered the numerous traps and villainies that I had laid in store for them.*

To amuse myself, the short answer portion of the test was all about ninjas and sumo wrestlers taking over the school and the various efforts of the student body to fight them off.  At one point one girl said, "This should totally happen."

I stopped answering another girl's question, turned, and said, "Remember, Edward won't be there to save you."

Hilarity ensued.

*  At one point one girl discovered a trap and exclaimed, "You are evil!"  Two other girls who had already finished said, simultaneously, "What did you do?"  I grinned and grinned and repeated my apothegm "I am the anti-Claus."
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #451 on: 04 Dec 2008, 21:39 »

Wait, what subject do you teach anyway? You didn't answer that yet, did you? Just the grades you teach, right?
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SirJuggles

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #452 on: 05 Dec 2008, 06:30 »

I believe he is an english teacher? Or have my multiple days of lurking led me to imagine things?

I find myself in an interesting position in regards to all this. I'm the same age and general demographic as Peaches (albeit male), and I am most certainly of a highly literary bent. I must admit, however, that I highly enjoyed the Twilight books. They captured my attention, left me unable to put them down, and I'll even admit to going to the midnight release party for the 4th book (with my girlfriend, thank you very much). I can match fan-girlyness with the best of 'em. However, I am also in agreement with many of the other points of view stated so far. I'm an avid Pratchett, Scott Card, and Clancy reader who genuinely enjoys (most) "great/classic" literature, and have been so since middle school. I can't help feeling that the His Dark Materials books were just generally... not enjoyable, though I can't at the moment express exactly why. I mostly made it through The Golden Compass, and got midway through The Subtle Knife before I realized I was only reading to see the next cool use of the Knife itself.

It comes back to basic personality I believe. Those who are inclined to read will do so. From what I remember of middle school even then is pretty late to get someone turned on to reading if they aren't already. Someone mentioned not too long ago how the lowest common denominator factor of entertainment comes in to play. The Twilight books can certainly be entertaining, but perhaps they fall more into the world of "mainstream entertainment" than "quality literature". It all comes down to how you want to define what terms.

--preemptive apologies if I contradicted myself or lacked a point in general. Just wanted to get in on the discussion.
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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #453 on: 05 Dec 2008, 06:33 »

A big problem I've found I have with the "at least it gets kids reading" stance is that I've not seen a single kid reading this shit. Everyone I see, or hear about, reading this garbage is between 17 and 30. What excuse is there for that? Sure, you may like shitty books and that's all well and good, but it's not helping anyone start reading.
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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #454 on: 05 Dec 2008, 09:03 »

You know what's the only thing that could make these books seem more terrible to me?

If they played physically impossible inhuman baseball with aluminum bats designed to handle about seventy MPH fastballs at best, as opposed to INHUMANLY FAST AND BEAUTIFUL SLIDERS!!!

Fuck this bullshit.
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JD

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #455 on: 05 Dec 2008, 12:03 »

Juggles, you make a valid point.


Also, a female friend of mine has watched the movie 3 times. (she gets in free because she knows the guy who runs it)
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #456 on: 05 Dec 2008, 16:08 »

I thought aluminum bats weren't used in major leagues not because of their strength, but because it would be too easy, the people that consistently hit it into the outfield would be hitting home runs with aluminum bats?
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Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #457 on: 05 Dec 2008, 17:30 »

Wait, what subject do you teach anyway? You didn't answer that yet, did you? Just the grades you teach, right?

Science.  They fought ninjas with science.  And won.
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Chesire Cat

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #458 on: 05 Dec 2008, 17:40 »

Dont bring a katana to a gun fight
« Last Edit: 05 Dec 2008, 17:42 by Chesire Cat »
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #459 on: 05 Dec 2008, 17:41 »

Wait, what subject do you teach anyway? You didn't answer that yet, did you? Just the grades you teach, right?

Science.  They fought ninjas with science.  And won.
That makes sense, a few household chemicals in the proper proportions, huh?
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Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #460 on: 05 Dec 2008, 17:52 »

Well...  momentum, density, and acceleration, but yeah.
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Dimmukane

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #461 on: 05 Dec 2008, 17:55 »

Dont bring a katana to a gun fight

Toshiro Mifune will come back from the dead to prove you wrong.
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #463 on: 12 Dec 2008, 19:40 »

You know, I have new respect for the actors in the movie. Considering how close the lines in the parody are to the movie, I hadn't realized how shitty a script they got handed until just now. No wonder they both hate the movie.
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Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #464 on: 12 Dec 2008, 23:24 »

Every time I see one of my students carrying one of these books, I want to... make pointed, mean comments.  I refrain.

But shit damn do I want to give them detention for reading such antifeminist garbage.
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ruyi

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #465 on: 13 Dec 2008, 07:06 »

(I would actually recommend On Bullshit cus it's an interesting read and as a bonus looks silly on your bookshelf)

Late response, but just reminding you guys to listen to this man.

Anyways, I remember distinctly how I got into this series. I was clicking around on facebook and I got to the profile of a younger sister of a classmate. She had a number of those bumper stickers referring to Edward Cullen. I remember thinking to myself, specifically: I am sad, I want to read shitty fan fiction. It was based on this explicit desire that I googled the name. As it turned out the original texts were readily available and I figured that I might as well familiarize myself with the story before looking for fan fiction.

Of course, after reading the books, I found there was no need for fan fiction.

So, they served their purpose for me. I read through all the books in two nights and was thus distracted for a short time from my grandma being in hospice care.

I guess this was a useless response except for where I reveal to you all that I am not smart at all. In fact I intentionally seek out shit to read :-(
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Lines

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #466 on: 13 Dec 2008, 07:45 »

I'm reading the fourth book and I have to say that the beginning of it is utter bullshit. Not that the first three books aren't crap, but jeeze, COME ON.
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CardinalFang

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #467 on: 13 Dec 2008, 15:03 »

It's currently out of stock but hopefully they'll get more in in time for Christmas.
Be a vampire!

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Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #468 on: 13 Dec 2008, 15:34 »

Oh dear god.  My students are going to be attacking each other with that shit.
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #469 on: 13 Dec 2008, 15:53 »

You might want something teflon-coated in case they try it on you when you insult their book.
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Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #470 on: 13 Dec 2008, 16:23 »

First one that tries that on me will get the business end of a hissy fit.
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #471 on: 13 Dec 2008, 16:52 »

Yes, but you will still end up glittering.
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LucyStag

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #472 on: 13 Dec 2008, 19:59 »

I didn't even know what the books were until my boyfriend bought and read them all. Then, with all the backlash going on, I was curious enough to read them and see just how terrible they were.

Answer, the first one is awful. The prose is bloated (I cannot help but think of the following line, '"I'm sorry," I apologized.'...Anyone see the problem with that? And she does it TWICE on a page) and full of unforgivable mistakes. And the love story is horrible and full of creepy anti-feminist undertones. And yet I was entertained enough to keep reading. The second boo was better, the third was almost sort of good, what with the more blood and vampire backstories. The fourth was less good, what with the ending not having a bloody battle.

I just don't understand that people are obsessed with the WORST part of the books -- the crap between Edward and Bella. It's exactly the same as when teenage girls freaked out over "Titanic" and it's awesomely generic, boring, anchronistic, unconvincing lvoe story, and ignored the amazingly interesting historical tragedy aspects.
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #473 on: 13 Dec 2008, 20:08 »

I'm willing to forgive her having a hard time with speech verbs, they are a bitch to write, especially when you have a lot of dialogue, you keep second guessing yourself. "Did I use say too many times?" I hate that part of it. Sometimes, you should just stick with no verb at all, but do that too much and you screw it up as well. Of course, a bit of editing would have probably helped, if she hadn't just written it all in one long run without appreciable editing (hopefully). How did she even get published, anyway? Her husband a publisher?
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Tybalt

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #474 on: 13 Dec 2008, 21:13 »

http://www.take180.com/s/ep5l7?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=cpm&utm_campaign=jb_twix

Funniest thing. Ever.
...You're joking, right?  That was an awful parody christmas AND Twilight.
It's currently out of stock but hopefully they'll get more in in time for Christmas.
Be a vampire!
That is so amazingly hilarious that I think I might have to buy it.
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Alex C

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #475 on: 14 Dec 2008, 10:48 »

I hope you acted fast; apparently it's sold out, at least on their online catalogue.
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #476 on: 14 Dec 2008, 20:51 »

it was even before he posted (she? sorry, can't tell). Might be a store in the middle of nowhere that still has some. Well, unless it is part of the Utah nowhere. Or a nowhere that the person in charge of ordering stuff hates twilight enough to cut into profits (I have heard that hot topics can have a pretty big variation between them in stock carried).
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Chesire Cat

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #477 on: 14 Dec 2008, 20:54 »

Whats wrong with a little iridescent glittering?  Raptor-Jesus does it, why cant I.
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ampersandwitch

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #478 on: 14 Dec 2008, 21:00 »

(I would actually recommend On Bullshit cus it's an interesting read and as a bonus looks silly on your bookshelf)

Late response, but just reminding you guys to listen to this man.


Even later response, but, right.
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Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #479 on: 18 Dec 2008, 04:15 »

So these books were briefly discussed in a corner of the faculty christmas party last night (I may have ranted).  An interesting theory was put forth as to why 13-14 year old girls are devouring these things.  Because it's a first crush in book form.  The obsession, thinking the other person is completely perfect, thinking even their flaws make them better, more beautiful.  These are children who, due to inexperience, don't really have any awareness of what love actually is, so this series really speaks to what they know.

Which is why it's utter shit.  Because they don't know a fucking thing.
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #480 on: 18 Dec 2008, 12:23 »

That doesn't quite seem to fit, though. 13-14 year old girls will already have had their first crush, perhaps they are wanting to read something like it, but ending better?

Oh, something brightened up my day a few days ago. I just met an old elementary school friend again, and she doesn't like Twilight. Not the level of hate some people have for it, but she doesn't like it.
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Lines

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #481 on: 19 Dec 2008, 14:15 »

That doesn't quite seem to fit, though. 13-14 year old girls will already have had their first crush, perhaps they are wanting to read something like it, but ending better?

Death - The Ultimate Happy Ending! WHEE! Or undeath. Take your pick.
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Nodaisho

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #482 on: 19 Dec 2008, 15:12 »

Eh, the first one happens to everyone, might as well make it useful or enjoyable. But really, it doesn't seem to apply, given that I tend to think of death as being the end of your experience on this world, where as in Twilight, it is just the beginning of bland mary-sueness.
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MadassAlex

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #483 on: 19 Dec 2008, 17:38 »

Eh, the first one happens to everyone, might as well make it useful or enjoyable. But really, it doesn't seem to apply, given that I tend to think of death as being the end of your experience on this world, where as in Twilight, it is just the beginning of bland mary-sueness.

At least the terrifying nothingness of death has a morbid beauty to it. Like shark teeth.

Twilight, if it were a person, would be someone who starts adulthood very cocky before realising their grave inadequacies and ultimately ends up throwing their life away to crack cocaine and booze in an effort to delude itself.
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Surgoshan

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #484 on: 20 Dec 2008, 03:11 »

Harry Potter is like a hot dog.  It's not great, but it's not terrible.  It's kinda fun and something you eat (read) when you're looking for something easy.

Twilight is like a dirty twinkie.
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melliechick

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #485 on: 23 Dec 2008, 17:05 »

I first read Twilight because a friend had wanted me to read it.  I read the whole series, only because it was so terrible I just had to keep reading it to see if it could get any worse. :p  Never again will I pick it up, unless I'm really in need of a good laugh.  The whole series feels like it's written by a little twelve-year-old vampire fangirl.  I was tempted to see the movie, because I heard it was even worse than the books, but I don't really know if I want to spend money on it...

My fifteen-year-old sister, on the other hand, absolutely loves the books.  She usually hates reading, so it's good that she's reading them I guess?
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ruyi

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #486 on: 25 Dec 2008, 00:46 »

Man, I actually really enjoyed the film. It's not great, but what it does with the book is legitimately amazing. Cuts out all the inane babbling between Edward and Bella, for instance. Too bad it couldn't cut out the problems with the plot.

The film's treatment (not sure how much is Hardwicke's or Rosenberg's doing) of high school life was very sweet, in showing how every small interaction is magnified in significance. (This becomes a kinda bad pun in the biology lab scene when they work with microscopes while scrutinizing each other.) Certain moments ended up staying with me, like when the girls were trying on prom dresses. I dunno, it is just endearing to see young girls watching themselves in the mirror, self-conscious and anxious about how they look but pleasantly surprised with what they see.

Some of it was awkward, like Eric and Mike and all the other boys trying to fawn over Bella, but that was kinda inevitable because it's a stupid premise. Other small things were done well, like the relationship between Bella and her father Charlie.

Also I liked how the principal characters were strengthened. Pattinson wasn't the charming/cocky guy from the book, instead he looked/talked/behaved like a fucking alien. Edward seemed genuinely withdrawn into himself and isolated. In that scene where he jumps off Bella's truck and tells her he's going to take her to meet his family, he acts kind of...socially retarded? Like, he's just so excited with this idea he had that he's just going to share it with Bella right now, oblivious to his own weird behavior.

Similarly, Stewart wasn't the useless fill-in-the-blank (with yourself, the reader) girl; she was actually pretty strong and stubborn in pursuing her decisions. When Edward blubbers about not being able to handle his feeeelings, she forces him to deal by asserting her own feelings. She doesn't get intimidated by his withering attempts at scary faces. She's intelligent, curious, figures stuff out and gets shit done. Whereas in the book Edward is the one in control, telling Bella what's good for her and setting the limits on her sexual desires (and carrying her around like a child to boot), in the film it is clear that they are mutually just a little nervous around each other, like in the bedroom scene after their first kiss. In other words, they both act like teenagers. He still withdraws rather violently when they approach intimacy (which is problematic for obvious reasons) but his reaction is presented as an expression of vulnerability rather than a patronizing castigation of Bella.

Honestly, it's incredibly retarded that Edward is supposed to be over 100 years old and his first love is a 17-year-old, and it becomes really problematic in light of the franchise's fanbase. The imbalance of power in the dynamics of their relationship is even more creepy in the book. I think it's good that he came across as about equal in maturity to Bella in the film.

One big problem with the book is that Edward is, for all intents and purposes, Bella's imaginary friend, in that he is basically with her all night every night. Like, he was literally a crush come to life. What I mean is, I think when young girls have their first crushes, they're basically just a new kind of imaginary friend in that they build the person up in their mind and start imagining the crush everywhere, reacting to all the different going-ons in their own life. (I, uh, draw this from my own memories.) Edward as a character was just an extension of that fantasy. The film removed this bullshit, I thought.

I don't know if I like that this film is so hyped though. Whenever I read something online about the reaction of fans I find it terrifying. Little girls should not be thinking the things this book is telling them!
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ruyi

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #487 on: 25 Dec 2008, 00:52 »

Aw fuck I'm a little girl  :-(
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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #488 on: 25 Dec 2008, 01:21 »

Don't beat yourself up, you expressed your opinions in a relatively mature fashion  :-D
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yelley

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #489 on: 25 Dec 2008, 01:52 »

ruyi, i <3 you because you just said everything that i felt about twilight movie vs. book but didn't feel like taking the time to explain to people.

it's easier to just tell people that i have a 12 year old girl crush on robert pattinson.
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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #490 on: 25 Dec 2008, 18:44 »

Your avatar makes me giggle.

I want to see the movie when it comes out on video just for shits and giggles. I mean, the books weren't great in the first place, but supposedly they're on par with the books.
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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #491 on: 27 Dec 2008, 00:24 »

Guess who gets to read Twilight for his Women Studies course?! 
This is going to be the most exciting course ever, ever.
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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #492 on: 27 Dec 2008, 00:42 »

Wow.
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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #493 on: 27 Dec 2008, 06:47 »

And the point is? I hope it's to say that this is not how most females act. Please say that's what it is.
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KharBevNor

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #494 on: 27 Dec 2008, 06:54 »

It's a book...by a WOMAN!

What more do you want you filthy hippies?
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NeverQuiteGoth

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #495 on: 29 Dec 2008, 20:01 »

His Dark Materials I've only read the first book of, but while it's certainly "more than suitable" for the demographic, I think the key element here is some kind of romance. Which certainly isn't apparent in Northern Lights.
That's because Lyra's love interest isn't introduced until the second book.
And that most people don't even notice that its a love story while its happening, 'cause its actually a love story, not a lust story.

Also the movie totally botched everything.
--------------------------


As for Twilight, I like the books, because they're bad. I can read one in a sitting if I'm bored; its just like watching TV.
Also, I like to think they were just practice for The Host, which is really good if you're paying attention and realize that the story is NOT in fact about Melanie and Jared. The Host is the one that should have gotten a movie deal; its better than all of Twilight put together.

As for the movie,
I don't think it was worse than the books, and it (mostly) stood on its on feet, which is not something you can say about many book-to-movie movies. Maybe I'm just overly forgiving because no matter how bad something is, I always think, "well, at least its not as bad as Eragon."

And another thing, the loss of Midnight Sun is really a big deal. The Edward in the movie was drawn from that, and even though that was more of an accident on Robert Patterson's part, he nailed it; after reading the partial draft, you realize that most of what makes Twilight so inane is actually intentional, showing Bella's point of view. Reading it from Edward's perspective really shows how twisted Bella's view of things really is, and a lot of things that seemed trite or nonsensical suddenly fit together.

Not that any of it makes the series suddenly perfect; I think of twilight with the same "eh its better than nothing" fondness with which I watch That 70s Show reruns.


In conclusion, I vote for His Dark Materials to be added to the English curriculum standards. :-D
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Yes, thank goodness we live in an enlightened society where we're horribly sexist to both men and woman in equal measure. >.<

ampersandwitch

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #496 on: 30 Dec 2008, 00:12 »

Really?  I read Midnight Sun, and for me, the only thing that
Reading it from Edward's perspective really shows
is that SMeyer cannot write a 100+ year old dude to save her life.  She instead takes up the supposed voice of an angsty, pretentious, ennui-tastic teenager bored with high school and his peers, replete with imagining in what time period he can kill everyone in the room. 

But he sparkles and stuff.
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Tom

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #497 on: 30 Dec 2008, 02:06 »

I don't think that SM had any such intention NQG.
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Josefbugman

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #498 on: 02 Jan 2009, 05:57 »

Having not read the books, nor seen the movie I find I have only one REAL thing to contribute to this conversation, and that is limited to four little words "Vampires Should Not Sparkle!!

I want to ask a minor question by the way, since when did "vampire" come to mean, attractive preadator? People seem to have forgotten that in the earliest stories they are horrendous walking corpses feasting on the blood of the living. They have become attractive alternative girls or moody gitwizards since... well probably just after the "hammer horror" films finished.

It gets on my wick that while they are often evil, they are never bestial... I am starting to wish people would return to the old ones, at least they would make cool bad guys instead of just flouncy ones.

Oh yeah that reminds me, a goodly amount of my friends went to see it and were... impressed shall we say with the male lead. "why didn't he take his shirt off more" is not something I expect to hear when people are reviewing a film.
« Last Edit: 02 Jan 2009, 07:49 by Josefbugman »
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Oddly enough the "oh no boobs!" box in the background of todays comic is my usual reaction.

JonSnow

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Re: Twilight Series
« Reply #499 on: 02 Jan 2009, 07:11 »

lol josef, you're right about women being impressed by the male lead :D
most of my female friends find the male lead's looks to be the most notable thing in the movie.

I miss the times when vampires actually shunned the light, were feared, and only wanted to romance women to make their undead bride.
A vampire that walks in broad daylight, even though he finds it mildly uncomfortable -.-, you could just call him a cannibal, cause that's what he is a man that eats other people and has little of the disabilities a vampire has

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