Topic: WCDT 15-19 November 2010 (1796-1800) (Read 445564 times)

Saral · « **Reply #400 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:01 »

Quote from: bhtooefr on 16 Nov 2010, 03:20

I could see Dora and Marten breaking up over this, although it's obvious that that's not what Marten really wants.

They actually have broken up. Dora just dumped Marten remember. They need to stay broken up for some time at the minimum.

Quote from: bhtooefr on 16 Nov 2010, 03:20

There's no way in hell that I could see Marten ACTUALLY dating Hanners. I could see Hanners wanting to, but I couldn't see Marten thinking of her in that way at all, and even if he did, I couldn't see him wanting to deal with those issues right after Dora's issues.

I'm starting to understand why Dora loses people to Sven. He's an ass but at least he says straight up these are the rules with me. And after a "relationship" with Dora, no strings might be just what some people need. He only crossed one line, a line he didn't quite know he was crossing. A big one to be fair but he didn't know. he thought it was casual. And he did try to correct it. Too late as it happens but unlike Dora he tried.

Blaming Sven means Dora doesn't have to examine her behaviour. The fault line in relationships looking to be Dora's not Sven's. Until Dora can honestly say she's at fault, her relationships will not improve.

jeanramone · « **Reply #401 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:07 »

mmmm, juicy drama.

It's such a nice break reading fictional drama rather than dwelling on your own

jwhouk · « **Reply #402 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:09 »

Its power level! It's over NINE... PAAAAGGGEEESSSS!!!!

Skewbrow · « **Reply #403 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:14 »

This is painful to read. My friends are hurting. I still believe that somehow things will be patched up (I can't really see Jeph jumping the shark and turning QC into a day-time soap opera, where people take turns mawwying each other). Who can put the first band-aid on a bleeding heart? Let's take stock:

1. Sven. He would be in a position to beat some perspective into Dora with a rolled up journal. Or, he would, if he were not currently trying to rinse a certain Georgia Peach out of his system with excessive amounts of Jack Daniels. So... pas ce soir.

2. Hanners. She could easily give Marten that comfort hug. But that's where it would end. She is, indeed, making progress, may entertain some secret hopes about Marten, and since when has "lack of ability of maintaining a healthy relationship" stopped people from trying, but even so. Marten wouldn't go for anything beyond that hug. Furthermore, if Hanners' first sexual encounter would be a rebound fuck with Marty, then Jeph would have violated the "cruel and unusual punishment to the readers" clause of the US constitution. No, the best thing Hanners could do would be to "go critical" on both of them. For that to work Dora & Marten would need to be in the same room with her, so we save that for later tonight.

That leaves us with

3. Faye. She helped quite a bit during the underwear incident. And a friend in need is a friend in deed..

jwhouk · « **Reply #404 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:18 »

"If you'll take steps to get yourself fixed up - I mean more therapy, medication, whatever it takes, I'll do my best to treat you as a friend and not as a <crazy ex-girlfriend>."

AnAverageWriter · « **Reply #405 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:22 »

Don't forget Marigold!

She's a sweet, intelligent shut-in who could use a good, solid relationship, and needs someone who is patient, kind and tolerant.

Marten would be just the guy!

Or Tai. But she's not a guy. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

But anywho, seriously- what would be so horrible about Marten and Marigold? They're both fundamentally good people, they both deserve some happiness, and they're both patient enough to not fly off the handle at the slightest offense.

Blackjoker · « **Reply #406 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:30 »

I just really really hope that Tai isn't at CoD looking for Marten, because otherwise this could get worse FAST

akronnick · « **Reply #407 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:35 »

I don't think Dora would be up for canoodling, and I hope Tai wouldn't take advantage, but you never know

bonzombiekitty · « **Reply #408 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:36 »

Quote from: Saral on 16 Nov 2010, 04:01

Quote from: bhtooefr on 16 Nov 2010, 03:20
I could see Dora and Marten breaking up over this, although it's obvious that that's not what Marten really wants.

They actually have broken up. Dora just dumped Marten remember. They need to stay broken up for some time at the minimum.

They didn't break up though. She said "Well I guess that's it then" then left angrily. What "that" is could be a number of things - i.e. "well I guess that this is where this fight is going and I'm really pissed off so I'm leaving in a huff". It doesn't necessarily mean she ended the relationship.

I guess I'm in the minority here who likes Marten and Dora together. People keep talking about them fighting all the time, but really, how often have they fought. I can think of three real fights -

1. This one
2. The underwear incident
3. Marten getting hit on.

Were there others I don't recall?

rje · « **Reply #409 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:41 »

I have decided that what I most want to see happen is Marten and Dora sitting down and talking. Actually talking, completely and fully, saying the all the things in their brains with their mouth parts - especially Dora. I honestly cannot remember her ever actually -honestly- talking about what she thinks regarding Marten and their relationship and her insecurities. It's always vague statement like "I'm insecure" or "I have some jealousy issues" or "My past relationships weren't good" (I don't even know if she herself told Marten this, or if it was Sven.) If I'm wrong, I'd sure like to see that, because I think what Marten needs to know more than anything right now is WHY. Not vague hints into past difficulties, but "I'm afraid you're going to leave me because in the past _____ happened and then ____ happened and _____ happened and it made me feel _____. I don't really understand why you'd want to keep anything from me because I think that means _____ and _____ because _____ happened."

It is really hard to understand the way someone behaves without knowing the underlying reasons for the behavior, and the only way to find that out is to ask and be told. (And I say this for Dora's behavior and Marten's behavior.) Not anymore of this "I'll work on it." "Okay good, because you should." "Yes, I should." "Yes." "Indeed." WHEE PROBLEM SOLVED

CONVERSATE GUYS. Conversate.

Cold · « **Reply #410 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:49 »

Quote from: Odal on 16 Nov 2010, 03:08

Prediction: Dora will go back to CoD and get all emotional with Faye around. Then after work she'll go see Sven and they'll both talk to each other about how much their lives suck. Sven because he thought he was making progress towards being a better person but got shot down by Faye. Dora because she's always had to work to make a relationship last with her past douchebags and now she's doing a fine job of destroying the one person who she's not had to bend over backwards for. Dora will get upset with Sven initially, because she's upset that he's never had to try to get women, while she's had the opposite.

But they'll both revert back to their old ways out of self pity. Sven will seduce Dora and they'll have intense, rigorous, and deliciously painful sex for the whole night. Then, the next day, Sven will leave unannounced realizing what an asshole move it was to have sex with his own sister. Of course they didn't think to use protection and Dora will get pregnant with her brother's child. And since Sven will not be around, she will be a single mother living on her own.

As for Marten, he'll be standing in the doorway for about 15 minutes after Dora leaves with the same dumb expression on his face, only after about five minutes tears will start flowing from his eyes. Hanners will show up with cleaning supplies on expecting that Marten would be gone and she was going to secretly clean his apartment while he was gone. Then she'll see Marten crying and it'll change her completely. Marten is such a great, and emotionally strong man. There's no way he could be crying unless it was a true tragedy.

She'll approach him and he'll jump, not noticing she was there. She'll ask if he's okay and he'll wipe away his tears while saying yes, trying to remain strong. Hanners will see through it though. Marten is a sort of hero to her and has helped her so much, and now its her turn to return the favor. She'll grab him by the hand with her yellow glove hands, take him over to the couch to sit him down, and take a seat next to him. She'll ask him what is wrong and to not bother telling her nothing because she knows better!

Marten will explain the situation and she'll tell him that he deserves better than Dora. Hanners will take off her gloves, scoot closer to Marten and nuzzle his face with her face mask and put her bare hand on his lap. Marten will be shocked initially, because he knows of her OCD. He'll grab her hand to move it away from him, but as soon as he touches her hand, he'll realize how soft and clean her skin is.

Marten will stare blankly into her bright, beautiful blue eyes.
"What about your O-" He'll mutter.
"It can be ignored." Hanners will retort.

And I'll leave the intimate Hanners and Marten to your imagination, except that Marten will use a condom since they're in Marten's (and formerly Dora's) place.

EVERYONE FUCKS THEN I RETIRE*

*Hannelore realdoll

pwhodges · « **Reply #411 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 04:53 »

Quote from: bonzombiekitty on 16 Nov 2010, 04:36

I can think of three real fights -

1. This one
2. The underwear incident
3. Marten getting hit on.

Were there others I don't recall?

Haircut (not that big a fight, but the first);
Marten still has feelings for old girlfriends (didn't go far);
Marten disagrees that Faye seeing Sven is aimed at him.

Zipperstuck · « **Reply #412 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:08 »

Far as I can tell, here's what went down.

Marten: I want you to treat me with the respect you expect me to give you. No more excuses.
Dora: Well, I'm outta here then. Who do you think you are, demanding the respect you deserve?

sirisaacnuton · « **Reply #413 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:12 »

Quote from: bonzombiekitty on 16 Nov 2010, 04:36

I guess I'm in the minority here who likes Marten and Dora together. People keep talking about them fighting all the time, but really, how often have they fought. I can think of three real fights -

1. This one
2. The underwear incident
3. Marten getting hit on.

Were there others I don't recall?

But there's fights and then there's fights. Couples fight about stuff all the time...but these were pretty vicious. Telling Faye she's fired and Marten not to come to bed is a huge reaction. Calling Marten a vindictive prick is taking things beyond just an argument within a couple. Add to that the fact that (in comic-time) these have all come pretty close to each other, and it gives the impression that it's just one thing after another.

So in the grand scheme of things, 3 fights in a relationship (or a few more) might be nothing. On the other hand, 3 fights in a relationship in a very short period, all of which are pretty nasty, all of which basically come down to being the same fight in slightly different wrapping, and none of which led to any serious kind of development of the relationship or their (lack of) communication. That's what doesn't bode well for the relationship.

gathayah · « **Reply #414 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:12 »

I think that ultimately the bottom line here is that this is mostly a matter of miscommunication. I say "mostly" because yes, there are other factors at work here, but I think miscommunication is the most prevalent. Most of this stems from Dora's insecurity, but that isn't to say that Marten doesn't have a hand in it as well, no matter how small.

Let's look at the facts here: First off, and perhaps most important, Dora is extremely insecure and is more prone to being irrational than the other characters in the comic. Case in point: the underwear incident and the haircut incident, both of which lasted for several strips before they were resolved. They were ultimately minor issues that should not have been problems to begin with, and yet they became a huge deal when Dora flew off the handle. But looking at Dora's track record with her previous boyfriends it isn't hard to see why this might be the case. If all of her previous S.O.'s were really as horrible as she and Sven have made them out to be, maybe she's just inadvertently worried that Marten will fall into the same stock. Despite evidence to the contrary, she's worried that he's just another asshole who will walk over her, so minor offenses erupt into huge confrontations.

Now, that said, this particular issue could have been avoided relatively quickly as soon as Dora followed Marten into his room to try to "apologize" (because let's face it here, based on her wording and body language, Dora's apology was most definitely NOT sincere). Marten obviously left the room because he needed time to cool down before talking to Dora. And what does Dora do? Back him into a corner, literally. Instead of telling Dora "I'm not ready to talk about this right now, I need some time to cool off," he immediately attacked her. That isn't to say that it wasn't necessarily unwarranted, but it wasn't the right time to be coming forward with the stuff that he said. Granted, he was angry and probably wasn't in the best of mindsets at that particular moment. But even so, simply telling Dora to back off until he calmed down could have easily avoided what has come to happen now.

Dora's got issues, we can't deny that. But both parties need to be willing to work through rough patches in any relationship, and this is certainly no exception. Dora and Marten need to sit down and have a nice long chat if they have any hope of fixing this mess.

Border Reiver · « **Reply #415 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:12 »

I left this forum at a mere 3 pages, went home from work and studiously ignored the computer in favour of my family and when I get back I find that we're now at nine flippin' pages!

At this time I will refrain from repeating what the saner heads have already spoken - namely that both parties have contributed to this situation, and that a relationship is not a "He/She's at fault!" game - learn that and you may have a shot at happiness with another person.

And to use a standard diversion of the conversation - Are we all looking forward to the annual turkey strip?

bhtooefr · « **Reply #416 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:16 »

Also, while Dora may have said "that's it," what I meant was more along the lines of, I could see them STAYING broken up. For good. Rather than Dora taking it back, and Marten apologizing (like usually happens, except without Dora saying "that's it.")

tbones · « **Reply #417 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:36 »

Quote from: mickcheese on 15 Nov 2010, 20:26

[...]Most Americans. We like to know there's a villain responsible for everything. Listen to any American politician give a speech. They don't talk about what they will do to fix problems or to prevent future problems, instead they spend the whole speech assigning blame for the current problems.[...]

Not only Americans (although i guess you were refering to North Americans) but the whole human race acts like that. And that's just.... pretty sad.....

Interesting fact!
Of this 9 pages, they were posted 17 psyducks!

Now 18!

AnAverageWriter · « **Reply #418 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:42 »

Quote from: tbones on 16 Nov 2010, 05:36

the whole human race acts like that

More than just the human race- other primates and such mammals have been known to form social cliques and scapegoat as well, such as the bathing monkeys of Jigokudani. It's because mammals are inherently not a naturally studious and hardworking form of creature. If a bear can find a way to laze around all day, it will. Thus, instead of studiously working to find solutions to problems, we as mammals have the tendency to seek quick and easy answers. Thus is borne the instinct to scapegoat.

Zipperstuck · « **Reply #419 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:43 »

Basically, Marten told Dora she's being a dick, and she didn't like hearing that. Hearing that she could do something wrong. So she breaks it off, before it comes to the point where she'll have to admit that she's the only one to blame for it this time.

All her previous boyfriends were cheating dicks, as we learned. That makes is somewhat easier to break up with them. Marten never really did anything like that, or even something remotely bad.
It seems like this is Dora's first time dealing with the fact that someone else has valid reasons not to like her character.

akronnick · « **Reply #420 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:48 »

Many people are saying that Marten and Dora are broken up as of Tuesday's strip (1797,) but are they?

They both said some pretty nasty things, and they had a huge fight over something that may or may not have been that big a deal, but, at their current level of entanglement, have they truly, officially, according to Hoyle-ly broken up?

It is my position that they have not, as yet broken up.

Given their level of commitment, a break up must be explicitly stated to be in effect.

Dora saying "well that's it then" does not meat this standard.

That is not to say they won't break up, and does not mean that Dora and/or Marten won't consider the relationship over, until one of them says something unambiguous to that effect, they are still, technically, together.

Mr_Rose · « **Reply #421 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:53 »

Quote from: Cold on 16 Nov 2010, 04:49

Quote from: Odal on 16 Nov 2010, 03:08
Prediction: Dora will go back to CoD and get all emotional with Faye around. Then after work she'll go see Sven and they'll both talk to each other about how much their lives suck. Sven because he thought he was making progress towards being a better person but got shot down by Faye. Dora because she's always had to work to make a relationship last with her past douchebags and now she's doing a fine job of destroying the one person who she's not had to bend over backwards for. Dora will get upset with Sven initially, because she's upset that he's never had to try to get women, while she's had the opposite.

But they'll both revert back to their old ways out of self pity. Sven will seduce Dora and they'll have intense, rigorous, and deliciously painful sex for the whole night. Then, the next day, Sven will leave unannounced realizing what an asshole move it was to have sex with his own sister. Of course they didn't think to use protection and Dora will get pregnant with her brother's child. And since Sven will not be around, she will be a single mother living on her own.

As for Marten, he'll be standing in the doorway for about 15 minutes after Dora leaves with the same dumb expression on his face, only after about five minutes tears will start flowing from his eyes. Hanners will show up with cleaning supplies on expecting that Marten would be gone and she was going to secretly clean his apartment while he was gone. Then she'll see Marten crying and it'll change her completely. Marten is such a great, and emotionally strong man. There's no way he could be crying unless it was a true tragedy.

She'll approach him and he'll jump, not noticing she was there. She'll ask if he's okay and he'll wipe away his tears while saying yes, trying to remain strong. Hanners will see through it though. Marten is a sort of hero to her and has helped her so much, and now its her turn to return the favor. She'll grab him by the hand with her yellow glove hands, take him over to the couch to sit him down, and take a seat next to him. She'll ask him what is wrong and to not bother telling her nothing because she knows better!

Marten will explain the situation and she'll tell him that he deserves better than Dora. Hanners will take off her gloves, scoot closer to Marten and nuzzle his face with her face mask and put her bare hand on his lap. Marten will be shocked initially, because he knows of her OCD. He'll grab her hand to move it away from him, but as soon as he touches her hand, he'll realize how soft and clean her skin is.

Marten will stare blankly into her bright, beautiful blue eyes.
"What about your O-" He'll mutter.
"It can be ignored." Hanners will retort.

And I'll leave the intimate Hanners and Marten to your imagination, except that Marten will use a condom since they're in Marten's (and formerly Dora's) place.
EVERYONE FUCKS THEN I RETIRE*

*Hannelore realdoll

...and now I'm wondering how this fight would have gone down if it turned out Marten was into bro/sis incest fiction.

Damn you all!

jwhouk · « **Reply #422 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 05:57 »

Quote from: akronnick on 16 Nov 2010, 05:48

Many people are saying that Marten and Dora are broken up as of Tuesday's strip (1797,) but are they?

They both said some pretty nasty things, and they had a huge fight over something that may or may not have been that big a deal, but, at their current level of entanglement, have they truly, officially, according to Hoyle-ly broken up?

It is my position that they have not, as yet broken up.

Given their level of commitment, a break up must be explicitly stated to be in effect.

Dora saying "well that's it then" does not meat this standard.

That is not to say they won't break up, and does not mean that Dora and/or Marten won't consider the relationship over, until one of them says something unambiguous to that effect, they are still, technically, together.

...or until Marten tosses all of her stuff (including Mieville) out onto the lawn of the apartment building.

EDIT: Phew! Didn't want to be the post that turns it into page 10!

EDIT (2): Wow, it's in the top five all-time. Um, yay Jeph?

tbones · « **Reply #423 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:05 »

Quote from: AnAverageWriter on 16 Nov 2010, 05:42

Quote from: tbones on 16 Nov 2010, 05:36
the whole human race acts like that

More than just the human race- other primates and such mammals have been known to form social cliques and scapegoat as well, such as the bathing monkeys of Jigokudani. It's because mammals are inherently not a naturally studious and hardworking form of creature. If a bear can find a way to laze around all day, it will. Thus, instead of studiously working to find solutions to problems, we as mammals have the tendency to seek quick and easy answers. Thus is borne the instinct to scapegoat.

what it bothers me is that us, as humans have the choice to find the best solutions, not the easiest. But our instict overcomes most people, and they try to find an scapegoat easily... An animal will only work hard, only if needed to, but we have the brain to choose to do it! And still...

akronnick · « **Reply #424 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:10 »

Quote from: jwhouk on 16 Nov 2010, 05:57

...or until Marten tosses all of her stuff (including Mieville) out onto the lawn of the apartment building.

EDIT: Phew! Didn't want to be the post that turns it into page 10!

EDIT (2): Wow, it's in the top five all-time. Um, yay Jeph?

Now that would be pretty unambiguous wouldn't it.

But Marten would never do that.

Unless Faye egged him on...

jwhouk · « **Reply #425 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:18 »

Quote from: akronnick on 16 Nov 2010, 06:10

Quote from: jwhouk on 16 Nov 2010, 05:57
...or until Marten tosses all of her stuff (including Mieville) out onto the lawn of the apartment building.

Now that would be pretty unambiguous wouldn't it.

But Marten would never do that.

<pause>

Unless Faye egged him on...

Or unless Faye beat him to it...

akronnick · « **Reply #426 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:24 »

Yeah that would be a career move!

jwhouk · « **Reply #427 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:31 »

Quote from: akronnick on 16 Nov 2010, 06:24

Yeah that would be a career move!

Oh, heck, she'd probably figured she was fired anyways after she smacked Dora over the head with the espresso machine after she told Faye how she'd broken up with Marten.

daryljfontaine · « **Reply #428 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:35 »

Quelle dramage!

Cool your jets and see how it plays out, people... don't be so quick to set up Taira, Martigold, Manners or Mambo (and I'll let your brains all dribble out of your ears with that last one).

Quote from: jwhouk on 15 Nov 2010, 21:37

Quote from: jephjacques (twitter)
It's interesting to me that every time I do an argument in QC everybody tries to decide who's to blame.

The writer.

Quote from: Odal on 16 Nov 2010, 03:08

(Dorven incestfic and Hanners and Marten Versus the SPAAAAACE WIZARDS deleted)

Dude. Issues.

Quote from: Mr_Rose on 16 Nov 2010, 05:53

EVERYONE FUCKS THEN I RETIRE*

*Hannelore realdoll

+1 Internets.

Quote from: Cold on 16 Nov 2010, 04:49

...and now I'm wondering how this fight would have gone down if it turned out Marten was into bro/sis incest fiction.

Damn you all!

"Ron had always secretly fancied Ginny..."

Quote from: jwhouk on 16 Nov 2010, 05:57

...or until Marten tosses all of her stuff (including Mieville) out onto the lawn of the apartment building.

Actually, my Total Drama Threshhold has the sequence like this:

1798: Dora at CoD, meltdown/semi-drama with Faye
1799: "You're right, I need to go talk it out with him. We can't leave it like this."
1800: Dora goes back home, Marten (and his stuff) are completely gone, moved out, no note. Pintsize has been left behind, the little traitor.
November 22nd: YELLING BIRD PRESENTS SIX WEEKS OF GUEST STRIPS, SHITCOCKS.

D

Coco · « **Reply #429 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:39 »

Quote from: Carl-E on 15 Nov 2010, 14:49

Quote from: Coco on 15 Nov 2010, 12:50
My husband is definitely the type to walk away from an argument to regain composure, but I'm the type that when he does this the argument festers and I get angrier and the longer he waits the more I turn myself into an innocent victim and cast him as the villian. Let's hope Dora isn't like that. But to anyone who is calling for their break up, my husband and I have been together for over seven years, married for one and we are still working on these issues. Life is like that. Not every fictional couple can be Bella and Edward with their perfect ~~stalker~~ ~~abusive~~ loving relationship.

My wife and I were much the same. I'd want to cool down, and in the interim she'd continue to boil over. It took a couple of years, but we've learned to channel it differently - rather than leaving to calm myself down, I focus on calming her down first, agreeing that there's a problem, and turning it into a mental exercise to try and get to the root of the problem before either of us gets too heated.

No, it doesn't always work. But it's better than what used to happen!

I like that, it's very good advice. I've been working on stopping the negative thoughts and turning them into positives. It's amazing how silly a fight seems after you take a minute and force yourself to remember what an great life you really have. Then by the time he comes back I'm ready to either apologize and/or accept his apology and move on to solutions.

Six pages were added to the forum since I last looked so I gave up reading by page four. But someone did point out that Dora seems to be self-sabatoging (sp?). This seems to fit into her general character mode. She's extremely insecure, and she has a boyfriend who never gets angry, is always reasonable, and who doesn't even have a creepy fetish! How can Dora keep a man like that? She obviously doesn't deserve him. She better keep poking that bear until he proves he's just as bad as her. Then she can break up with him and save herself the heartache. And if he breaks up with her, that just proves what she always knew, that he was too good for her, perpetuating the cycle of insecurity and dis-trust into her next relationship. It's really very sad and I feel sorry for both of them. I hope this results in some serious thought, conversation and some time off. I always thought underwear-gate was resolved too easily and therefore not truly resolved. Good for Jeph for not allowing that sitcom style ending to stand and to really dive into their issues.

snubnose · « **Reply #430 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 06:52 »

Quote from: scarred on 16 Nov 2010, 03:20

i honestly forgot how horrifying this subforum is

LOL

Border Reiver · « **Reply #431 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:06 »

Quote from: daryljfontaine on 16 Nov 2010, 06:35

Quelle dramage!

November 22nd: YELLING BIRD PRESENTS SIX WEEKS OF GUEST STRIPS, SHITCOCKS.

D

We should be so lucky.

But I want my turkey strip...

akronnick · « **Reply #432 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:08 »

Gong through the archives earlier, it turns out that 'The Talk' began on the Monday folowing OMG Turkeys.

True Fax.

Skewbrow · « **Reply #433 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:18 »

Quote from: Mr_Rose on 16 Nov 2010, 05:53

...and now I'm wondering how this fight would have gone down if it turned out Marten was into bro/sis incest fiction.

I was more worried about the possibility of a secret folder named "faye36D".

Quote from: daryljfontaine on 16 Nov 2010, 06:35

Actually, my Total Drama Threshhold has the sequence like this:

1798: Dora at CoD, meltdown/semi-drama with Faye
1799: "You're right, I need to go talk it out with him. We can't leave it like this."
1800: Dora goes back home, Marten (and his stuff) are completely gone, moved out, no note. Pintsize has been left behind, the little traitor.
November 22nd: YELLING BIRD PRESENTS SIX WEEKS OF GUEST STRIPS, SHITCOCKS.

D

Hopefully your posting this prevents Jeph from following that path.

Prince of Space · « **Reply #434 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:24 »

I just realized I feel pretty bad for both of these characters.

I've been in a relationship where there was constant blame. It never gets you anywhere.
When something is bothering you, you're supposed to try your best to step outside of yourself and figure out why your partner is acting the way she/he is acting (and try your best to recognize your own assumptions, then squash them).

For instance, Dora completely disregarded Marten's wishes. However, they'd never spoken about this type of thing before. Dora assumes that Marten was just kidding about not watching it. Marten assumes Dora should already know it's private. The way to nip this in the bud would be for both of them to just stop and listen to one another. However, that's hard to do when you keep *assuming* the other person should 'just know' what's right.

People are who they are.
At about 6 years into my own relationship, I finally realized it wasn't my boyfriend's fault that I was angry or upset. It's MINE, because I stayed! I tried everything. Blame first, then actual talking, sharing my own feelings and trying to hear his. Once this happens, blame no longer matters.

You just have to figure out if what you're both going through is worth weathering. Is that person having issues and will they change? Are you being too hard on them? Are you more happy than unhappy?

Those questions are usually easy to ask and answer...it's the actions you have to take afterwards that are hard.

daryljfontaine · « **Reply #435 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:34 »

Quote from: Skewbrow on 16 Nov 2010, 07:18

Hopefully your posting this prevents Jeph from following that path.

I never expect writers to use or change plot points based on fan speculation. With all the WAGging (Wild Ass Guessing) going on, someone is bound to hit at least one of the major plot developments, and to change it just because some random internets person correctly typed Shakespeare on their keyboard is a sign of insecurity in the writer.

I also never expect to guess correctly, though I reserve the right to point at my previous posts and grin if one of my WAGs turns out to come true.

I was in a role-playing game way back in my college days where we had the GM describe our NPC mission leader finishing a phone call before giving us our briefing. I made an offhand joke that he had just finished reporting to his villainous superiors; apparently this was actually the case and our GM had the presence of mind not to let that affect the rest of the game. We would not get the actual revelation for months. I am told (by the GM) that his glare at me in that first session would have turned me to stone had I actually taken notice of it.

D

Moxie · « **Reply #436 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:41 »

Quote from: Saral on 16 Nov 2010, 04:01

I'm starting to understand why Dora loses people to Sven. He's an ass but at least he says straight up these are the rules with me. And after a "relationship" with Dora, no strings might be just what some people need. He only crossed one line, a line he didn't quite know he was crossing. A big one to be fair but he didn't know. he thought it was casual. And he did try to correct it. Too late as it happens but unlike Dora he tried.

Blaming Sven means Dora doesn't have to examine her behaviour. The fault line in relationships looking to be Dora's not Sven's. Until Dora can honestly say she's at fault, her relationships will not improve.

I think this is a really interesting point! I think it also ties in with the point someone made about how if Dora and Sven were to talk and Dora makes the point about how she sees how Sven treats women who keep going back to him, but here she did one little thing to Marten and he just blows up at her with Sven pointing out to her that no, this is not the first "little thing" that has happened and also, has she noticed that he is all alone and stuff?
It's true that Dora's got a ton of insecurities, but it may also be true that a lot of them started from her interactions with her brother, meaning they have been building for an extremely long time. And if she can't move on from that and say that regardless of what happened, she's going to get better because she wants to do so, it will be just as easy for her to continue blaming others for her own issues without ever actually addressing them.

Incidentally, someone quoted me on saying that Dora seemed to be reacting on autopilot during this argument, and later someone else mentioned that Dora almost seemed to interpret Marten's "I'm sick of your apologies" and "I'm sick of you". I think that ties a lot into Dora was expecting this all to happen eventually, and now that she thinks it's happening, she's not actually listening to what's being said, she's just reacting as she did in previous bad relationships. Yes, Dora and Marten have terrible communication, but it's never going to improve as long as Marten won't actually stand up for himself when he is upset at the time and as long as Dora continues to assume she knows how this all is going to play out rather than actually paying attention to what she's got.

cocks · « **Reply #437 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:43 »

Prediction: Steve will blow up the coffee shop.

Elysiana · « **Reply #438 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:45 »

Quote from: Skewbrow on 16 Nov 2010, 07:18

Quote from: Mr_Rose on 16 Nov 2010, 05:53
...and now I'm wondering how this fight would have gone down if it turned out Marten was into bro/sis incest fiction.

I was more worried about the possibility of a secret folder named "faye36D".

You joke, but I somehow get the feeling that deep down that's almost what Dora was hoping to find - perhaps not specifically, but something she could use against him. Someone else mentioned that she is self-sabotaging, and I absolutely agree with that. I used to be that way - find something wrong, ANYTHING, and then you get to hold it over their heads, break up with them, and save yourself the heartache of someone else dumping you first. Dora always seems to jump the gun on this sort of thing, blame Marten, and then realize she's got it good with him and shouldn't have jumped the gun. Marten puts up with a lot of crap from her... I'm actually kinda glad he stood up for himself this time.

innermoppet · « **Reply #439 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:46 »

So many opinions to absorb...

I guess I'm coming at it from the crux of the issue. Not so much the invasion of privacy -which is bad enough- but the truth is Marten walks on eggshells so as not to upset Dora and she doesn't have the decency to even consider her feelings before she goes off half-cocked and checks his computer.

They are at their cores, very different sexually. Dora is free wheeling and will discuss anything with anyone. Marten has always had a line when it comes to sex, porn, his mother etc. He is super uncomfortable with that stuff and she hasn't picked up on that by now which suggests she isn't paying attention.

While i don't think this fight is stupid, I do think many a relationship has been damaged over excruciatingly stupid fights and over seemingly inconsequential things. It's never one thing. It's a series of little things that chip away at you until you just can't take it anymore. While I think it's great that Dora is good at apologizing for her behavior, it would be better if she bothered to pay attention to her behavior in the first place. After a while "I'm sorry" gets old. You'd rather have a partner that behaved like a grown up rather than someone who behaves like a child and scoots their foot on the floor and says "aww shucks" after they acted like a jerk.

Are they broken up? Doubtful, unless one of them makes a serious mistake in the interim and hooks up with someone else. Marten doesn't want to be broken up. He wants her to think about what she does before she does it instead of groveling afterward.

eyosgkxb · « **Reply #440 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:47 »

I can tell just by reading a lot of these posts that everyone here who doesn't think Dora broke a huge relationship boundry probably hasn't had a loving relationship. In love there are many unforgiving crimes, you don't break someone's trust and then chase them down to try and fix it. The way she's apologizing make it seem like it was some victimless crime, when the victim is standing right in front of you.

Coffee_Kaioken · « **Reply #441 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:51 »

Quote from: merv on 15 Nov 2010, 21:59

Someone before mentioned that because she asked him out, therefore he was not attracted to her. Um, no! That's slightly sexist to say the least. A girl can ask a guy out and they can go on to have a happy relationship.

That was me, and no, you completely misread my post. Someone said "I have no idea how Marten could possibly be attracted to her", and I threw in that it was because she took initiative and asked him out, which is not something girls do everyday. Usually the guys have to chase them, but Dora saw what she wanted and went for it. -cue the wave of girls coming in and posting "Um, I asked MY boyfriend out!"-

Rusty · « **Reply #442 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:55 »

Quote from: eyosgkxb on 16 Nov 2010, 07:47

I can tell just by reading a lot of these posts that everyone here who doesn't think Dora broke a huge relationship boundry probably hasn't had a loving relationship. In love there are many unforgiving crimes, you don't break someone's trust and then chase them down to try and fix it. The way she's apologizing make it seem like it was some victimless crime, when the victim is standing right in front of you.

Ill agree with that- From similar experiences, Martin would have been well within the right to blow up the way he did- when something like that happens, its not like "OHAI! door slammed, life can be teh happy nao!". Then of course, the chick always has to be Ms. Icanfixanything and come in, breaking out the Emo-BOOMstick(S-mart special), and causing the "oh shit" moment a few minutes later.

curious to see how the rest of the week goes.

Martin + Steve adventure to Cali to 'visit family', aka chase girls on the beach?

tbones · « **Reply #443 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 07:58 »

Quote from: eyosgkxb on 16 Nov 2010, 07:47

I can tell just by reading a lot of these posts that everyone here who doesn't think Dora broke a huge relationship boundry probably hasn't had a loving relationship. In love there are many unforgiving crimes, you don't break someone's trust and then chase them down to try and fix it. The way she's apologizing make it seem like it was some victimless crime, when the victim is standing right in front of you.

wow, that's quite a claim to make.

Coco · « **Reply #444 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 08:03 »

Prediction
1. Dora and Faye will talk
2. Marten and Steve will talk
3. Dora and Marten will talk and agree they need a break from living together while they work through their issues
4. Marten will go stay with Steve while Dora looks for a new place. Just because Marten is that kind of guy and it makes more sense to me than Dora staying with Sven.
5. Faye keeps Dora in line with her issues and Steve helps Marten grow a spine. Steve has always hated Marten's spinelessness.
6. Dora and Marten make-up, not necessarily bf-gf, but definitely still friends
7. Everyone has the sexxorz except Hanners who has been left catatonic from thinking about all the swapped bodily fluids.

Six new replies? Oh good.

Prince of Space · « **Reply #445 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 08:04 »

Quote from: Rusty on 16 Nov 2010, 07:55

Quote from: eyosgkxb on 16 Nov 2010, 07:47
I can tell just by reading a lot of these posts that everyone here who doesn't think Dora broke a huge relationship boundry probably hasn't had a loving relationship. In love there are many unforgiving crimes, you don't break someone's trust and then chase them down to try and fix it. The way she's apologizing make it seem like it was some victimless crime, when the victim is standing right in front of you.

Ill agree with that- From similar experiences, Martin would have been well within the right to blow up the way he did- when something like that happens, its not like "OHAI! door slammed, life can be teh happy nao!". Then of course, the chick always has to be Ms. Icanfixanything and come in, breaking out the Emo-BOOMstick(S-mart special), and causing the "oh shit" moment a few minutes later.

curious to see how the rest of the week goes.

So there's only black and white here? "OHAI life can be teh happy!" or "WHAT THE HELL?"

In relationships there is a grey area. SHOULD be. The both of them could have handled this better. You don't storm in and get angry. You come in and say 'I'm really disappointed that you did this. This is a big deal to me." Then talk ensues. Hopefully talk that explains what each is feeling and why.

Of *course* people get angry. Not everyone can be a saint.

But in a healthy relationship, you talk it out. You don't yell or scream unnecessarily just because you got butthurt. And if you do, sometimes you just have to stop and say 'I'm wrong for yelling. Let's stop this." It takes practice, but it can be done.

Antsan · « **Reply #446 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 08:04 »

Because someone asked: No, you're not the only one who would be sad if they broke up, I would be too.

And I read from page 3 to here, so I won't post anything to that topic, I guess, the discussion makes a thick overlay over the comic I read before. Can't remember my own feelings to it.... Dammit!

vettechinohio · « **Reply #447 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 08:04 »

Quote from: tbones on 16 Nov 2010, 07:58

Quote from: eyosgkxb on 16 Nov 2010, 07:47
I can tell just by reading a lot of these posts that everyone here who doesn't think Dora broke a huge relationship boundry probably hasn't had a loving relationship. In love there are many unforgiving crimes, you don't break someone's trust and then chase them down to try and fix it. The way she's apologizing make it seem like it was some victimless crime, when the victim is standing right in front of you.
wow, that's quite a claim to make.

How about, "hasn't had a loving relationship with anyone who considers their computer a private place."

Better?

eyosgkxb · « **Reply #448 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 08:05 »

Quote from: tbones on 16 Nov 2010, 07:58

Quote from: eyosgkxb on 16 Nov 2010, 07:47
...
wow, that's quite a claim to make.

Time and time again, I've seen countless people come to her defense as a simple selfish child who doesn't even understand what she does wrong. If she's capable of apologizing for a wrongdoing then she's capable of understanding why she was wrong, knowing you are wrong and continuing to do wrong represents uncaring for your partner. No one is this oblivious, except certain posters on QC I guess.

Wiregeek · « **Reply #449 on:** 16 Nov 2010, 08:07 »

Quote from: Enduar on 16 Nov 2010, 01:24

Damn. And to think my first post was just obsessing over Minecraft.

Man, fuck minecraft. fucking Notch. I've got a P4 3.0ghz machine with a fucking gig of ram running as the server (the only other thing that machine is doing is letting dyndns.org know 'I'm over here!' once an hour), and I can't host more than five simultaneous users without the world going.. wonky.

how the hell am I supposed to get the slave corps hauling cobblestone for the Grand Pyramid when I can only have three of 'em at a time?

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