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[someone1074]

But is it neccessary to go to a therapist over "the smallest hangups"? Seems like a waste of a busy professional's time to me.

A waste of their time that they get paid for? And don't you realize that most people see therapist's for just those small issues that they want to address but can't get over?

[Harashaw]

That wasn't about Dora. It was specifically in reply to someone1074's statement that it is wise to go to a therapist over, and I quote again, "the smallest hangups".

You know what, someone? Define small hangup.

[kaitco]

Is therapy the answer? In my mind, therapy is pretty much the last resort - a therapist helps you deal with something so huge you can't live a normal life without it.

Does a therapist need to deal with situational paranoia and a little low self-esteem?

To answer your hypotheticals, no. The reason being is that everyone goes through the same things. It may not be all the time, but all people have issues. Everyone can get depressed and everyone can get a little paranoid. I doubt that therapy is going to help Dora much because, what is a therapist going to tell her that she does not already know?

Dora knows that she has relationship issues, hence the reason for The Breakup. She knows that most of her issues stem from crappy boyfriend choices in the past, her jealousy issues with her brother and the fact that she jumped on Marten before the air could clear between him and Faye. It is not as if a therapist is going to uncover something more than this.

I also agree that people run to a therapist more often than they should. Every human being has a bias; it is a part of human nature, so the "unbiased" opinion can never really be that. Plus, unless one spends weeks explaining every significant event in their life to a therapist, there is always going to be something missing since a therapist is not a mind reader. They must be told before they can analyze. No one knows you more than you, so why should anyone but you be resolving your problems for you? While "talking it out" can help an individual, so can writing it out or meditating it out or praying it out or just taking a quiet moment to think about the issue. It should not take always take a third party to help someone look at their issues in a rational manner...unless it is a debilitating disorder that keeps one unable to function properly. A disorder keeps one from thinking or behaving in a rational manner and a third party should be able to help identify the major problem and provide help from there.

Dora has issues. Who doesn't? But, are these issues so great that she cannot function properly? Of course not! She is an entrepreneur who sometimes makes bad choices. Faye, on the other hand, needed therapy. It is not normal to be unable to begin a relationship with another person and she definitely needed to talk to someone regarding what happened to her father. Post-therapy, Faye is able to date and hits folks less often even though the desire is there. Dora's issues are not really anything that some self-reflection and a good cry cannot solve.

I am interested to see the end result of therapy, but I will be surprised (pleasantly) to see anything significant come out of it.

[someone1074]

Becoming nervous in new situations to the point where it hinders your ability to enjoy yourself or meet new people. An extremely common issue, but not a universal one, and it's something many people would like to correct.

Compared to actual trauma, that's a small hangup, but it's certainly something therapy can address if no other method has proven successful.

What do you think therapy is, exactly? It's just having someone to talk to who might have the knowledge to guide you through your problems.

[Coco]

But is it neccessary to go to a therapist over "the smallest hangups"? Seems like a waste of a busy professional's time to me.

Well, speaking as a "busy professional" though not a therapist, when you are working with a client and helping to improve their life, there is no such thing as a waste of time. I have never gone to therapy myself, but I believe that therapy never hurts. And if something can do no harm, and has the potential to work positive change in your life, and you can afford it, why wouldn't you go? All therapy represents is an impartial person, with a deep understanding of human social interaction who helps you constructively address problems in your life. It's definitely not just for people with a DIAGNOSIS.
Any issue that affects your life to a point that it prevents you from living it as you wish is a big issue, even if it seems like a small issue. Dora's problem isn't situational paranoia or low self-esteem. Dora's problem is an inability to function in a healthy relationship despite conscious knowledge of faithfulness. That sounds like a big problem to me.

[Harashaw]

I know what therapy is. What comic's forum do you think I'm in?

I was raised Working Class, so I feel that spending money - a lot of money - on something you can solve yourself is wasteful. If someone can't come out of their shell easily, maybe they should just try harder. I tend to be reserved, but I can still have fun in social situations if I relax.

[someone1074]

I know what therapy is. What comic's forum do you think I'm in?

I was raised Working Class, so I feel that spending money - a lot of money - on something you can solve yourself is wasteful.

Assuming you can solve it yourself. All the time.

If someone can't come out of their shell easily, maybe they should just try harder. I tend to be reserved, but I can still have fun in social situations if I relax.

Because everyone is like you. "I don't get all this therapy nonsense. People obviously can solve their problems on their own, and if they can't they're not trying hard enough. If I can do it, they can do it. Obviously." That's a great attitude.

I would think, coming from the working class, as you say, you could appreciate that not everyone is naturally situated or equipped to address problems the same way.

[Harashaw]

I'm not saying nobody should get therapy. Jesus, man, look at the first post I made ITT.

I just don't think it's neccessary as often as amny people think it is neccessary. Solving one's own problems is often more efficient than professional therapy/drugs/etc. because one has the knowledge that one can stand up for oneself.

[shengokai]

I know what therapy is. What comic's forum do you think I'm in?

I was raised Working Class, so I feel that spending money - a lot of money - on something you can solve yourself is wasteful. If someone can't come out of their shell easily, maybe they should just try harder. I tend to be reserved, but I can still have fun in social situations if I relax.

I dunno, man. I grew up working class and having been to therapists at the behest of my parents and the like, I can tell you that if you're having problems, a therapist is the best thing for you. Other commenters have said what I'm about to repeat: if you can't fix it yourself, and it's keeping you from living a full and meaningful life, you need to seek help.

Therapy is one way, and usually the best way, to do it, but you can talk to a firend, trusted relative, etc, but given that a therapist can accurately diagnose if there's more than just emotional issues (chemical imbalances and such) and actively help. At that point, it becomes a medical issue rather than a "grow a pair and deal with it" issue.

As I said down thread a bit, we don't know what all has caused Dora's issues. Hell, it could be a family thing as evidenced by Sven's lothario like ways, nor do we know what happened during the bad relationships that Sven mentioned to Marten. If I could hazard a guess, Dora's sexuality could be a response, a taking back if you will, of her sexuality that was taken from her. That's an extreme case, but it could be something as simple as everyone she's entered into a meaningful relationship with having used, abused, or abandoned her in some way.

Anyway, you shouldn't make snap judgments on the efficacy of therapy: for some people I know, it literally saved their lives.

I'm not saying nobody should get therapy. Jesus, man, look at the first post I made ITT.

I just don't think it's neccessary as often as amny people think it is neccessary. Solving one's own problems is often more efficient than professional therapy/drugs/etc. because one has the knowledge that one can stand up for oneself.

But Dora's issues don't appear to be about "standing up for herself", they're about paranoia in forming meaningful romantic relationships. It's to the point where her paranoia overrides her common sense and keeps her from having a happy relationship. I don't think that's something that she can fix by "standing up for herself", especially if there's something nasty underlying the paranoia.

she can want to stand up for herself all she wants, but unless someone helps her out of this mess, she won't be able to do it. Seriously. that being said, Jeph's not afraid to pull punches with his characters' issues (look at Faye!), so I wouldn't be surprised if there's something dark in Dora's past that makes her act this way.

[someone1074]

Harashaw, I'll just point you back to my last line in my previous post. The truth is most people actually aren't that successful at addressing their problems on their own. It's part of the reason that a majority of people are unhappy in the world. Especially in the United States.

[tbones]

ok people, knock it off a little, make a new thread about therapy, and discuss it over there. Try to not to repeat last week's errors.


*EDIT*
Woa, i sound way too harsh! but i think that therapy effectiveness is not something to talk in the Weekly Comic Discussions? ehr, what i meant was that try to not taking it too far... ehr... i don't know, have a psyduck.

[Harashaw]

Very well.

But I will say this: If Dora's backstory turns out to be as angst-packed as people are predicting, I'll stop reading QC. If I wanted everyone* to be an abuse victim, I'd read Hurt/Comfort fanfiction.

*Exaggaration, but you get my point.

[Econoclast]

Faye > Dora.

That is all.

[someone1074]

ok people, knock it off a little, make a new thread about therapy, and discuss it over there. Try to not to repeat last week's errors.

Woa, i sound way too harsh! but i think that therapy effectiveness is not something to talk in the Weekly Comic Discussions? ehr, what i meant was that try to not taking it too far... ehr... i don't know, have a psyduck.

Eh, while I disagree with non-moderators assuming the role, it's understandable. I thought the problem with the last topic centered on people attacking and reporting the posts of others, not necessarily that it just went off-topic.

Additionally, the topic of the effectiveness of therapy is somewhat relevant, as Dora may begin to undergo it. Some disagree that she needs it at all while others feel it's just what she needs. I'll concede that Harashaw and I left Dora behind a few posts back though.

That said, we've come to agree to disagree so I think that's settled.

[Wiregeek]

Eh, while I disagree with non-moderators assuming the role, it's understandable. I thought the problem with the last topic centered on people attacking and reporting the posts of others, not necessarily that it just went off-topic.

Precisely. Between the non-moderating moderators and the moderating non-moderators, the dick-broom brigade, the trolls, and the assholes, we've got one hell of a rogues gallery.

I'm disappointed, really. I was hoping to see Dora on the receiving end of some of the medicine she brought to Sven.

[TheEvilDog]

I'm disappointed, really. I was hoping to see Dora on the receiving end of some of the medicine she brought to Sven.

I think if Faye did that deliver some of that medicine, we'd be looking at Dora in a full body cast, drinking spaghetti through a straw, and Ms. Whitaker in the dock for grievous bodily harm.

And the comic would have lost three of its biggest stars.

 

[shengokai]

Agreed with Evil. I'm interested in Dora's backstory. How did she come to start CoD, what issues plague her, why are she and Sven opposite poles of the spectrum, WHAT IS ON THE SECRET MENU????!?

[Murphoid]

Now I see where Jeph was going with all this.  Time for some HAWT Dora on Faye action.  Let it all out Dora, tell Faye how you really feel!  Giggity!  

Just kidding sorry.

So they will all be friends and I bet within the next few strips we will see Marty make an appearance at CoD and we will be back to basics.  Really looking forward to reading the strips the rest of this week!  The breakup continues to be quite interesting reading.

Although I am not sure that Dora needs counseling, she just broke off a relationship that she was not happy in after all.  Now if she really feels that she has been in a string of borderline abusive relationships and could not be happy in a healthy one.  Although Dora is not saying that, Faye is.  There is a mile between the two.  You can't change someone, they have to really want to change first.  If Dora doesn't see it as a problem, then it isn't.

Being brought to tears might indicate that she agrees with Faye, or it might indicate she strongly disagrees or it might just indicate she felt like crying.  She is a woman after all.

===

I saw after I posted this there were some people actually discussing who should /should not seek counselling.  I have a friend who is a counselor who has some short videos on the topic on his website: http://www.successdevelopmentservices.com/multimedia

[Mr_Rose]

Go Faye! Bear-hug your problems to death: This is the best way.

Faye splits the difference between empathy and rage.

No kidding.
I think she finally figured out the "Monster Truck option" she wanted too...

[pendrake]

1. Panel #6: Is it me, or are Faye's eyes also welling up alongside Dora's *sob*?

2. "Buddies" are around when times are good.  "Friends" are around when times are bad.  [sadly I do not recall who said this ]

3. I am relieved to see that we are dealing with "aftermath" rather than "fallout" of The Break-Up (hopefully most will undertand the difference between the two).  I am certain it will be equally heart-aching to see its effect upon the rest of the QC cast, but also think they will be good comic strips to read.

4. I am sure Dora's history will prove to be as colorful (for a Goth) and storied as Faye's.  Especially considering what we already know about our bi-sexual, brother overshadowed, fire-lake tattoo'ed, small-business owner, former long-time Goth .

[tbones]

ok people, knock it off a little, make a new thread about therapy, and discuss it over there. Try to not to repeat last week's errors.

Woa, i sound way too harsh! but i think that therapy effectiveness is not something to talk in the Weekly Comic Discussions? ehr, what i meant was that try to not taking it too far... ehr... i don't know, have a psyduck.

Eh, while I disagree with non-moderators assuming the role, it's understandable.

i don't quite like it either. But you know what they say, better to prevent than to breast-feed.

[Wiregeek]

ok people, knock it off a little, make a new thread about therapy, and discuss it over there. Try to not to repeat last week's errors.

Woa, i sound way too harsh! but i think that therapy effectiveness is not something to talk in the Weekly Comic Discussions? ehr, what i meant was that try to not taking it too far... ehr... i don't know, have a psyduck.

Eh, while I disagree with non-moderators assuming the role, it's understandable.

i don't quite like it either. But you know what the say, better to prevent than to breast-feed.

he who lives in glass lions shouldn't throw stones?

[Mr_Rose]

2. "Buddies" are around when times are good.  "Friends" are around when times are bad.  [sadly I do not recall who said this ]

"A Friend at need is a Friend indeed" is at least 2300 years old; in the 3rd century BC. Quintus Ennius came up with 'Amicu certus in re incerta cernitur' which means (free translation) "you'll know who your real friends are when you're in trouble."
I expect there have been many independent re-creations of the phrase over the years of course, but the concept itself is very old.
Probably as old as the concept of friendship, really.

[Tobimaro]

Hanners is getting fixed, Dora is getting fixed.
Soon everyone will be so normal, they'll have to sit around making hipster music jokes again.
And how much will THAT suck, soap opera fans?
</kidding>

But we'll always have Pintsize!   

Seriously, Faye rocks!  She's keeping her promise for Marten's sake, but she is showing Dora what true friends do for each other.  Wow!   

[ocelott]

Take note, Marten.  It's entirely possible to tell someone you're angry with them and be supportive of them at the same time.  Y'know, rather than repressing it until you explode.

I think this just might be Faye's crowning moment of awesome.

Being brought to tears might indicate that she agrees with Faye, or it might indicate she strongly disagrees or it might just indicate she felt like crying.  She is a woman after all.

I don't even know what to say to that.  I am desperately hoping this is a bit of trolling, and terribly afraid it isn't.  Oh, those hysterical wimmins, always with the emotions.

[Carl-E]

1. Panel #6: Is it me, or are Faye's eyes also welling up alongside Dora's *sob*?

She's holding a friend who is truly hurting, how could they not? 

3. I am relieved to see that we are dealing with "aftermath" rather than "fallout" of The Break-Up (hopefully most will undertand the difference between the two).  

Aftermath is the pile of books and papers on the desk leftover from studying math.  Fallout is when you knock the pile over...

 

[Wiregeek]

Take note, Marten.  It's entirely possible to tell someone you're angry with them and be supportive of them at the same time.  Y'know, rather than repressing it until you explode.

I think this just might be Faye's crowning moment of awesome.

Being brought to tears might indicate that she agrees with Faye, or it might indicate she strongly disagrees or it might just indicate she felt like crying.  She is a woman after all.

I don't even know what to say to that.  I am desperately hoping this is a bit of trolling, and terribly afraid it isn't.  Oh, those hysterical wimmins, always with the emotions.

I completely missed that. Shitty little statement there, that is.

[Varian7]

Faye shows she can be a good friend to both Marten and Dora.  Faye's moment of awesome helping Dora get the help she needs!

[daryljfontaine]

I think this just might be Faye's crowning moment of awesome.

I was going with Crowning Moment of Awwww(esome) myself.

D

[Border Reiver]

Aftermath is the pile of books and papers on the desk leftover from studying math.  Fallout is when you knock the pile over...

 

No, Fall Out is something the American military does when the parade is finished.

[tbones]

Aftermath is the pile of books and papers on the desk leftover from studying math.  Fallout is when you knock the pile over...

 

No, Fall Out is something the American military does when the parade is finished.

Fallout is a pc game! And most recently for xbox and ps3 too!

[Tormuse]

Faye wins! 

(Flawless Victory)

[jwhouk]

1. YOU ARE NOT. GOING. TO GET. MY WCT LOCKED. FOR A SECOND STRAIGHT WEEK.

2. A "minor hangup" is NOT what Dora's dealing with right now. SHE SABOTAGED A RELATIONSHIP over trust issues. That is "minor" in the way the constellation Ursa Minor is "minor".

3. I still can't quite tell if Dora's crying out of fear or realization. I don't think it really matters, though.

[Carl-E]

Neither.  She's been afraid for such a long time. 

I think it's relief. 

[someone1074]

I think it could be relief and acknowledgment (or realization, as jwhouk stated). Relief that her good friend understands, and acknowledgment that she needs help.

[prophile]

Well, personally, I'm convinced that Dr Corinne has orchestrated most of the drama of QC in order to get more work.

Wake up, sheeple!

[Wiregeek]

1. YOU ARE NOT. GOING. TO GET. MY WCT LOCKED. FOR A SECOND STRAIGHT WEEK.

I would dearly love to know who did the reporting that caused the thread to be locked.  

2. A "minor hangup" is NOT what Dora's dealing with right now. SHE SABOTAGED A RELATIONSHIP over trust issues. That is "minor" in the way the constellation Ursa Minor is "minor".

don't forget the hypocrisy and abusive behavior!

3. I still can't quite tell if Dora's crying out of fear or realization. I don't think it really matters, though.

At this point? No, no it doesn't. Dora's in such a tangle right now, emotionally speaking, that there's a pretty good chance that seeing a leaf blowing along the sidewalk could send her into tears. This is pretty much normal, even if it sucks.

(cue Faye in a nice Gendo pose..  'just as planned')

[steveb]

Well, personally, I'm convinced that Dr Corinne has orchestrated most of the drama of QC in order to get more work.

Dr Corrie is quoted as refusing to see anyone else from Faye's social circle. Faye said this to Sven a few strips back. I was assuming the Faye was going to get Dr Corrie to recommend somebody else.

Does this mean a new character? If so what will they be like?

[iduguphergrave]

Neither.  She's been afraid for such a long time. 

I think it's relief. 

I think it could be relief and acknowledgment (or realization, as jwhouk stated). Relief that her good friend understands, and acknowledgment that she needs help.

This. Wait, since I'm agreeing with two statements, would I say "These?" That doesn't quite have the same ring does it? Anyway I agree. What Faye is saying is exactly what Dora needs. Dora's has tried dealing with her shit on her own and obviously can't, and she herself admitted therapy might help her even if it was for a different reason. She's had a lot more clouding her mind and judgment than I think even she thought before, and at Faye's words in today's strip, I think she's finally realized that she really does need help. And there's her best friend, holding her like a vice and telling her she's going to help her. Even laced with threats, it's an assurance nonetheless and Dora probably feels like the cloud on her mind lifted a little; a relief indeed.

Dora has been self-admittedly putting up a front, and this is probably a big reason for a lot of her pain. She's afraid to talk about her issues, which would explain why she never actually sought therapy herself, and why her relationship with Marty fell apart. She wasn't willing to communicate.

I love today's comic. Dora lets down the guard she's had for so long, and Faye tearing up a little in response is just the perfect touch.

[benenator]

Something I just remembered -- didn't Faye specifically tell Sven that Dr. Corrine/Corinne/whatever stated she wouldn't take any more of Faye's friends as clients?

Pre-posting Edit: Yup. A certain somebody ninja'd me before I could even post -- I'd like my head back, please.

Sure, it makes sense like a mint that Faye wouldn't want to bump into Sven during her therapy visits . . . but it makes just as much sense that the Doctor would want to keep as much objectivity as possible.

(Yes, that was a Tactical TMP -- Too Much Punnage)

[peterh]

1. YOU ARE NOT. GOING. TO GET. MY WCT LOCKED. FOR A SECOND STRAIGHT WEEK.

I would dearly love to know who did the reporting that caused the thread to be locked.  

I agree that hitting the reporting button sucks, and everyone using it just to indicate trolling (rather than something REALLY offensive, like posting horse porn piccies or selling enhancing drugs) shouldn't be on a forum in the first place - for the sake of their own mental health.
But it eludes me what good it would do if any one of us knew who did that. If the mods know it, that's good enough for me; I don't want to know.

But I digress. I don't think that was what jwhouk referred to. I think he means that we shouldn't let this week's WCDT escalate like last week's. I can see a notable improvement this week myself: the dickbroom brigade and their followers (and that includes me) appear to have decided to ignore the occasional sample of die-Dora-die bait.

[lolbutts]

Something I just remembered -- didn't Faye specifically tell Sven that Dr. Corrine/Corinne/whatever stated she wouldn't take any more of Faye's friends as clients?

Faye said she was going to get a reference from Dr. Corrine. By that she meant Dr. Corrine was going to write a reference letter for Dora to get an appointment with another therapist.

[Murphoid]

Take note, Marten.  It's entirely possible to tell someone you're angry with them and be supportive of them at the same time.  Y'know, rather than repressing it until you explode.

I think this just might be Faye's crowning moment of awesome.

Being brought to tears might indicate that she agrees with Faye, or it might indicate she strongly disagrees or it might just indicate she felt like crying.  She is a woman after all.

I don't even know what to say to that.  I am desperately hoping this is a bit of trolling, and terribly afraid it isn't.  Oh, those hysterical wimmins, always with the emotions.

You are right I apologize I wasn't trying to be sexist I was trying to be funny and it was a fail.  Didn't mean to offend.

[Is it cold in here?]

Kaitco is right that there are tactics for self-therapy that Dora hasn't tried, but they may not be adequate for her problems. She needs someone to suggest concrete actions and to bring about insights which she might not get from journaling or meditation.

If mental health is the ability to love and to work, she's only halfway there. She's got a recurring problem that hasn't yielded to willpower, and I think she's reasonably strong-willed. Therapy can create a safe space to use as a workbench for self-repair, and I'm not sure Dora has ever had a safe space.

[Boomslang]

Speaking on the whole 'Ghosts of Dora's past' subject-

I forget which comic it is, but it's the one after Hanner's apartment gets blocked off with paper, and they're talking about missing the obvious solution to the problem. Dora's quip?

"All of my relationships in college were like that. 'Oh, I can just break up with them!' (or something pretty close to that).

You know what that says to me, in light of recent events? Fighting to stay in the relationship is something Dora tried with all of her previous asshole boyfriends. And now she's too afraid to try it again, probably because it always got worse after she stayed in a relationship she shouldn't have.

Or maybe I'm reading too much into one throw away joke. Definitely a possibility.

[benenator]

Something I just remembered -- didn't Faye specifically tell Sven that Dr. Corrine/Corinne/whatever stated she wouldn't take any more of Faye's friends as clients?

Faye said she was going to get a reference from Dr. Corrine. By that she meant Dr. Corrine was going to write a reference letter for Dora to get an appointment with another therapist.

I should've remembered that, but I've been awake for around 31 hours.

[Dr. ROFLPWN]

FUCK YEAH FAYE

Jesus, Faye really has worked hard on her issues. Chick is working on becoming my favorite character, because she would never have done this at the beginning of the strip. You are a true baller, Faye Whitaker. I would high-five you if you were not fictional. I should high-five Jeph if I ever see him at a con or some shit.

Aiiiiight gonna check out before the dramavasion proceedeth apace.

_{(Wooooooooooo go and get the thread locked guys I want to see what jw's face looks like distended in absolute rage)}

[Wiregeek]

(Wooooooooooo go and get the thread locked guys I want to see what jw's face looks like distended in absolute rage)

I must admit that there's some attraction in this..

So what're the odds that we're done with 'plot' comics for the week, and we're staring down three days of Turkeys/Yelling Bird?

[peterh]

So what're the odds that we're done with 'plot' comics for the week, and we're staring down three days of Turkeys/Yelling Bird?

0.

[Wiregeek]

So what're the odds that we're done with 'plot' comics for the week, and we're staring down three days of Turkeys/Yelling Bird?

0.

I claim ignorance...  too damn busy on the forum, forgot to check the Twitter.