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Author Topic: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)  (Read 526924 times)

Kugai

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2000 on: 15 Jan 2016, 12:13 »

Sarah WHAT HAVE YOU DONE??!
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2001 on: 15 Jan 2016, 12:25 »

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2002 on: 15 Jan 2016, 21:25 »

Aww...
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2003 on: 15 Jan 2016, 21:37 »

Bad news that actually probably should've been said. At least Dina knows what she's in for, not like it's gonna make any heartbreak easier.

Good thing a week takes a year so that inevitability may not happen for quite some time.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2004 on: 16 Jan 2016, 13:04 »

At least Dina is going in to this with her eyes open.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2005 on: 17 Jan 2016, 13:43 »

I think it should read 'Mostly Harmless'
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2006 on: 17 Jan 2016, 20:20 »

I understand Leslie would like to help but I empathize on a very personal level with Joyce's current mistrust of collegiate authority figures.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2007 on: 17 Jan 2016, 21:09 »

Oh, shit, Mary, this is on you for destroying what might be over $100 of personal property. Yeah, the one's against the school's rules, but as a Christian, you should know that auch destruction and hatred is against your God's law. You are the problem, Mary.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2008 on: 17 Jan 2016, 21:12 »

The Klingons would understand this.
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James The Kugai 

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2009 on: 17 Jan 2016, 21:12 »

Also yelling is against the rules, Mary.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2010 on: 18 Jan 2016, 22:46 »

This is correct. Yesterday, too, I had to be impressed that she could repeatedly bounce with the assumed level of rhythm. I mean damn. I've done enough calf lifts to know what it takes to hop in that manner, and damn.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2011 on: 19 Jan 2016, 13:05 »

I wonder if Mary's gone to tattle to Ruth.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2012 on: 19 Jan 2016, 20:45 »

Isn't Carla one of the few who Ruth has no effect on?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2013 on: 19 Jan 2016, 21:02 »

I'm pretty sure that it's Mary who will have to start worrying about if she will continue to have femurs.  Ruth might even know where a convenient pit of quicklime is located.  The way things have been going, the "breather" strips were evidence that something horrible would be coming.

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« Last Edit: 19 Jan 2016, 23:11 by hedgie »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2014 on: 19 Jan 2016, 23:16 »

Well, I understand why DMW turned off comments. The thread for today's strip (20/1) would likely have been a blast-furnace otherwise! That said, the only thing that occurs to me is this: How did Mary know? Did she know Carla pre-transition or has she got a contact in administration who passes the juciest gossip on about her peers?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2015 on: 20 Jan 2016, 00:38 »

Fuck sake, Mary.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2016 on: 20 Jan 2016, 01:58 »

Well, shit's going down now.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2017 on: 20 Jan 2016, 04:10 »

So Carla's trans. I wish Willis had chosen a less horrible way to tell us*, but...yeah, that alt text is pretty accurate.

*Yeah, it's been hinted at earlier in the comic and I think he's said things outside of the comic itself but this is, as far as I know, the first solid canon confirmation.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2018 on: 20 Jan 2016, 04:37 »

Well, it's been Word of God for a while now. Willis has stated it when he introduced her as character and showed concept art on his blog.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2019 on: 20 Jan 2016, 05:04 »

But Method of Madness treats Word of God as spoilers for this strip...

It'll be interesting to see if Mary decides to try to blackmail Ruth here. (Oh, who am I kidding, she's absolutely going to blackmail Ruth here.)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2020 on: 20 Jan 2016, 05:16 »

I treat "word of god" in anything as either spoilers (if said before) or non-canon commentary (if said after).
« Last Edit: 20 Jan 2016, 05:22 by Method of Madness »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2021 on: 20 Jan 2016, 05:50 »

Well, I understand why DMW turned off comments. The thread for today's strip (20/1) would likely have been a blast-furnace otherwise! That said, the only thing that occurs to me is this: How did Mary know? Did she know Carla pre-transition or has she got a contact in administration who passes the juciest gossip on about her peers?
My guess is this is when she found out...

I'm pretty sure that it's Mary who will have to start worrying about if she will continue to have femurs.  Ruth might even know where a convenient pit of quicklime is located.  The way things have been going, the "breather" strips were evidence that something horrible would be coming.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2022 on: 20 Jan 2016, 06:02 »

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2023 on: 20 Jan 2016, 06:25 »

Hooo shit Mary. You done stepped into an industrial sized vat of shit now and it looks like Ruth is gonna make you eat it all. I'm not convinced that Mary knows Carla is trans from this strip. Maybe it's been suggested before and it's clear some people know. But I don't know if Mary is one of them. I think this is more of a 'you act like a boy, so you belong with them and more importantly, away from me' rather than taking the dig at Carla because she knows. If nothing else, Mary would have used that insult earlier and more often if she did know.

By Ruth's expression here... she may know, or she may have other reasons to hate that insult. But it looks pretty clear she's not here to break up a fight between the two. All her angry attention is focused on Mary, with a you dun messed up BAD look on her face. Carla she's just casually dismissing with the usual 'I got this' wave.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2024 on: 20 Jan 2016, 06:33 »

Actually, Ruth probably would know, I'd think - Carla gets her own room for privacy reasons, and Ruth has presumably seen everyone's files (including Billie's having had a DUI, which is how she knew, and why she bullied Billie).

Wouldn't be surprised if Ruth had mandatory training on transgender issues, too, purely because of situations like this. I'm quite certain that that training did not include separating the offender from their femurs and beating them to death with them, but that's just Ruth's personal style.

That said, I also wouldn't be surprised if Mary's comment was initially intended along the "you act like a boy" lines (the face she was making was disgust, not her usual "I have dirt on you" smirk), but I also suspect that she holds quite transphobic views, I wouldn't be surprised if she suspected it, and if she didn't know Carla was trans... her reaction in panel 3 confirmed it, and the "I have dirt on you" smirk appears in panel 4.
« Last Edit: 20 Jan 2016, 06:40 by bhtooefr »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2025 on: 20 Jan 2016, 06:45 »

That look can also be interpreted as 'I finally found something that hits the mark and will shut you up'. Same basic idea of having leverage over a person, but different reasons. Keep in mind that for many, probably most people the subject of transgender people doesn't even come up or cross their minds. That is less of a case now that we have a number of high profile transgender people in the media... Both as transgender themselves and transgender characters on shows. But many/most people don't go wandering around trying to guess who is or isn't trans, unless they have a specific reason to think it. With Carla, there has been no indication that her (probably) status as a trans woman is known beyond a few people or at all obvious.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2026 on: 20 Jan 2016, 10:09 »

OK, based on an exchange between Jeph and Willis:

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2027 on: 20 Jan 2016, 12:08 »

Ugh, I started reading it again because I like Carla, but I'm not sure if I'm prepared for this storyline. :/

I checked all of her appearances in DoA, and there are really only two clues toward it, besides her having her own room:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-4/04-the-whiteboard-dong-bandit/permanent/
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-5/01-when-somebody-loved-me/purpleandskates/

(click to show/hide)

I completely agree that it is inappropriate as a story-writer to introduce that information (or at least to imply it) in this way. It shouldn't be used for the sake of a shock factor, and honestly, it feels like it's diminishing her possible identity as a plot device rather than as a component of her character.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2028 on: 20 Jan 2016, 12:30 »

Well, trans people in real life don't get to have a 'special coming out episode' where the subject is brought up and dealt with in a nice 22-40 minute package. Even if Carla is not in stealth, which is not something that we can assume, it's not like every time she appears she's going to point out that she's trans. Assuming that she is, but that's the most likely case at this point. Still and all it's not fair or appropriate to assume that you know what someone's gender or status is. Especially given that she's not a major character, and we've only seen a very small part of her in the comic.

So the question is... How is it supposed to be brought up in the comic? Hints have been dropped. She's clearly living as and accepted as female by the school and students, as far as we can tell. She's got no reason to be telling anyone. So the only two real ways that are likely to happen is she gets close to someone and tells them about it, 'on camera'. Amber is a possible candidate after their little bonding experience cleaning up Amber's split scalp a little while back. Or she gets accidentally or deliberately outed. Both happen, and neither are more or less appropriate experiences, both from a literary and real life sense. One is something you should never do to someone, sure. But it does still happen.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2029 on: 20 Jan 2016, 12:57 »

Those are very good points. I guess I just figured she'd just like mention it in passing to someone she's talking to or even "Since you're trans, what do you think about this?" I wasn't expecting a "coming out" story or whatnot--just perhaps something a bit less callous and not used as shock factor, because that's what it feels like to me.

But you're right that a lot of people get outed against their will, so it's definitely not unrealistic here. It just feels like he chose to do it this way in order to treat it like he's only doing it this way to shock people.

There are plenty of ways to unpleasantly out people--I'm just not sure that this one was chosen very well.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2030 on: 20 Jan 2016, 13:12 »

Who is Mary outing her to? They are alone. The audience? I thought it was already common knowledge for the audience. It's certainly been mentioned often enough here in the boards.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2031 on: 20 Jan 2016, 13:14 »

The audience. There have not been any actually direct statements about it in the comic so far. I checked all of Carla's appearances in the strip, and it's only been implied so far in those two strips I linked. Everything else doesn't even come close to outing her.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2032 on: 20 Jan 2016, 13:20 »

I don't think that's what Willis is doing here. He has a history in his comic of addressing issues like this bluntly, but not just of the sake of being shocking. Consider Joyce nearly being raped. Or Becky being kidnapped at gunpoint by her father for anti-gay prayer therapy. These are big, shocking things to have happen to a character. But the story wasn't played out for the shock value of it. But rather to point out that this stuff really does happen, to real people.

I do feel that Willis does a good job balancing things. I've read enough ongoing stories/web comics that were based around LGBT issues or that have primary LGBT characters that fall into the trap of either it's all good for them or it's horrible all the time. Nothing majorly bad every happens, everyone is accepting and any kind of drama related to the issues are resolved neatly. Or the characters lives are never ending misery. They stumble from one bad situation to a worse one endlessly. Neither of those is very good storytelling, or realistic. Willis strikes a realistic medium when it comes to putting his characters through the ringer. I feel the same will be done with Carla.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2033 on: 20 Jan 2016, 13:21 »

Is there anyone on the boards who didn't already know?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2034 on: 20 Jan 2016, 13:23 »

Willis also likes to do exposition of facts both inside and outside the story. Word of Author is definitely valid for his works.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2035 on: 20 Jan 2016, 13:28 »

It's more a matter of vocalizing it, to get the scenario started. What I was trying to get at before is that left to her own devices, it's pretty unlikely that she would have come out and said anything, or any of her friends would have. It's been implied, but until someone says something, it won't be out in the open to write a story about. Kind of like when Claire out of the blue opened up to Marten. Both were purely methods for the writer to begin the storyline and point out clearly that the character is transgender.

It's relatively easy to express a character's sexual orientation, race, religious or political leanings. Showing a character is transgender without someone coming right out and saying it is a lot more difficult.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2036 on: 20 Jan 2016, 14:12 »

Word of Author is definitely valid for his works.
You are welcome to think so, and I won't say you're wrong. But that's hardly absolutely true.
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Does anybody really know what time it is?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2037 on: 20 Jan 2016, 15:14 »

Hooo boy, now the fun begins.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2038 on: 20 Jan 2016, 15:29 »

Well, I understand why DMW turned off comments. The thread for today's strip (20/1) would likely have been a blast-furnace otherwise!

He's seen it coming. Even the relatively harmless Patreon got ruffled:

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2039 on: 21 Jan 2016, 01:28 »

Well, it seems that Mary is smarter and more cunning than for which many gave her credit. She's played this to perfection (in a certain Lawful Evil way - She'd do well as a Sith Witch). She might actually win, at least in the short term, by triggering a possibly-lethal mental break-down in Ruth.

It won't save her with Carla; Carla only has to go to Administration, point at Mary and shout 'hate speech' and it will be game over. Becky just has to vanish for a while and, surprise surprise, Joyce is going home for the weekend. If Becky goes with her, that would let her be absent during an investigation. I doubt that Becky will have left much of a 'footprint' in Sal and Billie's room and if she isn't obviously present on campus, I doubt that the administrators will bother to search too thoroughly. Becky has already been the cause of an embarrassing incident, thanks to her sociopathic father and they would be reluctant, on PR grounds, to stir things up too much.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2040 on: 21 Jan 2016, 12:31 »

Personally, I think Mary is heading for a very large crash and burn.

Long overdue I think
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2041 on: 21 Jan 2016, 12:35 »

As an RA Ruth cannot catch everything, as a resident Mary should have reported any illegal activity.  Also I am not sure what Ruth would get in trouble with when it comes to having Billie over.  Alcohol maybe if they caught it on her, otherwise its Mary's word against Ruth's.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2042 on: 21 Jan 2016, 13:52 »

As an RA Ruth cannot catch everything, as a resident Mary should have reported any illegal activity.  Also I am not sure what Ruth would get in trouble with when it comes to having Billie over.  Alcohol maybe if they caught it on her, otherwise its Mary's word against Ruth's.

This. I'm not too familiar with the way these things work, but I would think the residence manager would take Ruth's word over Mary's, unless of course, Ruth and her hall has a publicly-known history of rule-breaking. It would put Ruth under a magnifying glass, which would lead to discipline unless she changes her alcoholic ways, which we know she's not likely to do.

As to Ruth 'fraternizing' with Billie, that actually could be against the rules, considering their relative positions of power. Power-imbalance in relationships can lead to favorable treatment in otherwise unrelated situations. It would be similar to the rules against professors dating students, though in a dorm it would be about the RA's significant other getting away with rule-breaking, as opposed to wrong answers.

Totally right on the RA not being able to catch everything. I've actually been in a very similar situation to what's happening in the comic with Becky, though I was playing more the parts of her friends. One of my semesters in college,  I had no roommate. Not officially, anyway, but it happened that a good friend of mine that same semester got kicked out of his room for his grades. So, in all actuality, I had a roommate. He did, eventually, have to move out, but it was because they banned him from the dorms entirely, even for social situations, not because they found out he was squatting in my room.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2043 on: 21 Jan 2016, 14:45 »

If she wants to make a stink of it and gets the school faculty involved, Mary could find herself in really hot water over the glue stunt. Yes, skating in the halls is against the rules. But she damaged school property (the rug/floor), another students property and a case could be made for Assault on Carla since the intent was to cause her to fall. Plus, her 'dirt' is not as strong as she thinks. Yes, depending on the rules having Billie basically living in her room may or may not be against the rules and could bring disciplinary action down on Ruth. Maybe in to the extreme of losing her RA status if she already has strikes against her. But Becky living in the dorms is a non issue, since this is the first time Ruth has heard of it. Everyone else in the dorm has been working to keep that information from Ruth. It would probably result in Becky being invited to leave, immediately. And maybe some disciplinary action for Sal, Billie and/or Joyce. But I doubt the faculty will want to make a big legal issue when they find out she was the target of an armed kidnapping on their school property. Even more bad press and all.

In the end, I think this is going to wind up a lot worse off for Mary than she thinks, and her position is no where near as good as she thinks it is. If nothing else, Becky seems well liked, and once word gets around that she was the one responsible for ratting her out... I think she'll find the other students pretty cold to her. More so than they already are.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2044 on: 21 Jan 2016, 18:01 »

Everything I could possibly say has already been said, so I'll just add this:

Ruth definitely doesn't have strikes against her! In fact, the strip where she makes us aware of this is called "Strike."

http://www.dumbingofage.com/comics/2011-03-10-strike



I wish I didn't remember this comic as well as I do. XD
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2045 on: 21 Jan 2016, 18:11 »

Except she does have a strike against her now, if prank fire alarms count as strikes...
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2046 on: 21 Jan 2016, 18:25 »

That would depend on whether she wound up convincing her boss that she'd pulled a 'Snap Fire Drill'
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2047 on: 21 Jan 2016, 21:04 »

Today's comic makes me think that there are rules at Indiana University that Willis is aware of that those of us saying Ruth still had the upper hand did not know.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2048 on: 21 Jan 2016, 21:08 »

More like Mary is the most outright malicious person in the DoAverse.  She knows how to hurt people, and she enjoys doing it just because she *can*.  The past few days on Patreon, quite a large number of people are talking how she's even worse than the Toe.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #2049 on: 21 Jan 2016, 21:39 »

So Mary's plan is basically "Let me be a massive bigot or I'm taking you down."  Okay.

I hope Joyce destroys her.
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