Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
WCDT Strips 3506 to 3510 (19 June to 23 June 2017)
JoeCovenant:
--- Quote from: Tova on 22 Jun 2017, 03:24 ---I stand by my opinion that Marten is the more insecure one here. He needs to learn to simply reassure instead of freaking out like this. I mean, I can understand why he does given his past. But the more he freaks out, the less liable Claire will be to express any minor insecurities that do come up (which are only human, lets face it). That is how minor insecurities can grow into major ones.
--- Quote from: Case on 22 Jun 2017, 03:05 ---Someone seems to have a penchant ...
--- End quote ---
Case, you are such a peasant.
--- End quote ---
Well, that's not very pleasant
Dammit.. Ninja'd !
...like a pheasant...
(Wut!?)
DannyboyTheDane:
Um ... hello! I'm new here. I've been following the comic for a good number of years now and have lately been lurking a bit in the forums, and now the urge to join the discussion became too great to resist. I know this forum holds a high standard of conduct, so I apologise in advance if I mess up!
As for what prompted me to chime in, it's that there was a part of today's comic that seems to haven't been remarked upon yet (until dawolf just did while I was writing this post, which I am now too lazy to majorly reword :P ): According to Claire, Dora said that Marten isn't good at dealing with insecurity. Now, there are several ways to read that, and Marten himself doesn't seem to think much of it, even being able to jokingly poke at Claire for it in the last panel - and nobody in here has mentioned it, either (until dawolf just now), so maybe it's really just me, but ... isn't that kind of a really unfair depiction of how it went down between Dora and Marten? I feel like that phrasing suggests on some level that it was Marten's failing that he wasn't accepting enough of Dora's insecurities, when it was my impression that everyone in the comic, even Dora herself, seemed to agree that her behaviour had been unfair. Heck, she was the one who chose to end it, based on that. I know relationships and their failings are often too complex to entirely lay the blame at any one person's feet, but I think what struck me was that I believe this is the first time I've seen Marten criticised for his handling of the situation. Sure, he was less graceful in certain moments than in others, but overall I think he's been pretty good at alleviating insecurities in his partners - both Dora and now Claire. I don't know, it just feels kind of like a slap in the face to say Marten is bad at handling insecurity - especially for Dora, of all people.
But yeah, I might just be reading way too much into it in the worst possible way. We don't even know specifically what Dora told Claire versus what Claire took from it versus how she expresses it to Marten here. Anyway, what are your thoughts on this?
oddtail:
--- Quote from: USS Martenclaire on 22 Jun 2017, 03:28 ---
--- Quote from: sitnspin on 22 Jun 2017, 00:40 ---
--- Quote from: Clubman8 on 22 Jun 2017, 00:05 ---
--- Quote from: comicalArchitect on 21 Jun 2017, 20:04 ---If you would otherwise date someone but won't because they're trans, you're a transphobe.
--- End quote ---
Transphobia begins and ends with hatred or bigotry of transgendered people. You cannot call someone transphobic because they choose not to date trans people. Applying the same logic, every straight person is homophobic for refusing to date a gay member of their sex lmao.
I didn't know my support of my trans friends was voided because I wouldn't sleep with them.
--- End quote ---
If you treat trans people differently than you do cispeople based solely on them being trans, then yes you are transphobic. "But I have friends who are trans" is not a get out of jail free card.
--- End quote ---
I deleted my original post as it was rather combative and not very helpful. The thing is, in this context, gender identity is irrelevant. Because it's not about the person being trans, lesbian, gay, redhead, tall, large or anything like that - it's about who *you* are attracted to. Your personal preferences - possibly the most personal and intimate preferences you can have. As such, its a core part of who you are. Having someone dictate who you can and can't be attracted to (with obvious exceptions) can be just as oppressive as having someone dictate your gender identity.
--- End quote ---
I think the issue is different. If I'm not attracted to someone and they happen to be trans, it's not an issue. If I'm attracted to someone and then they turn out to be trans, and that impacts my view of the person's being a viable love/sexual/romantic interest, that DOES speak of a level of bigotry. And flat-out not being attracted to trans people (or rather, claiming so) seems kinda similar to the latter, not to the former.
It's a subtle distinction, but I *do* think it's functionally different if one happens to not be attracted to a lot of trans people, and if one claims to just flat-out "not be attracted to trans people". The latter implies that the person is put off by the fact that someone is trans, rather than by something about their appearance. And there's about as much variation in how trans people look, I'd imagine, as there is for cis people, so "I'm not attracted to them at all" carries a strong undertone of bigotry, in my view.
To put it another way - I tend to be attracted to women with a very light skin tone, blonde or red hair, freckled skin. I don't think it's bigoted per se, the fact that I'm less likely to be attracted to a woman with a very dark skin tone is a matter of preference*. But if I said "I'm just not attracted to women of African ethnic origin", that'd be superficially similar, but profoundly different. And yes, it'd be a pretty racist attitude. Not the most horrible kind of racism out there, but an attitude does not have to be the worst thing in the world to be problematic.
*although it probably is, on some level, racially biased, seeing as my preferences have been influenced by certain standards of beauty, and those can be fairly racist. But let's not split hairs.
MrNumbers:
Sees #3509
Good.
USS Martenclaire:
I think I can see what folks are getting at and I agree that if you're attracted to someone and then reject them because they're trans, then it is a discriminatory view to have. Its sad in a way though. Like....your body is attracted but because of hang ups, worries what other people think and all that negative stuff, you deny ypurself a possible chance at happiness. Rejecting someone because they're trans says a lot more negative things about you than it does the trans person.
TL;DR - I understand where the posters above me were coming from, I agree with them, sorry for the confusion. >.>
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