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[jwhouk]

I don't have a poll ready for this one, after the... uhm, interesting comments in last week's WCDT.

Remember to be civil, wipe your feet at the door, mind the gap, guard your lug wrench, etc...

[Thrillho]

What I do with my lug wrench is my own business.

[Case]

What I do with my lug wrench is my own business.

Definitely, definitely your business.

[TheEvilDog]

Case, are you really lug shaming?
For shame on you. For shame.
 

[Case]

Don't wrench, don't tell.

[Thrillho]

Definitely, DEFINITELY not melting my lug wrench.

[Carl-E]

Ohlordno, not the lug wrench thing again. 

I did a search, but the forum search only goes back up to 9999 days. 


...wait, that's like, 27 years.  The early lug wrench days must be on a now-inaccessible thread in some locked away board... Still the posts go back to 2014 and that was well past the early lug wrench days. 

But I did find this, dated 1/5/2013;



I don't recall the context, something silly about a lugwrench army. 

Ah, that's it!  One word, not two.  Here it was. 


<unofficial unpaid board historian>

[TheEvilDog]

So what you're saying Carl-e, is that the lug wrenches are all your fault?
 

[Carl-E]

Oh, no.  In fact, I think I found the first thread in which Kugai melted someone's lug wrench.  Completely unprovoked. 

https://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,27868.0/prev_next,prev.html#new

It was the beginning of a bit of a feud...

https://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,28017.0/prev_next,prev.html#new

https://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,28373.0/prev_next,prev.html#new


It got worse after that. 

[jwhouk]

Oh, yeah, Carl-E, you missed that, didn't you?

Uh, Kugai has stopped posting for a very sad reason. He can't see anymore.

[Case]

Oh, yeah, Carl-E, you missed that, didn't you?

Uh, Kugai has stopped posting for a very sad reason. He can't see anymore.

I thought about that: There are text-to-voice software that can process html - maybe there's one that can also navigate BBS?

I mean... If he wanted to.

[hedgie]

Even assuming that accessibility software works flawlessly, I suspect that getting used to it is something that'd take time to get used to.

[Case]

Even assuming that accessibility software works flawlessly, I suspect that getting used to it is something that'd take time to get used to.

Well, to be brutally blunt: So does learning to navigate the world without eyesight.

I just miss the guy 

Am I being wildly inappropriate? Sometimes I can't tell.

[hedgie]

I miss him as well.  I didn't even know what happened until now.

[TheEvilDog]

We all miss Kugai, who for me was one of my favourite forumites.

And so, perhaps, instead of being morose that circumstances means that he is no longer able to join us on the forum, we should look to him as an example of how to be irreverent to the seriousness that seeps into the WCDT. Let's laugh, make jokes and not take a comic that serious.

And melt a few lug wrenches too while we're at it.

[Carl-E]

Oh, wow.  Thanks for letting me know.  I actually met him on a different comic forum before I found QC.  It was a pleasant surprise to find him here. 

We're almost exactly the same age, just a few months difference.  So we got a lot of the same references, despite growing up on opposite sides of the planet...

Which is probably the only thing keeping me from going for a visit. 


[Sigh]


Oh, and the comic's up. 

Pintsize needs to stop trying to help...

[TheEvilDog]

I too hate spreadsheets. I hate them with the burning, fiery passion of hell's hottest forges.

Also...Claire. You have lived with Marten how long? What on earth made you think Marten would use a budget?!

[Baleanopter]

I rather like spreadsheets. Such handy things for sorting information. I was introduced to the concept via a personal word processor machine that had basic spreadsheet functions as a new feature, back in the days when the Windows operating system was still just a pup.

[Penquin47]

Spreadsheets are love.  Spreadsheets are life.

...Okay, maybe not.  But I do enjoy them for some things.

[chris73]

Also...Claire. You have lived with Marten how long? What on earth made you think Marten would use a budget?!

Without wanting to start anything this whole arc is not painting Clare in a good light. I mean, generally speaking, one of the first things you do when you move in together is do a budget, even if its as simple as Martens is yet its coming up now?

Like Marten has learnt to not disregard what Clare says and dig deeper (and thats good) but has Clare learned to communicate better?

Seems to me Clare was doing a boy who cried wolf thing in that she'd say something about being stressed and Marten would ask whats wrong and she'd tell him everythings ok so Marten learnt that Clare didn't need help with stress, until she did and then Marten had to admit his failure whereas Clare doesn't think she had anything to do with it

[hedgie]

Maybe they just keep their money separate and don't ask as long as the rent/bills are paid.

[SordidEuphemism]

*reluctantly shuffles to the lectern, tapping a pack of cigarettes into his palm as a nervous habit*
Hi, my name's Sordid...
I, uh...
*he peels off the top of the pack and pulls out a cigarette, flicking it between his fingers*
I learned to use spreadsheets when I couldn't find a decent character sheet for D&D.
That led to learning the rest of the Office suite. Then HTML and CSS. Then SQL.
*he lights the cigarette and stuffs the pack and lighter back into his pockets*
Today, I'm an implementation specialist, helping Timekeeping software speak with Payroll software for hundreds of clients.
*he looks at the cherry on the cigarette, then shrugs*
Spreadsheets.
*takes a drag off the cigarette*
Not even once.

[brasca]

They’re both right.  Spreadsheets are invaluable for my budgeting, but also depressing when I realize how much I have leftover.

[ImVeryAngryItsNotButter]

Never have I felt so alienated by a comic strip before today's.

[OldGoat]

I'm with Claire.  Excel, at least when I design the sheet for my own purposes, is a thing of beauty.  Not so much when I'm handed one made by someone else.

(And damn Microsoft for changing the user interface.)

[Cornelius]

(And damn Microsoft for changing the user interface.)

Agreed. Another thing that's annoying is how they translate the formulas in localized versions. Not  problem if you work in a unilingual environment, but with users using three different versions, it can be challenging to explain what exactly went wrong with their calculations.

Also, pivot tables!

[cybersmurf]

Spreadsheets are pretty handy. As longas you know what's going on. A lot of people understand their own spreadsheets but fail to make other people understand them, and that's where the issue begins. And some spreadsheets are just purr clusterfuck, those need to die in a nucular explosion.

To an extent, spreadsheets can be a poor man's database, you just meed to do it right. Basically, a spreadsheet can be treated like a single database table, or at least excel csn do it. On a side note: I don't like databases. I can't really handle them, for whatever reason. But Spreadsheet databasing? That I can do.

[shanejayell]

Even if you SELL a kidney, Marten, that'd still require a budget EVENTUALLY. 

[BenRG]

Something tells me that this is the point where Claire introduces Marten to 'Independent Adult Living - Lesson 1'. I do understand why he automatically rebels at the thought of having to plan stuff like this. I'm sure having a budget makes it harder to maintain his personal illusion of being the 'footloose and fancy free' young adult but you have to face up to stuff like this eventually!

Notice that Claire is eating with a fork off of a plate? That's a symptom (maybe even an advantage) of having stayed with her mother for most of her student life. She's always had nutritious meals served properly; she's never had to subsist on ramen and noodles on occasion, the way Marten and Faye likely have. Thus she's never had the cause to learn how to use chopsticks!

Finally, I'd ask Pintsize to stop enabling damaging behaviour but I suspect that would be expecting too much of him!

[Cornelius]

On the other hand, Pintsize's enabling behaviour might just be the thing that's signalling Marten  that it's a bad idea.

[Tova]

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/YourApprovalFillsMeWithShame
(or https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AntiAdvice)

[Case]

Definitely, DEFINITELY not melting my lug wrench.

What are you melting?

[Thrillho]

Definitely, DEFINITELY not melting my lug wrench.

What are you melting?

Butter on this delicious slice of toast.

[pwhodges]

Definitely, DEFINITELY not melting my lug wrench.

What are you melting?

Butter on this delicious slice of toast.

I was about to suggest cheese on toast.

[Thrillho]

Definitely, DEFINITELY not melting my lug wrench.

What are you melting?

Butter on this delicious slice of toast.

I was about to suggest cheese on toast.

That was yesterday.

Also I love budgeting spreadsheets. Makes me feel like an adult and is genuinely helpful!

[shanejayell]

Cheese whiz on toast.

Yum....

[JoeCovenant]

Ohh...
Money issues raise their head.
One of the main reasons for relationships to fail...

Throw in professional jealousy, some (minor?) communication difficulties, differences in life expectations/future planning/priorities...

These guys are starting to push a number of the 'relationship implosion' buttons...

[chris73]

These guys are starting to push a number of the 'relationship implosion' buttons...

On the plus side it might mean more Marten based strips so thats a good thing

[BenRG]

These guys are starting to push a number of the 'relationship implosion' buttons...

Personally, I think that you're letting your personal negative viewpoint on this relationship colour your interpretation of the strips, Joe.

[TheEvilDog]

While I don't think we're going to see the end of Marten and Claire's relationship in this storyline.

What we are seeing is the end of the cutesy-lovey-dovey stage of their relationship and we're moving to a point where they're starting to notice the other's flaws.

In Claire's case, its realising that her boyfriend has no real plans for his life and that its a long way before he's an adult.

In Marten's case, its realising that Claire has a little too much of a control streak in her and is more than a little ruthless.

This storyline could be setting the stage for future plots involving Claire and Marten and their struggles with their relationship. I'm not saying they're going to break up, but when you have two people who are just complete opposites, its going to be tough. Not to mention that Claire's got a bit of a dominant streak that might raise some uncomfortable memories for Marten. And Marten's constant laissez faire attitude to life might be incredibly frustrating to someone with a lifeplan like Claire.

On a related note, the lifeplan Claire has and her seeming unwillingness to be flexible in that respect seems to be setting her up for a major crash back to reality. What happens if she doesn't get a job in a library? What happens when she realises there could be 1000 candidates for one position? What happens if she does get the job and finds it is not what she thought it was going to be? Claire is somewhat tightly wound and that kind of realisation could be devastating.

One last point. Claire is playing with fire right now and she doesn't realise it. Marten might be the most passive character in the comic, but in the past when he's been pushed enough, he's let loose a salvo of some devastating comments about people and their flaws, in particular Faye and Dora. Claire might want to slow down, or she might end up hearing something rather painful.

[cybersmurf]

There's friction building up. Marten will be able to handle it better than Claire I think. Claire will need to burst her own bubble, and the question is whether the relationship will survive. Although being Trans, I have the feeling she was somewhat sheltered from the really bad things, mostly leaving her steaming in her own anxieties and expectations.

There will be a big bang, the question is how metaphorical that will be.

It probably will push Marten on a path he was avoiding to take.

This whole Arc will be a learning experience for both marten and Claire, with the latter realising she could've had it worse herself. Although the most important part is her social circle is accepting her the way she is, and she can both relax and open up. Yes, there will be crude remarks, but that's just Pintsize.

[Welu]

I'm not sure how having a marginalised status shelters you from the "really bad things". Claire is acutely aware of her personal safety, like many others in her situation. I could guess if her focus of the last couple years mainly have been her parents' divorce, studies and transition, then that may have left her comparatively unready to others her age for things like moving out of home and establishing their first serious relationship.

~~

I use spreadsheets all the time in work and made a lot of use of them when planning my wedding. I like using them a lot because my brain just seems to read the info out of them pretty easily. I'm pretty sure the ones for my wedding only made sense to me, even though I tried to make it more parsable because I was sharing them with other people. The day went well so they did the job. Though I probably do use colour coding way too much.

[JoeCovenant]

These guys are starting to push a number of the 'relationship implosion' buttons...

Personally, I think that you're letting your personal negative viewpoint on this relationship colour your interpretation of the strips, Joe.

Personally, I think you are incorrect.
Surely you cannot deny the things are raised have happened?
Nor that they are known stressors on relationships...?

I see behaviours taking place (and the above replies certainly seem to agree with my 'take' on what i am seeing)
I am merely commenting on the plain facts that such behaviours, if left unchecked, can escalate and lead to the ending of said relationships.

My like or dislike of Claire (or, indeed, Marten) has no bearing on that.

[BenRG]

These guys are starting to push a number of the 'relationship implosion' buttons...

Personally, I think that you're letting your personal negative viewpoint on this relationship colour your interpretation of the strips, Joe.

Surely you cannot deny the things are raised have happened?
Nor that they are known stressors on relationships...?

Actually, yes, I can deny some of the things you said have happened.

There are no money worries, only Claire suggesting Marten should be thinking ahead. The pair have no indication of being under financial strain at all.

There is little 'professional jealousy' too. Marten hasn't got it in him to be jealous, as Claire's clear perplexedness when he admitted that he didn't know why any qualified person would want his job clearly demonstrated. Claire certainly didn't want his job, only a job (and preferably a more senior one).

The only thing that seems to have happened is the communications breakdown that definitely seems to have been resolved aside from both party's sense of guilt at failing to listen but just assume. I think that it is more likely that the two of them will be more likely to try to be extra-nice as a result rather than be offended!

[JoeCovenant]

These guys are starting to push a number of the 'relationship implosion' buttons...

Personally, I think that you're letting your personal negative viewpoint on this relationship colour your interpretation of the strips, Joe.

Surely you cannot deny the things are raised have happened?
Nor that they are known stressors on relationships...?

Actually, yes, I can deny some of the things you said have happened.

There are no money worries, only Claire suggesting Marten should be thinking ahead. The pair have no indication of being under financial strain at all.

There is little 'professional jealousy' too. Marten hasn't got it in him to be jealous, as Claire's clear perplexedness when he admitted that he didn't know why any qualified person would want his job clearly demonstrated. Claire certainly didn't want his job, only a job (and preferably a more senior one).

The only thing that seems to have happened is the communications breakdown that definitely seems to have been resolved aside from both party's sense of guilt at failing to listen but just assume. I think that it is more likely that the two of them will be more likely to try to be extra-nice as a result rather than be offended!

Personally, I think you are letting your desire to see the relationship work, colour your interpretations of the strips.
(ETA: Feel free to check my previous edited comment which I posted to early...)

[TheEvilDog]

Actually, yes, I can deny some of the things you said have happened.

There are no money worries, only Claire suggesting Marten should be thinking ahead. The pair have no indication of being under financial strain at all.

There is little 'professional jealousy' too. Marten hasn't got it in him to be jealous, as Claire's clear perplexedness when he admitted that he didn't know why any qualified person would want his job clearly demonstrated. Claire certainly didn't want his job, only a job (and preferably a more senior one).

The only thing that seems to have happened is the communications breakdown that definitely seems to have been resolved aside from both party's sense of guilt at failing to listen but just assume. I think that it is more likely that the two of them will be more likely to try to be extra-nice as a result rather than be offended!

Claire and Marten might not have money worries now, but the fact that Marten can't even open a savings account is a big red flag for their future. A quick check for the legal requirements told me that Marten would need to have a minimum daily balance of $300 to maintain the savings account. So either Marten is terrible with money or he has no plans in case there's a big emergency.

While Claire might not have professional jealousy, she did attack him for getting a job that he was not qualified for (and before someone says she said "I'm not attacking you", let's just remember that adding "I'm not X" to the start of a sentence is still going to have someone acting like X). Not to mention that when Marten asked her if they weren't dating, would she kill him for his job, Claire said she would prefer not to answer that.

What is happening here is what I said before. Marten and Claire are no longer in their young-people-in-love phase of their relationship. They're people-in-a-relationship. Gone is the cutesy "I love you. No, I love you more" and its replaced with them looking at each other as people, warts and all.

[Is it cold in here?]

Certainly I've heard from people with a lot of experience listening to relationship problems that differences over handling money are common and dangerous.

[themacnut]

Indeed so. And considering Marten's hatred of spreadsheets, I hope Claire has the wisdom to start him off with a relatively simple one. Just inflow-outflow, with one set of columns for income, another for expenses, and maybe one more set to show what's left.

Rule of comedy however, says she's going to set up him up with one more suited to running a mid-size corporation, thus turning him off the whole budget concept even more.

[Emperor Norton]

So either Marten is terrible with money or he has no plans in case there's a big emergency.

Because yes, that is the only reasons possible that someone doesn't have a savings account.

[TheEvilDog]

So either Marten is terrible with money or he has no plans in case there's a big emergency.

Because yes, that is the only reasons possible that someone doesn't have a savings account.

Well, let's see. Marten is impulsive when it comes to money, best observed when he bought a very expensive guitar after coming into some money.

Also, unless the apartment was something of a steal, until recently most of his money would have been going towards rent or bills or food.

But go ahead, sit back and contribute nothing to the discussion.