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Wedding Special - Who Caught the Bouquet?

Claire and Marten
Dora and Tai
Clinton and Emily
Veronica and Jim
Hannelore and the local Fire and Rescue Company
Pintsize and Bubbles
Steve and Cosette
Momo and May

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Author Topic: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)  (Read 40928 times)

BenRG

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #100 on: 28 Jul 2015, 03:31 »

For what does Dora have to apologise to Faye? For not enabling her alcoholism? For not letting her endanger Dora's business*? For being upset with Faye lying to her to cover up her drunkenness? For behaving like Faye's boss?

For causing her friend pain, no matter how necessary and well-intentioned.

The first step to a functional friendship is a desire to live in peace. That means being willing to swallow your pride and realise that bad things can come from necessary and good acts and to show the correct level of humility to heal those wounds. Pride (which is nothing like self-respect but is, rather, a selfish view that you are more important than all other things and people) and a stubborn insistence that you were right all along is a short journey to living without friends in social isolation.

Burning bridges seems to be a Bianchi characteristic. I wonder if Dora will have the strength of character to decide to build instead?
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swapna

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #101 on: 28 Jul 2015, 04:34 »

am i the only one sick to freaking death of doras bratty attitude. its like wah  my brother has it easy because of natural talent.  wah my friends want to bone him wah.
And of course "Grrr! He hits on my friend and employee, on my business premises*, during the working day, in an extremely creepy, entitled, and inappropriate manner." That, after all, is what Dora means when she says that Sven burned the bridges with her. To describe her view as a "delusion", an observer presumably believes that it did not happen, or that his behaviour was acceptable, or that he has some sort of right to be judged indulgently by his sister regardless of how he behaves. And in-universe, apparently even Sven does not believe that.
She also forbade Raven to hit on him. Recap: Raven asked her to introduce them, and she threatened Sven with violence. Okay, she also threatened Raven, but she forbade them to flirt/hook up even though they weren't at her shop and, again, none of hers. She flipped out when she heard that Faye hooked up with him, even though that happened entirely on their private time. She set up a situation where Sven was supposed to ask out the girls at the coffee shop, and when Hanners accepted, she got angry. None of the women were coerced, they acted very much out of their own initiative, and what they do in their private lives and who they share their bed with is none of their bosses business.

Dora crosses boundaries all the time, and Sven even helped her enforce her bullshit rules to stay in good terms with her. Sven crossed a big one with Faye, but Faye handled it on her own, and wouldn't even have told Dora about it - she heard it from somebody else.

I wanted to write something concerning pride and apologies, but BenRG, again, put it better than I ever could. BEEENRRGGGGGGG
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SubaruStephen

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #102 on: 28 Jul 2015, 04:36 »

It's interesting that Hannelore eats fast food.  Given some of the stories about fast food food, whether they're true or not, you'd think she'd be paranoid about eating those products.
This thought came to mind for me, as well.
Especially since she's previously been reluctant to try Taco Bell. Not sure why she'd consider Arby's to be less terrifying.

Because despite how it tastes, Arby's serves actual food?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #103 on: 28 Jul 2015, 05:22 »

Everyone say it together,

Thankyew. That was the first thing I thought as well.

Quote
In other news... Okay, in the same news, Sven makes creepy comment and the deathsquads march. Hanners makes creepy comment and it's okay? Because Beatrice would probably utterly ruin the life of anyone if Hannelore asked her to.

It strikes me as a pretty symmetrical bit of boundary crossing, being examples of things both of them probably would have done in the past, without considering all of the consequences. Both are now at a point where they do think about the follow on from what they do but haven't quite fit that into the rules of polite conversation.
So you're saying she crossed the line twice?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #104 on: 28 Jul 2015, 05:27 »

Sven's line was eyeroll-inducing, not much more.

Hanners is helping a friend (Sven), even if another friend (Dora) gets helped by result.

Also, I would say that Sven may think he deserved to have the bridges burned, but he would probably still rightly say that Dora burned them.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #105 on: 28 Jul 2015, 05:37 »

Given how boring and mundane the specials board now appears to be.  I suppose it's pretty obvious who was responsible for all the  "Punch in the head, so you can call in sick"  listings
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Method of Madness

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #106 on: 28 Jul 2015, 05:40 »

I wouldn't call "sausage latte" boring or mundane.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #107 on: 28 Jul 2015, 05:47 »

So you're saying she crossed the line twice?

Chess set... so wrong. Can't stop laughing.

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #108 on: 28 Jul 2015, 05:48 »

None of the women were coerced, they acted very much out of their own initiative, and what they do in their private lives and who they share their bed with is none of their bosses business.
How far should respect for another person's personal autonomy make you keep quiet when they're doing something you think ill-advised? This topic has come up before:

I get that Dora is trying to look out for Hanners given Sven's past... but I don't like how she says "... but you can go." acting like it's actually her place to give permission. They are all adults and hanners can do whatever the hell she wants, screw Dora's bs paranoia. While I may be biased because of my long time dislike of Dora, it would annoy me if any other cast member acted this way too.
Hmmm... Personal autonomy is all well and good, but let us try a thought experiment. Imagine your friend, who had never driven a car before in her life, was proposing to take a Shelby Cobra* at high speed down a wet mountain road. Would you really just think "Meh... She's a grown-up, entitled to make her own decisions," and wave her off? Or try to talk her out of it?

Sven's background is that of a serial philanderer, with serious honesty, personal accountability, and self-control problems, who is (as far as Dora knows) unreformed, and who's shown that he's willing to seriously hurt her friends. Friends don't let friends drive drunk. Friends care enough about friends to try to talk them out of dangerous behaviour.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #109 on: 28 Jul 2015, 06:01 »

None of the women were coerced, they acted very much out of their own initiative, and what they do in their private lives and who they share their bed with is none of their bosses business.
How far should respect for another person's personal autonomy make you keep quiet when they're doing something you think ill-advised? This topic has come up before:

I get that Dora is trying to look out for Hanners given Sven's past... but I don't like how she says "... but you can go." acting like it's actually her place to give permission. They are all adults and hanners can do whatever the hell she wants, screw Dora's bs paranoia. While I may be biased because of my long time dislike of Dora, it would annoy me if any other cast member acted this way too.
Hmmm... Personal autonomy is all well and good, but let us try a thought experiment. Imagine your friend, who had never driven a car before in her life, was proposing to take a Shelby Cobra* at high speed down a wet mountain road. Would you really just think "Meh... She's a grown-up, entitled to make her own decisions," and wave her off? Or try to talk her out of it?

Sven's background is that of a serial philanderer, with serious honesty, personal accountability, and self-control problems, who is (as far as Dora knows) unreformed, and who's shown that he's willing to seriously hurt her friends. Friends don't let friends drive drunk. Friends care enough about friends to try to talk them out of dangerous behaviour.

I REALLY don't think your analogy is accurate. Hanners has reservations herself, it would be closer to a 'friend who can't drive taking a motorized scooter down a hill."

i agree, Sven's been a dickhole, but the whole staff is AWARE, so add that the driver of the car has been warned THOROUGHLY of all the shit to watch out for, and given fair warning. At that point, Dora doesn't get a say, because it's not her that's getting involved.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #110 on: 28 Jul 2015, 06:34 »

Yo, but...Arby's, though.

I'm sure there's lots of awesome discussion about Sven going on, but...Arby's.

How is that not worth at least three pages of psychoanalysis, curly fries aside?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #111 on: 28 Jul 2015, 07:58 »

Yo, but...Arby's, though.

I'm sure there's lots of awesome discussion about Sven going on, but...Arby's.

How is that not worth at least three pages of psychoanalysis, curly fries aside?

I'd be up to psychoanalyze Hanners' liking for curly fries if I didn't agree with her.

As it stands, curly fries are tasty, end of analysis.

There is little else to say.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #112 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:13 »

Sometimes a curly fry is just a curly fry.
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Thrudd

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #113 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:22 »

And then there is what is actually served.
Do not read if you have a delicate constitution.
Curly Fries:
(click to show/hide)
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #114 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:38 »

Mm, delicious chemicals. I really want some Arby's now.

Genuinely though, I'm pissed there aren't any in Ireland.

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #115 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:40 »

I'm not sure if I've ever actually been to Arby's.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #116 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:42 »

Method, has your avatar always had mysterious shapes in it?

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #117 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:43 »

Ever since I changed it to this one, yeah. It's a .gif, the pup is trying to get the stick across the bridge, the shapes represent his mental calculations.
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Welu

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #118 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:45 »

Ah! I didn't get that, but I have seen the video of the pup getting over the bridge with the stick. Somehow never saw the shapes before.

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #119 on: 28 Jul 2015, 08:54 »

I haven't seen the video but I wouldn't be surprised if the shapes were added in for the gif.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #120 on: 28 Jul 2015, 09:00 »

Mm, delicious chemicals. I really want some Arby's now.

I like their Reuben sandwich. Yes, I know that it is not a true Reuben. But I like it.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #121 on: 28 Jul 2015, 09:05 »

Now I want a Jamocha shake.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #122 on: 28 Jul 2015, 09:12 »

Mm, delicious chemicals. I really want some Arby's now.

I like their Reuben sandwich. Yes, I know that it is not a true Reuben. But I like it.
What IS a true Reuben? The ingredients look right (although I'd get it without the dressing because ew).
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swapna

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #123 on: 28 Jul 2015, 09:55 »

None of the women were coerced, they acted very much out of their own initiative, and what they do in their private lives and who they share their bed with is none of their bosses business.
How far should respect for another person's personal autonomy make you keep quiet when they're doing something you think ill-advised? This topic has come up before:

I get that Dora is trying to look out for Hanners given Sven's past... but I don't like how she says "... but you can go." acting like it's actually her place to give permission. They are all adults and hanners can do whatever the hell she wants, screw Dora's bs paranoia. While I may be biased because of my long time dislike of Dora, it would annoy me if any other cast member acted this way too.
Hmmm... Personal autonomy is all well and good, but let us try a thought experiment. Imagine your friend, who had never driven a car before in her life, was proposing to take a Shelby Cobra* at high speed down a wet mountain road. Would you really just think "Meh... She's a grown-up, entitled to make her own decisions," and wave her off? Or try to talk her out of it?

Sven's background is that of a serial philanderer, with serious honesty, personal accountability, and self-control problems, who is (as far as Dora knows) unreformed, and who's shown that he's willing to seriously hurt her friends. Friends don't let friends drive drunk. Friends care enough about friends to try to talk them out of dangerous behaviour.

Yeah, worrying for Hanners I can understand. I can even understand Dora getting over-protective and overstepping her boundaries there, even though I can't support it. But Raven? Raven is the girl who (according to your analogy) does half-legal high-speed-races with a modified car with rockets on it, and Dora forbids her to go out with Sven (and the other way around). And with Faye she was furious, as if this was somehow a personal betrayal - it was definitely not because she was worried.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #124 on: 28 Jul 2015, 10:08 »

Mm, delicious chemicals. I really want some Arby's now.

I like their Reuben sandwich. Yes, I know that it is not a true Reuben. But I like it.
What IS a true Reuben? The ingredients look right (although I'd get it without the dressing because ew).

It's Arby's version of a Reuben. I am certain that there are purists out there who would tell me what a proper Reuben sandwich should be like. Sadly, in my part of the USA, there are no such places that serve one. I only have the large chain eateries like Arby's or Penn Station.
« Last Edit: 28 Jul 2015, 10:14 by Tobimaro »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #125 on: 28 Jul 2015, 10:19 »

So does anyone have a quick recap on what exactly happened with Sven? People have some pretty strong opinions on whether whatever it was was really his fault or whatever, and... well...

:psyduck:

Seriously, though, I can't remember anything at all.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #126 on: 28 Jul 2015, 10:23 »

So does anyone have a quick recap on what exactly happened with Sven? People have some pretty strong opinions on whether whatever it was was really his fault or whatever, and... well...

:psyduck:

Seriously, though, I can't remember anything at all.

- Declares love for Faye in fairly Nice Guy fashion
- Baffled that this fails
- Dora calls him an asshole for being so insensitive to Faye when her and Angus are on the rocks, cuts him out of her life
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #127 on: 28 Jul 2015, 10:27 »

- Declares love for Faye in fairly Nice Guy fashion

You know, at this point I half think "Nice Guy" just means "anything I don't like", since actually clearly stating your feelings is exactly the opposite of what a lot of people (hell, for all we know it's something Sven heard that led him to this) call "Nice Guy" behavior.

See e.g. xkcd

----

Anyway, now, so I can see both sides of it, does anyone who is claiming it wasn't his fault and that Dora was overreacting have a recap of their versions of events?

Why do they add it when they cook in it?

Hang on, did you think it was on the list for some other reason than the fact that they cooked in it? All fried foods list the grease/oil as an ingredient.
« Last Edit: 28 Jul 2015, 10:36 by Random832 »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #128 on: 28 Jul 2015, 10:40 »

He declared his love for Faye and then expected her to fall into his arms entirely on the basis that he thinks Angus is an asshole. Lots of folks dispute whether he even actually loves her, I would say that is quintessentially Nice Guy. 'I told her I loved her and her boyfriend is a douche, what more does she want???'

Anyway, his defenders say he was simply being honest about his feelings and Dora overreacted.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #129 on: 28 Jul 2015, 10:45 »

The issue isn't that he stated his feelings, it's that he thought doing that alone would be enough to make Faye leave her current boyfriend for him. Also as Steve says, sometimes honesty isn't the best policy.

Edit: Ninja'd.

Double edit:

Back to today's strip, I'm really disappointed in Dora that after the practice-date thing where Hanners insisted she had fun and Sven was respectful, that her first comment about him is asking if he made a pass at Hanners. It's not only insulting to Sven, but also to Hanners' judgement of character.
I think Dora's built an image of Sven in her head that makes him out to be more malicious rather than oblivious to his good fortune, which is supported by actions he has done. Although she uses those negative times to override the times he isn't a douchenozzle.
« Last Edit: 28 Jul 2015, 10:52 by Welu »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #130 on: 28 Jul 2015, 11:34 »

Anyway, his defenders say he was simply being honest about his feelings and Dora overreacted.
What would I be, then? I think it was a shitty thing for him to do and that Dora overreacted.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #131 on: 28 Jul 2015, 11:44 »

Anyway, his defenders say he was simply being honest about his feelings and Dora overreacted.
What would I be, then? I think it was a shitty thing for him to do and that Dora overreacted.
An iconoclast?

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #132 on: 28 Jul 2015, 11:48 »

That seems cromulent.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #133 on: 28 Jul 2015, 12:13 »

I wasn't trying to embiggen your ego, there.

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #134 on: 28 Jul 2015, 13:45 »

Now I want a Jamocha shake.

Their Orange Dream shake isn't too bad.

...and I thought their schtick was the potato cakes, not curly fries?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #135 on: 28 Jul 2015, 14:21 »


How far should respect for another person's personal autonomy make you keep quiet when they're doing something you think ill-advised? This topic has come up before:


Mine is "until I run out of popcorn and schadenfreude."

And curly fries are awesome.  Just gotta say that.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #136 on: 28 Jul 2015, 14:47 »

These last two days are interesting to me. I know who these characters are, and care, but I wonder if there are newer fans who are puzzled. This takes me back to that comic Jeph used to do before the present adventures of Marten and Claire, and boy-Claire and the weird girl from Marten's workplace.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #137 on: 28 Jul 2015, 15:01 »

I really hope we get to see Dora and Sven talk (or argue or fight). I've never been quite able to parse Sven's weird overly dense attitude when he told Faye he loved her. It felt incongruent with how he usually acts, but since we see so little of him, it's hard to tell.

I know you shouldn't show everything, but I would've loved seeing Dora tell Sven she's cutting him out of his life just to hear him talk about his actions with someone he actually cares about. The debrief with Steve just kind of doubled down on his attitude.

I guess it seemed a little strange to me that Sven went from being mopey, lonely and introspective to thinking life would be like a romantic comedy for himself. I mean, he's used to getting what he wants, but I thought he was more realistic about it in the past. His creepy line to Hannelore felt like it came from the same mold though, so maybe that's just how he is now.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #138 on: 28 Jul 2015, 15:01 »

I'm not sure it's been That long sine we last saw Dora and Hannelore. Sven, it's been a while.

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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #139 on: 28 Jul 2015, 18:09 »

I don't really think Hanners wants her Mom to buy CoD and turn it into an Arbys

In some way I can understand Doras attitude towards Sven.  After all, she's had a lifetime of dealing with his shtick, and what happened was likely the straw that broke the Camels back, but in some ways I think she's also behaving a little immaturely about it.  She really does need to talk to Sven at some stage, but I think she may wind up talking to Faye before that happens.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #140 on: 28 Jul 2015, 18:10 »

They were Svan and Mora.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #141 on: 28 Jul 2015, 18:12 »

It's interesting that Hannelore eats fast food.  Given some of the stories about fast food food, whether they're true or not, you'd think she'd be paranoid about eating those products.
This thought came to mind for me, as well.
Especially since she's previously been reluctant to try Taco Bell. Not sure why she'd consider Arby's to be less terrifying.

Because despite how it tastes, Arby's serves actual food?

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Arby's.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #142 on: 28 Jul 2015, 18:38 »

Now I want to see Svan and Mora eating some Spathe Ham.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #143 on: 28 Jul 2015, 18:39 »

Nothing reconciles siblings like space ham.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #144 on: 28 Jul 2015, 20:25 »

I know this story is supposed to be cute and feel-goodish (how can it not be when Hanner is involved), but it continues this myth that 1) estrangements are unjustified/bad (keep in mind almost all stories that cover estrangement put this out), and 2) outsiders should get involved to stop estrangements.

That's not really a good idea. First off, outsiders can actually make things worse between estranged family members (unless the outsiders are trained in professional mediation). 

Second, most of the time, when someone has to make a shitty decision like walking away from their family, it's not over some stupid or petty misunderstanding. Either severe mental illness is involved (either from the person who walked away or the ones who were estranged) and/or the person who got out had a damn good reason.

I wish artists/authors would take a more mindful approach when covering the subject of estrangement. I respect whatever direction this particular story takes (it's really up to Jeph), but I think I'm just going to have to step away and come back later. 
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #145 on: 28 Jul 2015, 20:36 »

I don't see how estrangement (at least in this case) isn't a bad thing.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #146 on: 28 Jul 2015, 21:33 »

It's the things we DON'T say that hurt the most - especially when it get to be too late.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #147 on: 28 Jul 2015, 21:37 »

I really do hope they reconcile, Sven is kind of a jerk but he hasn't done anything worth disowning your brother over.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #148 on: 28 Jul 2015, 22:15 »

The whole thing was really about Mora's friend Raye.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3011-3015 (27 - 31 July 2015)
« Reply #149 on: 28 Jul 2015, 22:19 »

Yea, the funny things on the chalkboard are back!!!! Woot.


Yes, that's the only reason I'm posting.
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