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Bubbles and Faye trying to help eachother heal

Renee and Brun - Odd Couples Don't Get Odder!

Brun Rebuilding Her Life

Clinton and Claire trying to rebuild a few burned bridges

Dora trying to persuade Hanners and Emily to actually WORK (Barn fart! Baaarrrnnn fffaaarrrt!)

Clinton and Brun's incomplete business

[sitnspin]

Any unwanted and unsolicited touching is inappropriately intimate.

[Nepiophage]

Any unwanted and unsolicited touching is inappropriately intimate.

Stay away from me then.

[sitnspin]

It's all about respecting boundaries and consent. Don't just assume everyone has your comfort level.

[Jakk Frost]

Any unwanted and unsolicited touching is inappropriately intimate.

And that right there is what's wrong with North American society today.   That's the kind of thinking that gets people wanting to charge 5 year olds with sexual harassment just for giving a hug to a classmate.

[sitnspin]

Nice strawman there.

[Gyrre]

Croissants are really good. Everyone can agree on that. The important question is: are croissants the best pastry?

That's a subjective question.
For me, the answer is 'no' because homemade apple fritters and blueberry coffecake crumble. Also homemade strawberry rhubarb pie. (Or is pie a confection?)

[BenRG]

Gyrre, please have mercy; I'm a diabetic!

[heyjames4]

Looks like Eliot is crushing on Brun. Remember the star eyes when he first saw her?
It makes sense. He's got a strong protective instinct, and his first introduction to her she's literally Cinderella-ing.
(She lost everything, and is now cleaning a bakery for pocket money, while wearing a cute bow, and her flat affect can be read as determination in face of adversity.)
How strong the crush, unknown.
How much he accepts/understands his own feelings, unknown. Good discussion today on Renee's teasing and his counterproductive reaction.
If he has strong feelings, and an urge to demonstrate them, his track record is (as far as we know from the Padma arc) not good.

Someone else said earlier, he's very physical. A strong silent type. Good with reading body language and used to keeping mum.
She's very literal, unskilled in or incapable of interpreting nonverbal signals.
That's not a great match of communication styles.

Brun is unlikely to interpret statements of concern or acts of assistance from Eliot as indicators of interest (Renee and Jim are concerned and helpful, but not romantically interested).
If Eliot wants to pursue Brun, he's going to have to stretch outside his default style, to clearly and forthrightly state his intentions.
If he does that then, no matter how she feels about it, she'll probably respond with a stony face and rigid posture. Because that's her default style.
And to a kinesthetic person like Eliot, that will read as rejection, whether or not its intended.

Or maybe Renee will meddle, try to play matchmaker or (what's the word for anti-matchmaker), running roughshod over whatever feelings or preferences her two friends actually have in favor to what she thinks they want or what she thinks is best for them.

[sitnspin]

Croissants are really good. Everyone can agree on that. The important question is: are croissants the best pastry?

That's a subjective question.
For me, the answer is 'no' because homemade apple fritters and blueberry coffecake crumble. Also homemade strawberry rhubarb pie. (Or is pie a confection?)

I'd take croissants over any of those, but I don't really like sweets. As you said, subjective.

[drmike]

Do we have a thread (or an announcement even) about the new site layout?  I wanted to mention that the light blue font on a white background is an issue for those of us with vision issues.

[Welu]

Emailing him (jephco at mac dot com) or trying his twitter are probably the communication methods he is most likely to see. On the occasions that he changes the site, it's not announced here before or after usually.

[Is it cold in here?]

Welcome, carnex!

[FunkyTuba]

Is is canon or just me misremembering (or maybe a newspost or title/tagline) that Clinton wore glasses as a preference, not as a vision necessity?

I might have time for an archive crawl this weekend to prove myself right/wrong but if anyone remembers of this and has a link I'd be greatly appreciative.

[brasca]

Well, Renee's not crazily protective about Brun's romantic life. She didn't seem unhappy with the idea of Elliot crushing on her precious vulnerable friend until he tried to muss up her carefully crafted hairstyle.

Elliot is someone Renee knows so she doesn't think he'd do anything bad and he'd have to face her on a daily basis if he broke Brun's heart so she can trust he'd be on his best behavior.  Clinton, however, is unknown to her and even though his reaction to Brun's situation is not all that different she won't give him the benefit of the doubt and assumes he's a creep. 

[Kugai]

I think Renee is just a touch jealous of Elliott crushing on Brun

[TheEvilDog]

I think Renee is just a touch jealous of Elliott crushing on Brun

I do get the feeling that Renee is a person who wants to be the centre of attention, that she wants actual recognition for what she does. So its not a case of Renee being jealous of Brun being crushed on by Elliott, but rather that the attention isn't on her.

I guess that this is going to turn into Renee's main character flaw.

[Timemaster]

Do we have a thread (or an announcement even) about the new site layout?

I rather think that there is a technical problem with the layout or the whole site. Or it´s under construction.
The whole think looks kinda incomplete and wrong. I don´t have any knowledge in html or any of that stuff. But this doesn´t look like a finished webpage. I suppose we´ll see a change back to the original design ot to something completely new soon.

TM

[Tova]

Any unwanted and unsolicited touching is inappropriately intimate.

Elliot had misinterpreted Renee's words as her wanting a comforting head pat.

I'm sure he would not have offered if he'd known it was unwanted. Notice, he didn't give Brun a pat on the head, even though he wanted to.

The rest of this post is speculative, as I don't have any special insight into what others are thinking.

To me, the big joke in today's comic is that Elliott is so desperate to deny that he's attracted to Brun in any way that he's proposing to engage in an entirely inappropriately intimate behaviour with Renee so as to try to prove to himself that what he wants to do with Brun is nothing indicative of attraction. I can't exactly blame her for being freaked out by this.

I see the crux of the entire difference between the my interpretation and the one above as whether you thought Elliot was "crushing" on Brun when reading the previous strip. Interestingly, no-one has actually discussed this. Half the forumites have simply posted under the assumption that is true, the other half under the assumption that it is not. I'm not actually 100% convinced either way, but I initially read the latest strip assuming that he wasn't. I hadn't seen what Renee and some forumites apparently saw.

Obviously, you would read Elliot's reaction to Renee's words differently, depending on which position you've taken.

I think Renee is just a touch jealous of Elliott crushing on Brun

See now, I thought that Renee was shipping the pair so hard that she saw a crush that really wasn't there.

I think that the crux of this difference in interpretation is perhaps based on whether you strongly believe Renee is self-centred or selfish. It's easy to imagine that she is reacting jealously if you think so, and hard to imagine that she is shipping a relationship between Brun and someone else, which would imply that she is looking beyond her own needs and her own relationship with Brun.  Maybe that's even why Elliot reacted the way he did. Again, two different interpretations that spring naturally from the assumptions you carry into the strip.

It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.

(click to show/hide)

Not actually Mark Twain. So very meta.

[comicalArchitect]

I just had a flash of inspiration—what if Renee's recent spotlight has been setup for Angus's reintroduction? This may just be wishful thinking on my part, but i believe there's a chance.

[Undrneath]

To what end though?

[Perfectly Reasonable]

Wrestle her to the floor and mess her hair up! She deserves it!
...
...
Wait... Can it be... that that is what Renée has been waiting for...

NONONONONOO...

[chaospersonified]

Today, Marten amused me. I want to use that line. I want an excuse to say that.

[TheEvilDog]

Comic is up.

Aaand honestly Claire, you gotta up your game if you want to mess with Marten's head. Dude lives with Pintsize for pity's sake.

[jheartney]

Here's a prediction for next week. Clinton refuses to go to COD to discuss tattoos, so they end up going to The Secret Bakery instead. Clinton bumps into Renee AND Kiki/Brun. Hilarity ensues.

[cesium133]

Here's a prediction for next week. Clinton refuses to go to COD to discuss tattoos, so they end up going to The Secret Bakery instead. Clinton bumps into Renee AND Kiki/Brun. Hilarity ensues.

I just had a thought (dangerous, I know).

We've had it all wrong. Clinton isn't going to end up shipped with Brun. He'll end up with Renee. She'll probably go along with it to get out of her date with Pintsize. 

[Storel]

"...You didn't pat me on the head."
"I--I'm sorry! I'll do it right now!"
"Keep your paws off me."

See, Renee, that kind of reaction is probably why it never occurred to Elliot to pat you on the head. You're a hard-edged, self-reliant person, and even when you talk to someone about your troubles you don't present it in a way that garners you any sympathy or inspires any sympathetic gestures. "I was pissed off about my mom last week" -- yeah, you were probably bitching about her to the point where Elliot was simply wishing you'd shut up, not feeling any urge to give you sympathetic pats.
 
Brun is, in some ways, a kind of childlike character. Her logic that she needed a bow to work in a bakery because Kiki worked in a bakery and had a bow is the sort of logic that children use. And the simple pleasure she took in wearing that bow, despite all the tragic things that have happened to her, made her seem like a brave child taking simple pleasures where she finds them. Is it any wonder Elliot wanted to pat her on the head and comfort her? I probably would have wanted to do that too, and I know I'm not crushing on Brun.

Elliot's a pretty nice guy, and I really don't think he's feeling anything but sympathy for Brun. Or at least, he wasn't until Renee put ideas in his head. Now he'll be like "Am I crushing on her? I didn't think so, but Renee seems pretty sure. Gosh, maybe I am?" and he may decide to start treating her as someone he finds attractive rather than someone he just feels sorry for... probably with poor results, for all the reasons everyone else has given. Gee, thanks Renee!

[BenRG]

Claire uses DEFLECTION! The move missed!

Seriously, with the number of people in Marten's life who refuse to confront difficult experiences or are in denial about their feelings or serious personal problems, Claire is going to need to do a lot better if she wants to figure out a way to distract Marten.

I've got to admit that I'm not even sure why she did this; it isn't as if Marten's 'voice of experience' directly impacted her here. I just think that this is a symptom of her 'I know best' attitude: She's got a plan for Clinton and she didn't want Marten's input possibly ruining her attempts at directing her brother's behaviour. An alternate explanation is that Claire likes her life to be high-drama on some levels and tries to cause that drama if it isn't happening. I'm not so keen on that idea as it really doesn't seem consistent with her other behaviour.

Here's a prediction for next week. Clinton refuses to go to COD to discuss tattoos, so they end up going to The Secret Bakery instead. Clinton bumps into Renee AND Kiki/Brun. Hilarity ensues.

I am still hoping for a prolonged scene at CoD where various couples, potential couples and other groups are all in there at the same time, interacting and generally realising various things. We'll have the Clinton-Emily-Elliot-Brun quadrangle (Elliot having come with the muffins and Brun having come seeking familiar faces); Faye will have accompanied Bubbles who wants her next tea hit and maybe Hannelore will have some wise counsel for them. Marten and Tai will be getting coffees before opening the library and will thus be there to modulate Claire and Dora's behaviour.

[Tova]

I've got to admit that I'm not even sure why she did this;

Well, maybe she was just sassing him for amusement. 

I do hope that we have a few "collisions" at CoD next week.

[Storel]

Who exactly was Clinton applauding with his "Well played" comment? Marten, or Claire?

[BenRG]

I just want to add that Jeph really managed perfect character art with Claire and Clinton in today's comic. He doesn't fall into any obvious traps and the art very nicely showcases how totally Clinton and Claire have changed since their first appearances.

Remember the first time they went into CoD and someone (I think it was Faye) asked if they were twins? At that time, it was an easy mistake to make on lots of levels. These days, I think that they're both showing a lot more of their individuality and it is no longer likely that anyone would simply lump them together as 'The Augustus Kids'.

Who exactly was Clinton applauding with his "Well played" comment? Marten, or Claire?

I'm fairly sure it was the smooth way Marten disarmed Claire's attempted deflection/distraction.

[Lubricus]

Who exactly was Clinton applauding with his "Well played" comment? Marten, or Claire?

I read it a sarcastic comment to Claire.

[Tova]

I read it as non-sarcastic applause to Marten.

At least we all agree on the characters' names... (shhh don't shatter my illusion please).

[Kugai]

He is used to your strange ways now Claire, your Jedi mind tricks will not work on him anymore

[brasca]

Seeing as how Clinton has returned to Coffee of Doom twice since Emily turned him down I don't think he's trying to avoid her.  I think he just doesn't want to get another tattoo and would prefer to use that as an excuse. 

[gopher]

Looks like the page redesign is deliberate. I know we are here as non-paying guests and thus should be polite, but to me it looks 1995-terrible. Bad fonts, poor layout, poor colour choices. I have the urge to hunt out an AOL online CD to load up Netscape Navigator to view it to see if is any better.

[brasca]

Looks like the page redesign is deliberate. I know we are here as non-paying guests and thus should be polite, but to me it looks 1995-terrible. Bad fonts, poor layout, poor colour choices. I have the urge to hunt out an AOL online CD to load up Netscape Navigator to view it to see if is any better.

Maybe it's your device.  I have no trouble viewing the strip on my computer or smartphone.  I prefer the old layout more, but it's hardly as bad as the 90's websites. 

[Thrillho]

And that right there is what's wrong with North American society today.   That's the kind of thinking that gets people wanting to charge 5 year olds with sexual harassment just for giving a hug to a classmate.

If you want to properly discuss this, there is a Discuss forum. However generally speaking, you might want to be careful about outright dismissing the boundaries of others on this forum.

[Thrillho]

I've got to admit that I'm not even sure why she did this; it isn't as if Marten's 'voice of experience' directly impacted her here.

Shits and giggles.

If you're comfortable in a relationship you can do that kind of thing very easily. My ex knew that I was once signed up to a dating website with an embarrassing username and she never stopped making fun of me about it. But it was completely good natured.

[Method of Madness]

since Emily turned him down

Are we absolutely sure she turned him down?

[BenRG]

That's the thing. From most people "I'm too busy to date" would be an excuse and an attempted polite rejection. From Emily, it is likely a completely factual statement and Clinton is quite likely to receive a 'phone message from out of the blue along the lines of: "I've submitted my last course unit for the semester! So, when do you want our second date?"

[hedgie]

That's the thing. From most people "I'm too busy to date" would be an excuse and an attempted polite rejection. From Emily, it is likely a completely factual statement and Clinton is quite likely to receive a 'phone message from out of the blue along the lines of: "I've submitted my last course unit for the semester! So, when do you want our second date?"

Well, it is a rejection for an indefinite time frame.  This may be more frustrating than a flat "not interested" would be.  In either case Clinton's best bet would be to move on and not dwell on it.  He has no way of knowing if Emily has any feelings for him, short of asking directly, and would only make himself miserable

[Gyrre]

Elliot = dog personality.

Renee= cat (obviously)

I know quite a few cats and dogs that get along just fine.

[Gyrre]

This is meant solely as reference material.  I've noticed an online trend over the course of the last two weeks; people misusing/misidentifying the strawman fallacy. Here's a short vid on what the strawman fallacy actually is. There's also a playlist for the other common logical fallacies that can be found in the related videos list.

[swapna]

For me, Elliot and Renee read like people who've been co-workers for a long time; they might even be friends. It looks more like good-natured ribbing than anything else.  And she might not be wrong - he blushed while talking to Brun; maybe Renee saw it or another coworker told her.

Don't understand Claire, as usual (is it a joke? why does she pretend to be shocked? is she roleplaying the 'jealous girlfriend'?), I like Clintons reaction. He probably didn't know; I don't think the Augustus siblings tell each other everything, and he was introduced after the break-up and didn't have that much time with the main cast. He admires Marten's reaction - he 'diffused' whatever drama Claire was trying to pull in a second, a skill that Clinton really wishes he had.

[Mojo]

Hey, who's the guy in the blue shirt?

[Perfectly Reasonable]

Um, the site still has a 'Cast' page. (Although it does not explain Renée.)

[Storel]

Hey, who's the guy in the blue shirt?

Didn't we decide he was Steve, the last time he showed up?

[HiFranc]

As I was listening to this, I thought of everyone here.

[Oenone]

I just had a flash of inspiration—what if Renee's recent spotlight has been setup for Angus's reintroduction? This may just be wishful thinking on my part, but i believe there's a chance.

Or Jeph could continue his trajectory of offering female characters whose role in the plot does not hinge on their romantic entanglements.

[Tova]

As hilarious as the whole "who is this guy, he looks like Marten but he has a spine" jokes are, I am wondering for how many months and years we need to see them posted before people finally start to reassess that premise as well.